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| Jump to page : 1 2 3 4 5 6 Now viewing page 2 [30 messages per page] Muskie Fishing -> General Discussion -> Will there ever be a new world record or state records? |  |
Kingfisher |
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| thrax_johnson |
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Posts: 313 Location: Bemidji, Lake Vermilion | |||
| marc thorpe |
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| marc thorpe |
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| esox50 |
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Posts: 2024 | |||
| Kingfisher |
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| Baby Mallard |
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marc thorpe - 10/17/2009 5:22 AM Keep in mind,I have not just seen 1 fifty incher,I have seen more than any person alive or dead in exception of 1 other person Can I get your autograph? Edited by Baby Mallard 10/19/2009 8:40 PM | |||
| Big fish only |
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| PIKEMASTER |
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Location: Latitude 41.3016 Longitude 88.6160 | I wonder how many GIANT Muskies he has caught in his life ????????? Edited by PIKEMASTER 10/19/2009 5:35 PM Attachments ----------------  normal_mikelazarusmuskie.gif (69KB - 363 downloads) | ||
| sworrall |
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Posts: 32955 Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | |||
| guest |
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| river runt |
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| MN Muskie |
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| sworrall |
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Posts: 32955 Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | |||
| Kingfisher |
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| woodieb8 |
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| Pointerpride102 |
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Posts: 16632 Location: The desert | |||
| Jerry Newman |
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| Kingfisher |
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| Marc Thorpe |
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| Allow me to explain my thoughts which have led me to believe there is a maximum potential. Its is from observation,reading studies on cold blooded animals and fish in particular that have led me to from this opinion My post may have been to short to understand and I apologies for the arrogant tone of one of my phrases. Yes I can humiliated myself,I do it every day when I look in the mirror,the day only gets better from there on end  I have spoken with DR Casselman about his maximum growth chart,even he admits it is a speculated calculated growth chart,there are many variables which are not factored.Like all species in which growth charts are calculate for. He also does not have the information on many of years past great big fish including mine and Mike Lazarus and many others. We must understand that in most regions growth does not occur all season,it occurs during the months of June to September in length and October to December for girth,the retention and building of fat and egg development.These factors can be somewhat slowed or increased depending of yearly and seasonal water temps and weather conditions. Keep in mind fish do not gain weight during the course of the summer due to high metabolism in accordance average summer water temps. Un seasonal cool summers will allow the fish to retain a certain amount of weight but generally they stabilize in weight according to their physical features and make up which is somewhat below maximum girth grow potential. also given the cylindrical physical make up and feature of the fish a 55 inch fish would support IN WATER a girth slightly more than have its length which would equate to 27.5 inches in girth,yes there are the exceptions of 28 and possibly 29. Williamson s fish which supported a 31 inch girth measured laying flat and out of the water according to my information was above normal. Allow me to speculate that if the girth was taken in the water ,it would have supported a 29 inch girth which would placed it in the maximum norm. Some fish display great length but slender back ends,the heaviest fish seem to display uniformity from head to tail. The fish that display uniformity could be at maximum health period during their growth years/life while fish displaying great length but slender tail sections or back end may have exceeded or surpassed their maximum health and growth life period in their lives We must also factor in angling pressure,many fish have shown signs of sulking and ceased feeding for a period after being angled and displayed avoidance afterward. I suspect that this experience of angling may impact a fish feeding behavior which would equate to lack of growth. From my observation on the Big O and Big Flo and many other regions of fish pictures I have observed,this is a important factor and determining factor which is an addition to all other variables which would allow for maximum growth I do believe and from my observations and measuring from in water to out of water girth measurement there is a discrepancy of 1,5 to 3 inches from in water girth measurement to out of water girth measurements.I suspect many of the big girths we are seeing are out of water measurement. This has led many to weigh there fish instead of girthing them,some do girth also their fish along with weighing them,its seems their weight and measurements seem to correlate with my thinking. I seldom girth and do not weigh fish anymore,simply due to limiting my presence and pressure but most of all out of water and human contact to the fish One must stare the ennemy in the eye if he wishes not minimize his impact on the fish For one,we must break down each region which is producing great big fish and the physical make up and build of the fish.Each region shows variables in physical build and characteristics. There are many regions which posses and have produced great big fish of 50 pounds or mid to 58 pounds or so. Most if not all those fish were at peak growth and weight gain. The question all ask is : The fish bite again,what says it wont eat more. My reasoning is : Did the fish eat the lure cause it was eating or did it hit the lure because it was invading its space of peace and tranquility. I do not believe fish hit lures because they are eating all the time,I suspect many times they hit lures simply because it disturbs them in there resting area, whether it be shallow or deep. For those that fish above the norm,they will understand my next thinking. Ever notice you catch fish all summer them the fish somewhat disappear then show up gain and they are big! Maybe we are catching them when they are not eating! But catching them when they are being disturbed. I have observed the behavior of fish and its feeding tendency,I suspect a fish that hits a lure from the head or mid body is feeding but a fish that hits coming from behind,I suspect its hit from disturbing the fish.Many times those fish are slight hooked from the inside of the mouth but many times its from the outside in which would indicate an aggressive behavior towards the intruding lure. We are living in the ear of the best muskie fishing in history and the era of educated anglers,If there were 60 pounders,we would be catching them on a regular basis There are many of today's guides and anglers which specialize in great big fish,They are not catching them. In all exclusion of the NFWHF First lets understand that in most cold water regions 50 is attained generally between 18 to 24 years.Muskies are speculated to live until 30 years of age. When we factor that most living animals live out their lives to 80% of life expectancy,we can somewhat speculate that most muskies reach the pinnacle of there lives somewhere between 24 and 27 years old.Some do live out to 30 years old. They do not continue growth all there lives some just like all animals cease growth at 48,50,53 and the magical few will attain 58 inches or so. Most cold blooded animals seem to show lack of weight gain in the last year or 2 of there lives. Which would indicate that for a fish to be at its maximum potential the fish generally would be aged somewhere between 18 and 24 years of age. Georgian bay has produced most probably the only 60 pounder ,speculation of Obrien's fish still abound but Williamson fish is un-disputably 61 pounds,It was aged at 17 years old ,which from all indication was a fast growth.Now to make clear the gonads were never verified to my understanding and information so the speculation that this fish was sterile is un-founded. Georgian bay has produced many 50 pound to mid 50 pound muskies but like many regions it faces some environmental issues and the importance of all ,the diminishing of its forage base. The instability of weather which has direct effect on the feeding behavior of fish and most importantly the stability of water levels and temperature. Although it has produced many 50 pound fish,the length or maximum length do not seem to be common,fish in excess of 55 inches. I still believe that Georgian bay given its vastness could produce a fish slightly bigger than any other area. But not 70 pounds and I would be surprised at 65. Green Bay posses the possibility of producing such a big fish also if the angling pressure does not override and cease the potential maximum growth rate. It has produced a few 50 pound fish but once again at its early stage in evolution, maximum length seems to be somewhat of a small minority of fish. It was also stocked some 20 years ago or so which many of the first generation of fish can and will attain maximum growth rate,the second and third generations seem to display a slower and lesser growth rate. What I have not quite understood yet about the Big Green is average water temps and growth rate speed,its seems from my understanding and information that the growth rate is accelerated which would indicate that these fish may not live to full expectancy but this is not yet understood MN has produced some giant fish also,again 1st generation and fishing pressure seems to have created a form of avoidance in some areas.Once again the average maximum length seems to fall short somewhat.Although some giant are caught year to year,I do believe that methods of girthing maybe the variable that we are not looking at. The recent 58 incher and Jonenesi and Dahms fish are example of giants that do exist but once again we are looking at mid 50 pound fish which seem to display the peak of their life and physical being,The only variable which needs clarifying is whether girths were taken in water or out of water which would give a true approximation of their weight . Great big fish none the less The Big O and the Big flo have displayed length but due to specific fishing pressure and current factors these fish display different physical features and make up. The Big O fish have had specific angling pressure which has led to avoidance and somewhat ceased weight gains during the fall months. I have personally observed 3 individual of 58 inches,2 of those were approx 45 to 47 pounds,I do not believe these 2 females posses the the physical make up of attaining 58 pounds or better,There is 1 female which her physical make up and characteristics does meet the needed make to attain possibly 58 pounds,Finding her during the prime maximum weight gain period is like looking for a needle in a hay stack.I suspect avoidance and possibly angling experience may hamper her feeding ability. We did capture her last year at 58x26 (in water girth measurement) last year due to unseasonably cool waters,the year previous she was 58x25 For all others I suspect angling pressure has affected there feeding ability or willingness. The barbosa fish after many discussion with Mike Lazarus the fish may have been 55 to 57 pounds and the Lapointe fish somewhere around 58 pounds(that fish is now dead from old age) The Big Flo has produced many big fish but the one thing many do not understand is the current things.Many fish that lay in current use there swim bladders to rest upon the bottom to allow themselves to lunge upwards to feed,These fish although show some very nice girth,most have air trapped in their swim bladders which leads to abnormal girths not supported by weight due to the dimension of the fish. Again the methods of girthing whether in water or out of water may lead to discrepancies in the girth of the fish. The Mcnair fish in my opinion is around 55 to 57 pounds and at its maximum growth period at the time of the season and her life,without factoring the trapped air in her swim bladder. Lac Seul and LOTW seem to show signs of similar issues as the Ottawa When you factor all these regional variables and add environmental issues + weather + water conditions + angling pressure+ maximum life expectancy + maximum life period growth = limited possibilities of a fish exceeding 65 pounds or better C&R is great resource management tool and solutions but it is not the end all of end all, Post Mortality is a big factor and more an individual gets captured year after year or several times a years,Higher are the odds that post mortal release will ensue. I do believe state records can and will be broken if harvested I suspect we may have seen the biggest fish ever captured in Williamson fish There is a possibility that one slighty bigger may exist but unless harvested we will never know In hopes this further clarifies my views on the matter,Although I am not a biologist,I am an enthusiast of the species and understanding its life evolution and behavior. At this point in my evolution of muskie fishing,its goes beyond the great big fish,its about the great big fish and I am only as good as my clients are. Tks Steve W,I suspect you may have had some inclination were I was going with this marc thorpe | |||
| Guest |
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| Baby Mallard,I appreciate the request but unfortunately I do not sign autographs.The only autographs I sign are the checks for my Child Support and the Mother of my kids Fancies collecting them hahahahaha Its all in good due, just my humor at looking at life! | |||
| SMallSKi |
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| Herb_b |
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Posts: 829 Location: Maple Grove, MN | Let us not forget that all it takes is one fish to break the world record. One unusually large, genetically mutant fish to break the current record and for someone to get lucky and catch her. How many eight foot tall people do you see walking around? But giant people do exist and so do giant Muskies. Here is a link to the tallest man ever. Will there some day be a nine foot man. Possibly. http://www.guinnessworldrecords.com/records/human_body/extreme_bodi... Most Muskies never grow past 50 lbs and few ever grow past 60 lbs. But some have. Can a Muskie grow to be larger than 65 lbs? Not a normal Muskie, but a genetic mutant could and that is what it will take. All said, it is fun to dream about catching a world record and there is nothing wrong with that. But its also probably best to not get to serious about it either. Good fishing all. | ||
| guest |
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| guest |
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| sworrall |
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Posts: 32955 Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | |||
| Herb_b |
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Posts: 829 Location: Maple Grove, MN | And the guy that will catch it will most likely not even be fishing for Muskies. Like Ken Obrien who was trolling for walleyes..... Time to lighten up and get out fishing! | ||
| Skept |
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| bturg |
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| muskiewhored |
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Location: Oswego, IL | |||
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