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Posts: 1460
Location: Kronenwetter, WI | Like most anglers I manage to get on the water a couple times each week throughout the summer. I catch my share of fish each year, but I have been out with a few guides and almost always put a fish in the boat. I always thought a good amount of the success rate must be due to the guides ability to be on the water every or nearly every day for many hours at a time....getting onto different waters when one proves unproductive....
My question is this...how much of your success as a musky guide do you attribute to sheer time on the water...developing and being on patterns with regard to lake choice, lure selection, and time of day? In other words if you were off the water for two weeks and came in cold...how much would that influence your success?
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Posts: 32930
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | One is inseparable from the other for me, because I've fished the waters I guide for so many years. Most days I can find the fish even if I have not been out there at all for weeks, but some days, they simply do NOT go, and no amount of looking works. |
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Posts: 227
Location: Southeast Wisconsin | Time on the water is key, but skill, dumb luck, and sticking to the fundamentals have alot to do with it as well.
For the last 4 opening days myself or clients have boated fish, so not fishing a particular lake for an extended period of time hasnt really been a factor. On the same hand, theres lakes that I dont fish until fall and when I do finally fish them, expect to catch and see fish on my first trip...and usually do.
Like Steve said though, when there off there off..
Edited by Ben Kueng 1/10/2007 1:48 AM
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Posts: 1060
Location: Palm Coast, FL | I strongly agree with Steve. Yes, you need to be on the water for the most part. But many times it is the history of the body of water you are fishing. Certain lures/areas have worked out in the past. You do have to be out there and look for new patterns...adaptation.
Many times I will try "off the wall" baits/presentations while having clients throwing what is working for sure. |
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Posts: 1296
Location: Hayward, Wisconsin | I have to echo what Worrall said. If you know your water and the seasons, etc. it isn't hard to get on fish. Getting them to bite however is another story. And yes, depending on weather patterns, early spring, late spring, etc. things do change slightly from season to season. It is then that not having been on the water, but "knowing" the lake pays big dividends!
Muskie regards,
Larry Ramsell
www.larryramsell.com |
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Posts: 2691
Location: Pewaukee, Wisconsin | There is no substitute for being on the water. Time on the water will keep you up to date on the changing patterns that happen all season long. The only thing that keeps you on top of this if your not out there for weeks is good friends. When I take a vacation I will be on the phone on the way back to see what is going on if I have to guide the next day. I like to keep up to date on the lakes I fish and guide. The cell phone is a great tool when your not on the water.
As for the history of the lake: That is always a great place to start and then work from there. Patterns come and go as the water temps change. Wind, weather and boating activity will all come into play with patterns.
Best bet is to be on the water as much as possible and when off the water be intouch with people who are out. This will keep you on fish and catching fish all the time, not just some good weeks during the year.
Time on the water!!!! |
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Posts: 389
Location: Presque Isle Wisconsin | All of the above are great answers.Probably the best thing a giude has going for him or her is a detailed knowledge of the of the lakes structural elements and how baitfish,and as a result of baitfish being present,how muskies will present themselves in that location.
Factors such as the highway a muskie will use getting to that spot,or how light hits a certain spot at a certain time of day are just a couple of examples of how we Should be at least incrementaly better that the guy that just sees a weed bed,etc abd starts casting something he thinks will work. If you dont get get very good at this on the lakes you fish,well then you wont be in the business for long.I kinda look at my job as removing luck from the equation as much as possble.Its all about reducing the odds against you as much as possible every day and connecting the dots enough to keep food on the table. |
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Posts: 1936
Location: Eau Claire, WI | All good answers I have to agree with.
There are some waters that I have learned like the back of my hand and like Steve and Larry said, you just know based on experience where/how to start based on time of year, weather patterns, etc.
The other element is what Mike eluded to as he experiences this on Pewaukee. Staying on the water and in touch with the little things that make all the difference. On lakes that get a lot of pressure such as Pewaukee, being out there and being in tune to what's happening instead of doing the same things out of habit can make all the difference.
Another thing is having or making the time to try new spots and different tactics on waters you've fished for many years. I spent a fair amount of time doing this this past summer on my home lake. The traditional spots are getting more and more pressure all the time. Making time to try new locations, new tactics doesn't always pay dividends but it does help your learning curv and once in while you find something that hits pay-day. The hard part about this is fishing new locations during prime times knowing you may not do "squat" and resisiting the urge to run to spots you know you've been successful on in the past. Gotta keep the learning curv going... This something I do when I'm out alone or with a few friends, the thrill of the hunt helps keep it fun and interesting.
Edited by Mark H. 1/10/2007 3:09 PM
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Posts: 1906
Location: Oconto Falls, WI | Not a lot to add. First hand on the water time initially is key to build a base knowledge. Reading structure when fishing it is another good one. Know where the break or inside turn is well before you get there. Not blowing spots by bad boat control. Paying attention to ALL the little things.
However, I think having the confidence and making those in the boat have that confidence in what you are doing is very important. You have to believe what you are doing is the right choice, and when the doubt creaps in the guide knows when to switch gears and go to a different tactic/location. Sticking to your guns and not "chasing rainbows". Not letting the client quit believing in what you are doing, as then the guard is let down for that one key moment we have been fishing all day for.
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Posts: 906
Location: Warroad, Mn | Knowledge is the key. Time on the water creates knowledge. Fishing the same water makes it easier, but knowledge will put you on fish on lots of different lakes in a short time.
Doug Johnson |
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| i agree with all of above
time on water
familairness with the lake/river
keeping focused and hopefully away from bad habits we all develop easily.
and most of all keep the bait in the water.......
dannyboy
www.dannyboysguideservice.com |
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Posts: 376
Location: Lake Vermilion Tower, MN | On the water is the best teacher you can get. However it only works, when you're paying attention.
Abosulte focus and
absolutely believing that what you're doing, is the best way to get on that fish. Confidence in your game plan, will make you a much more determinded angler.
Experience isn't a thing you can get in a book or a video.
You can only get it on the water. 
"Ace" |
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Location: WI | Time on the water; (which leads to knowledge) patterns change all the time, being on the water helps in staying on top of things when they do. Also having a good network helps.
Confidence/Focus; expect a fish every cast and be ready for it. (do as I say, not as I do)
Boat Control; Probably the most overlooked thing, but definatly one of the most important.
Being able to adapt; not being too bullheaded when you hit a rut, because what worked yesterday (spots/lures/tactics) doesnt always work the next day.
Have fun, thats what it is really all about! |
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| We put decades of fishing patterns in our mind's files and pull them out when conditions dictate.
Instinct comes into play on every trip. I usually don't know exactly what I'll try on every trip - I have a good idea - but when I am on the water and feel the wind and smell the air and see where the birds are hanging out -then I let my instincts take over.This comes from fishing a few bodies of water ALOT and knowing them intimatley.
Alot of good guides are on the cutting edge - we try new techniques that later become mainstream. I think the most important element is having a deep passion for the sport and knowing the science of the fish we seek. Ben brought up a great point about opening day. The last 4 have been great for me as well - we haven't fished for months but opening day is a little different as the fish haven't been pressured for months and are a bit more vulnerable.
Guides do have tough days on the water as well - some days you have to really work for action - other days you hit one on your first cast - that's what keeps us coming back.
Kevin Moore
Muskies etc. Guide Service |
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| TIME ON THE WATER AND EXPERIENCE ON A SPECIFIC BODY OF WATER CAN MAKE UP FOR ALOT IF YOU'VE BEEN AWAY FOR AWHILE OR THE FIRST TIME OF THE SEASON BUT..... WITH REPEATED,CONTINUOUS DAYS ON THE WATER COMES NUMEROUS FISH SPOTTED,LOCATED, AND PATTERNED SPOTS AS TO WHAT WIND,LIGHT,TIME OF DAY,ETC IS GOING ON AT THAT TIME,WEATHER PATTERNS, OR PARTICULAR SEASON BESIDES THAT REALLY CAN SWING THE ODDS BIG TIME. LUCK CAN PLAY A BIG PART BUT MOST THAT DO IT CONSISTANTLY MAKE THIER OWN LUCK. |
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| I can honestly say I would be lost for a pattern on the Chip if I was off of it for three weeks or so. The Chip changes so much. I don't think it's as big of a deal on LAKES to be off them for some time but flowages seem to have differing structure and baitfish movement. When we go to LOTW the same spots we caught fish on the year before don't always produce, whereas on most of the lakes I fish the same spots always produce. Make sense?
Ty |
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