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Posts: 2258
Location: SE, WI. | ToddM - 2/7/2020 7:08 AM That is one of the main reasons to get involved, the causes. If you have caught a stocked fish in Illinois, not just a musky, even a descendant of a stocked fish in Illinois my club FRV as well as the other musky clubs in Illinois, the IMTT through the IMA has had a hand in putting that fish on the end of your line. The same can be said for any Muskies caught in Lake Geneva Wisconsin. We have even helped Indiana some. More than enough reason to be involved in some way. Go to their fundraising events, donate. We are the biggest contributors to the IDNR and their needs. Com-On Todd; how about a little credit to the Milwaukee chapter, M I. For help stocking the Fox Chain;) JD |
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Posts: 165
Location: Cedarburg, WI. | 37 here. I won't participate in something that feels more like a "good ol boys" club and a place that serves more to stroke the ego's of the people in charge. I send Muskie's Inc a check every other year in hopes to help with stocking otherwise i have no interest. I can get all the inside info and or seminar type talks on You Tube as well.
Also felt the same way about a gun club my father and I belonged to years back. |
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Posts: 1340
| It's a snowy Friday afternoon here in Colorado, I hesitate to jump in on this topic but here it goes.
My dad was a Muskie fishermen from Wisconsin and been going up north since 1936 when he was four years old and my mom was born in northern Minnesota. I grew up in California but spent some summers in northern Wis. as a teen ager.
We moved to Colorado in 1991 after my dad retired and I lost my job.
In winter of 92 I found work and joined The Colorado Chapter Of Muskies Inc. witch was founded in 1990 or 91.
My dad and I were on the local board on and off from the beginning.
I was RVP for the chapter from spring 99-fall 2001 and my dad was chapter president for part of that time.
Our chapter numbers would hover around 100. (there was a small chapter in northern CO. for a short time also)
When I was RVP we had almost two hundred members.
some of the old guard did not like how the chapter was run and I guess did not like me or my pop!
So we stepped away from the board and just come to the meetings and other functions let some of the others do the work.
At this point membership was dropping and some of the old members who were not on the board were starting to die off to the weed bed in the sky. Then one fateful night at a banquet mom, dad and myself sat at a table and two couples come and sit by us, them someone come up a whispered in the ear of one of the couples and they got up and sat somewhere else and no one come and set with us for the rest of the night.
then the president during a speech thanked to whole state of Colorado for there work in muskies Inc except for dad myself and my nephew.
After the banquet a number of peeed off people to our aid with words of encouragement.
My dad did not re up and I went unaffiated and after I could not get the international to send me my release patches I was done. 2 3 years later five people showed up for the Christmas party (this used to be quite popular) And the chapter was disbanded. |
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Posts: 20212
Location: oswego, il | Not every club is a good ole boys club. I can say that my club is definitely not that way. We have a good group who are pretty selfess and feel they are a part of something good. I know I feel that way about them. We take nothing from it. Even with that it's tough to get members involved in activities. We have a decent turnout for our meetings but down from where it was 10-15 years ago when our January meeting would see 100-150 people, our tournament at capacity. Our most important event is our banquet which relies on a good bump of people who are well outside the musky community to make it successful. Far less than half are members. This year that bump of people won't be there. It will make things tough without that support. |
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Posts: 8772
| It's part getting people to join, and part getting people to stay. Sure, there's the "good old boy" thing, but that's perception from a few folks who walk into a room full of people who have known each other for years expecting to be immediately recognized because they have a pulse and can fog a mirror... Relationships of any sort require social interaction. To me, that's a skill lacking in the younger generations. I'm sure we as older folks aren't stellar at it either, but here's a story of why my wife left MI and will never return:
Some years back... I had just gotten her into the sport, first trip to Canada, first introduction to M.I., first actual day muskie fishing...
Wife whacks a 45"er on a topraider, maybe 10 casts into her actually knowing how to put a lure where you want it. *BLAM!!* Coolest topwater strike I've ever seen. Wife gets fish. Not a hawg, but a #*^@ nice fish for a beginner and especially a woman.
Wife wins award in our club for said fish...
As we usually do in our club, award winners get to go up on stage during the awards banquet and tell their story. She does. Wordy. Excited, as expected. Not realizing that lots of guys took a long time to get to 45"...
During this, some little punk DB kid at another table loudly exclaims: "Somebody needs to punch her in the face!!"
Well... Okay. I didn't hear that. She didn't hear that. Hats off to the guys in my club for removing said DB prior to telling me or her about it. Whaddya got, small dick syndrome? Maybe your biggest fish is 42"??
Well... Wife quit M.I. and swore she'd never go back. Reason being "What kind of ^%$&ing ^&*-HOLES" do you hang around with??!! THIS is the ^%*$*^& crowd?! If you heard that, I'd be sitting at the police station trying to get you out of $%^&* JAIL!! God KNOWS WTF we'd have to pay for lawyers! And no amount of money would even get you close, because that ^&$%* would be in little pieces, and you'd no have no WAY to justify what you did!"
Again, hats off to the cooler heads in our club, because she probably wasn't far off in her assessment. Best case would have been if she heard it instead of me. No judge in the world would convict her, but I have no doubt she'd have put a hurt on that MF that he'd remember to his deathbed... |
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Posts: 2315
Location: Chisholm, MN | Ufff, peees me off just thinking about that! |
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Posts: 8772
| And that's the thing, man... Here's a woman, new to a sport dominated by men, who goes out and whacks a chunky 45" fish on her first day in Canada. I know seasoned veterans who would have blown chunks on that fish. I might have blown chunks on that fish! Blam! she nails it. And some stupid prick has to ruin that for her? F you! We all complain about getting new people into the sport, and getting women into the sport, and so on. And when it happens, some little dick MF'er has to ruin that experience? I'm not a violent guy, but I'd like to beat that stupid MF'er half to death for the sake of muskie fishing. |
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Posts: 140
Location: Northern Illinois | Todd M. , I would quit banging your head against a wall. Most people don't have enough free time to commit
to a club and meetings. i'm old, run a business, and raising a family. I don't even have time to go fishing much anymore,
but I do like to go after muskies, if I can get out. I think musky fishing is an evolution, start with bluegills on a canepole….
you get my drift. It's kind of the pinnacle, I got around to it rather late myself, but grew up fishing. Teach your kids and
take them fishing, they are the future. So many good times and memories are created. I think most people would donate who musky fish, but don't have any free time to get involved. Start a musky go fund me page, make it easy. lol Thanks for stocking those fish in the Fox chain by the way, I've had some fun catching a few.
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Posts: 20212
Location: oswego, il | Jeff, the cooler head was me. I was the person who heard him say it. Rather than create a scene I found out who he was with and had him removed. He wasn't a punk btw, someone our age who is an angry drunk, a relative of someone in our club who didn't fish. He hasn't been back. Isolated incident and we missed not having you guys there.
Fishin-ski's I want to have this discussion. My fear is this younger group will never get involved. As I stated this goes much deeper than going to club meetings. We have doubled the survival rate for the fingerling stocked in hatchery ponds. We do that kind of stuff. Without the support that goes away. This sport will suffer. A cry for help on social media will fall short, I don't care how many worshippers they have. I have already seen these types of calls to action fall short. This is why I want to have this discussion. I might ultimately be banging my head but I won't go down not swinging.
Edited by ToddM 2/8/2020 6:42 AM
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Posts: 153
Location: MN | I used to attend most winter meetings and the banquets with my wife. I lost interest with the club when they pushed legislation to raise the minimum to 54". That is just too much. Rarely do these fish reach this length before dying, IMO. We lost support from the general public when the minimum was raised to 54", again IMO
There are other reasons, mostly political that has kept me from re-joining. If the fishery requires stocking to support it then the season should be year round or limited closure. I think if muskie inc hadn't protected the muskie so much , muskies and muskie inc may have more supporters. Think about this before you dismiss it, like you may have dismissed these ideas from former muskie inc members. |
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Posts: 2315
Location: Chisholm, MN | Born - 2/8/2020 9:05 PM
I used to attend most winter meetings and the banquets with my wife. I lost interest with the club when they pushed legislation to raise the minimum to 54". That is just too much. Rarely do these fish reach this length before dying, IMO. We lost support from the general public when the minimum was raised to 54", again IMO
There are other reasons, mostly political that has kept me from re-joining. If the fishery requires stocking to support it then the season should be year round or limited closure. I think if muskie inc hadn't protected the muskie so much , muskies and muskie inc may have more supporters. Think about this before you dismiss it, like you may have dismissed these ideas from former muskie inc members.
Why? You wanna keep one? Strange ideas you have. |
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Posts: 4269
Location: Ashland WI | esoxaddict - 2/7/2020 9:54 PM
And that's the thing, man... Here's a woman, new to a sport dominated by men, who goes out and whacks a chunky 45" fish on her first day in Canada. I know seasoned veterans who would have blown chunks on that fish. I might have blown chunks on that fish! Blam! she nails it. And some stupid prick has to ruin that for her? F you! We all complain about getting new people into the sport, and getting women into the sport, and so on. And when it happens, some little dick MF'er has to ruin that experience? I'm not a violent guy, but I'd like to beat that stupid MF'er half to death for the sake of muskie fishing.
I’m not quite following.
What was the dude upset about? And punch a woman in the face? It sounds like the guy was really out there.
And regardless, it was one a hole. Unless there was a lot of people supporting his sentiments (and none in support of your wife) , let it go. There will always be jerks out there. You quit , they win. |
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Posts: 549
Location: deephaven mn | Born
you make a good point about the stocked fish lakes. If there is no reproduction why close season?
I think it's mostly an across the board season to protect spawning fish and having different rules for different lakes
makes it confusing and leads to rule breaking. Did not realize that protecting the resource is a turn off.
Catch and release is the first form of protecting the resource and has done wonders in keeping fish available to catch.
Which what I desire. Muskies Inc was the pioneer of this practice because of the limited numbers of muskies. It works!
and results are wonderful!
Edited by kap 2/9/2020 8:22 AM
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Posts: 153
Location: MN | I could have killed the first big fish I ever caught 48" brute, didn't have a camera. I let it go. Never said I wanted to keep a fish. Just think 54" is too much and has alienated people who were neutral on the subject and now consider the muskie vermin to be removed and never to be stocked in new waters. |
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Posts: 20212
Location: oswego, il | Born - 2/9/2020 8:35 AM
I could have killed the first big fish I ever caught 48" brute, didn't have a camera. I let it go. Never said I wanted to keep a fish. Just think 54" is too much and has alienated people who were neutral on the subject and now consider the muskie vermin to be removed and never to be stocked in new waters.
I understand what you are saying but are those people who oppose the length limit avid musky fisherman, people that would join, have been members and left? I don't know of any 54" size limits on any waters that don't have that potential. Just looking for clarification. I can understand the elitist argument and those who oppose Muskies really oppose musky fisherman on their lake. Build it and we will come, way more of us than you want.
Edited by ToddM 2/9/2020 10:57 AM
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Posts: 32878
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | A campaign by a few goofs did do some damage and I'm sure it would have been about the same misinformation campaign if the max was 50, or 49, or whatever. MI's job there is to assist legislators to understand the biology and reality, and help the DNR with management policy acceptance by educating the public. The efforts over there are about access rights and keeping anglers off 'their' water. Without the hard work of a few MI folks what they were after might have happened. In this case, 'the public' was mostly them...and us. |
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Posts: 20212
Location: oswego, il | Ledo, the person who said that about Jeff's wife said it to another woman directly as well. A person came up to me and wanted to get into a confrontation, I intervened and handled it without an incident. When he said it aloud when I heard it Jeff's wife Samantha was up front getting award. She didn't hear it When I had his relative remove him I was told he can get that way when he drinks. It wasn't so much a problem personally with the woman as it was he had a personal problem. He hasn't and will never be allowed back. An unfortunate isolated incident.
Edited by ToddM 2/9/2020 11:03 AM
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Posts: 1719
| Just as some people shouldn't be allowed to have kids, some shouldn't be allowed to drink. |
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Posts: 153
Location: MN | The slowing and stopping of stocking new MN lakes happened shortly after the 54" minimum went into place. IMO if it had stayed at 50 the anti sentiment wouldn't have happened. |
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Posts: 343
| I joined Muskies Inc. in the early 1990's and was put into the newly formed Colorado Chapter as Wyoming didn't have a chapter. Was going to college at the time so I wasn't able to attend meetings. Northern Colorado Chapter formed a few years later and I was moved into it without being asked or informed. Turned out to be a good move as I found the new chapter to be more welcoming and friendlier. Chapter was later folded back into the Colorado Chapter. At the beginning of 2000 I moved to Tennessee and looked into joining the Tennessee chapter but it closed about the time I moved south. I asked about staying in Colorado Chapter and was told it was no problem, until I started to have success fishing in Tennessee and Kentucky. I started to win the release title fairly regularly and suddenly new "rules" were implemented. I had to attend at least one meeting or outing each year to be eligible to win. I attended a meeting and was introduced to several of the chapters bigwigs. The chapter's new "golden boy" the president's and secretary's son came up to me to introduce himself and asked me if I had ever caught a tiger (hybrid) muskie. That year I had caught a couple in Wyoming along with a bunch of Kentucky and Tennessee purebreds. He then shared with me that he hadn't ever caught one. That same meeting I was told of a new "rule" requiring all entered fish be "local". Golden Boy caught all his fish on his yearly family's month long vacation on Lake of the Woods Ontario. I knew then that the politics weren't my deal and became an unaffiliated member and have remained one clear to the present. Since then I do all my esocid lobbying on my own.
Utah started a chapter a few years ago and a Utah fisheries biologist I correspond with regularly encouraged me to attend a tiger muskie seminar put on by the DWR and the Utah chapter. During the seminar all the Utah chapter people sat bunched together, no name tags or any other identification identifying themselves as club members. You would think that meeting would be prime recruiting grounds for new Muskies Incers. but they just turned me and many others off with their preceived superiority complexes. I definitely had no desire to deal again with the politics of belonging to a chapter and had several nonmembers express concerns about club attitudes while visiting with me at the seminar. Unfortunately politics can and do have an effect on club recruitment, which I find to be one of Muskies Inc's. largest problems. |
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Posts: 1719
| I find it interesting that there hasn't been other Muskie organizations started. Whats to stop somebody from starting something else a bit more informal and fun that might draw others. It can't be cost, just takes a few guys and a meeting place to start. |
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Posts: 487
Location: Northern Illinois | The "elitist" problem is a local problem. It's amazingly true how a club or group follows their leadership when it comes to accepting new people into their group or being inclusive when it comes to sharing knowledge and information. But it is a mistake to globalize the problem and paint all MI clubs with the same brush. I understand the sour taste a bad experience can leave and feel fortunate that our club has good leadership. |
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Location: oswego, il | RLSea - 2/9/2020 6:09 PM
The "elitist" problem is a local problem. It's amazingly true how a club or group follows their leadership when it comes to accepting new people into their group or being inclusive when it comes to sharing knowledge and information. But it is a mistake to globalize the problem and paint all MI clubs with the same brush. I understand the sour taste a bad experience can leave and feel fortunate that our club has good leadership.
I think these are isolated issues not so much the global issue I am hoping to find. I can certainly understand it can happen.
As far as non-muskie inc clubs go, there are some and they are good smaller clubs.
Edited by ToddM 2/9/2020 6:38 PM
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Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | ToddM - 2/9/2020 6:36 PM
RLSea - 2/9/2020 6:09 PM
The "elitist" problem is a local problem. It's amazingly true how a club or group follows their leadership when it comes to accepting new people into their group or being inclusive when it comes to sharing knowledge and information. But it is a mistake to globalize the problem and paint all MI clubs with the same brush. I understand the sour taste a bad experience can leave and feel fortunate that our club has good leadership.
I think these are isolated issues not so much the global issue I am hoping to find. I can certainly understand it can happen.
As far as non-muskie inc clubs go, there are some and they are good smaller clubs.
For certain. |
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Posts: 386
| I just so happen to be in that age bracket, and technically a MI member. Unfortunately, I rarely get to partake in club activities due to work schedules between my wife and I. Kids activities, tae kwon do, swim lessons, etc... Also, when I do have the time available, and it's during fishing season, I'd rather just go fishing. I'm selfish like that. |
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Posts: 1036
| So...our Milwaukee Chapter had some pretty poor finances for years. We streamlined a lot of things, because we get no direct money from Muskies Inc dues, and now, after about 6 years, our books look really good.
We are trying to do some "new" things in our chapter to help get people on the water, whether for muskies or other fish.
Last year we ran an ice trip to Door County for whities. Got a handful of members to participate.
The exciting thing we did was a "Powder Puff" tournament. No entry fee. But it was a women's event. Men were there to run the boat, net fish...etc. Everyone who fished got some gourmet coffees and a bottle of wine. We had 3 large gift baskets for the "winners" of the tournament. Those gift baskets we comprised of gift that my wife picked out. Wine, chocolates, coffees, a handbait custom bucktail made by a member....etc.
We got that thing going as a fun way to give back to the ladies who allow many of us to fish for these critters. And it was well received. We even had a little "wrap up" session at a bar when the event was done. We kept it to about 4 hours and were told that was a good amount of time for most of the women who just weren't used to slinging baits all day.
If you are looking for a fun way to get more members involved, I'd recommend a ladies outing/tournament like that.
This year we are looking to do more member events for our chapter. It's nice when you have some funds to allocate to those kinds of events. |
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Posts: 20212
Location: oswego, il | Vegas492 that is one of the points I want to make here is where the clubs raise money to do stuff like this, support youth events, youth clubs, the DNR, stocking our club raises money for cancer research every year in addition to the ones I just mentioned. We also raise money for One Hope United, Take a Vet Fishing and the Schaumburg H. S. Bass Team. The money doesn't come from our monthly meeting. Those are more for comradery and learning. The money is raised by our banquet, tournament, musky show raffle and our cancer awareness outing. Without participation for those events we can't do anything.
Edited by ToddM 2/10/2020 10:55 AM
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Posts: 1767
Location: Lake Country, Wisconsin | Born - 2/9/2020 1:10 PM
The slowing and stopping of stocking new MN lakes happened shortly after the 54" minimum went into place. IMO if it had stayed at 50 the anti sentiment wouldn't have happened.
Couldn’t disagree any more. That’s a complicated issue with a variety of factors and your reasoning is way too simple. Invasive species, public water access rights, declining fishing of other species, spearing battles, etc...
Pretty odd to me to be critiquing the 54” size limit when the amount of fish caught over 54” in MN (although possibly tapering off) was probably the highest likelihood of that happening anywhere on earth. It clearly worked for what it was intended to do
Edited by Musky Brian 2/10/2020 11:28 AM
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Posts: 1036
| You bet, Todd!
Muskies Inc Chapters do a lot for the fishing and the community. Far beyond "just" muskies.
Our club isn't quite there yet with community things, but we do run a great Vets outing and Big Brothers/Big Sisters outing. We need a few more good financial years to be able to do more...and of course we could use more volunteering members. As I'm sure every club could use.
The power of Muskies Inc. will always be in the local chapters themselves and what they want to accomplish. The parent is there for some support, but really it falls on the local chapter to make a difference. |
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Posts: 1257
| Musky Brian - 2/10/2020 11:26 AM
Born - 2/9/2020 1:10 PM
The slowing and stopping of stocking new MN lakes happened shortly after the 54" minimum went into place. IMO if it had stayed at 50 the anti sentiment wouldn't have happened.
Couldn’t disagree any more. That’s a complicated issue with a variety of factors and your reasoning is way too simple. Invasive species, public water access rights, declining fishing of other species, spearing battles, etc...
Pretty odd to me to be critiquing the 54” size limit when the amount of fish caught over 54” in MN (although possibly tapering off ) was probably the highest likelihood of that happening anywhere on earth. It clearly worked for what it was intended to do
Musky Brian is correct. There wasn't that much resistance to the 54 inch issue. Actually, it was supposed to be 55 inches, and all it took was a one inch concession to get the deal done. The only reason to have a smaller limit is so you can whack more fish (and there is no good reason to do so). No correlation between the size limit change and the new lake stocking either. Other issues involving the DNR, at the time, complicated the lake stocking. |
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