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Posts: 906
Location: Warroad, Mn | Thought I'd try with what I think. Many of the above posts say time on the water is one of the keys, and that's very true However, I think that if you are fishing a very low population of fish it's very hard to know if what you are doing is right or wrong. To become a real good muskie fisherman you need to fish where there's a good population of fish. To know if you are doing something right or wrong you need to have something to catch. Then as mentioned, boat control is very important, and this comes with learning the lake. When to stay out, when to get in close, when to go fast, (low population spot) when to go slow (high population spot) and pick it apart. With this is the ability to cast with great accuracy, with out any screw-ups. Be very efficient with your casts. Do an “L” on each cast and learn how to see a muskie following your lure. Then learn how to read the water. There will be spots in weed beds, boulders, flats, points, cliffs, basins, sand beaches, fallen trees, bait schools, and many others that are a better bet than the rest of the lake. Learn where these are. Fish these areas! Learn about the fish. What do they like for prey, when do they spawn, what is their preferred water temp and water clarity. What do they do on a seasonal basis. Learn about there home ranges. They do lots of different thing, but many are the same. Fish where they are at that time of year. Fish with as many different experienced muskie fisherman as you can as very likely you'll learn something. One of he best muskie learning experiences there is, is to guide for 30+ years. And a whole lot of luck! Doug Johnson |
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Posts: 283
| Lots of really good points were made. Another thing that wasn't hit on yet...Is just straight up keeping fish pinned. The best fishermen have the best figure 8s and can read fish well turning followers into eaters. Anyone can catch the suicidal fish on the figure 8. |
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| dougj - 4/1/2015 9:13 PM Fish with as many different experienced muskie fisherman as you can as very likely you'll learn something. That's the REAL secret, right there. There's not enough time in one lifetime for an isolated person to develop all the necessary knowledge and skill needed to be "that guy" all on his own. |
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Location: varies | Man! "Really good" sounds like a lot of work. I'm good with just "Aw right". |
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Posts: 410
Location: one foot over the line | Enjoy the hunt. If one is so he!!-bent on boating the biggest fish or the most, fishing can turn into an extremely frustrating game. Be prepared; boat, gear, maps, positive mental attitude, electronics, analysis, etc, however, if it doesn't happen on a given outing, understand that there will (hopefully) be other days. Very similar to bow-hunting trophy bucks. Reminds me of a field of dreams, "if you build it, they will come". Time on the water is wonderful, enjoy it. |
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Posts: 397
Location: Wisconsin | you bring up a good point... My Dad and I have always said, "they hit when you least expect it".... |
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Posts: 4080
Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion | A lot of great information here. Time on the water seams to be the key.
Nobody mentioned the "Network factor"
The Guy that has people calling him 4-6 times a day with info on the Bite, has a big advantage because he knows the, Where, When, What Bait to use, Color, How deep, ect. ect.
Good topic. |
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Posts: 19
| i think setting yourself up to succeed is a big part of it also, you can spend a lot of time on water and not accomplish much. Realizing that you cant do everything and have to make decisions on what you feel is right for the area you fish and the time you have. Have FUN and don't expect to catch ten fish before you catch one
i did not expect much when i started reading this but i like it:)
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Posts: 284
Location: Eagan, MN | "Ask 'why?' allot. Figure out the answers."
Why ask why? Muskies are as dumb as a stump. Not much to figure out. Throw a 2x4 and eventually you'll get bit. Time on the water. Those guys who catch fish are just lucky, that's all. |
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Posts: 20219
Location: oswego, il | Awareness is mental, a state of mind. It is part of your consciousness. Some learn it some don't. You ever ride in the car with someone and they run up behind a slow car, slow down and could have easily just passed them on a 4 lane road? Vary their speed 5, 10, 15mph for no reason? Awareness. I have fished with people who do this. That lack of awareness shows on the water too.
Agree on fishing with experienced people but not necessary if you posses the above.
Edited by ToddM 4/2/2015 6:30 AM
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Posts: 358
| mastery of the basics & the will to succeed. this makes you good wherever you go. many people think they have it, but not many really do. |
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Posts: 688
Location: Northern IL | Are you talking about where you blind fold a guy, set him in a "tiller boat" anywhere in the world and in a short amount of time he could tell you about everything there is to know about the body of water in which he just landed? I knew a guy like that!
This guy use to say it took him about 4days to put a lake in his back pocket, show off... He could draw you a map of the most productive structure situations in that body of water and show you the migration route the fish were using. He would show the places (he called them "breaks") where the fish would stop or pause along the route and say "how far they move and how long they stay at a break or breakline was totally dependent on the weather and water conditions at the time". He would also say "water color is one of the most important chooses a fishermen can make", he really was something! Give him three rods, 2 trolling /mono & single strand wire and a casting rod, a set of "tools" lures that allowed him to reach the shallows, the deep and the in-between depths at all speeds and a basic depth meter and watch this master go to work.
No one will argue that time is necessary in rising to the top in any endeavor but imo and Todd's and others time alone is not enough. To point to tow. as being the cure all misses the point. Guys that understand or are aware of fish movements, fish activity, how the weather and water conditions effect these movements get more out of their time. All of the "successful consistent" fishermen that I know, met or have ever fished with in my little world have all the same things in common. They all have a positive energetic attitude about fishing and life in general. They have endless amounts of energy and like a lazier beam are focused on their target often having an appearance, "Like a duck on water". They all have a no quit mentality while they patiently wait for what's about to happen. They have a basic understanding of the movements and migrations of the species they seek and they are all excellent mappers!
While time is extremely important it's only part of what separates the really good "consistent" anglers from the rest. I have no doubt in a guy with the qualities listed above and him armed with the right knowledge that he will soon be "Really Good". For example look at young Cory Allen. |
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Posts: 620
Location: Seymour, WI | I love reading the responses from the most accomplished anglers on this post.
One thing that I'm suprised no one has mentioned yet is bait presentation. The best anglers that I know are very specialized in their bait presentation. They are using the same musky baits as all the other musky anglers, but they are much more precise in the way they present it. Through a combination of learning the water that they're fishing on and knowing how to put a bait where the fish are, they get bit more often. You can see this every year if you fish a musky tournament like the NCMO in Eagle River. Often the same guys win the tourney every yr and they do it using the same lures as everyone else, whether it be bulldawgs or jerkbaits or bucktails. The really good sticks that I've fished with present the lure differently than the guy that's just casting it out and reeling it in. At first glance the way they present a lure might not look all that different than the next guy, but it is different. By being on the water alot and kwowing the water extremely well they are able to get their baits just a little bit closer to the fish without fouling the bait on the bottom or in the weeds. This is an easy skill to talk about, but very difficult to perfect. That's what I think makes "that guy" so much better than the average Joe.
Grass |
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Posts: 129
| ToddM - 4/1/2015 1:07 PM
Awareness and your ability to think for yourself. This sport can be broken down into followers and leaders. Which one are you?
Time on the water plus the ingrediants above |
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Posts: 1220
| I wrote an article recently where I asked a bunch of what I think are excellent sticks (like what you are talking about here) what they thought about a certain point of fishing. With one possible exception, (he may be an old guy too-not too sure) they are all way younger than me, one is often referred to as a "kid" almost all the time. They are all way better than me too, some you could say don't even play in the same stadium. I sort of doubt that any of them have much more "time on the water" than me. And, even though I recognize my betters when I see them, I really don't have a complex about my fishing or feel that inferior. In fact, I really can catch a musky once in a while. But, all this "time on the water" stuff is giving me a bit of a queazy stomach. Put simply, if you enjoyed your time on the water, you had a good quality life, you lived it wisely....but that doesn't make you any kind of expert. It's what you learned in whatever time it took you to learn it that made you the angler that you are. I really wished I really started listening more years ago. Unfortunately, there are kids in their 20's who are not only younger, stronger and who posess a really nice head of hair, they will fish the pants off of me (and some of you too) it's just a fact. Sure, Tom Gelb's older than most, and maybe the best mind in the sport....but it's not his time on the water, it's simply that he took a lifetime of engineering expertise and applied it to his approach toward fishing. He was working hard the whole time. The only thing that comes purely from TIME ON THE WATER is skin cancer. |
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Posts: 558
| Each and every spot you fish always have the confidence that there is fish there to be had. That way you pay attention to every single cast. I always like to think i have a fish following evey single cast, keeps you pumped up. Stay positive is number 1 imo. Pound the water with your confidence lures, other wise you will be wasting casts changing lures when you could be making more casts out to where that next bite could be. Boat control also a big part. Just have fun, thats what puts fish in the boat.
Edited by Musky Face 4/2/2015 10:33 PM
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Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | BrianF. - 4/2/2015 5:04 AM
"Ask 'why?' allot. Figure out the answers."
Why ask why? Muskies are as dumb as a stump. Not much to figure out. Throw a 2x4 and eventually you'll get bit. Time on the water. Those guys who catch fish are just lucky, that's all.
You can't be serious.
And Marty nailed it.
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Posts: 8782
| Marty, what you are eluding to is SMART time on the water. It's the time you spend trying to figure out what's going on because you have a desire to go out there next time and do better, and know more. Some guys just go out there and fish, and there's nothing wrong with that. I suspect that they enjoy their fishing just as much as the rest of us. Part of the game for me is looking at the box of 1,000 pieces and being able to put a few more pieces together at the end of the day or the week to get that much closer to the big picture. I'll never finish the puzzle, and that's okay. I'll likely never get as far as many have on getting the big picture together, and that's okay, too. Unless you're fishing a tournament it's not a competition. I just like to learn stuff, and I enjoy the challenge of outsmarting a fish.
They're pretty stupid, but they live under the water in a world we don't fully understand. We have to figure out what they are up to from above the water using something that doesn't move or act like a fish, and only looks like a fish to us. Being able to do that with any consistency is a pretty cool thing.
I was lucky to spend the majority of my fishing years alone out there just absorbing what happened when I caught fish and trying to figure out what went wrong when I didn't. Just me and the water and the fish. I had no magazines, no guides, no internet, no books, and no mentors. I think there were Saturday morning fishing shows back then, but I was too busy fishing to watch TV. I didn't really care what anyone else was doing as long as they were fishing somewhere else and I could be alone to figure out how to catch more fish.
I've gotten into the magazines and websites and seminars and guides and internet and such over the last ten years, and really tried to learn as much from others as possible during that time, and that's been a huge benefit. I've learned a lot from a lot of really great anglers and guides. The older I get, the less I care about what other people are doing or catching. It's fun to fish with old friends and have a few laughs. It's good to learn from others. But I will end this game just like I started it over 40 years ago. Just me and the water and the fish...
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| So....How many of you that posted are "that guy" ?
lots of arm chair quarterbacks but to really know it is to be it.
Nope...I'm definitely not "that guy". |
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Posts: 1937
Location: Black Creek, WI | "That Guy" can be anyone. "That Guy" for me may not be "That Guy" for you. I just hope that I'm "That Guy" for my two boys. And... an "arm chair quarterback" for you may not be an "armchair quarterback" for me. |
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Posts: 880
Location: New Berlin,Wisconsin,53151 | Some of the multiple post on this topic makes you wonder if these guys wives let them get out and fish? I agree with Junkman "IT'S TIME ON THE WATER"!
Netman |
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Posts: 20219
Location: oswego, il | Junkman said its not time on the water but what you do and learn from it. |
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Posts: 2687
Location: Hayward, WI | Lots of great thoughts and answers to this guys. It's grown more than I figured it would. Time on the water is certainly important, but Marty's last thread really said it well. Somebody that spends a little less, but thoughtful time on the water is likely to be way ahead of somebody that goes all day every day, but uses the same bait, in the same spot, at the same depth, etc. etc.
For myself, the hardest thing to know is how fast to fish a spot, or spots, and how to know when to change presentations, spot types, depths, etc. Expecting to catch a fish every few hours when doing the "right" things, it's hard to know when to experiment due to limited feedback. Fishing panfish gives a lot more feedback - can pretty much change things constantly till fish are found and start biting.
Most of the time, there isn't enough time to do it all in a day, and I think it's the guys that are very strong at narrowing down the pattern are the guys that really do well on a consistent basis. I generall have no problem catching fish when they are where I am fishing and willing to bite the baits I'm using. When they are somewhere else at a different depth, and need to be searched out and patterned - that's what seperates the men from the boys in my eyes.
A lot touched on paying attention and I think that's huge. Equally important is knowing what to do with the information (or sometimes lack of information) one is receiving and knowing what to do with it. I think that's one of the hardest parts, and might be nearly impossible to teach how to do that through a book, seminar, or online forum. I think the best of the best have developed good instincts and that goes a long ways.
Great information here. Hope to read some more.
Oh, regarding who is THAT guy. I'm not, or at least I sure don't feel like it most of the time. It's likely that some guys think they are THAT guy while they are not, and a lot of them that don't think they are THAT guy - really are, at least in other's eyes. Then again, what THAT guy is, really boils down to perception.
Tucker
Edited by curleytail 4/3/2015 11:17 AM
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | 'That guy' is whomever is currently better at catching muskies under certain conditions (etc.) than I am. Once I learn and master what 'that guy' has figured out, then it's the next 'that guy'. It will never end. |
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Posts: 8782
| I'm not "that guy". Maybe I was that guy back in college when I didn't have a job and I could fish every day. I was sort of that guy when I had a job that generously allowed me to have 8 weeks of paid time off and every weekend to fish.
These days, I get to fish with "that guy" a few times a year, maybe for a week if I'm lucky. If I live long enough and I am really lucky, I'll get to retire and be that guy again one day. Hopefully I won;t be too senile to remember what I learned from "that guy" along the way.
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| ToddM - 4/3/2015 10:45 AM
Junkman said its not time on the water but what you do and learn from it.
Now that's awareness!  |
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Posts: 880
Location: New Berlin,Wisconsin,53151 | Now thats funny, it still "Time on the Water" LOL |
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Posts: 1144
Location: Minnesota. | In my boat I'm "That Guy"...otherwise I'd take my toys and go home (w/my tail 'tween my legs!)
Heck I feel lucky every time get a hit! |
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Location: oswego, il | I am that guy, that ****ing guy, that mother ****ing guy over there. |
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Posts: 246
| If I were to ever become that guy what would I do with all the excuses I have lined up in my brain? |
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