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Location: Maine Township, MN | Reading the "MN" thread is pretty depressing... This news just picked me up a little bit:
District 3 – Fergus Falls area
CO Tricia Plautz (Henning) checked ice anglers during the week and worked trapping enforcement. She also seized a large muskie and cited an individual for taking it out of season.
Edited by nocturnalmotors 12/19/2013 8:02 AM
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Posts: 216
| It is good he got caught but that just confirms what everyone was afraid of. It's already started. For every one that gets busted there'll be five more that get away with it. There's always gonna b a sneaky dirtbag poacher out there somewhere.they need to be hard on em.take his liscence and don't let him hunt and fish for five or ten years maybe he ll think twice next time |
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Location: Yahara River Chain | Brozz88 - 12/19/2013 8:20 AM
For every one that gets busted there'll be five more that get away with it.
Where you get that number? Is there evidence you can point us to?
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Posts: 1082
Location: Aurora | "People can come up with statistics to prove anything. 41% of all people know that."
~Homer Simpson~ |
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Location: The desert | Brozz88 - 12/19/2013 7:20 AM
It is good he got caught but that just confirms what everyone was afraid of. It's already started. For every one that gets busted there'll be five more that get away with it. There's always gonna b a sneaky dirtbag poacher out there somewhere.they need to be hard on em.take his liscence and don't let him hunt and fish for five or ten years maybe he ll think twice next time
Do you think he cares about a hunting or fishing license?
It's funny when people use this line. "They'll think twice!" No, they'll just break the law some more. They didn't care about the laws to begin with, why now will they suddenly abide by them?
Tricia is a good CO. |
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| I find it rather humorous (and depressing) that people get on here in truth detector mode and start saying "do you have proof" there are five poachers vs. one or two or whatever. I guess I look at it through the lens that a 5000 acre lake will have, on average, 0.25 fish per acre. Doing rough math that equals a population of ~1250 fish. So if even one guy spends 2-3 months spearing and kills fish with abandon, he might take what 15-20 in a year if he spears a lot? Probably more if he has bad intentions and knows what he is doing. That is almost a 2% reduction in the fishable population. Times this by 5 poachers, that equals 10% of the population. Oh by the way, each of those fish, depending on size will take 6-12 years to replace.
Yyou might argue with my math on the spearing total. OK, well, what if you drop the lake size down to 1500 acreas or 500 acres? That takes the formula the other way. On smaller waters even killing 5 is bad news. Kill 20 and you might change the lake.
So IMO, I do not care if there are five, ten, or even one poacher out there and I do not care if someone can "prove" it. I care about the fact that it only takes one to do damage to a fishery. The challenge here is that Muskies do not exist in great numbers, so even one jack wagon out killing them is bad news for those of us who like to catch these fish. (And I get you'll never stop them all. Fine, I want to at least stop as many as possible...)
IMO, the better debate to have is about solutions. What is the best way to prevent this from happening? I'm guessing debating statistical validity adds essentially zero to that question.
Edited by Brad P 12/19/2013 9:49 AM
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| Would there be objection to an abnoxious fine increase? I bet you could justfiy a $2000+ fine on this offense given the average resource it takes for the DNR to put just one adult musky in a lake.
You are not going to stop them all, but I bet if you popped a few of them at that rate heads would roll.
Just brainstorimg. I'm not going to admonish debate and suggest ideas without suggesting some ideas. |
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| No I don't have evidence I just know there's a lot of poaching scums that don't get caught,for every one that does, my neighbors one of em.twice as many deer as any one man had tags for.And right maybe that guy doesn't care about a liscence, some ppl do, and Probly might think next time if he wants to hunt and fish legally ever again.but for some you can't fix stupid.huge fine and no liscence then.you gotta do something to set a example for others who might think of tryin it. |
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Location: The desert | Brad P - 12/19/2013 8:51 AM
Would there be objection to an abnoxious fine increase? I bet you could justfiy a $2000+ fine on this offense given the average resource it takes for the DNR to put just one adult musky in a lake.
You are not going to stop them all, but I bet if you popped a few of them at that rate heads would roll.
Just brainstorimg. I'm not going to admonish debate and suggest ideas without suggesting some ideas.
I believe there are limitations on size if fine based upon the classification of the infraction. As in misdemeanor (a, b, or c) vs felony.
Plus you need a willingness of the DA to prosecute such cases, which isn't always a given. |
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| One would think there would be a financial case that could be made given the cost of stocking Muskies. Of courser that doesn't always end up being persuasive to a politician...
Edited by Brad P 12/19/2013 1:38 PM
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| Fines are great if that actually serves as a deterrent to anyone. Whether it does or not is obviously up for debate. But where does the money that is collected in fines actually go? If it went right to stocking or management or hatcheries or something, I say let them be stupid and get caught. |
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Location: Minnesota | Was it said wether it was taken spearing? They are caught through the ice on conventional tackle. There are more people out fishing with tip ups than spearers. You all have this idea that spearing is a bad thing. That spearers are out there everyday to kill every pike or muskie they see. You make your selves sound like idiots. I spear a lot. It's pretty easy to tell the difference between the species. I don't kill many pike. Most spearers are selective. And with spearing there is no hooking mortality on pike of undesired size. I also volunteer with Muskies Inc. doing spring nettings on rearing ponds. I most certainly don't want to see them removed from the lakes either...This isn't a one sided blasting from a spearing advocate. I lightly defended the guys sitting over a hole. Just an opinion from a guy that enjoys both worlds. |
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Location: The desert | esoxaddict - 12/19/2013 12:54 PM
Fines are great if that actually serves as a deterrent to anyone. Whether it does or not is obviously up for debate. But where does the money that is collected in fines actually go? If it went right to stocking or management or hatcheries or something, I say let them be stupid and get caught.
It usually doesn't. |
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| esoxaddict - 12/19/2013 1:54 PM
Fines are great if that actually serves as a deterrent to anyone. Whether it does or not is obviously up for debate. But where does the money that is collected in fines actually go? If it went right to stocking or management or hatcheries or something, I say let them be stupid and get caught.
In MN a fine goes to the State general fund, but restitution goes to the DNR. These are the amounts for restitution, and are often what the DNR seeks over fines.
6133.0080, Subp. 2.
Muskellunge.
The restitution values for muskellunge are as follows:
A. Four to less than 30 inches, $40;
B. 30 to less than 40 inches, $200;
C. 40 to less than 50 inches, $500; and
D. 50 inches and over, $1,000 plus $100 for each inch over 50 inches
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| So I'm guessing at least a $500 ticket. That's more than I thought it would be. |
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| yep no where did it say it was speared, just people jumping to conclusions |
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| Unfortunately I see poaching of fish and wild game more than I care to, UGH !! GRRRRR !! Some people feel that every fish they catch they are going to keep and use. An individual who hunts a land tract next to mine likes to kill a few more Deer than he should or has tags for. Well we got a " New Sheriff " I.E. WCO in the county and is aware and very interested in this fella. This fella was going to shoot my 140 lbs. German Shepherd ( While on my property ) with a twelve inch fluorescent orange band that is worn year round around his neck, so not to be shot for a Coyote. That would not of been good for either parties. Like the WCO told me there are so many wild game give away programs that a poor family would not have to resort to poaching. Thus less the excuse "Oh I have to, to feed my family " Heck the PGC. will even transport the deer to their residence. Pennsylvania has a shortage of WCOs and a bigger shortage of Deputy WCO to which are part time and not really paid well enough for what they do and risk. Most WCOs have an awful lot of territory to have to cover and still have to handle complaints. Pa. upped the penalty for poaching...finally, however I see a lot of plea bargaining or the Judicial System letting these characters off too easy and not following the set guide lines for punishment. GRRRRR !!!! |
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| Lots of poaching in the musky world these days... |
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Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | They don't mean cooking, Ben. |
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Location: Eagan, MN | Riding the elevator down at work last night with a collegue here in MN. He knew I was an avid fisherman. Told me he was up north in the Alex, MN area on his first ever darkhouse spearing trip. His buddy, an avid spearer, was taking him for the first time. They got nothing. Said he had a HUGE musky come into the hole and his buddy took a shot at it with the spear, but missed. I asked, "Isn't it illegal to spear muskies?" He said, "I think so. But, my buddy was going to say he thought it was a pike." Well, I have nothing against darkhouse spearers that fish legally. But now know why the darkhouse groups and the musky groups go at it so much here. That little story irked me. I guess some fishermen kill muskies intentionally and illegally, too. Either way, it's stinks for the musky fishery. |
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Location: Tomahawk, WI | I moved from The Twin Cities to a small town in Northern Wisconsin a little over 20 years ago. I didn't realize how bad the poaching problem was until I had spent a few years here. I have to agree that for every violater that is caught, there are at least five more that are not. The people who violate aren't even shy about it!! The problem is the enforcement. How can one or two wardens slow this down? They cant. |
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| banditman - 1/15/2014 7:47 AM
I moved from The Twin Cities to a small town in Northern Wisconsin a little over 20 years ago. I didn't realize how bad the poaching problem was until I had spent a few years here. I have to agree that for every violater that is caught, there are at least five more that are not. The people who violate aren't even shy about it!! The problem is the enforcement. How can one or two wardens slow this down? They cant.
And that's the problem right there. The DNR just doesn't have the money to put enough wardens out there in enough places to even have a presence. And with so much area to patrol, and so many lakes, I don't see that changing. We can hope that most people will realize why the laws are in place and obey them for the sake of the resources they enjoy, but there's still that attitude of "I paid $70 for a license, I caught it, and now I'm going to keep it" out there. I only spend a few weeks a year up there these days, but I STILL see it often. |
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| I consider the $18 I spend on and MN license and $50 I spend on a WI license to be the cheapest entertainment out there. I wouldn't hesitate to pay $60 for an MN license and $50 for a musky stamp if the money went towards more wardens and expanded management. |
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