|
|
Posts: 124
| I just wanted to continue on the topic of lure colors at night. What colors do you like to throw at night? Feel free to list different lure types, weather, chop, or moon conditions if you wish.
Lee Tauchen
http://LeeTauchen.com |
|
| |
|
Posts: 829
Location: Maple Grove, MN | I have gone to spinner baits with a glow blade and black skirt or black hair. The glow blade is easy to see so locating and presenting the lure is easier. I don't think the fish care if the blade is glow or not.
Without the glow blade, I get a lot of "clunks" - when the steel leader hits the rod. 
Edited by Herb_b 1/26/2010 12:28 PM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 496
| I have had luck with grim reaper inline spinner baits at night . Black with nickle blades. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 1348
Location: Pewaukee, WI | Hi Lee. My favorite night time bait is the double 10s Gerry's Girl that I tie up with Salt N' Pepper flashabou and with 1 nickel and 1 blk. nickel or smoke blade. You can see that bait coming through the water column a long ways out, even on a dimly lit night.  |
|
| |
|
Posts: 574
| I throw mostly white just so I can see it. Oh yeah and because it works. Easier for me to see= easier for them to see? Maybe...
Rainbow or blu/nik DCGs are visible and work well also.
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 2894
Location: Yahara River Chain | It doesn't matter what color I throw. i have night blindness and I couldn't see it even if it glowed. I however, will be in tune with the sound of my topwater.
Edited by muskie! nut 1/26/2010 12:51 PM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 283
Location: neenah, wisconsin | black jntd depthraider w/silver glitter from long ago,,,,,cant beat it for deeper weed edges----10-15ft!!!!!big glow bead above the leader also!
Edited by muskie54956 1/26/2010 12:52 PM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 433
Location: Cedarburg, Wisconsin | I doubt whether color makes a diddly bit of difference at night for muskies. My best luck came on surface lures. A cisco colored Hawg Wobbler, an Orange LeLure Globe, and a black Top Raider with a chartreuse tail. After that, a Solid black Depth Raider, and spinnerbaits with florescent painted blades.
I have seen a tremendous color preference for walleyes after dark and it usually was chartreuse. Muskies? No. |
|
| |
|
| color can make a HUGE difference at night....there are def times we have seen muskies prefer certain blade colors or flashabou colors at night...where 2 boats working together, communicating what they are seeing/catching can be key...anyone who thinks color doesn't matter at night (at times) simply hasn't put in enough hours to see the times it does matter imho...
again, some nights you can throw about any bucktail color at them and they hit it..at other times the color could be the trigger..i'm more of a believer in the sound/vibration of certain lures having more of an effect but color def matters (at times)
I throw mainly black topwaters at night....just a conf thing...but realize I should be experimenting just like a do w/ subsurface lures |
|
| |
|
| Believe what you want, but muskies rely mostly on their LATERAL LINE to feed (especially at night!) |
|
| |
|
| key word is mostly.
have seen nights were a certain color can and does get more hits than others...
|
|
| |
|
Location: SE Wisconsin | Surely they do, but don't eliminate other triggers. It's false to assume musky simply blindfold themselves at night before going on the prowl - I've never met a musky named Jean Claude Van Dam. There is more to their arsenal than their lateral line and mandable pores. Why not throw something that carries a clear visual profile to cue the hunters senses? I tend to believe that golds, like brass and copper throw off more reflection of the moon than silver - call me crazy - so I tend to use those blades. I like black at night, at least in the way of skirts for blade baits, it can make a nice sillohuette under a clear moonlit sky.
When you're in a treestand surrounded by turkeys or squirrels, but your waiting for the crunch of a deer, the distraction or distortion of sound alerts you to utelize your vision to aid in your hunt so that big buck doesn't slip by you. Musky, simply put, have to have all their senses or wits about them to uphold that ultimate predator title. I digress, however, that while I believe in visual cues, none the less, I DO still consider a muskies sense of feel (lateral and mandable pores) to be their strongest weapon day and night. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 32810
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | bn,
There is no color at night, and muskies cannot see color at night even if there was.
If they 'prefer' a certain 'color' lure and you are absolutely sure that's it and not another variable in the overall footprint, it's contrasting well and elicits the reaction you are looking for for that and perhaps a dozen other reasons..
My favorite night color? Lack of one entirely on the bottom, white on the top so I can see the lure using my head lamp.
Sam,
A muskie approaching the lure at about 42 degrees will see it at about 10 degrees because of the effect on light in the water. Like as not, and light reflected from the moon isn't a factor, as it's reflected back towards the source for the most part. Moonlight increases ambient light, however, so things change as the moon rises and sets. At 10 to 20 degrees, most of the moonlight is reflected back off a calm surface. But when there's waves.... |
|
| |
|
| the starts, moon, city lights etc don't shed light into the water ? how can there be zero color at night? I am convinced at times color does matter at night...too many nights on the water and experiences to think differently...but who knows...guess that is my gut and not science talking |
|
| |
|
Posts: 2024
| guest - 1/26/2010 1:38 PM
Believe what you want, but muskies rely mostly on their LATERAL LINE to feed (especially at night!)
This is an interesting point, though one I'm not sure I agree with 100%. See below link to study on muskie capture behavior.
To summarize it, muskies use their vision and lateral lines in compliment to capture prey. Vision is used to find the prey and initiate the beginning of the strike while the lateral line helps make critical, last minute fine-scale adjustments to successfully capture prey.
I'm guessing this was done in very clear water tanks since video was used to analyze the strike, so turbidity and light levels were not analyzed. It would be interesting to see what systems (vision/lateral line) they use at night and if one is used more or less than the other. However, I wouldn't totally write off vision as a key component to night-time feeding behavior.
http://jeb.biologists.org/cgi/reprint/204/6/1207.pdf |
|
| |
|
Posts: 23
| Having spent quite a few all nighters with BN in the boat at night I think he knows what hes talking about!
There are simply colors that outfish other colors at night. Period. When you switch baits from the guy in the front to the guy in the back and that bait gets bit 4 times and no other baits get touched, how can you explain that? Talk to other boats on the water at night, sometimes all it takes is a phone call and a switch of baits for them to start catching fish. |
|
| |
|
| contrast then and not color..whatever it is...as Scottie mentions we have had 2 boats on the same lake w/ one boat getting lots of action, the other boat getting basically none..a quick text or call to the other boat to switch to the colors the action boat is getting and guess what..they start seeing/catching fish...guess in that situation I'd like to know how it is only the footprint as all 4 baits in the water were double 10s..only difference was the color...
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 32810
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | bn,
Not enough for color to exist, keep in mind water is a prism and even in pretty good light, removes most colors pretty quickly. And, Muskies are on Rod Vision then anyway, and can't see colors, but ARE 30 times more light sensitive in that mode, so contrast seems to be key.
Part of the overall footprint of the presentation is it's visual cues to the muskie...that's not mutually exclusive, IMO.
Just trying to point out color is irrelevant, but contrast due to the shade of grey the color becomes to B&W vision isn't. When talking different paints that LOOK the same in the light of day, we can be talking yards of differences after dark.
|
|
| |
|
| that I can agree with..I guess we call it color but to a musky it might be contrast..whatever it is..I have seen where color (that we see) on baits does make a difference to the muskies...as they may see it as contrast...that's fine w/ me...just saying I'm a firm believer color can and does matter...at night ..and in the daytime...
I let the fish tell me what color they want at night but tend to start w/ bucktails that have 2 different colored blades and go from there |
|
| |
|
Posts: 32810
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | As an example of a small portion of what I'm trying to point out, let's say you want an orange blade. Orange is yellow and red mixed. if the base color is red and just enough yellow is added to make it look orange, it becomes darker faster than if the base color is yellow and a tad of red is added. |
|
| |
|
Location: Latitude 41.3016 Longitude 88.6160 | Most of the time it is black for me, but last year on Bright Full Moon nights, DCG 10 with pink blades and pink tinsel was hot for me, I was casting black DCG and my partner was using a Pink Bladed - Pink Tinsel DCG10 and he was seeing all the action. The Pink DCG only was hot if it was full moon. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 727
| I've have had my best luck with a black creeper. |
|
| |
|
Location: SE Wisconsin | Steve, I think you're working around the effects of the purkinje shift. An example: A bed of roses. Under the sun, the red is very profound and effervescent compared to their green stems. While the green stems are still very green, bright green at that, their effervescence doesn't stand out as much as the shades of vibrant red. REVERSE under an overcast day, as well as early morning and late evening as the sun rises and falls. During that low-light period, the vibrant red of the rose buds now show dull and even dark, while the green stands out as the vibrant of the two colors.
I will explain further my point to the moonlight vs overcast skies in the night. Blade reflection surely does catch the eye to a lurking musky - there is no doubt about that. While in the darkness, a musky may not be able to make out that I'm using a gold blade, they certainly will see the flash - admittedly, not in the same way we do, but think of it in black and white for a moment where the color sceme is black, white and grey. While most of the flash DOES in fact angle upwards, the inside of the curved blade does emit a downward flash, while gentle, it still exists. My BST- it could make a "blinking" effect that would catch the eye of a musky.
In a black and white world, even black and grey, just the same as night-vision works, different colors produce different shades in the darkness. A brown would appear lighter under darkness than would black. Wave refraction of light, and simple surface refraction doesn't constitute ALL light, that is evident when you can sometimes see the rays of a boat light or the moon dancing on the bottom of a shallow sand flat. As you dig into the depths of a steep break or basin, of course light can be assumed less than week, it would be vacant. But in the shallows, I believe PINK, as someone mentioned above, would surely elicit a "lighter" shade in dark water - perhaps catching someones eye below.
This is a great topic, I think there's a lot we're gonna learn from all the responses. |
|
| |
|
Location: SE Wisconsin | Muskerboy - 1/26/2010 3:14 PM
I've have had my best luck with a black creeper.
Point is, aside from the color component, water displacement and noise (which isn't heard, but IS felt), as well as the dark profile/sillohuette can turn some heads. Disturbances on the surface clearly spark interest in fish, it's impossible for them to be unaware if they are close, so it would seem to be a great option to go with. Surely ripping cabbage with big blades can stir the emotions of a surprised musky enough to entice some action, and so can slow-rolling a big blade. I think slow-rolling is a great go-to tactic because it's slow enough for the muskies to zero in on it with less effort than chasing half blind in the dark using vibration as their headlights. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 968
Location: N.FIB | I have an orange creeper that has done great on full moon nights,and in the daytime.Anything else I throw will most likely be black,or have alot of black in it. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 182
Location: musky waters of SE, WI | Black skirted and chart bladed super model. I like to be able to see the bait coming, but still use a mostly black lure.
Edited by Ryan_Cotter 1/26/2010 3:53 PM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 32810
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | 'I will explain further my point to the moonlight vs overcast skies in the night. Blade reflection surely does catch the eye to a lurking musky - there is no doubt about that. While in the darkness, a musky may not be able to make out that I'm using a gold blade, they certainly will see the flash - admittedly, not in the same way we do, but think of it in black and white for a moment where the color sceme is black, white and grey. While most of the flash DOES in fact angle upwards, the inside of the curved blade does emit a downward flash, while gentle, it still exists. My BST- it could make a "blinking" effect that would catch the eye of a musky.'
Only if the reflected light reaches the Muskie's eye. Take a convex mirror, and put a light source at the angle you would like to test, then rotate that mirror to mimic the rotation of a bucktail blade, for example. Note where the reflected light ends up, and you will see my point. Take care to remember that most light from level to 20 degrees is reflected off the surface of the water and never enters this debate anyway, so the light source has to be at the 20 degree or more angle.
Purkinje shift isn't on the radar screen here. You have the prism effect of water, the periscope effect at the angle of attack in calm water, the fact muskies cannot see color at night even if there's enough ambient light to create any ( a parking lot in the bright moonlight displays a bunch of light gray to black cars. Some of the light shaded cars are middle shades of green, as are some of the dark shaded cars, it's the base color of blue or yellow and how that is applied and mixed that makes it so).
Pink is red mixed with/diluted by all color, or white. If there's ambient light available at the angle of the muskie's attack considering reflected and refracted light to water conditions, it will appear to a muskie to be gray. If there isn't, it will appear not at all. So why use a color that if all goes perfectly 'appears' gray, instead of gray? True Gray is a dilution of black with white or the other way around, depending. Absense of, presense of, in a mixture. No primary color mixes to try to figure out...
Here's an experiment. Take all your 'perch' pattern lures and hang them outside on the east side of your house tonight. Look at them at dusk, a little later, and after dark. The differences in contrast of each lure which are supposedly all the same 'color', especially against the snow, will surprise you. Now compare them after dark against a basically mirror like surface, and you have the moonlit shallows with the moon at it's high point in clear water, but your eyes are not 30 times more sensitive to available light, so we still are guessing.
If your neighbor asks what the heck you are doing, tell her/him you just washed your lures. No more explanation is necessary.
Then, of course, there's Gerry Bucholtz's ideas that UV may be a factor...
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 3518
Location: north central wisconsin | Good thread. With kids now, after dark is one of the few times I can go have quiet 'me' time and not feel guilty about it, especially when on vacation somewhere, as I still have the day to spend with the fam for sight seeing and boat rides.
That said, the one thing I have learned over the years is how little color seems to matter in our production. Where I used to use black lures to a fault, I now grab the lure that gives me the confidence for the situation9which is often a certain color, but..). For example, when the sun goes down and I feel like throwing topwatr, I might just grab my trusty pumpkin orange rylure tail bait. Next night it might be my white/orange/nickel ac-10, followed by the trusty green frog jointed creeper etc etc.
I guess my point is, if that same tail bait mentioned above was pink, it would still be the first tail bait out as it has a sound that I/we have just not been able to duplicate. If that ac-10 was mauve, I would still grab it as it just has the vibe/size/ and proper weight to keep it running at the depth and speed I want it.
I like bright/light colored baits at night so I can see them coming in(I don't fish with headlamp on), but that is about my only color consideration anymore.
I firmly believe that lure size, action, depth, and speed will trump the color every single time and I'd suspect that those lures that you use that are golden at night posess something more than a 'lucky' color, if you really look into it.
The coolest thing is that since I have come to realize using black lures makes little to no difference in my production, I have been able to focus on the 'why's' a lure produces at night and how to duplicate it.
Edited by Reef Hawg 1/26/2010 4:54 PM
|
|
| |
|
| What I find very interesting is take a guy like Jason (who catches lots o big fish) above who is pretty much saying he doesn't think color matters..and maybe me or other buddies of mine who live and fish in MN and catch lots of huge fish at night and they SWEAR that color can and does matter...very interesting to see both sides...I do agree there are more things to trigger a fish at night than color but I look at it the same way I do moon rise and moonset...it might just be that one extra trigger added to trip the fish into hitting...I'll take it...
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 3518
Location: north central wisconsin | One thing I should note is that I don't have quite the experience chasing those mn fish night after night like brad does. Where I get 10-12 nights over there sporadically, he does 25-30 and many in a row, to see patterns develop. Don't catch the numberseither, so maybe I should read his logic a bit more closely... That said, I have definately seen where certain colored lures of mine produce at certain times at night, really well. However, it is my opinion that I could paint them(won't) a different color and they'd still perform. What I am talking about are hard baits. When it comes to bucktails, I just have not seen where I could switch to a color that is getting eaten and have more action. It usually comes down to how the guy is reeling or something about the blades, weight , or length. That said, I have certain colored doubles(10's or 13's) that are go to''s in certain situations at night, based on depth/time of year/water clarity/weeds vs clean bottom etc. I guess what I need to do is pick some lures that closest resemble the best producers, but in different colors, to see if they work equally well. Just tough to stray from standby's.
Edited by Reef Hawg 1/26/2010 6:36 PM
|
|
| |
