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Posts: 726
Location: Eau Claire, WI | It seems the answer is no.
In my tire kicking quest, I've looked at a lot of boats and there seems to be no rhyme or reason to pricing. makes it hard to decide what a good deal is or what a fair offer should be.
Here's one example - I saw a 12 year old 692 listed for 2x the book value. Why? NADA has the value at $8K and they want north of $15K. Are 692s that valuable and why is it that NADA doesn't reflect that?
I've seen 2000 620s for $30K and 2004s for $30K
How do you guys figure out what a decent price should be? Don't get me wrong, if people can get what they want for their boats, more power to them. However, as a buyer it makes me a little nervous figuring what is a fair deal for both parties.
Jono
Edited by Jono 2/8/2008 1:41 PM
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Location: Lake Geneva, WI | I don't think NADA values include the motor, you also have to price that. |
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| so many things to take into consideration on buying a used boat...condition, how well it was maintained, supply/demand, what motors are on it, i.e. are some troublesome motors/engines?
I sold a ski boat last April that the nada had a high retail of 16k, I got 2500 more than that because anyone who looked at it could not believe it was 10 yrs old...it was flawless with quite a few upgrades. And the person that bought it had a matching color truck. so he paid maybe more than it was "worth" to others.
690/692's are a good hull that can handle big water but isn't overkill and fits in most garages. I think your bluebook of 4600 is a bit off.
It all comes down to the condition, how it was maintained and what YOU think is fair...why worry about what others do or don't pay? buying a boat isn't bragging rights at the dock to see who got theirs for more or less.
my 2 cents |
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Posts: 13688
Location: minocqua, wi. | on a lot of boats the NADA rings true ... with the 690-series it gets thrown out the window because that was a classic layout and platform that will always be desireable, mostly because when you compare them to new boats they win hands down for price and value even at the 3x book numbers ... if you are able to find a good one. they come up and don't last long when they are for sale.
you could always just buy my boat JONO ... special price just for you.  |
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Posts: 726
Location: Eau Claire, WI | Guest, I double checked and it is 4600 but I should have said that is without motor. that was my mistake. makes it roughly double book value.
Edited by Jono 2/8/2008 1:40 PM
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Posts: 726
Location: Eau Claire, WI | jonnysled, ya that's pretty much what I'm going through. I'm convinced there is no perfect boat. Just being patient and keep looking around for something close to perfect.
I've got a good handle on what things cost but still scratching my head as to the disparity. There a lot of 690/692 fans out there and I figure theres good old supply/demand for you.
good luck selling yours, is that the center console boat I've seen around?
Jono |
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Posts: 2427
Location: Ft. Wayne Indiana | There are a zillion used boats out there for sale, and most of them are over priced, In My Opinion...
People put a price on it....it doesn't sell for 2 months so they drop the price a few grand....it doesn't sell....so they drop the price again....If you want to sell it why not put your price on it and SELL IT!
I had sold my last three boats without having to advertise. When somebody is interested in my boat, I call my bank, get the pay off amount for the month of December, and that's what they pay. Not a dollar more. If the pay off is $28,678 then that's what I will tell people the boat is for sale for. Not 33,000 or 32,000... My boats blue book for alot more, as they are "current year" boats, but I just don't feel right sitting on a boat for a few months trying to squeeze a few grand out of them.
Blue books are a good place to start, but definately not the bible on prices.
Edited by MikeHulbert 2/8/2008 6:45 PM
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Posts: 13688
Location: minocqua, wi. | try selling a center console offshore boat sometime .... the market is small .... very, very, very small. everyone is curious about them but very few want to commit to that drastic a change. it's just not something that most people are comfortable with. but most people who have been in mine make the same comment after spending time in it ... like ... "wow, this makes total sense" or "more people should see this kind of boat" ... or "someday more will go this way ... all they have to do is be in it once" ... which is true but tough to "sell" |
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| Jono its sometimes all about what someone has in it when it comes to asking price. A lot of people put these toys on long term loans and 5 years later the payoff needed is quite high. The other factor working against you is that new boat prices have gone up substantially in the last few years. This will drive up the used boat prices. For example, a fair price when I bought my 03' 620 a few years ago was about $30k. Today I can still get almost exactly what I paid for it. |
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Posts: 412
Location: Waukesha, WI | when working up a list price for my Lund Mr Pike, I looked at NADA Guides and talked to my marine dealer. I was told that NADA Guides isn't what they use because it is a national average which includes those run in saltwater, and it's updated yearly. Also, my dealer uses a different book of which I can't recall, but it is updated quarterly and takes location into account. HTH, Mike |
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Posts: 726
Location: Eau Claire, WI | Thanks to all of you for the insights.
ESfishOX, I think the book you are referring to is ABOS. It's a dealer only professional publication not publicly available from what I understand. I think it's based on a wholesale price and what they use to calculate trade in. I'd love to get my hands on one of these books. My bank uses NADA so if I wanted to finance something then it's gotta be pretty close to the book or its a "bad" loan for the bank to make.
Just another tough angle like Guest talks about. New prices high raises the level for all so you'd better have some decent bucks to pony up if you plan to finance a used rig to make up the difference between book and reality.
This is interesting stuff. I keep learning more as I go looking for my next ride.
Jono
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Posts: 11
Location: grasston | Hey Mike buy a new Ranger Z -commanche and I will pick it up from you in a couple years !! Tony |
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Posts: 317
Location: Grafton, WI | I ask this question all the time when I think about selling my current boat (which I hope to do this spring / summer).
I have a 1989 Tuffy Marauder
In 2003, the hull was refinished and repainted (also added a new trailer at that time)
In 2004, the interior was completed redone to match a new esox ltd.
So, how would I price this one? NADA pricing reflects the faded, worn-out boat I used to have, not the nice and shiny one it is now.
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Posts: 5874
| The bank payoff cetainly isn't the bible. Here's what would happen if I called the bank.
Me: "What is the payoff on my boat loan"
Bank: "Uhm, Mr. Sheppard, you don't have a note on your boat."
Me: "Oh, then I guess that I shouldn't sell it for nothing.
If your boat is worth $32K, and you owe $28K on the note, why wouldn't you try to sell it for the $32K, or at least something between what you owe, and what it is worth. I'd wait a couple months for a couple grand.
My last boat was on the market for 3 months. Lots of calls and lookers, but no offers. I also had a few say I was asking too much for it. Well I originally asked $18,900, and sold it for $17,900. That was the first offer I got, and accepted. One of the early callers called back, and when I told him what I sold it for, he said he would have paid that. I just said then he should have made an offer.
The price will be what the market will bear. If you feel the boat is worth a certain amount, then list it at that, or slightly above, and encourage offers. Only you can decide ultimately if you will accept a low offer or not. The best way to get an idea is look at the pricing on a lot of similar boats. There's plenty out there to get a good idea. |
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Posts: 1663
Location: Kodiak, AK | jonnysled - 2/8/2008 1:40 PM
try selling a center console offshore boat sometime .... the market is small .... very, very, very small. everyone is curious about them but very few want to commit to that drastic a change. it's just not something that most people are comfortable with. but most people who have been in mine make the same comment after spending time in it ... like ... "wow, this makes total sense" or "more people should see this kind of boat" ... or "someday more will go this way ... all they have to do is be in it once" ... which is true but tough to "sell"
SOLD! 
Good talking to you on the phone tonight. |
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| AWESOME! the king of tire kickers gets to go shopping..uh oh, now we are in store for 6 mo of more tire kicking Bette!
good job on buyin that rig off him...! |
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Posts: 13688
Location: minocqua, wi. | giddyup ... you know there are things that i'll never get back from operating that rig. just this morning our dear bette reminded me that it makes a statement on the trailer moving through town ... it's no surprise where i am ... that boat commands attention and that's true. i am ready to go to a smaller boat though and excited about shopping for something that fits my changing needs.
.... i think i've got it narrowed down nellie ... 618 with a swingaway will go into the garage easily. i want that peace of mind more than anything. no more driving 4 miles to get the boat.
major thing i think i'll miss is the view from the center console especially on the big water so watch for me complaining about missing the ride on rough water in the future lol
esoxfly based on what you told me of your interests last night you're gonna love this boat! |
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Posts: 726
Location: Eau Claire, WI | Looks like this conversation helped your sale, Sled. Glad it worked out for both of you.
Jono
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Posts: 742
Location: Grand Rapids MN | You have to pay some attention to NADA just because that's what banks use when reviewing loans. So if the boat you are looking at is selling over that book value then you'll need the extra cash to put down on it. The book may not be a 'true' representation but its what drives the cash flow for most of us and getting approved. Boats seem to hold their value longer than what we are used to when compared to our other depreciating investments like trucks, cars, etc. 2 years ago I bought my first boat for under book value and I still get amazed when I look up value versus what I owe on it... I can actually pay it down faster than it depreciates!
Good luck shopping and hold out for the one.... I looked for over a year and withing 2 days found and bought my boat. You'll know it when you see it. |
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Posts: 1663
Location: Kodiak, AK | jonnysled - 2/28/2008 8:03 AM
esoxfly based on what you told me of your interests last night you're gonna love this boat!
Agreed. Enough bow space for one guy, enough storage for my stuff, enough boat for big water and enough floor space for the dog.
I just got your email Jon. I'm game. I'm out the door right now for the gym, then to work. I'll try to give you a call tonight; if not, tomorrow.
Jeff |
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Posts: 1663
Location: Kodiak, AK | Targa01 - 2/28/2008 10:29 AM
You have to pay some attention to NADA just because that's what banks use when reviewing loans.
Usually. I was sitting the bank yesterday talking about a loan for the boat mentioned above, and they told me they use KBB or NADA depending on the underwriter and the loan. That's the extent of my knowledge on that; it's just what the gal told me. |
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Posts: 742
Location: Grand Rapids MN | You're right.. I've heard of them using KBB also but didn't think of mentioning it. All the banks my wife has worked with or dealt with have used NADA so that stuck in my mind.
Thanks.. |
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Posts: 1663
Location: Kodiak, AK | Yeah it was news to me too. A good friend's wife is a higher-up in a bank she said the same thing about going with NADA and don't bother with KBB, but then yesterday Wells Fargo sprung that on me. |
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