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Posts: 2687
Location: Hayward, WI | I'm not trying to be arguementative, but as I re-read the law, I'm still not sure of how clear it is.
'“Motor trolling” is trailing a lure, bait, or similar device used to attract or catch fish
from a boat while being propelled (forwards or backwards) by a motor or a sail or while being towed by a boat being propelled by a motor or sail.'
To me "trailing" would mean the bait is behind the boat being pulled. Something directly below me is not trailing in my mind. In my opinion, this law says running suckers is fine as long as they stay vertical rather than "trailing" behind the boat.
Tucker |
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Posts: 20219
Location: oswego, il | The law is still stupid. I can trail a sucker with a 1oz weight and be illegal or use a 4lb cannonball and be legal. A vilas warden told me if you have a sucker in the water and your trolling motor is on for any reason or amount of time you are in violation. In kenosha county running the trolling motor is mot an issue with suckers. From an economic standpoint the law the law is rediculous as well. tourists can fish elsewhere with suckers without worry. |
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| sworral, you can keep posting the same thing but it's still not clear. If I'm hanging a sucker off the front of my boat and the line is held vertical with a 3oz lead weight while I'm moving up a shoreline very slowly, the bait is clearly not being trailed and therefore not illegal.
Personally, I avoid the whole mess by going to a county that allows motor trolling. I don't think the northerners know how much money they are losing from this silly law that..... prevents what exactly? |
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Posts: 4343
Location: Smith Creek | More muskie guys out on the Vilas/Oneida/Iron county lakes this time of year than Washburn/Bayfield/Price/Clear Sawyer lakes this time of year in my experience. Maybe the fishing is just better in the non-trolling counties? Maybe trolling is the reason? Maybe guys just don't mind violating that particular law? |
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Posts: 3240
Location: Racine, Wi | Have fun debating, I'm going trolling. I love SE Wisco. |
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Posts: 4343
Location: Smith Creek | tuffy1 - 11/2/2012 3:12 PM
Have fun debating, I'm going trolling. I love SE Wisco.
It's a sportsman's paradise!  |
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| I guess I'm still going to do it and if I get popped I'll drag the whole thing out in court as long as I possibly can costing the taxpayers a fortune. At least I'm making a serious attempt at position fishing. Wisconsin needs to allow trolling. This whole thing is ridiculous.
I guess I'll just live and let live. Have a safe weekend everybody.
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| The way the law is written it is still open to personal interpretation. Do what YOU want (not necessarily what you think is right, by the law) but consider how you might defend yourself against a warden or in court. If you think someone else is violating, either call them in or look the other way and don't worry about it. Again, your choice. |
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Posts: 1455
Location: Kronenwetter, WI | All good on the river too! |
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | 'sworral, you can keep posting the same thing but it's still not clear.'
I posted the law. Some of you are trying to combine it with ANOTHER regulation on what defines position fishing. One thing is crystal clear, if you are pulling your boat forward faster than you can drift or in another direction of what the drift should be and a sucker is trailing over the side...weighted or not...you are violating the trolling regulation. AND...you are NOT position fishing.
You can try to make it hard to 'get' all you want. If you are moving faster than a drift would allow or in a different direction, and that don't take rocket science to see even from a distance, you are trolling whether moving forward or backward.
A controlled drift/position fishing is not propelling a boat forward or backward. Don't confuse the description of a controlled drift with that of trolling, they are, OBVIOUSLY, polar opposites and the Wardens know the difference. Pull suckers along with the boat under power and you are breaking the law unless row trolling.
And there it is. No grey area, simple and straight forward. What I see here is folks who WANT to troll by the definition in the regulations, is an attempt to use the position fishing regulation to get away with breaking the law by adding weight to keep the line vertical. What will happen if you do...a ticket...you are trolling.
To the statement that the N WI folks don't know how much money they are losing; if you say so....many of us, including me voted to allow trolling but not because we feel it will increase tourism much, just because we feel the law is outdated and based on not much of anything but emotion.
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| If you're casting and the sucker is vertical, you're good to go. |
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Wow. Not if you are propelling the boat forward or backward with your electric motor. That's why the law was rewritten recently. Go ahead and troll, and if you get a ticket, you will lose trying to convince anyone the law is unclear.
I rarely see anyone on the water fishing suckers legally. Maybe if the wardens were numerous enough, the revenue stream from tickets would help the economy...:)
Question: Were you pulling your boat down the structure or shoreline forward or backward with your electric?
Answer: Yes, but...(add whatever jibberish you want here)
Decision: You were trolling by the definition in the law. |
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| Granted, whether I undertand the intent of or agree with a law makes little difference. It is what it is. Never the less, I have never understood why WDNR feels it's a good thing to not allow motor trolling of Suckers. Artificial lures...OK. But Suckers? My opinion doesn't mean squat, but I it's a moronic law. |
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Posts: 566
Location: Elgin, IL | I love these discussions. I have been fishing The Northwoods of Wisconsin for awhile....and I really like it. Especially in the Fall, and late Fall.
I don't agree with everything that the State says we have to do, but I dang well abide by it...as well as I can. So, regarding this sucker fishing issue, I have to admit that at times, I may have come really close to crossing that fine line.
And I think ALOT of you have too....I would say probably about 85% of you. Yep, you know the difference between trolling and position fishing......so why come on here and pretend you don't? You really know the difference. Period. Don't you.?
If you don't, then you fall into the other 15% who really don't know what end of the sucker has the rubber band in it or not anyway. That 15% is out there no matter what we do here.
Be smart folks...it's very clear what they want us to do with this issue, just do it.
I really like this row-trolling idea anyway.
Edited by Northwind Mark 11/2/2012 8:40 PM
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| This whole debate reminds me of a time my wife and I were fishing...and she didn't have a license. (Technically she wasn't fishing, just trying out a reel...but, still making casts from the boat!) Just happens that day that a Warden spotted her, and we got a ticket for fishing without a license! Now, we could have gone to court and tried some lame defense like, "But she wasn't really fishing. She was just casting lures in the water." But being as we were guilty of "fishing" by definition---we didn't bother making that defense. Trolling is trolling and is the same type of thing. The law is only black and white, no gray areas. |
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Guest - 11/2/2012 8:37 PM
Granted, whether I undertand the intent of or agree with a law makes little difference. It is what it is. Never the less, I have never understood why WDNR feels it's a good thing to not allow motor trolling of Suckers. Artificial lures...OK. But Suckers? My opinion doesn't mean squat, but I it's a moronic law.
It would amount to pandering to a special interest to allow trolling just for us and just for suckers, but not the walleye guys or guys who fish cranks or...
Lots of folks don't want trolling on the little lakes up here, especially with 3 lines each angler. It wasn't pretty during the backtrolling era. I'd even settle for one line each angler if trolling for the highway 64 North zone. |
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| It's weird that the wardens don't issue tickets for hanging a sucker over the side when you're casting, even if the trolling motor is set on a constant speed. I've had my license checked twice when doing this. Oddly enough, no ticket or warning about trolling! What gives? |
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | What part of MN are you from, and where were you checked? |
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Posts: 2687
Location: Hayward, WI | trail (trl)
v. trailed, trail·ing, trails
v.tr.
1. To allow to drag or stream behind, as along the ground: The dog ran off, trailing its leash.
Seems to me the key word here is trailing, and the definition of trailing seems to use the word behind. I would not call something directly below me trailing. It doesn't seem right to use a 3 lb downrigger ball and move your sucker along at 3 mph... but with the way the law is written?
Like every year, everyone will have their own beliefs on this and most (yep, myself included) are going to be hard to convince otherwise. These never go anywhere really but we like to talk about it each year.  |
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Go ahead and argue that the sucker wasn't 'trailed' while propelling the boat forward...it was, directly under your 'weight'.
Ticket, and I'd call your butt in, too.
Semantics will not draw you an excuse to disobey the law.
I bet if you were discussing ways to get around the law fishing in MN with two lines the MN public would rise up and smite you.
Why would anyone think it's OK to skirt or ignore the fishing regulations here or anywhere?
The law reads as it does and it isn't open to 'beliefs' designed to ignore the regulation.
You are breaking the law if you tow suckers around the lake up here.
Even if it is a dumb law. Which I think it is. |
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Posts: 1516
| Any idea what the fine is or trolling suckers? |
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| Well, that seems to be a mystery to most people, due to the fact that while many people do troll Suckers legal or not, it seems to go largely unenforced.
Somewhat like how few people know (experientially) what the fine for speeding between 55-65 is because you rarely actually get pulled over until you drive over 65----even though 56 is breaking the law on some roads. Maybe that's the same reason why people keep trolling....no real fear of consequences?
But I'm with you, if I'm going to roll the dice I'd kind of like to know what the penalty actually is. I mean for me, it's not so much of a moral thing as it is the potential financial consequences as to whether to obey the law or not. There's always the risk of learning that answer the unpleasant way.
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Posts: 134
| I have an Esox Magnum boat with oarlocks and oars for moving suckers. I checked with the DNR station in Rhinelander before sucker season started for me. He said, quote "it is illegal to drag suckers around using your trolling motor and casting". Now do what you want, but you better have a lawyers' business card in your wallet if a warden decides to bust you. By the way, rowing my size boat is pretty easy and relaxing. Alot of muskie fisherman have pasted me and asked why I'm rowing and not using my trolling motor. When I tell them it is not legal they don't believe me. To each his own, but Steve W. is absolutely right!!!!!!!!!! |
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Posts: 410
Location: Wakefield, MI | dh buc - 11/4/2012 1:50 PM I have an Esox Magnum boat with oarlocks and oars for moving suckers. I checked with the DNR station in Rhinelander before sucker season started for me. He said, quote "it is illegal to drag suckers around using your trolling motor and casting". Now do what you want, but you better have a lawyers' business card in your wallet if a warden decides to bust you. By the way, rowing my size boat is pretty easy and relaxing. Alot of muskie fisherman have pasted me and asked why I'm rowing and not using my trolling motor. When I tell them it is not legal they don't believe me. To each his own, but Steve W. is absolutely right!!!!!!!!!! I was thinking of doing that with my boat, 14' aluminum rows very nicely. But for now, I'll just stick to Michigan with my dads boat. |
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Posts: 20219
Location: oswego, il | I know alot of people who went up north this fall, fished suckers and talked to them all. Every one of them were trolling. Many of them did not know dragging a sucker while propelling the boat with a trolling motor was trolling. One person told me they were advancing their position which is not trolling. I think alot of people dont realize they are breaking the law.
Edited by ToddM 11/4/2012 3:44 PM
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | Is it called a trolling motor or an advancing position motor? |
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Posts: 434
Location: searchin for 50 | Amen,Steve it is a dumb law and needs to be rewritten. |
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Posts: 189
Location: Barrington, Il | On the lake our cabin is on, saw a guy last time I was there, casting and moving along with 2 suckers out. He had painted his bobbers black so you couldn't see them. |
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Posts: 400
Location: North/Central WI | Stealth bobbers... |
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| So I see nothing in the rule about reels being held or in the act of reeling.
All this talk of 'trailing' and 'advancement' makes me question; If your trolling motor is on and moving the boat at any time aren't you trolling? Unless you are always casting at a 45 forward and the bait is out of the water before trailing you, you are trolling, right? I doubt anyone can argue a boat on constant forward is not imparting some propulsion to your bait.
Not trying to be a smartass, but if you insist on reading the law to the letter, without any subjective thought, it may not be all that clear. One could argue the 'Im clearly casting' is the same thought pattern as 'It's clearly vertical and not trailing'. |
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