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Posts: 785
| jlong - 2/10/2014 3:46 PM
I hold the bag until ready to submerse the net (this helps avoid snagging a cleat or rod holder).... but plan to inflate the bag with some forward movement prior to the fish crossing the rim of the hoop.>
^^^Yep. Thanks guys, I was curious to hear the problems you've run into. When dealing with inexperienced net men I agree the more simple approach of not holding the net will work best. Sounds like that is the main problem. The keys to holding it is once the net begins entering the water I've usually already dropped the mesh. I get the net fairly deep and come up around the fish with a fully deployed bag below. This way the fish slides deep into the net. I also like coming up with the hoop somewhat horizontal. I'm not a fan of guys netting at sharp angles allowing the possibility of the fish to turn sharply and shoot back out of the net or jam into the side of the bag. I agree getting the net ready and being in position quickly is very important. For some people though the above mentioned is unlearnable 
Edited by musky-skunk 2/10/2014 4:33 PM
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Location: SE Wisconsin | I just saw this on Joe Bucher Outdoors where Joe was telling his St. Croix rep to stand on the front deck where Joe was waiting to net the fish. Joe's point was made based on catching it all on film, while his fishing partner made several comments about how much easier it would have been to net the fish had Joe scooped it when the guy fighting the fish was on the rear deck since his rod was a stiff 9-footer. This is where I think Keyes Outdoors has it right with their tower tripod and wide lens camera to capture the action of both the netman AND the guy fighting the fish in one view without crowding and flexing a 9+ foot musky rod in weird ways. |
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Location: 31 | This is an interesting discussion and there are obviously several methods that work well for different people. I've netted fish holding the bag and not, same with people who have netted fish for me. I've also completely blown a couple of net jobs, especially some of my early solo attempts. Years ago I was filming with Marc Thorpe and I thought we were all set and at the last second he moved the net unexpectedly just as I began powering the fish in. The fish ended up getting hooked on the opposite end of the bag from where it should be and then just kind of sat there. Without panicking Marc immediately reverse scooped the bag with the fish still attached in one desperate motion… and we both had a good chuckle after really dorking one for the camera. The strange part is that we had done this same routine many-many times, I think that was even the third 50” just that morning. Anyway, it just goes to show things can go south in a hurry even with two experienced anglers… and none of us are beyond reproach. Regarding the recommendation not to net every fish, I wholeheartedly agree and would have never netted a low 40” like that one in the picture on page 1, except it was my first solo doubleheader and I wanted to get it all on video. Conversely, I know some very experienced anglers who prefer to net almost every fish because they feel they can simply unhook the fish faster and safer. I say whatever works and to each their own, (I would never use a bogagrip for instance), and would be much more reluctant releasing even a 5 pound pike without my welding glove.
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Posts: 7
| I agree, it is important to secure the net after the fact. Like others mentioned, I certainly hold the excess bag out of the water while waiting for the correct moment (unless I am fishing alone, then I am only netting with one hand). The bag will open up if the sweep is made correctly at the right time. Also, I think it is just as much the fighter's job to guide the fish into the net as it its the netter's job to scoop the fish. Because of this, I like the fighter and the netter to be standing pretty close. Not everybody uses the 9' rods exclusively or at all. I still mostly use 6' and 6' 3" rods. Those I fish with use mostly 7-8' stuff. Another thing that I'd like to mention is that the net should be lying where it is easy to access, unobstructed, and not tangled in anything. This is especially important when fishing alone. The true mark of a good netter is the ability to do it solo. If anybody wants to see footage of this, I will let you know when and where you can see it.
I have been doing a lot of filming and it helps me work through the stupid crap that I pull in the heat of the moment and don't even realize that I am doing. It is easy to watch the footage of others and point out their mistakes, I do it on occasion as well. People who put themselves out there on TV are of course making money and willingly exposing themselves to criticism, so they have to take it in stride. However, we are all human. |
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Posts: 1168
| I concur with almost everything jlong is saying here. I was fishing with him when I saw the bungee net strap in set-up and applied the concept to my rig. A piece of baler twine tied in a loop around a leg on my removable deck. It keeps the net handle lower and out of the way. I've done the boat cleat thing and it wasn't comfortable. I prefer to have that net handle locked down and secure instead of giving it the chance to move around.
Bottom line with a net securing system is to use what makes YOU more comfortable. For some it's a cleat, others a rod strap, you've got the bungee around a chair post method, I've got my loop of baler twine... Plenty of ideas here to accomplish the same goal. The biggest benefit I see other than freeing up your other hand is that if I get a fish in the net I can secure it in place and take a step back to gather my thoughts/adrenaline before removing hooks. You're not fumbling around with a net while getting your hook removal tools where you need them to be.
The thing about communication is critical. I try to have any fish in my boat netted on the port side if possible because there is more room over there (single console). To be honest, it's not really "netting" a fish as much as the angler with it hooked is guiding the fishing into an awaiting net. The guy with the fish hooked is the navigator here and the netman is just coming along for the ride but needs to be clear as to when he's ready with the net. A netman who just wildly scoops away is the type who tends to knock fish off at boat side because either the angler or fish are not ready to be guided into the net.
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Posts: 47
| One thing that works nice, is putting the end of the net handle through the handle on top of an unopened 30 pack of Old Style. Holds the net securely, and even tears slightly during the unhooking process, allowing for an easy brew grab once released. |
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Posts: 210
| Strawberry - love your thinking! |
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Posts: 196
| I haven't fact checked it but heard that Florida implemented a law that any tarpon over 40" is not allowed out of the water. Anyone else hear the same? |
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Posts: 1247
Location: On the Niagara River in Buffalo, NY | I think more important is knowing when a muskie is too stressed to take out of the water! Net or No Net! |
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Posts: 306
| I've got the netting part down, but what about after the fish is in the net?
I'll admit, my landing techniques probably haven't been the best, but they've all swam off. I do what I can in the net, but 1 week a year of practice in a rental boat doesn't offer much. It's a little risky sticking your hand in the water with 9 hooks, teeth and an upset fish, but only fair to assume some risk since I just forced her in by the lips. It's great when you can get the pliers on the hook and it just pops out, but what about the other 90% of the time when it's not that easy? Tips/tricks??
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Posts: 1937
Location: Black Creek, WI | I think if done properly, netting fish is best for both angler and the fish. Of course, there are always exceptions to the rule. A pet peeve of mine is when a fish is netted and the hooks are tangled high in the bag near the hoop. This prevents the fish's head from being IN the water while the the net is hung from the rail. If you inflate the bag and get the head of the fish deep into the bag... now you can take full advantage of these awesome nets we have available today. So, for some a successful net job is whether the fish was landed or not. For others, it may be how quickly the fish was released and with minimal stress. This is why I retired my Beckman Fin Saver and switched to a Frabill. I was spending too much time untangling hooks from the finer mesh of the Beckman... at the fish's expense. Food for thought,..... |
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Posts: 284
Location: Eagan, MN | JLong said: "A pet peeve of mine is when a fish is netted and the hooks are tangled high in the bag near the hoop. This prevents the fish's head from being IN the water while the the net is hung from the rail. If you inflate the bag and get the head of the fish deep into the bag... now you can take full advantage of these awesome nets we have available today"
Uh oh... Guilty as charged, my friend. That is probably a function of coming up on them from having a net deep in the water. Or, possibly because you catch fish that are so dang big, the fish doesn't fit in the net so well - in which case it's not my fault. I prefer to think the latter...
B.
Edited by BrianF. 2/12/2014 2:38 PM
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Posts: 785
| Booch. It can be intimidating. Have long nosed pliers, bolt cutters (extra hooks), jaw spreaders and you may want to have a glove, although I admittedly never wear mine. If the bait is swallowed not allowing you to reach the hooks with pliers/cutters I'd attempt to grab the fish under the gill so you can prop it's mouth open, good time to wear a glove. If this fails to open the fishes mouth I'd break out the jaw spreaders. If gill grab is too intimidating for you I would seriously recommend getting a boga grip. They aren't very popular among most musky anglers but I've seen Jason Hammernick use them on tv enough to see the merit. Use it to grab the fish and hold it's mouth open to reach the hooks (without getting your hands in the mix). I would prefer to see you never pick the fish up out of the net with it though, grab it under the gill for pictures. The verdict is still out whether completely lifting their body weight from the jaw injures them or not... I just wouldn't. Also most deeply hooked fish will require some out of water time, but I would do all I can to keep that time to a minimum.
Edited by musky-skunk 2/12/2014 4:13 PM
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Posts: 2325
Location: Chisholm, MN | I just watched a video of some guys trolling a headlock and put a fish in the net. The fish was hooked with the back hook, but they decided that they would cut both the front hooks off before trying to unhook the fish. Now this is kind of expensive and maybe not necessary, but it definitely reduces you chances of getting hooked and the fish getting an unnecessary hook. It also helps the fish stay lower in the net if the bait cannot get tangled in the net. Something to think about trying if you think there is some risk involved while unhooking a fish. |
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Posts: 8781
| Kirby, that's a good idea. And really - what does it cost to replace a few split rings? A lot less than a trip to the hospital! |
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Posts: 2325
Location: Chisholm, MN | I know I will start doing it more, especially since I fish alone a lot and after dark. |
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Posts: 335
Location: Pulaski, WI | I once had the netman too far away. |
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Posts: 177
Location: ON | Booch - 2/12/2014 2:24 PM
I've got the netting part down, but what about after the fish is in the net?
I'll admit, my landing techniques probably haven't been the best, but they've all swam off. I do what I can in the net, but 1 week a year of practice in a rental boat doesn't offer much. It's a little risky sticking your hand in the water with 9 hooks, teeth and an upset fish, but only fair to assume some risk since I just forced her in by the lips. It's great when you can get the pliers on the hook and it just pops out, but what about the other 90% of the time when it's not that easy? Tips/tricks??
It's even better when you net the fish, they headshake once and the bait pops out.
I'm still getting the hang of landing fish solo. Part of it is knowing when to try and net it, not as easy or fast as as when you have a partner. |
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Posts: 2015
| One of the worst things you can do is try to take a fish too early solo, even when I know they are hooked poorly you have to play them longer and wait until the fish is ready (unfortunately you will lose a few more lightly hooked fish with no partner in the boat)...like most things you get better with practice. Having your net ready and not tangled in baits or on anything in your boat is critical, muskie usually become quite docile when they are "done".
Edited by IAJustin 2/12/2014 10:06 PM
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Posts: 7
| There is a fairly long list of Florida gamefish that are not allowed out of the water. |
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Posts: 455
| Shut up. It`s because everybody is using magnum baits with 7/0 or bigger hooks these days. You have to net the fish so you can use the Jaws of life on the hooks. I prefer Gamakatsu magic eye hooks on smaller baits. Super sharp super strong and the barb is barley perceptible. Never do I need to cut a hook never. Never do I need to net the fish unless I want too. The difference is you can`t safely pop out a pounder or a double 13 with out netting the fish. Unless you want to use the jaws of life on yourself. Most people who have started muskie fishing the last ten years have no idea there is any other way. Catch fish on mega bait, net fish, cut hooks. That is how it works for most people on every fish. |
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Posts: 306
| Thanks Musky Skunk. My next step is usually the gill-grab with a landing glove, to get some clearance. I considered the bogo for how you mentioned, too. Would never lift it using one, though. I've yet to have any real difficult ones, but its bound to happen at some point.
Sounds like there's really no belly-rubbing trick or anything like that to make it easier.. ha ha.
Edited by Booch 2/13/2014 10:41 AM
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Location: Contrarian Island | I too like Strawberrys way of thinking!
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Posts: 1202
Location: Money, PA | jlong - 2/12/2014 2:07 PM I think if done properly, netting fish is best for both angler and the fish. Of course, there are always exceptions to the rule. A pet peeve of mine is when a fish is netted and the hooks are tangled high in the bag near the hoop. This prevents the fish's head from being IN the water while the the net is hung from the rail. If you inflate the bag and get the head of the fish deep into the bag... now you can take full advantage of these awesome nets we have available today. So, for some a successful net job is whether the fish was landed or not. For others, it may be how quickly the fish was released and with minimal stress. This is why I retired my Beckman Fin Saver and switched to a Frabill. I was spending too much time untangling hooks from the finer mesh of the Beckman... at the fish's expense. Food for thought,.....
I disagree totally with your first sentence....especially if you have an extension made on the Boga like the one I fabricated below. Also a pair of 18" needle nose pliers. Yes, netting is safer all around for the angler, but NOT the fish. A safer method all around, for me, is the use of a Boga grip and long pliers on 90% of our fish. 
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Location: Chisholm, MN | And I totally disagree with using a boga grip to lift a fish. |
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Location: Money, PA | Kirby Budrow - 2/13/2014 11:08 AM
And I totally disagree with using a boga grip to lift a fish.
OK |
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| Where legal, I still use a gaff for most fish while fishing alone. Is more fish friendly than the net for me. BR |
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Posts: 455
| Pretty brave for saying that Ben. I always keep one on board incase the fish gets hooked in the gills or eyeball. That way the eye or gill does not get mangled when the fish thrashes in the net. If you put a hand under the fish lifting with a gaff or boga is really no different than lifting the fish with your hand on the jaw. |
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Posts: 1202
Location: Money, PA | Just an FYI:
The slime coat (mucoprotein coating) on fish is the fish's main defenses against infection and disease. It acts as a shield against disease causing organisms in the fish's external environment.
It also acts as a barrier to prevent loss of internal electrolytes and body fluids.
When even a small portion of the slime coating is removed, the fish will bleed electrolytes from its body into the surrounding water.
The slime coating is the fish's first line of defense against infection. Essential electrolytes necessary for osmoregulation are lost through breaks that may occur in the skin and slime coat, causing dangerous stress. Open wounds and abrasions caused by handling and netting are readily attacked by disease organisms, resulting in further stress and disease.
When a fish is hooked or netted, handled and placed in a stressful situation, such as low oxygen, high carbon dioxide or temperature fluctuations, the slime coating is disturbed, making the fish vulnerable to disease, such as bacterial, fungal and parasitic diseases.
Particularly when fish are shipped in high concentrations in low volumes of water, they are subject to trauma such as being scraped, bitten and otherwise wounded.
Ammonia, a waste product of fish's digestion and respiration, is released into the water containing fish.
Ammonia is also released at high levels by dead fish and decaying food.
At high ammonia levels, the fish are subject to ammonia burns which disturb the slime coating and adversely affect the fish.
Beneath the fish's mucoprotein coating (slime coat) are its scales which can extend to the outer skin surface from the underlying dermal connective tissue. Beneath the scales in a fish's skin is the epidermis, comprising several layers of cells. The fish epidermis is distinguished from mammalian epidermis in that mammals require hardened layers of skin to prevent dehydration, whereas in the aquatic environment, the fish has no need for such protection. Thus, unlike the case in mammals, mitosis is usually seen in the lower layer of the epidermal layer of a fish. Beneath the epidermis of a fish is the dermis comprising fibrous connective tissue interspersed with black pigment cells. The vascular dermal tissue contains a network of capillaries providing nutrient to the skin.
Stress is the number one cause of a deteriorated slime coat.
Below is a short list of some of the sources of stress on a fish.
•Poor water quality: ?Poor water quality can really eat away at the slime coat of a fish. This can come from improper pH, salinity, etc..... The main way to avoid this is to do regular (perhaps monthly) water changes.
•Water temperature: ?Water temperature is one of the most overlooked problems. While different species of fish require slightly different water temperatures, it is important to make sure that the fluctuations in water temperature are moderate, both throughout the day and year.
•Water changes: ?very time you change the water in you tank, you are adding stress to the fish. This comes from both the water removal process, and the introduction of new water that may contain chlorine and be at a different temperature than the aquarium water. Be particularly cautious when doing larger water changes, and make sure to use de-chlorinator to treat the water.
•Transportation: ?Fish do not enjoy traveling. Transporting fish can have a drastic effect on their slime coat, and often can be a nucleating cause of infection. When introducing new fish into your tank, take special care to acclimate the water temperature of the new fish with the aquarium.
•Netting and Handling of fish: ?In gathering bait this is the biggest problem you will be faced with.
Some don't are
•Don't over crowd your net or holding tank without proper circulation-filtration-airation. .
•Don't handle fish / bait anymore than you absolutely have to.
•If harvesting, Use the proper size and quality of net to prevent the bait / fish from being gilled.
How to help your fish get their slime coat back.
•Aqueous aloe vera gel 5% to about 30%
•Sodium carboxymethyl cellulose (cmc) up to about 7.5 g/l (g/L is an abbreviation for grams per litre : - .0265 oz per .28.16 oz) - mucoprotein slime-replacing compound.
•Polyvinylpyrrolidone (pvp having the molecular weight of about 40,000 - K-30 available from GAF Corporation) 1.3 to about 25 g/l (0.046 oz / 28.16 oz) - mucoprotein slime-replacing compound .
•Sodium thiosulfate or asorbic acid 12.5 (.44 oz to 2.12 oz / 28.16 oz) to about 60 g/l - dechlorinator
•Ethylenediaminetetraacetic acid (EDTA) 2 g/l (.07oz / 28.16 oz) - chelating agent.
•Tris(hydroxymethyl)aminomethane 0.3 to about 1 g/l ( .001 to .035 oz / 28.16 oz) - maintain the pH
•Diazolidinyl urea 1.3 to about 4 g/l (.05oz to 1.4 oz / 28.16 oz) - preservative
•Aloe vera gel ("VERAGEL 1501") 4 liters (1.057) gallons.
•sodium thiosulfate 1400 g (49.38 oz)
•carboxymethyl cellulose 100 g. (3.52oz)
•polyvinylpyrrolidone 400 g. (14.11)
•ethylenediaminetetraacetic acid 40 g. (1.4 oz)
•tris(hydroxymethyl)aminomethane 17 g. ( 0.6 oz)
•diazolidinyl urea 80 g. (2.8 oz)
•deionized water enough to dilute to a total volume of 40 liters (10.6) gallons
Edited by ShutUpNFish 2/13/2014 11:45 AM
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Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Properly used, a gaff is a great way to handle a large fish. |
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