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Posts: 147
Location: WI - Land of small muskies and big jawbones | One thing that I can say from experience is that a Rangers dry storage actually stays dry and I have a hard time finding many people who can say the same for Tuffy boats. I spent about 25 years fishing almost entirely in the Hayward area where there are (or were) probably more Tuffys in one single area that size than anywhere else and this was something most Tuffy owners complained about. Tuffy makes a great boat and they are great to fish out of but the dry storage problem with them got real old after a while. Another thing about Rangers is the re-sale value seems to hold up better than on Tuffy boats. I see a lot of Tuffys for sale on this site alone that don't move until the price drops quite a bit. If I can sell a Ranger boat relatively fast for a price at or near what I want out of it only because it has the name Ranger on it, that is a good thing and makes me glad it was not something else.
Edited by Lockjaw 2/1/2007 7:28 AM
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Posts: 5874
| Brad the 690 is a pretty good boat, maybe one of the best Ranger built. And while the two years warranty you have left may give you peace of mind, it is unlikely you will need it. That's all I'm saying. I ran out of warranty on my 97 F150 after two years, and never gave it a second thought. Why is it that a hull warranty is criticised for "Only" 5 years, yet a vehicle that costs thousands more, and driven daily year round, is OK when the warranty expires after less than 3 years? Why would you ever buy a new, or used, vehicle with less than a lifetime, or 10 year transferable warranty? Because you'd never find one, because no manufacturer would ever be stupid enough to offer one. The rate of incidence is so low on boat hulls, that a manufacturer can offer a long warranty, without a lot of risk. But what is the point?
As for the Tuffy dry storage? Yup, maybe in boats that were built more than 4 years ago. But with the redesign of the decks, Tuffy's now have dry storage. Oh, and I'd bet my new digital camera that Rangers are not always dry. Why do you think I had to get a new digital camera last summer? |
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| Shep, Again, I wasn't criticizing Tuffy for only having a 5 yr warranty..I'm not sure how you think I was..don't twist my words..I did say that I might not need mine, (warranty) but it's nice to know it's there...I guess the question to me is...if Tuffy Can offer it, cuz it's such a great hull, which I'm sure it is, Why don't they? Why not make it a lifetime warranty if it is going to hold up anyway...
They may be a bit more, but not 12-15k....and from what I have seen the last 3 yrs following boats for sale on this site and many others, Tuffys resale is not close to what a Rangers is...so that has to be taken into account when buying...at least I would think it would....how long have some of the boats in the classifieds that are Tuffys been in there?
again, all nice boats, buy whatever you want and fits your needs...my old Ranger does it for me... |
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| No way Lambeau King Kong would squash him like a bug!  |
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| i think Godzilla would beat King Kong in a fight because of his fire breath.
but that's just me.
(oops...i deleted my earlier post when i meant to edit it)
my point is simply that you don't have to hate one type to be happy with a different brand.
sometimes both can be good.
i've been in plenty of Rangers of different styles and i really liked them.
i've been in every current Tuffy except the 2060 and i really liked them.
i prefer the Tuffy layout and value, but that doesn't mean i hate Ranger.
i don't feel the need to thump my chest about how much i know or how much others don't know either. that's counterproductive if you ask me, and it's more likely to piss people off and turn people away from the brand i'm representing as a member of their staff. putting a competitor brand down is NOT the way to promote the brand you're a fan of, nor is belittling someone's views on their favorite brand a way to convince them to take a look at your favorite brand.
my experience and opinion is that Tuffy offers boats with muskie-fishermen in mind. they're extremely fishable, dry and safe. and they even go fast.
lots of other great boats out there too, but if you take a good look at a Tuffy you'll probably like it and anyone i've talked to who owns one has been pleased with the performance.
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| In my mind the resale on Rangers is horrible, when you look at purchase price vs sell price. Look at the prices people are paying for those boats and look at what they are selling for a year later it is simply ridiculous. I saw a 619 a couple of weeks ago with a 50,000 price tag on it....no thanks!
I believe the Tuffys hold up better in resale I have sold 2 of them over the past 7 years and always sell them for what I want to, and sell them fast. Also in regards to the dry storage on the Tuffy, you must be referring to the Esox Magnum. Yeah in the older models the storage got wet mainly due to water being able to get in from underneath, but we dealt with it, because there simply is not another boat made that will do what that boat does. I know plenty of Rangers that have the same problem The bottom of the compartments, like the Ranger compartments, were the actual hull of the boat with carpeting layed on it, and once the carpeting gets wet you are done. Go to a walleye tournament sometime and look in the parking lot after a rough day on the water and you will see plenty of Rangers with their lids popped open trying to dry out their storage compartment carpeting.
Post 2005 all storage in every Tuffy is enclosed, sealed fiberglass bins and they can't get wet, which is really nice.
There are lots of good boat out there, get the actual scoop before you try to throw a brand under the bus. |
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Posts: 5874
| Brad, not trying to put words in your mouth. Tuffy's warranty is what it is. Ranger's is what it is.
$12-15K was for a 2060 vs a 620, comparably equipped. $43,800 for the 2060, vs $57K+ for the Ranger. These were boats seen at recent boat shows.
A new 619 is mid to upper 40's. A 1890 is upper 30's, comapably equipped.
As for resale, yes, Ranger has good reasale. I would not say Tuffy's have bad resale. You'll see a disproportionate number of Tuffy's advertised here, than Rangers, so maybe that skews the perspective a bit.
I'm not bashing Ranger. They build a great boat. But I'm looking for value, and I found it again in Tuffy. |
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| That may be true on an 07 619, but I know of several leftover 06's that are new in the high 30's....just gotta do your shopping to find the deals...I agree, both are nice...we can leave it at that!
Sort of a Ford vs Chevy type thing....
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Posts: 2323
Location: Stevens Point, WI | Well of course your going to be able to find a 619 in the $30's, there trying to unload the things! Same goes for every other 06 that dealer might be sitting on. That's what happens this time of year! |
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Posts: 144
| This thread has kind of taken a turn for the worse. I didn't want to start a debate. The reason I asked was because of the prices I saw at the Milwaukee boat show. When I bought My 619dvs in 2005, brand new, I paid around $35,000 for the boat, trailer, motor( 200 0pti), minn=kota maxxum 74, lowrance 125, on the bow. No kicker, no console locator. After I added that stuff I was up around 39000. This was in september of '05. Last week,at the milwaukee boat show, I priced the new 619 with a single console, the same motor, and trailer. The price was $40,000. They had a 619 there rigged like mine,(except for the 225 pro xs) for almost $50,000. I compared this to the Tuffy 1890 with a 200 0pti. and was quoted a price of $36,500. They didn't have an 1890 at the show but have seen some on this site and they really look awesome. I just can't believe how Ranger has increased their prices. Who can afford that? The only reason I could afford my boat was because I inherited a car from my dad! I didn't even bother to look at the show price on the 621, it must have been $60,000!! I Didn't want to imply that Tuffy was somehow inferior or anything, I just thought it was strange that they didn't have a lifetime hull warranty. If I had it to do over again right now, I wouldn't even consider the Ranger. If any of you guys with an 1890 ever make it to Pewaukee Lake I would really love to have a ride! |
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Location: Stevens Point, WI | At the Milwaukee boat show last weekend, there was a 621 that topped $60000. In my opinion that's freakin ridiculous! |
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| At the Milwaukee boat show last weekend, there was a 621 that topped $60000. In my opinion that's freakin ridiculous!
it's expensive, but not necessarily ridiculous, imho.
Ranger is a successful business and they're well aware of their market. they have to be.
if they weren't able to sell boats at that price, they wouldn't be listed at that price.
free market prices are set by supply and demand, and apparently the demand is strong.
now, if you're talking value rather than price...that's the realm of subjective opinion and i agree with you wholeheartedly! i believe this is one of Tuffy's real strengths - you get more for your money compared to other boats of equal performance and rigging.
that, and Godzilla's fire breath would send King Kong running for the banana trees every time.
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Posts: 2037
Location: lansing, il | you guys are funny with your boat egos!!! brad i usally agree with you but i gotta side with mike on this one......no way could kong take godzilla out..no way!!
i got a sears robuck & co. inflatable raft with a 2 hp eska it gets the job done and blows away any ranger or tuffy |
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Posts: 5874
| Pete,
I'll be on Pewaukee for the Southern Opener, and you're welcome to join me for any part of the day. If you want to get out sooner, we could meet in the middle somewhere.
As for the price increase, it appears the 619's went up with this year's redesign, about as much as the 06 620's went up. When I priced an 06 620 last year, it went up over $6000 from the 05 I priced. That was boat and trailer increase. |
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Location: north central wisconsin | Tj and bn, check Docs tattoo studio in Medford WI. He does great work. Please, no pictures here though, just the story line..... |
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| No way Bette, I'm runnin a 1989 12' Grumman Scanoe with a 1976 Minn Kota 22 lb thruster for 07..your S&R is goin dowwwwwn! |
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Posts: 5874
| I have a Merc Minnow(1984?), with a Green 3HP Clinton(Mid-1900's!) I used for a duck skiff. Made from Ram-X material, it was the same a the Coleman Crawdad. It's been out in North Dakota since 1990, when I quit duck hunting in WI. That Clinton was something. Only had forward gear, always! If you needed to back up, you turned the motor 180 degrees. Runs like a champ. Last time I saw it was fall of 01, though. I need to get back out there one of these years. |
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Location: north central wisconsin | Don't knock the Gruman dude!! It is one effective Musky machine year in, year out for us!! The dry storage sucks though.
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Location: Stevens Point, WI | Reef Hawg, between my college budget and my fishing addiction, I don't see any tattoos in the near future!
Lambeau, I totally understand that if Ranger's market can sell those boats for those prices in my opinion great. I find it funny though that many people have bought there first house or even houses for less than what a new Ranger costs. But in my opinion, you are paying that extra money for a name. I think we all know that. But yes I did mean value. I think for the money and for a comparable boat that the Tuffy is just as good or better in some areas, seeing they have been around for a very comparable time. Ranger has just a touch more history in the boating world than Tuffy. Seeing that Ranger touches everything from the bass world to inland saltwater, they are much more diverse! |
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| If someone can get 60k for a new 621 more power to them. Don't knock the dealer for it, knock the people who are willing to pay those prices. If I take a dump and put my steaming pile of poo up for sale I'm going to sell it to the guy who gives me 10 bucks before I'll sell it to the guy who wants to give me 5 bucks for it. The guy with the 5 dollar bill is going to wonder what made my poo worth 10 bucks so he might want to save up another 5 and offer me 10 the next day....
Interesting though...when did the higher metal prices kick in and have an effect on boat prices? Kind of a moot point talking about glass boats but there's metal in those trailers. |
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Location: minocqua, wi. | Upright Floatation
ok, TJ ... i was on Sardis Lake about 15 years ago with a Champion Dealer in a fully rigged 18' bassboat trimmed out and the guy told me to crank the wheel as hard as i could .... no skip at all .... so i skipped to the dealer and bought a Champion and could afford it so i bought what impressed me over the others i had ridden in, including ranger.
1998 i was in florida and saw them cut a boat in half with a chainsaw and drive both halfs in to shore .... i had 4 kids and after seeing that and moving north i sold the Champion and bought the Whaler and again could afford it.
2000 i saw similar results of hull design and upright flotation from Ranger and needed a longer boat .... still 4 kids on my mind so sold the Whaler and bought a Ranger.
i was in a car accident really bad one and again had 4 kids and bought an S-Class Mercedes after understanding their engineering of crumple zones for high impact safety results .... the car cost a lot of money and i could sell it anytime probably for the remaining value, but here it is 1989 and it still looks and runs new.
just like boats, cars, trucks ... you get what you pay for with some brands and there are people who buy for many reasons and don't consider price a problem if its delivering them value ... and value doesn't mean a cheap price. if you can show me a boat that you can cut in half or fill with water and i can have that confidence .... as a parent with 4 kids in the thing as much as mine are, i'm buying that boat. if they give me a jacket i might wear it too.
i think the truck discussion would be a fun one too!
Edited by jonnysled 2/1/2007 2:09 PM
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Posts: 364
Location: Kentucky | Hey,
I think I bought your steaming pile o poo on eBay... for $15. Somebody else tried to outbid me.
Ranger, Tuffy, both good, but value after the sale is wiped out by the maxim that applies to any brand: BOAT = break out another thousand. |
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Posts: 1168
| You got a good deal. If you dig through it you'll find a high concentration of gold flakes from a recent goldschlager bender. |
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Posts: 5874
| The resins used in glass boats kicked in about the same time as aluminum. They all had dramatic increases the last couple years. |
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Posts: 364
Location: Kentucky | ulbian - 2/1/2007 4:22 PM
You got a good deal. If you dig through it you'll find a high concentration of gold flakes from a recent goldschlager bender.
OMG, you were right!
And yet, you just ain't right.
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Posts: 7039
Location: Northwest Chicago Burbs |
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Location: minocqua, wi. | i'm in Zibo China near Jinan and saw Godzilla last night pillaging the area ... he's one tough dude! oooohhhhh!!!! GoooZilllaaaaaaa ... all i can hear on the streets! |
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Location: The desert | You had a goldschlager bender without me???
Slamr, what is that contributing to this topic? |
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Location: Northwest Chicago Burbs | Pointer,
In the end, Ranger vs. Tuffy vs. Champion vs. whatever....or Okuma vs. Daiwa vs. Abu vs. Tica vs. whatever.....Professional Edge vs. St. Croix vs. Lamiglas vs. Loomis vs. whatever....
It's all King Kong vs. Godzilla. Figure out what is in your price range, find out the positives vs. negatives, and make your choice.
No one product is perfect for everyone. It's what you think, what fits you best, what you believe in. Some people think Kong would kick Godzilla's butt, some think the other way around. . I personally think Godzilla would womp on Kong, but thats just me. |
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Many of the ads for Tuffy Boats onsite here are boats that have sold, we need to update those. I'll tell you why there are lots of Tuffys and lots of Rangers for sale here; lots of folks buy both brands. Plus, there are a number of Tuff Team folks onsite who advertise their boats for sale after a year or so, with the intent of buying a new Tuffy; and a number of Ranger Team folks doing the same. Another point, this is a Muskie website, and Tuffy builds Muskie boats. Might be a bit of an influence there, don't you think?
The storage issue in the E Mag was a pain for years in the rear storage hatch especially. That was redesigned and now it's sealed, and won't let water in unless the latch seal gasket fails, which CAN happen. Interestingly, Ranger doesn't promise dry storage, and in fact in the 2007 warranty won't cover leaking hatches or other designed openings, and for good reason; water is GOING to occasionally get into the best designed storage lockers. Crestliner, Lund, and a host of other brands didn't even try to go there, most of the storage is just plain wet sometimes.
A bit more of a warranty explanation; the hull, stringers, and transom are 10 years on the Ranger, lifetime for original owner and this is only transferable ONE time, according to the 2007 published warranty. Now Ranger knows, just like Crestliner and Lund, the average guy owns his new boat for between 3 and 5 years. So the second owner has a few years warranty ONLY on the hull, transom, and stringers, and those only if there has been a failure deemed to be Ranger's problem, so to speak. If the boat didn't have any problems after 3 years, it is extremely unlikely it ever will.
Gelcoat finishes including blistering, cracking, crazing, fading, chalking or discoloration are not covered, nor is crazing; carpet and upholstery wear, fraying or tearing or any other problem covered under the three year warranty unless it's deemed to be a workmanship or material defect by Ranger. Many of the components in a Ranger warranted for three years Tuffy covers for five, like the seats, carpet, and main electrical. If they didn't fail after 3, they probably won't by 5. Ranger offers a transferable warranty with a $100 fee; one transfer only, Tuffy doesn't care if the boat has had 4 owners, if it's within the 5 year warranty schedule, it's covered. Most Tuffy owners keep their boat for more than the 5 years, anyway. If a Ranger has a two year birthday at a dealer, then the warranty the customer gets when buying that non current is running from the date of manufacture, so 1 year on some things or zero if the boat is 3 years old, nothing to transfer but the hull, stringer, and deck warranty. A non current Tuffy will be covered for 5 years from the date of sale, regardless of the model year or date of build. Subtle differences, and really not that big of a deal, but I'd guess the dealers are keenly aware of the warranty issue, and drop the price of a Ranger approaching that 24 month in stock barrier to sell it while the full warranty applies for the customer. That might explain the great prices one sees on two or three year old new Rangers now and again. No idea, but it makes sense to me. By the way, if you are after a new Ranger, our good friend Chuck Nelson went to work at Heckels in Eagle River, I bet he'd love to have a shot at the sale.
My experience with a stringer or hull failure on an older Tuffy has been they take care of the customer UNLESS there was abuse or serious neglect, and even then will offer a deal most customers are delighted with to fix the problem. I bet Ranger does the same, on a one to one basis. The warranty is only as strong as the company, and both exceed the warranty sometimes to keep a customer happy and talking up the brand.
As far as owning an older Ranger or Tuffy, some folks 'old' boats are other folk's 'new' boats. Thank goodness for that, or there would be a ton of guys fishing from shore. Every one of you who own an older boat ARE an eventual prospect for a new boat, be it a G3, Tuffy, Ranger, Polar Kraft, Skeeter, or whatever. All will do the best they can to win you over.
Face it, both are great boats. One is a national builder, the other regional. Neither worries all that much about the other, we get along out there just fine. Both will get their share if they innovate and build cool new products.
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