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| there are no slot limits for muskies in Ontario. it's a minimum size limit. |
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Posts: 174
Location: Ontario | My mistake,size limit. misremembered |
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Posts: 311
Location: Ontario | Been fishing that area about 25 yrs. There's very good water in all directions.
The muskie wins!
If not the derby cup, 'The Award For Drunkest Cabin That Night' for sure! |
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Posts: 174
Location: Ontario | 18 Guys in a Cabin for 3 days. Were contenders for that award for sure !! |
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Posts: 61
Location: Anoka | How is a guy suppose to know its 54" without a measurment its not exactly easy to do it while the fish is in the net what if its 52 1/2" your telling me this guy expects you to just look at it in the net and know lmao. |
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Posts: 311
Location: Ontario | I guess the COs make the assumption that fish are to be unhooked and measured without ever leaving the water, using a tape, floating measuring stick or a cradle with tape built in. If its 54in you can bring it aboard for your picture, if the in-water measurement falls short, in-water pics only. (That was actually the terminology and logic the CO I mentioned earlier used....'if a fish isn't legal size, you'd better hope the water is warm when you're in the water having your pic taken with it.') Laws and common practicality are divergent in many cases, this being one of them. |
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Posts: 225
Location: Ontario, Canada | This is a silly endless debate! "Trophy'" waters in Ontario have high size limits for a reason, to promote large fish growth. To suggest that you would be fined for taking a pic of a 48" or 53" Muskie on Georgian Bay is rediculous! We do have a court system here in the Socialist Utopia we call Canada, any CO that fined you would not win in an Ontario Court. |
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| So are you telling me that every time a TV show like Musky Hunter films an episode in Ontario, like a couple weeks ago on the Kawarthas and a whole bunch on LOTW, they are in direct violation of the law? Look up any episode and they take the fish out of the water for the camera every time and i promise you the muskies were not 54" long! If just photoing the fish was against the law how is it legal for tournaments to happen? Here in Wisconsin, i fish many tournaments on lakes with high size limits but if you never put the fish in your livewell and transport it, than you never take possession of the fish so you are perfectly legal. If that is not the case in Ontario i believe i know many people who have been in violation of a rediculous law! If i put in that many hours to catch a musky and when i finally do i cant even take a photo of the fish and put it back in the lake? Why would i ever want to travel north to fish in Canada then? |
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Posts: 100
| I totally agree with the above sentiment. Although it is very unlikely that a CO who is so inclined to fine an angler for taking an undersized fish out of the water would be present to witness such an act the fact that someone could be fined is rediculous. Even though a fine would probably be overturned in court, the fact that a court apperance would be necessary is unacceptable. |
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Location: Eastern Ontario | Actually the size limit there is only 44 inches
There was a musky tournament in the Kawarthas last June and the CO's were on hand to make sure no fish under 44 inches were held
Don't be to sure it would be tossed out of court although it is mainly used for people catching and releasing bedding bass before the season opener
Edited by horsehunter 3/4/2012 2:38 PM
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Posts: 174
Location: Ontario | When you say the CO'S where there to make sure no fish were held...do you mean kept or held for photos ? We used to go to Pigeon and Buckhorn every year for the pickeral opening.Had a great derby going there with 60-70 guys.Now with the slot size,its like winning a lottery.Fish has to be exact size and weigh in around 2 lbs.But you still have to take them and handle them to be measured.
Muskie fishing in those waters is fantastic.Lots of locals hate them though.Blame them for decreased levels of pickeral. |
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Location: Eastern Ontario | They were making sure they were released IMEDIATELY no holding for judge boat, water release of fish obviously under 44 inches . Initially all fish were to be held for judge boat untill the MNR made it quite clear charges would be laid. |
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Posts: 311
Location: Ontario | To Re-Cap:
1. Some COs-----like the one I mentioned in my original post, who is
a real cowboy---apply laws based on their own interpretation of said laws. I did not write these laws, and, as admitted, have broken them hundreds of times. They are silly, and anyone who knows muskie fisherman knows that they're all normally very conservation-oriented.
2. Laws are largely in the hands of the interpreter in the field. He has the option of enforcing them as he sees fit. You have the option of showing up in court to defend yourself back on shore, if it comes to that.
This is a circular argument, and one that's literally applied case-by-case, based on a CO's disrection. Based on a CO's discretion. Based on a CO's disrection.
I did not write this law. I reported on a first-hand verbal experience with an individual who applies the law in a very specific way as it applies to talking under-sized muskie out of the water for photographs. It's my opinion that this guy is an extremeist, and the odds of him being present when you have a 53.9 on your line are pretty miniscule any way. I think he's an isolated example, but an important one to be conscious of. Again, these guys are under-staffed, under-funded and the odds of you getting a break in a grey area are pretty slim, when revenue is dependant on fines. This is a pretty basic concept, I think. (And it is 100% possible to accurately measure any fish while its laying in the water alongside your boat, IMO.) The Regulations are filled with grey areas that are applied and enforced based on a CO's disretion at that moment in time. There really isn't much more to say than that. Tourism photos, magazines and TV shows are full of fish being held for pics that are 'illegal' by some people's reading+application of the laws. Its all very silly! |
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Location: Eastern Ontario | AMEN |
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Posts: 100
| I understand the nature of the argument, and also think that this issue has been disected as much as it can be. Being new to the sport I would like to know if there has ever been a push to clear up the regs, such as gving definition of possession or immediate so that some discretion is taken out of the equation. |
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Location: Eastern Ontario | Probably not I once sat in on a discussion between 4 CO's that couldn't agree as to what a road was. |
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Posts: 174
Location: Ontario | So this has become more muddled than I thought it would be. Whynot said he has sent an e-mail to MNR to clarify the rule on this issue.Will be interesting to see what the letter of the law states.
Im about to have a 52" muskie replica made of a fish caught last year. Guess no invites to CO's to the house |
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Posts: 174
Location: Ontario | I just spoke to the MNR regarding this issue.The answer given is completely different from any suggestions or opinions given so far.
I was told that as long as you have a sport licence(not conservation) You are allowed to land the fish,measure it,take a picture and then release. The fish then counts as your 1 limit fish for the day. Any fish caught after are to be released immediatly while in the water as you have already reached your limit.
Good news !!
Edited by Tim R 3/5/2012 8:48 AM
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Posts: 100
| Glad to get clarification, I guess this means that a CO could not charge you unless he came upon you taking a pic with a fish, and you volunteered to show him pics of other fish you have caught. |
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| Well i guess the only GB ill be fishing in the future will be GREEN BAY! I could catch 20 fish, have a chance at a giant and photograph every one of them! What a stupid law!! |
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| u can catch as many muskies as you want, and get a picture with them as long as you return them to the water. no fish you release back into the water and swims away counts as your "limit" for the day |
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| the difference between "sport" and "conservation" is the amount of fish you can keep...
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Location: Eastern Ontario | Guest you are wrong |
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| the only difference between sport and cons license is amount of fish you can keep and theres no rule about taking a picture then releasing a fish..if there is find it, how many people would be taking pics of musky they catch on their grand trip less than 1% ????
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Location: Eastern Ontario | Tim R - 3/5/2012 9:28 AM
I just spoke to the MNR regarding this issue.The answer given is completely different from any suggestions or opinions given so far.
I was told that as long as you have a sport licence(not conservation) You are allowed to land the fish,measure it,take a picture and then release. The fish then counts as your 1 limit fish for the day. Any fish caught after are to be released immediatly while in the water as you have already reached your limit.
Good news !!
I fail to understand how a fish that is under the legal size limit can count as your I fish limit.
I spoke to a friend this afternoon who is a CO and he said if it was in season and you quickly took a picture and released it he wouldn't do anything, if you took multiple pictures or passed it to a friend for more pictures he would. Where the law is vague some CO's take the word immediately literally and lay the charge. The word immediately is in bold type in the regulations. Most CO's use the law for people catching and releasing bedding bass before the season and in both cases the charges do stick. He also said he has a case going to court right now where the guy brought a sublegal Ottawa R. fish ashore took pictures then tried unsuccessfully to release the fish.
In most cases your not going to have a problem untill you run into the CO that just got chewed out by his supervisor or had a fight with his wife. We had a CO here that would crawl across 100 yds. of broken glass to charge his mother.
Edited by horsehunter 3/5/2012 5:55 PM
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| lets just pull people over for going 1mph over the speed limit... |
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Posts: 174
Location: Ontario | I believe the interpretation is correct.Muskie has a season.You are allowed one fish.If that fish is not 54' it must be released. Basically,dont harvest any muskie,plain and simple.
Not sure any CO would ever find a muskie in a livewell..ever.Unless caught by someone ignorant to the species or rules. But you dont see many of those types out there in the gnarly fall weather
If anything it clarifies that it is a legal fish within my fishing derbies with our fishing club.Thats all I was looking for. |
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| So I take it if you have a big boat and cannot reach the water you cannot fish for Muskie because it cannot be brought aboard? Please......
I would love to see an OMNR give me a ticket for having to big a boat to fish in.
Removing hooks in the water while hanging over the side of the boat is almost insane unless you like to wear hooks. This idea of not taking a picture of an undersized ski is a bunch of hoo haa.
Hoo Haa |
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Posts: 897
| Haven't heard back yet, just got an email saying they forwarded it to the appropriate person. |
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