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Location: Contrarian Island | i agree jason..wisdom for some things does come with age..and experiences..lots of em....year in and year out... locked drags to me are overkill and bad things will happen w a locked drag...but to each their own as the saying goes ... |
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| how about some actual drag pound numbers? everyone seems to care what the reel specs say about drag poundage until after they own the thing then it goes out the window once the reel in use -- jlong - you seem to have it dialed in -- 5 pounds? 8 pounds? 13.5? |
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Posts: 1039
| I tend to run my drags a little loose, probably 75-80% of full. I got in the habit a long time ago of thumbing the reel on every hookset. I like to have some give when they hit and like the drag to be slightly loose for a figure 8 hit.
It takes time to learn how to thumb the hookset. Until you get it down, it is probably wise to crank her down too much than too little. |
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Posts: 1938
Location: Black Creek, WI | Actual drag lbs? Ummm... is that practical? I may be aging, but would still like to think I'm pretty strong.... so ahhh... maybe 100 lbs... heh heh heh. I'd love to be quantitative with setting my drag... but in reality.... for me its a pretty subjective method. Good discussion. |
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Posts: 8824
| BNelson - 6/6/2012 8:35 AM
or a stump... ;o)
If you're not setting the hooks on a stump once in a while, you're not fishing close enough to them! |
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Like Jason when I started muskie fishing we used dacron, and then all me reels were 6500 c3s with 6-7 ft rods. Drag was always locked down.
When I switched to no-stretch in the late 90's the first thing I noticed was losing more fish on the hookset and at boatside. Less drag and more "finese" fighting of fish was all it took to change that.
Something else to consider here is how well your drag is working. If you clean your reels regularly than your washers should be good to go and you will have a lot range in your drag settings. If you don't, than your drag washers will become greasy/wet and your drag will either be very tight or very loose with not much in between.
A lot of guys think they need to lock it down because their reels aren't working like they should, and the drags are to loose if they don't have it locked down.
JS |
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Posts: 225
Location: Nordeast Minneapolis | I've lost fish from loose drag, and I've lost fish from dull hooks... since I started getting more serious about sharpening hooks, I've lost a lot fewer fish, regardless of drag setting. I'm not talking about spending a half an hour and three separate files on a hook... I just use one of those double-barrel hook sharpeners that can get a good point on a hook in about a half a dozen passes or less. |
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Posts: 925
| I agree with JLong and BNelson. I wrap the line around a couple fingers and it takes a hard pull from me to pull line out. Just be careful to not cut your fingers with the line! |
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Posts: 4343
Location: Smith Creek | you lost fish on the hookset cause your drag was too... tight? Whaaa?
My guess is not enough wheaties were consumed prior to fishing. And I agree, loose drag is nice when you set the hook like you don't want to break your high heels;)
Long rods help to keep fish pinned with a tight drag. The boat provides a nice drag system too.
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Posts: 270
Location: brooklyn park mn | I've always done the tighten the drag as tight as I can deal. Caught lots of fish and got really good at free spooling when needed but after last big fish lost when I got it the boat not so sure anymore. Big girl was hooked with one hook in beak and kept bulldogging down after he would come up.. kept up good for a while with free spool but just keep thinking if I had my drag at about 85 percent when she made that unexpected last run I have my personal best and instead of watching her swim away. Couldn't free spool last run she made while she made run straight down no matter how hard I tried. I set hooks hard and good so am starting to think why am I setting drag all the way down. Does anyone tighten them down all the way and then back drag off abit or qaurter turn while fighting fish? |
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Location: Contrarian Island | some other things to consider,,, yes, I have loosened on quite a few after initial hookset...good reels like trinidads have awesome drags... when fishing alone i hooked a 50+ in the 8 and set the hooks home,,in that instance i wanted to loosen the drag right away so the fish could take line a lot easier to tire it out some ...a locked drag that wasn't about to budge even if i backed it off a 1/4 turn w that fish i think was a recipe for a "aww man you shoulda seen this one I had on" but it is to this day probably one of my top 3 fav fish hits/catches... so I loosended it , allowed her to run and peel off line..and then i caught up to her and scooped her...lots of variables to every situation...i agree that some are locking drags simply because their drag systems/reels are just not that well built...trinidads, revo toros, etc all have great drags...not sure why guys buy things then not use them to their fullest..like having a gps but not taking the time to lay down some icons ... 
Edited by BNelson 6/6/2012 11:43 AM
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Posts: 1220
| I guess you always need to expand for variables. My post, which was the first answer was simply to lock it down. I stand with that for most of what I do. Obviously, that is not for trolling. It's also not for when you are using light tackle or baits that have tiny wire hooks (like small Cranes and such) or substandard leaders, snaps, rings, blah, blah blah. But if (let's say) you are just out casting a big buck-tail with 7-0 trebbles, 80 pound braid or better, Stealth or other high quality leader, and a good rod and reel (St Croix for me) I don't see a better setting than totally turned tight. If the fish is under 40 inches, you can do what you want to the fish cuz you can just "horse" it in. If the fish is over 45 inches, he can still pull all the line out of there he needs to give you the room you need to work. But...and this is a big but, most guys will not have the dexterity of hand nor the clarity of mind to unlock a really tightly locked drag in the middle of the excitement that a big fish will create, and the tension on the line (which there better darn be) will often make it hard to push the button and free-spool the fish. There are certainly some top-sticks on this board who can perform brain surgery on high-seas...but for the average snook like me...just lock the #*^@ thing down! |
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I've never understood why you would want to "horse" a fish in.
Don't people like to play fish anymore? Is putting that fish in the net green going to make unhooking it and handling it any easier?
I guess whatever floats your boat.
JS |
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Posts: 8824
| Guest - 6/6/2012 12:35 PM
I've never understood why you would want to "horse" a fish in.
[...]
JS
I've done it on small fish so I could get back to casting at the big fish we just saw. On bigger fish? Maybe people just don't want the trouble of having to net the fish, unhook the fish, lift them out of the net, take a picture, possibly cut hooks, change leaders, etc. And then there's all that bending over and the time it takes to release them. Seems like an awful lotta work |
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| Opinion
Have your partner hold your line a cast lenght away and give him your best hook set, maybe try a jerk bait with hooks removed. You'll be surprised at how little pressure you actually have. Sharp hooks a get and keep a bend in the rod, hooks can dig in if as fish tries to loose the lure. Only god and the muskie can really set the hooks. 2 hooks can also dig in better than 3.
Just the thoughts of an old man.
I' |
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Posts: 1169
Location: New Hope MN | Simple question:
If you set the hook nice and hard on a fish, should the drag give? |
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Posts: 4343
Location: Smith Creek | If I wanna play a muskie half to death I'll catch them on a fly rod or walleye gear. Quick in and quick out when I'm using the right equipment. The longer a muskie is out thrashing around the better chance it has of coming unpinned or getting a hook where it can do a lot of damage. Or going belly up after the release.
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Posts: 321
| Muskie are easy to get in on a fly rod, the saltwater fish are much more a challenge on the equipment. H |
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Posts: 4343
Location: Smith Creek | Thanks. I had no idea there were fish that fought harder than a muskie.
Would you agree that a poon hooked and brought to leader on a fly rod has a better chance of becoming shark food than one hooked and brought to leader on heavy gear? |
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Posts: 321
| Flambeauski - 6/6/2012 1:48 PM
Thanks. I had no idea there were fish that fought harder than a muskie.
Would you agree that a poon hooked and brought to leader on a fly rod has a better chance of becoming shark food than one hooked and brought to leader on heavy gear?
Nope, fly rods are quicker. It is more drag to carry fly line through the water for the tarpon. Heavy gear has the line out of the water less drag and they are able to make more runs. Plus what is heavy gear? a 12-14wt fly rod is pretty appropriate gear. ?Also my little creature spinning rod has landed large muskie as quick as my heavy gear. Fish pull harder when the force against them is harder. Are people more tired jogging 5 miles or doing it in sprint intervals? H |
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Location: Contrarian Island | JS, you've fished w me enough to know I don't exactly "play" fish out.... sooner they are to the boat and in the net the better, but also having unhooked hundreds you get good at that too... lol. |
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Posts: 4343
Location: Smith Creek | Running doesn't make me tired so I can't answer that one. I'll defintely tell the next muskie I catch on the fly rod about the line drag. They're not aware of that around here. |
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Posts: 321
| Flambeauski - 6/6/2012 2:40 PM
Running doesn't make me tired so I can't answer that one. I'll defintely tell the next muskie I catch on the fly rod about the line drag. They're not aware of that around here.
pick up 20 yards of fly line and pick up 20 yards of braid, it will be educational for you. H |
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Posts: 1220
| If JS is who I think it is, I really can't hardly believe you'd say what you did about "playing a fish." My take is that there ought to be zero extra seconds involved in fighting a muskie. Sure, it can be fun, but that's what the good Lord created Smallies and 6 lb test line for. These are much more fragile fish than most folks think. Very little extra time on line or in the boat can mean life or death to them. I know you are totally aware of that, were probably kidding around, but some of the guys reading this stuff might take that seriously and say, Yea, why not downsize and play them out?" The results would be bad....even worse in the summer. |
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Posts: 4343
Location: Smith Creek | 20 yards is pushing it, let's say 16-17;) And I fish shallow and high stick so there isn't much (fly) line in the water. No more drag than the 4" float I use with suckers.
Are we sufficiently off topic yet? |
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| MuskyMidget - 6/6/2012 11:12 AM
I agree with JLong and BNelson. I wrap the line around a couple fingers and it takes a hard pull from me to pull line out. Just be careful to not cut your fingers with the line!
THAT is a recipe for disaster. Try that method and see what happens when a fish hits a suick on a full cast.I lock down and free spool, i have what i want when i want it.
No offence intended.  |
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Posts: 38
| A muskies is mouth is very boney and tough not soft like a bluegills. Hooks should not rip completely through a musky's mouth.
Guest - 6/6/2012 7:12 AM
If your drag is so tight you can straighten hooks, then how do you expect to not pull it out of a fish's mouth??
I'm a very firm believer that drags to tight lose way more fish than drags to loose.
JS
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Marty;
With all due respect, playing fish does not mean fighting them to the point they can't recover. That's something that should be obvious to everyone.
If your drag is constantly locked down you never even get to feel a big fish run.
It's kind of cool, you should try it some time.
JS |
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Location: Contrarian Island | guest..do tell, how is what we do a recipe for disaster...my drag will not slip if i get a hit w a suick on the end of a long cast...not sure what your point is with your post.... JS... "big" is relative..lol....40 inchers might be big to Marty! ; ) |
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Posts: 1220
| I've been fighting size problems ever since that cross-eyed girl started spreading rumors. And besides...I like catching small fish..my PB is almost up to legal in Wisconsin waters (that's pre 2012 legal) and John, I knew you know the difference between hurting a fish and not...but a lot of guys don't. |
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