|
|
Posts: 512
| Unfortunately i dont live up north in prime musky territory. i live in northwest indiana, chesterton to be exact..
I bought the boat from a private seller, who bought this boat in minnesota, so yes this dealer is far away. i am going to send them an email to ask them about the motor. They obviously didnt set this boat up at all.
It does call for a 14 inch prop on most sites, not sure why it has a 13 on it now, so was thinking a 14x21 stainless..
The boat is also maxed on h.p. at 90.
I also was thinking of getting a trim/tilt gauge, i thought the boat came with one..
thanks
Dave |
|
| |
|
Posts: 437
| Dave, I have a Suzuki as well (though a 150) and the inlet hole for the speed had gotten plugged a couple times by weeds or some wood causing it to not function at all. Comparing it to GPS, it is a few MPH faster (meaning GPS reads a lower MPH) than the guage on the boat.
What I did to clean mine out was disconnect the hose, its a clear hose and there is a splice at the base of the motor right where all the cables come out of the engine. Pull that apart there. Then take a VERY small drill bit or if you are lucky enough to have a dentist pick poke that in the inlet hole at the base of the lower unit to loosen up what might have gotten in there. Then using some compressed air (do not pump up over 20PSI) blow into the line toward your speedometer. You should be able to see your guage go up. Then blow back toward the motor, hopefully whatever got in there blows right back out.
You cannot see any hoses other than where they come out of the front of the motor by all the cables. Everything else is inside.
When you said you at a 13 inch prop I was surprised because that seemed extremely small to me, but I dont have that motor. I was thinking a 14 would be much better and it looks like you have found some info to support that.
I believe the 90/115/140 share the same engine block. Not 100% sure, but I know the 115 and 140 do.
I would bet with the right prop and GPS you would be in mid to upper 30's for speed. My buddy has the same boat (with a full windshield) and he gets 34 MPH. He has a 90 Yammy or I would ask what prop he has on it, but it wont really correlate for you.
Do not put one of those wings on there, they really dont work provided you put the right prop on.
I did a quick search on Ebay and found two 14 x 19 props. $160 ish. The Johnson 4 strokes are made by Suzuki so you can use one of them as well, but make sure its a Johnson 4 stroke.
Edited by Captain 8/24/2011 8:24 AM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 512
| Yes, i think that is what happened because i had a bunch of weeds hanging on the engine in that area. So i will check that out.
I think the 90/115/140 are all the same because the manual i have is for all of those h.p. So you are right there.
I was thinking a 14x21 possibly if im about 500 r.p.m.s over, but i will take it out again friday and check it once more before i buy any props.. Do ya think just going up an inch in diameter at 14x19 would decrease r.p.m.s also?
I really like the wing thingys, surprised to hear so much negative stuff on em, really helps with porpoising.
Also, does your suzuki 150 have the water pilot hole adjustment on the back? where your tell tale water stream comes out? Mine is gone, water just comes out so its hard to see it unless you go back and check it. Have been looking for the part online, cant find it!
thanks captain
Dave
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Any increase in the prop size will decrease RPMs. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 3480
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | Hi Dave,
Depending on the water outlet, it might just be a hose that comes through a rubber grommet, and it might just need to get pulled out a little more.
Steve Worrall is correct in that when you increase diameter, you will reduce RPM's... Here are rough estimates of what happens:
Every 1/4" change in diameter will be a change of roughly 100 RPM's. So...if you go up 1" in diameter, be expecting a reduction of roughly 400 RPM's on your engine.
Likewise, (as I believe Steve Worrall mentioned earlier) that a 1" change in pitch will change your RPM's anywhere from 100 to 150 RPM's. So...going up from a 19 to a 21 pitch prop could reduce your RPM's by something like 200 - 300 RPM's.
So...if you go 14 x 21, you would roughly see a decrease of roughly 600 to 700 RPM's... It might be what you need, depending on where your RPM's are currently.
The wings are not a negative thing for many boats. They are designed to help under-powered boats stay on plane at lower speeds because the power is not there for the engine to do it alone. The wings provide stern lift and if the fin is in the water, the ability to trim the boat a bit better. With your rig, you are max on HP, so the right prop will bring your boat alive.
With your combination, you should be really close to, if not over 40mph...
Steve |
|
| |
|
Posts: 437
| Also, does your suzuki 150 have the water pilot hole adjustment on the back? where your tell tale water stream comes out? Mine is gone, water just comes out so its hard to see it unless you go back and check it. Have been looking for the part online, cant find it!
Your stream should be easily visible from the cockpit of your boat. My guess is just as VMS said that something may be clogged or not fully sticking out.
There are several "ports" if you will that you can remove the plugs and flush with fresh water from your garden hose. This would be a good idea. Your owner's manual will show you these locations. There should be a plug in the front and one on the side at least.
Also, on the bottom of the lower unit there is a screen on either side. Remove those and make sure there isnt anything plugged in there. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 512
| There is a piece missing. it says in my manual that you can turn the water pilot hole left or right to shoot the stream one way or another.. this motor is missing that piece. I looked at a johnson 4 stroke that was missing the same piece.. I wonder if it got clogged often so they just removed it? Would like to buy one so i can see the stream! It seems to have a good flow, but is just missing the piece.
i will attach a pic, if you zoom in on it, you will see what i mean. Its the port on the right side.. Not sure what the left port is, seems to be exhaust maybe?
Crap, had to shrink the pic so the detail isnt that good so its hard to see. but im sure its different then yours captain.
Dave
Edited by Dave T. 8/24/2011 10:46 AM
(mccartney at wrigley 042 [].JPG)
Attachments
----------------
 mccartney at wrigley 042 [].JPG (127KB - 126 downloads)
|
|
| |
|
Location: Des Moines IA | My 70 Horse Suzi lost it's exhaust nozzle as well. I got a replacement from these guys
http://store.brownspoint.com/
It was like 5 bucks so I ordered two. Keep an extra in the boat. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 437
| Yep, that is definitely different than mine.
Ive been thinking about that prop you have on there. I wonder if they guy you bought it from had a stainless prop on there to begin with and didnt want to part with it so he swapped it for some other prop. It just seems odd that you would have a 13 on there, I cant even imagine what that would be good for. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 512
| yes i finally found the part! It is on the oil pan assembly, missed it there.
Going to try to find it at the local suzuki dealer, if they ever return my calls!
Or if necessary, i will order it..
thanks
Dave |
|
| |
|
Posts: 512
| I dont think so Captain, this was a nice guy, but he knew less about boats than i do! He had no clue. he just hooked it up and fished a couple times a year.. It probably did the same thing for him, he just didnt think anything about it.. Im emailing with a guy from the original dealer where the boat came from, he says 13 seems right to him.. also said to stop by and he take a ride with me no charge.. Too bad im like 450 miles away!!! I need to move north. at least for the summers!
I did finally find the part number for the water pilot hole nozzle, went and picked one up. Just snaps in.. Bad design, i imagine if it heats up, it will get soft and may pop out again..
But its there now. the guy at the parts desk said the motor may overheat without that piece.. dont see why it would, just turns the flow into a stream basically..
Dave
|
|
| |
|
Location: Des Moines IA | I'm pretty sure that piece creates the water pressure inside the engine. Without it you won't get proper flow through the motor. At least that's what I was told. I would have bought two if I were you, they do disappear magically quite often. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 512
| Maybe. i dont know why that would be a problem though. Its a smaller hole so would decrease the total flow i would think.. I hope it isnt an issue down the road, ive had enough with this boat all ready!!
but i dont know nothing.. Just know i saw a johnson just like that too, so it must be common..
i did think about getting two, dont know why i didnt.. idiot!!
Dave |
|
| |
|
Posts: 395
Location: NW WI | Use a little bit of clear silicone maybe to hold it in? |
|
| |
|
Posts: 437
| There are always a few things when buying anything. I thought I was smart adjusting the trim tab on mine to control torque steer. Well, I didn't tighten it enough, then when backing up it turned around and the prop hit it bending the stainless prop. Ouch! |
|
| |
|
Posts: 512
| I was thinking something like that..
actually a drop of super glue..
good idea though
Just got a price for a custom cover for that boat thru cabelas.
$850!! ugh, i miss my old boat
Dave |
|
| |
|
Posts: 512
| Ok, one more question..
How do you figure out the rotation of your motor?
R or L..
I see some pretty decent prices for stainless on boat.net, may try one of those
after testing it out again friday..
Dave |
|
| |
|
Posts: 3480
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | your motor will rotate to the right... Best way to test this: put it on a garden hose, start it up and put it in gear...see which way the prop turns for forward and reverse.
The only times that I know of that a person would want a prop to turn the opposite way is with dual outboard applications (like ocean running boats or heavy towing situations). The torque from each prop turning is offset, by one prop turning right, and another prop turning left.
Steve
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 395
Location: NW WI | Dave T. - 8/24/2011 7:47 PM
I was thinking something like that..
actually a drop of super glue..
good idea though
Just got a price for a custom cover for that boat thru cabelas.
$850!! ugh, i miss my old boat
Dave
I might not use superglue. With silicone, at least you'd be able to pry it out if needed. If you use SGlue...well you might end up breaking more than just the part you want to hold in if you ever have to remove it.
Hang in there....it's a nice looking boat! Things like this happen when you buy a boat from a private seller. Ask me....I just bought a boat a month ago and it's had more than it's share of "surprises". LOL!!! Today it's going to be a $135 voltage regulator! |
|
| |
|
Posts: 512
| Ya youre right. stuff happens..
Just wasnt looking to buy a new boat, but the accident forced my hand, so that probably doesnt help..
Like i said before, i didnt realize how good of a deal i had with my old boat.. Just bought that baby and ran it!!
and yes, silicone does seem like a better idea, just have to keep it out of the water hole!!
Thanks a bunch guys, i will let ya know how the 2nd lake test goes!
Dave |
|
| |
|
Posts: 512
| Just got an email about another navigator, with a 90 E tec on it, and he said the prop is a 13.5x15.. hmmm
different motor tho.. interesting
Dave |
|
| |
|
Posts: 437
| Yeah, each motor is completely different. Gear ratios play a big role in what prop works for what motor. If that was a Johnson I would say you might have a comparison since that is a Suzuki motor, but not an Etec. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 255
|
I live in the Chicago area. I was recommended to a guy by the name of John at DAH prop in Burlington, WI. You do not even need to go see him. I got the boat I always wanted 2 winters ago. An Alumacraft 185 Tournament Pro Tiller with a 90hp. It is way underpowered but 90 is the max allowable hp for that boat. I talked to many prop and motor guys in the area. Tried some modifications and even posted on here to get better performance. VMS on here was helpful and is knowledgeable. No offense to anyone but John from DAH blew me away. My boat is dialed in with the prop he made me. I get the correct RPM the best fuel efficiency and amazing handling. His website is www.dahpropellers.com You can even just call him and ask some questions. Just don't be afraid of a stainless prop. Hope this helps. Tom |
|
| |
|
Posts: 512
| Oh yes, was going to get a stainless..
i will call him after i take it out and play with it tomorrow
thanks Tom
Dave |
|
| |
|
Posts: 2323
Location: Stevens Point, WI | Call Mike and Marine Diversified for a custom cover. 262.206.3045. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 512
| Do they make snap covers TJ?
thanks
Dave |
|
| |
|
Posts: 512
| I asked someone who had the same boat and motor, (one year older) and he says he is running a 14 x 21 aluminum prop... That may be the problem then..
Dave |
|
| |
|
| Is the moral of this story "Don't buy a Navigator?"
I will be in the market for a new boat myself in the next year. With buying a new/used boat, I would be pretty disappointed with all the issues. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 437
| Guest - 8/26/2011 7:47 AM
Is the moral of this story "Don't buy a Navigator?"
I will be in the market for a new boat myself in the next year. With buying a new/used boat, I would be pretty disappointed with all the issues.
The boat is not the problem, its the setup. It has been obvious from the first post that this boat was not set up properly starting with the trailer not setup, etc.
Some dealers dont take the extra time to do things right. And when buying used you never know what you are going to get.
Once he gets the right prop on this boat it will be a great performing machine. It shouldnt have gone down like this though, it should have been set up properly from the beginning. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 512
| The moral is 80 year old ladies shouldnt be driving! If not for her i wouldnt have been in the market for a new boat..
But seriously, Captain is right. Its not the boat, it was the dealer.. The boat will
be fine after i work thru all this little b.s. It is disappointing, but it happens, been that kind of summer for me so far.
Luckily i got a pretty good deal, so dont feel too bad spending a few more dollars to make it right.
Dave |
|
| |
