|
|
Posts: 61
| sworrall - 7/11/2014 11:44 AM
X190 Tiller? With a 90 HP OptiMax or 4 Stroke Merc will do low 40's loaded, and will base price about $29,500.00 water ready. Late Fall, early Winter 2015 release.
Mercury 90hp 4 stroke barely pushes a 1825 Lund pro guide "loaded" into the low 40s.
Explain how tuffy can accomplish these feats?
And why not a 115hp rating like the 1890T now has?
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 117
| Quick google search turned up this link--I cant get smalljaws link to work, so maybe this is what he posted as well. The photo album is titled "x-190 tiller". I know I saw pictures like this well over a year ago...if the tiller isnt available then I assume these are proto boats?
https://www.flickr.com/photos/outdoorsfirst/sets/72157609697032158/
Regarding moving the decks back...the ONLY reason I have interest in tuffy boats is BECAUSE they have the deck layout the way they do. Different deck layout would make them more or less the same as every other multispecies boat on the planet...who needs another one of the same thing? Give me a bass boat-esque layout with a small floorwell and a 25" transom any day of the week.
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 206
| "Mercury 90hp 4 stroke barely pushes a 1825 Lund pro guide "loaded" into the low 40s.
Explain how tuffy can accomplish these feats? "
The 1825 Pro Guide and the x-190 hulls weigh almost exactly the same. The advantage of fiberglass is that the hull is shaped for better performance, so yeah it could be a faster boat with the same motor... |
|
| |
|
Posts: 32923
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | The rear deck modules come up to the seats because they are large....which everyone said they wanted. Yes, the decks are removable. It takes about 5 minutes to remove the deck. The regular seat bases are already underneath.
How does a fiberglass performance hull run faster than an aluminum, or a high performance hull better than a deep V both fiberglass?
Lift, engine height, nothing on the surface causing disruption of water flow....basically hull design. That's why a bass boat the same size and weight will run away from a deep V or even a padded deep V hull. Race a 621 against the 21' Ranger bass boat once, both rigged with a 250. But then....add 3' waves and race.
There was an X190T. I ran one and really liked it, but some folks had trouble driving the boat because very few understood what it takes to make a padded hull plane out and run right. Better to discontinue the padded hull tiller availability and go with what would be described as a 'true V' design that will run well no matter how it's driven.
The X190 interior is exactly the same layout as the 1700, 1760, 1890, and 2060.
The X Series is pretty good on the rough stuff, but not as good as the Deep V models.
Compromises.
HP ratings are decided upon by US Coast Guard formulas up to 20' in length centerline, not the builder's whims. Tiller ratings will always be way less than console because of how abrubtly the boat can be turned with a tiller VS a wheel, passenger placement (driver sight line) in a tiller VS a console, and a couple other complicated reasons. Merc (Mertens) power steering will not give you a higher tiller rating.
Anything over 20' can run whatever outboard the builder feels is safe.
That's me driving the X190 in the Flickr gallery. It was early December, and colder than cold, I was bundled up like I was going ice fishing. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 206
| Steve, part of what's impressive to me about the x-series is the weight of the hulls. How do you achieve this, through less freeboard, thinner fiberglass or both?
Also, you mentioned an approx price tag of $30k, assuming big tiller handle and rear casting deck are more? |
|
| |
|
Posts: 32923
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Neither. It's the high tech composites used to build FRP (Fiber reinforced plastic) boats these days that trims down the hull weight. There are 13 layers of laminate in the running bottom of that ride, and the entire transom is also composite. Trims a BUNCH of weight.
The Merc big tiller would be extra, yes.
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 206
| So are all glass boats (not just Tuffy) going to FRP and will we see other existing Tuffy models getting lighter? |
|
| |
|
Posts: 32923
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Composites, yes. All the Tuffy models are composite. FRP is 'fiberglass'. That term is pretty broad, especially these days. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 349
| smalljaw - 7/12/2014 4:42 PM
Steve, part of what's impressive to me about the x-series is the weight of the hulls. How do you achieve this, through less freeboard, thinner fiberglass or both?
sworrall - 7/12/2014 5:45 PM
Neither. It's the high tech composites used to build FRP (Fiber reinforced plastic) boats these days that trims down the hull weight. There are 13 layers of laminate in the running bottom of that ride, and the entire transom is also composite. Trims a BUNCH of weight.
I'll rephrase this question. What about the hull design makes the x-190 lighter than the shorter/narrower 1760?
I assume each boat is built with the same/similar materials so there has to be something in the hull design that makes a 19'4"/90" boat lighter than a 17'6"/84" boat. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 206
| Thank you for re-phrasing, curious to get the answer too.. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 32923
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | The X190 actually has fewer square feet of materials, to oversimplify. The two boats are really close these days in total dry weight.
The 1760 listed weight is the heaviest model, a Walkthrough. Bigger consoles, a heavier windscreen scenario and not available in the X190. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 206
| I've gone back and re-read this thread and I'm wondering Steve, if you can tell me the hull weight of the 1760 GC TILLER and if there are any overhead pictures of the interior? And/or if there are any dealers that currently have one in stock to see..
Edited by smalljaw 7/23/2014 5:20 PM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 32923
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | There's one getting finished in the Factory now. I'll get you images of it next week. I'll also get you an accurate hull weight. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 206
| Thanks, I should have clarified - "Esox" tiller layout, weight, etc.. thx |
|
| |
|
Posts: 32923
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | All that is is a rear deck. Only difference between the Osprey and Esox Deep V. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 2687
Location: Hayward, WI | Can the rear deck be added to the Tiller models, and still have a place to sit and comfortably reach and operate the tiller handle? |
|
| |
|
Posts: 206
| Yes, a picture of the rear deck would be very helpful. I've compared to the Ranger 175t but it lacks a aft casting deck. I think Tuffy has the competitive advantage there but I'd like to see how it actually looks, where the seat is positioned, etc. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 32923
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | The seat is placed with the new owner sitting in it to make it absolutely perfect.
Yes, you can sit on the deck or on a seat just ahead of the deck with a 6" slide to get it off the deck when fishing. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 153
| just bought a 1995 tuffy renegade this year 18 footer all Im waiting on is a motor and she is set im working on updating the electronics and trolling motor going with a minkota 70 pound thrust power drive on the bow still debating on if I want a kicker or not |
|
| |
|
Posts: 2687
Location: Hayward, WI | That's neat to hear that the rear deck can be used on the tillers. Maybe my wife will be more likely to let me pull the trigger if there's more standing room back there...
Steve, did you happen to get any pictures of the new boat being built? I always like interior pictures of these boats. Would also be interested to hear the hull weight of the 1760 G series boats. I imagine the single console doesn't add a whole lot of weight over the tiller boats? |
|
| |
|
Posts: 206
| Yes, photos of the gunnel, interior, rear casting deck would be great. Also hull weight, total length on trailer with swing tongue and motor down... lastly are there any dealers with one in stock or are they made to order this time of year?
Edited by smalljaw 8/5/2014 10:14 AM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 2687
Location: Hayward, WI | sworrall - 7/23/2014 5:27 PM
There's one getting finished in the Factory now. I'll get you images of it next week. I'll also get you an accurate hull weight.
Next week was last week.  Did you have a chance for pictures or a weight before it shipped out? |
|
| |
|
Posts: 32923
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | No on the pictures. The weight in the catalog is pretty accurate.
This is really pretty simple. Every Tuffy Osprey and Esox in the 1700, 1760, and 2060 have identical interiors. The 1700 is proportionately smaller in the interior room category than the 1760 and so on. The ONLY interior difference between the Esox Deep V and Osprey is the removable casting deck. Storage compartments are the same size in all models. Rod locker, of course, accepts longer rods as the boat gets bigger.
We have a 16760 Osprey T here now. Images...
Attachments
----------------
 GEDC0029.jpg (107KB - 345 downloads)
GEDC0030.jpg (77KB - 319 downloads)
GEDC0031.jpg (72KB - 338 downloads)
GEDC0033.jpg (88KB - 430 downloads)
GEDC0036.jpg (98KB - 360 downloads)
GEDC0042.jpg (80KB - 368 downloads)
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 206
| I hope to see a local 1760 GT with the open gunnel over the next week and will try to take pictures of the interior and post them here. Its an Esox but doesn't have the rear casting deck unfortunately so if any pictures of that surfaces, feel free to add. Thx, SJ
Edited by smalljaw 8/8/2014 11:27 AM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 32923
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Here are a few of a 1760 G series.
Attachments
----------------
Boat3.jpg (81KB - 553 downloads)
Boat2.jpg (103KB - 453 downloads)
Boat.jpg (99KB - 299 downloads)
P5120026.JPG (109KB - 514 downloads)
P5120029.JPG (57KB - 353 downloads)
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 206
| That's an awesome over head view of the 1760 GT. A couple questions:
-How much room is on the port ledge to lay rods down. The gas fill is on that side, is it at least 7 foot in length?
-If there is a aft casting deck, can the driver's seat be detached and moved up onto the deck to sit up higher? I assume there is a pedestal base on the back deck..
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 11
| Smalljaw: I have the 1700 esox deep V which has a very similar interior to the 1760 only maybe a little smaller in size. I bass fish a lot, and can put 5, 7 foot long rods on the port side of my front deck and about as many 6 1/2 footers on the other side of the front deck and fish all day like that. My boat has the side console. These front decks are incredibly designed for fishing, lots of usable space.
Not sure why you would want to drive a tiller engine while sitting in a chair on the back deck, you wouldn't be able to reach the motor controls very well. The picture shows the ideal set-up with the seat mounted on the floor. There is still lots of room to fish from the rear deck of these boats even without the additional rear deck with gull-wing storage. The pictures posted should convince you the 1760 Tiller is as fine a tiller boat as you will find. I'm jealous of all you 1760 owners! But I still love my 1700.
Edited by horseshoe 8/10/2014 8:50 PM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 633
Location: Madison, WI | In my opinion, that raised gas fill is the worst part of the tuffy G series boats. I have a 1760 GC and that's the only thing I would change about it! It's the only place to lay rods longer than 8'6" and the gas fill was stuck square in the middle of it so I modified mine. Now my 9' lays perfectly!
Attachments
----------------
image.jpg (34KB - 336 downloads)
image.jpg (34KB - 335 downloads)
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 32923
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | One can use a 6" seat slide and a Min Kota handle extension to run the tiller with the rear deck installed with the seat mounted in front of the deck, but the reach isn't real comfortable If you mounted the seat on the deck it will be in the way, so you'd have to remove it when you stop the rig to fish. You will choose the Big Tiller handle with or without hydraulic steering whether there is a deck installed or not.
Plenty of rear fishing room w/o the deck. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 206
| I would mount the seat on the floor in front of the rear deck when under power with the gas engine. What I'd like to know, is after you stop - can you detach the seat from the cockpit floor and put it up on top of the rear casting deck? I had this on my old Alumacraft and it was a great arrangement to sit up high on the rear deck but have the option to sit or stand on a long day of casting. Then, detach the seat from the deck, put back on the cockpit floor base and motor off... Hopefully this can be done? |
|
| |
