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Reef Hawg |
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Posts: 3518 Location: north central wisconsin | jerryb - 6/26/2012 2:36 PM This suspended thing... Sure it happens, but maybe 10% of a fishing season. 10 or 90% hummm? Just a few thoughts... Can someone please interpret this sentance for me? | ||
| Homer |
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Posts: 321 | Reef Hawg - 6/26/2012 3:05 PM jerryb - 6/26/2012 2:36 PM This suspended thing... Sure it happens, but maybe 10% of a fishing season. 10 or 90% hummm? Just a few thoughts... Can someone please interpret this sentance for me? Code for Buck Perry is sexy. H | ||
| foulpole18 |
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Posts: 23 | Flambeauski - 6/26/2012 2:54 PM First off, Buck Perry didn't coin the term structure. 2nd, you likely weren't fishing the Gile or Flambeau Flowage if you caught 31 muskies in a week. But I invite you to come up this way and try your spoonplugging in 20+ feet in either of those bodies of water and see how you fare. I thought Buck Perry was pretty cool till I started reading your posts, you're not doing the man any favors. Jborst catching 31 muskies in a week and has a differing opinion than you do and you blow up about Buck Perry and say it couldn't be done on your waters. This thread was very informative until this post. Give a guy some credit instead of critizing him. Obviously he caught more fish last week than you did. No wonder I don't post on these forums very often. Everyones a critic. Congrats on the week of fishing Jborst. Bet it was fun! PS Buck Perry is cool Flambeauski. Edited by foulpole18 6/26/2012 8:35 PM | ||
| CiscoKid |
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Posts: 1906 Location: Oconto Falls, WI | jerryb - 6/26/2012 2:36 PM Btw all fish caught at 20' or deeper, and not one suspended. This suspended thing... Sure it happens, but maybe 10% of a fishing season. 10 or 90% hummm? Just a few thoughts... That 20' and deeper "structure" fishing, or not structure as you put it, is a tough area for most to fish effectively. My hats off to you on a "slow" week. So please do tell what is your technique for tackling the deep water as that was the question of this thread? This is a serious question, and not one meant to throw darts at you as I am always game top learn. To claim that only 10% of the muskies a season may be caught suspended...what are the considerations? 10% of your muskies, 10% of mine, or 10% of the total muskies caught in North America? I know one thing. You can't catch them suspended if you don't try to catch them that way.  | ||
| MD75 |
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Posts: 682 Location: Sycamore, IL | Jerry, I see that your from IL...please don't tell me that you caught 31 muskies in our state last week. I'm depressed enough already! Seriously though...it says that you are a Spoonplug Instuctor: where can I take your class to learn more about this trolling technique? Matt p.s. This is the best thread posted for quite some time:) | ||
| Clark A |
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Posts: 618 Location: Bloomington, MN | I really miss the sound and basic functionality of the old flasher units. The sound it produduced actually made one pay attention to what it was indicating below the boat. I probably could of bought and old beat up 16' resort boat for what I had spent on pig tail 6 volt batteries to for my Lowrance/BirdTraps over the years. Those that do not know the sound of a dying battery in a old portable flasher have missed a beautiful, yet horrifying moment in their "modern" angling life! It then became the needless cabin run due battery life dis-belief. 31 muskies in a week is a very good week, but it is possible with Mr. Jerry Borst, the Spoonplugger. He is a good fisherman, and an instructor. People actually work very hard to capture these fish, so unless it was stated to be in an area where trolling is illegal, why the doubt? If I and a friend got 18 in one afternoon out of Pelican Lake, WI in Guth's Bay in 1977 casting Slim Jims...anything is possible. The fish were 45", 34" 31", and a mess between 18"or so and 25"..maybe 26"...it was very busy as I recall! I can actually state I caught 68 muskies that year, 10 were legal, and I released 7. That was pretty good for 1977. I was a 14 year old kid, so I counted what I caught. That was the best summer of my life! Edited by Clark A 6/27/2012 1:03 AM | ||
| Flambeauski |
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Posts: 4343 Location: Smith Creek | I do believe Mr. Borst caught 31 fish in a week. I was the guy who posted that an angler fishing the Gile or Flambeau Flowage should be pleased he caught a fish in two days of fishing. 10 fish in a week would be phenomenal on those bodies of water. They have like .01 muskies per acre. And any lure that runs deeper than 10 feet is gone in a hurry. It would be like me telling Travis that fishing suspended is stupid because I went to LSC or Pewaukee and caught 20 fish in a week in the weeds. It has no relevance to the conversation. | ||
| jerryb |
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Posts: 688 Location: Northern IL | No surprise to see the back benchers weigh in.... Buck is very sexy! 1st, thanks foulpole, you wouldn't happen to be a Cards fan?And Clark for having a clear head, always enjoy hearing the stories of great days on the water, thanks! MD 75, be happy to talk with you, just send a pm or email. Would like to take this into a slightly different direction since the thread seems to have stalled. I think we'll describe one of the deep water structure situations where these "31" fish were located and subsequently caught, don't you just love the doubters, what do they believe? So what are your thoughts on getting into a school of muskie? What is your strategy to make a big catch each and every time you launch the boat?All game fish school right?The problem for most is they limit there "depth control" by only casting or trolling the shallows. And I get the casting thing, it's fun when it's happening but Casting, jigging and trolling can all be done in deep water, (8'-10' or deeper) quite effectively, providing the fish aren't in the shallows or dormant. If the fisherman places a limit on his depth not only does he place a huge limit on the number of fish he may run into but also on the size. Here's the way it works, muskies school! However the school will break up or scatter at either the weedline or if we have a shallow weedline (good water color) at the 8'-10' depth or deeper....Not only that but the larger a fish gets, the older he gets the more reluctant he is to move towards the shallows. Its like any aging animal there not as active in there later years. This is gonna be tough for some to swallow, sorry, I didn't make the rules, and there are rules. This is all right out of the book. That's the reason we rarely if ever have seen or experienced a big school of big fish in the shallows, beyond the spawn, cause they hardly ever get to the shallows as a group, (weather related). Not saying never. Last week we had decent weather conditions, not great but warm fronts beat a cold front. A good chunk of our fish basically came from 3 different spots, all far apart from one another and totally different structure situations, no two are ever the same. Structure: "The bottom of a body of water that is different from the surrounding bottom area". One in particular is a structure where we've caught good muskies and walleyes in the past so no surprise to find them there once again. Now that you have accepted the fact that muskies school, always love when guys say they "pack like wolves",, what ev, we must also accept that all fish including the muskie school according to "size", the little ones hang with the little ones, the fry with other fry, teenagers with there group and the big or adult fish in that last schooling size, thats the one we're all after. How many different groups are there? Don't know, and don't care. I'll leave that question to the smart fishermen... they like stuff like that.... If they didn't school according to size the small fish would get eaten by the large fish, blah,blah,blah... So we hit this little known producer and on the 1st pass we hit a good one, shes heavy or it could be fowl hooked, ya never know, it happens... No need to get too excited till we can see her, you ever have a guy in the boat and every fish he hits is a giant, funny. .. So we hit this fish and its on for a short while but shakes off. She had some good weight to her and our blood starts pumping, thinking, "we may have something going". Keep in mind this is a small area, and we know exactly where the fish hit, the total productive area is maybe a hundred yards,,,, out far from wood, weeds, or visible rocks, or the moon,, ha ha..The average muskie fishermen would claim, if he was lucky enough to ever hit this spot, that it was in the "abbis", more on that later. 38' is the deepest water in the area which we checked out later and hit one decent walleye and a couple small fish in 34'. This productive area rises out of the 38' fairly quickly to about 28-30' then goes kind of flat to this 300'+\- ridge which goes from 28' to 26', its clean and hard, with some hangie rock, hangie or hangy, is that a word? The surrounding area is firm but not as clean or hard and not hang y,. We set up again and make another pass from the opposite direction, were trolling and running parallel with this little ridge, we might make a pass at 28' and the next at 26'. We make the second pass at 4-5mph and another one gets the JB 1 spoonplug in her mouth another good one but didn't feel quite as heavy, we land it, a 45", nice fish! The big ones are defiantly moving! The 3rd pass yields nothing but the 4th pass another good one strikes the lure, large head shakes, she comes to the surface and throws the hooks., CRAP!!! I'd guess 50" or better but didn't get a great look at her. A couple more trolling passes were made, with no hits,,, we probably should have jigged it but then again we probably, maybe, could have, spooked em. Hind site.... What ya gonna do? We came back later and took a 24" walleye, one for the grill. Was out filming with a guy and we hit 9 that day in which 4-5 came off a different spot, no big ones there. So is 31 a lot for a week? How bout 7 between 40"-51" in a day? 96 in 3 weekends? I don't know, put it this way 31 in a week is not only possible but expected if you learn to interpret deep water. When you place your lure or bait at the right depth, move it at the right speed and do so at the right time., that equals a catch or two. Lower your expectations? Not here! Are you thinking Buck is sexy yet? The point is again interpreting deep "structure" as it says on the Alaska'n license plate, is "the last frontier". Knowing as much about the area being fished is critical to being successful on a more consistent basis, trolling, or casting. Of course were going to do our research on every body of water we go, fish populations, water color, "fishability", etc. Would you fish a lake that doesn't have any fish? Not me. And to add its full of hangs.... And the method of our presentation is dictated, don't think so..... I'll see you in Minn, or Canada, or Kentucky or Michigan, but not in northern Wisconsin. Another thing that the fisherman should also know is a fish is NEVER caught on accident! The fisherman may not know, is that even possible?where HE is, but be assured the fish know at all times where they are! A fisherman may think they caught one in the "abbis", not true. One of the best pointers ever given to us was, once you catch a fish ask yourself, "how did he get to where we caught him? Knowing, and if you don't know believe it starting now, the only retreat from a ever changing environment is "deep water". A fish doesn't swim about haphazardly, they follow well established routes and it all starts in the deepest water in the area. I guess we should talk for the last time about suspension, we know there are times when all species suspend some like the trout, salmon and stripper family more than others. The muskies can also at times be found suspended but it's a small percentage of the time, on lakes that have a heavy thermocline (this year, you bet) or when they have become extremely active mostly in the summer. I still say 90/10 from ice out to ice up, where legal of course. My 4 boys and I have been working deep water since 1995 deepest Muskie caught on purpose a 49" at 52'. I read Buck Perry's book, "Your guide to lunker catches" and I put the blinders on. We then went out and followed it to, almost the letter, ha ha. Throughout this time we've fished muskies about 1/2 of that time from a hundred+ different lakes, rivers and reservoirs and we're now closing in on 1900 boated. No spectacular records have been set and no great individual talents or skills were required but the fact that Buck Perry made some great discoveries that changed the way we all fish today. He wrote them down and we along with thousands of others took his proven step by step methods and followed it to the best of our ability. Now if that somehow turns someone off, Oh well, can't help that. Good luck! Edited by jerryb 6/29/2012 8:18 PM | ||
| foulpole18 |
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Posts: 23 | Sorry Jerry, I'm a Twins fan. As much as I like the Twins, I'm a bigger fan of Buck Perry. | ||
| jerryb |
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Posts: 688 Location: Northern IL | Np, have a great (fishing) season! | ||
| Northwind Mark |
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Posts: 566 Location: Elgin, IL | Just a quick Thanks to MuskieFever for starting this thread, and a HUGE thanks for all of those who contributed. Some really good info here. | ||
| Landry |
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Posts: 1023 | Just wanna thank you guys for this thread. Up in halliburton Ontario for 2 weeks and went back first evening and raised 3 nice ones but lazy follows. Today I could not raise a fish in what I felt were good conditions cloudy, storm approaching... Went to same shoreline and positioned boat in 30' of water, near main basin which is 100' deep. I started bombing casts towards the basin, probably landing in 50' depth. Not 5 min in I missed a nice one. Not long after I scooped a fat 46"er with my cisco mag super d in his mouth. I think maybe the eaters are mostly suspended in this lake as there is a lot of herring here. I owe that fish and learning experience to this forum. Thanks guys! Landry | ||
| Consigliere |
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Posts: 114 Location: Kingston, Ontario | This has been a great thread. Lots to think about. I'm a total newb, started fishing musky last year. I usually fish Lake Ontario, so pretty clear, big water. I've caught one fish so far, trolling a super shad rap. 32". Caught it trolling the weed edge at about 14ft at an inside turn into a weedy flat. I've been targeting similar weed edge patterns trolling without any luck at all, not even a pike. This thread has me wondering if there are a number of active fish out in the deep channels/basin of the area I've been fishing. Here's the topo of the area I fish: Applying some of the knowledge from this thread, I'm wondering if a trolling pattern at the edge dropping to 70-90ft is the spot to cover, or through the deep parts of the channel? Haven't tried this but might try this next few times out. Any thoughts on how I should break down this area? | ||
| jerryb |
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Posts: 688 Location: Northern IL | Consigliere, 1st let's not get carried away but your instincts to check other depths are correct but to jump out to those depths is not something you do over night. My recommendation for you is to back up and to learn to walk before you sprint. I know you won't understand but this is what you need to do! 1st you need to order Buck Perry's book: Spoonplugging, Your guide to lunker catches". I make nothing from it. All of the best fishermen in the country have read it, studied it and some refer to it as the Bible of structure fishing. Ask the Lindner family if you don't believe me, this book has made carriers for many fishermen and "some" in privacy will actually admit it. Get it, "study" it and if you have questions, Ill be happy to help in any way. Hurry up cause Lake Ontario is high on my list of next lakes, ha ha" | ||
| Consigliere |
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Posts: 114 Location: Kingston, Ontario | Already on the way...with the home study guide 9 part or something. | ||
| oldschool |
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Posts: 9 | Definitely some good information already posted, but here is my take on fishing deep water. Lakes of 25 feet or less do not stratify, and yes there are a lot of muskies on the bottom of the lake in the deepest water. If you know of any springs, they are a good place to start. Many shallower lakes have grass over the entire bottom, A deep diving crank bait like Hellbenders or Bill Normans, an extra weighted bucktail with in-line blade also works; letting a Bulldawg sink to the bottom or Bondy Baits also work good. Deeper lakes stratify, and this year with the hot stable weather the thermocline is very defined. In most lakes in northern Wisconsin the thermocline is at about 25 feet. Tony Rizzo wrote a book about 30 years ago titled, The Summer Muskie in which he devotes half the book to fishing suspended fish. If you can find a copy it has a lot of good information, it was my reference book when I started fishing deep water. Tony states in that book that his #1 lure for fishing deep water is the bucktail, and that has been my experience too. Rizzo states in another of his earlier books that he thinks that we are very often fishing under the fish when using deep divers for suspended fish. While you might start out just fishing the middle of the lake, over time you will find that some areas are better than others. Drop a way point when ever you see a fish. if there are several large pieces of structure that are above the thermocline, half way in between might be a good starting point. Just like Rizzo says in his books, hot calm days are some of the best for suspended fish, and the best time is between 10:00AM and 2:00PM/ Might be different on lakes with a lot of boat traffic, but definitely true in Northern Wisconsin. | ||
| MuskieFever |
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Posts: 572 Location: Maplewood, MN | I have always felt that about 90% of the lures in the muskie world are geared toward the top 5ft of the water column. For some reason, I have difficulty with confidence only fishing higher in the column even when I am over deeper water. | ||
| WI Duck Guide |
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Location: Minocqua, WI | Some good info. One thing I didnt see mentioned that I find myself trying more and more is fishing the "holes". think of them as reverse humps if that helps. With a hump you target the edges/shelves and the top of it. With a hole try working the outer edges (subjective based on the lake your fishing) and then reverse your approach and fish the center or deepest spot of the hole the same way you would fish a hump. Hope that makes sense... try it out. Especially when the weed edges and breaks seem devoid of life... It might pay off handsomely. Also, as for running baits high in deep water, muskies, as with most predators will feed up. Common knowledge, yes, but it is helpful when you are getting started. I have had several fish this year alone strike at or near the boat coming from straight below me in deep water and DEEP water. Just seeing the way they attack coming straight toward the surface is key... I had one do this in 60 - 80fow... not following the bait. Just came shooting up from the abyss. Awesome. Good luck out there! Edited by WI Duck Guide 7/17/2012 10:04 AM | ||
| WI Duck Guide |
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Location: Minocqua, WI | Otherwise, you could take up row trolling... it will help you find the "areas" in open water that consistently hold fish. Then you can head out casting with confidence casting. That is, if you can break the addictive grip of "row troller fever"... | ||
| CiscoKid |
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Posts: 1906 Location: Oconto Falls, WI | Consigliere, I say if you want to determine what deep water will hold the fish in your lake then you just need to cover the deep owater on that lake. Looking at a map and picking out spots for suspendos/deep water fish is not the best way in my opinion. I catch way too many fish in nondescript areas. By looking at a map and only fishing areas that look good on the map you are setting yourself up to mis out on some action. Every lake is different. Keep an open mind, and don't go into starting out in deep water with preconceived notions of where and what you need to do. You will learn that in time on your water, and from there can start cherry picking the best areas from past experience. Take a look at your map, and check the areas out with your boat if you must. See what the graph tells you, and what the area wildlife tell you. Even if the graph is blank don't think there is nothing there. High riding fish/baitifsh will not mark as they move away from the boat. | ||
| WI Duck Guide |
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Location: Minocqua, WI | 31 fish in a week is definitely possible. I have put 13 in the net 34" to 47" and lost a bunch more in the last 5 days and havent been on the water more than 4-5 hours any given day. But the schooling musky theory... it exists. this week alone i have had 2 seperate occassions on dissimilar lakes where I boated 2 muskies on back to back casts out deep. Coincidently they were a 38" and 40" one day and yesterday it was a 38.75 and a 40 and missed another one 2 casts later at the boat. Where there is one, there are usually more, especially out deep. Edited by WI Duck Guide 7/18/2012 2:09 PM | ||
| Muskie Bob |
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Posts: 572 | Does the wind play any role in how deep the muskies are? Are the muskies suspended shallower or deeper with 2 foot waves? Or is it just best to fish with little or no wind? Also, I've heard it is best to figure 8 longer when fishing suspended muskies. Any tips for figure 8's for suspended muskies? | ||
| CiscoKid |
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Posts: 1906 Location: Oconto Falls, WI | Muskie Bob - 7/19/2012 6:44 AM Does the wind play any role in how deep the muskies are? Are the muskies suspended shallower or deeper with 2 foot waves? Or is it just best to fish with little or no wind? Also, I've heard it is best to figure 8 longer when fishing suspended muskies. Any tips for figure 8's for suspended muskies? Wind doesn’t matter to me for location of suspended fish in the water column. I will say the windier it gets the less I fish suspended simply due to my boat. Even after filling both livewells and running two drift socks it can drift too fast. Figure 8’s…Way overrated while fishing suspended. If you work your baits right, and do your triggering moves at the boat (i.e. several rips, death pause) you will convert those that would have any kind of interest in eating. I still do them, but wonder why as I have yet to catch a suspended fish on a figure 8. Others I know also see the same results. Edited by CiscoKid 7/19/2012 9:10 AM | ||
| curleytail |
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Posts: 2687 Location: Hayward, WI | I haven't noticed having to fish differently with wind. The only thing I'm really aware of is that you can still do well on flat calm, sunny days out deep - days that might have you struggling when fishing shallower structure. I agree with Travis above. Every once in a while I'll have a fish come up and grab a bait boatside. Usually it happens before the 8 even starts though. The suspended fish tend to commit before the bait gets to the boat or not show themselves at all. I always 8 at the end of each cast too but never actually caught one in the 8 when fishing deeper. Tucker Edited by curleytail 7/19/2012 9:51 AM | ||
| jerryb |
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Posts: 688 Location: Northern IL | Duck Guide, Great looking web site. I like the no fish no pay, that's the way all Muskie guides should operate! Also congrats on having a good few days! Its a good feeling when the fisherman launches the boat with a real expectation of a multiple fish day. That becomes a reality season after season. When the fisherman starts to see and understand how fish move about, the features that they use in there movements and migrations. The fisherman begins spending the majority his time "where" he has the "best" chance to catch a fish,,,, and the wind, what wind? Was it windy today, it wasn't windy in 22', Ha ha. Bob I'm just messing, at least you have the courage to ask the question. Wind does help defuse the light and if the fish get active they will move some what shallower than they might have without it, it's the same with water color, same results. Dark water, shallow weedline, shallower fish movements. Clear water deep weedline not as shallow fish movements. The idea that a fish can be caught anywhere, at anytime on anything may be true but not recommended for multi fish days. Catching fish "consistently" means your doing the right things in the right area more often of the time. If the fishermen isn't catching fish consistently they're not. Time to face facts. It's not the wind or the moon, or the weeds, I don't know, pick one there's a thousand distractions keeping the fisherman from doing what he needs to do. There are things that matter and things that don't in the total picture. While some catch on quickly most do not, self included. Many see the catches, hear the stories and bye a lure..... It doesn't work that way. I could tell you so many success stories its crazy. Most of the best you'll never hear from but Brett, ha ha, Ill toot his horn for just a little. This guy was a Muskie caster, you'll see him in Mania's old Tuffy today. This guy read the book, he studied the book, he asks the right questions and he listens and then he backs it up with work! I talked about him in the "Trolling Help" thread, this guys on fire! He's smart but there's a lot of "smart" fishermen ask our Pres, ha ha.... Maybe it was the road to the boat ramp that makes him so successful. Enough of that, so Brett looks around at these ole spoonpluggers and after doing a little comparing..... Let's just say end of story! His fishing will never be the same again! I'll be honest it's difficult for some to see the terrain of a body of water in there minds at first and understand how and why the "schools" of fish will swim in certain areas and stay away from others. It takes time like anything else. How long will it take to see the next article in the Muskie mags "Schools of muskies......" lol. Is that better? Thanks buddy love you too. Edited by jerryb 7/19/2012 12:45 PM | ||
| Muskie Bob |
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Posts: 572 | Jerry, I'm a little confused about your statement regarding wind. I understand some of the movement to shallower water based on the wind. However, I was wondering about the suspended muskies in open water and their depth related to the wind, if any effect. Are you saying muskies related to rocks and other structures will likely move to the weedlines during windy days? Or, does this include suspended muskies too and thus one should not fish open water for suspended muskies on windy days? Sorry to be confused about open water suspended muskies. | ||
| jerryb |
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Posts: 688 Location: Northern IL | Mr. Bob, 1st let's talk about spending our time where we have the best chance to catch a fish. How often in a given season do muskies suspend? IMO and others, about 10%, maybe. Granted you may not fish from ice out till ice up. So let's give it another 5%. Where do you want to spend your time? Which fish do you want to spend your time chasing? There's a time to fish suspended and that's been talked about. We've caught our share of suspended fish, as many as 22 in a day. On that particular day most every one at 12'-14' down using a thermocline breakline, some at 20', some at 25', and some way way out off the structure at 30' and if you can believe a couple even came at 40', but the one fish that really opened our eyes was when we decided to cross the lake and happened to leave the lures down, that one hit in 60'+. The thing was not one single Muskie was caught in the "so called abyss" as some refer. The fish caught at 20'-30'+ were all caught off a horizontal suspension, the one caught in 60'+ was caught at the same 12'-14' down directly over the main river channel, a vertical suspension. Again, the fisherman may not know where he is but the fish always know where they are! There are no accidents. My statement about wind was if I can be so blunt, "don't put so much thought into it"! Learn instead to identify productive bottom features and all those little meaningless distractions will all go by the wayside, trust me! When we say "if"the fish get active they'll move "some what shallower" than they might have without it", but this is small potatoes because our lure presentation and going through the proper procedures will locate the fish no matter what depth they're at. The wind means very little in the whole picture. Good luck! | ||
| crix |
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Posts: 165 Location: tHe LaKe Of PrIoR, mN | i googled bucks book cause I think I'm gonna read it! I thought it was funny that one of his quotes reads: "Fishing success cannot be bought through the latest or hottest new lure. It can not be bought through the latest equipment, or some kind of gadget. Buck says that knowledge is the key to fishing success. " how true you may have all the tools in your box but what are they worth if you can't or don't know how to use them correctly | ||
| CiscoKid |
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Posts: 1906 Location: Oconto Falls, WI | jerryb - 7/22/2012 7:37 AM Mr. Bob, 1st let's talk about spending our time where we have the best chance to catch a fish. How often in a given season do muskies suspend? IMO and others, about 10%, maybe. Granted you may not fish from ice out till ice up. So let's give it another 5%. Where do you want to spend your time? Which fish do you want to spend your time chasing? There's a time to fish suspended and that's been talked about. We've caught our share of suspended fish, as many as 22 in a day. On that particular day most every one at 12'-14' down using a thermocline breakline, some at 20', some at 25', and some way way out off the structure at 30' and if you can believe a couple even came at 40', but the one fish that really opened our eyes was when we decided to cross the lake and happened to leave the lures down, that one hit in 60'+. The thing was not one single Muskie was caught in the "so called abyss" as some refer. The fish caught at 20'-30'+ were all caught off a horizontal suspension, the one caught in 60'+ was caught at the same 12'-14' down directly over the main river channel, a vertical suspension. Again, the fisherman may not know where he is but the fish always know where they are! There are no accidents. Good luck! Don't get confused in what Jerry is saying about suspended fish as I think obviously he has a different idea on what exactly constitutes a suspended fish. From what he has stated I take it he doesn't consider a fish that is located 10' down over a hump that tops out at 40' (coming up out of 60' of water) a suspended fish. To me that is a suspended fish. One that relates to structure at that. To say fish only suspend 5-10% of the time just means to me he either has a different defintion of what a suspended fish is, doesn't spend a whole lot of time for suspended fish, or fishes lakes that don't have a good suspended fishery. Or perhaps myself and others are just pretty dang lucky to be able to consistently catch fish that only suspend 5-10% of the time! Fact of the matter is most people don't know how to fish in water that is deeper than 20'. Doesn't matter if you consider it suspended fishing or structure fishing. What matters is gaining the confidence to be "out there" beyond the typical depth most people fish, and gaining knowledge in how to target those fish in the water bodies you fish. For me or anyone else to sit here, look at a map, and tell you right where you are going to catch fish in deep water without having any knowledge of the lake is just throwing darts blindly. My comments about just going out there and drifting to cover water is to get the angler to learn on their own what will work best on their lake. Edited by CiscoKid 7/23/2012 7:40 AM | ||
| curleytail |
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Posts: 2687 Location: Hayward, WI | CiscoKid - 7/23/2012 7:08 AM jerryb - 7/22/2012 7:37 AM Mr. Bob, 1st let's talk about spending our time where we have the best chance to catch a fish. How often in a given season do muskies suspend? IMO and others, about 10%, maybe. Granted you may not fish from ice out till ice up. So let's give it another 5%. Where do you want to spend your time? Which fish do you want to spend your time chasing? There's a time to fish suspended and that's been talked about. We've caught our share of suspended fish, as many as 22 in a day. On that particular day most every one at 12'-14' down using a thermocline breakline, some at 20', some at 25', and some way way out off the structure at 30' and if you can believe a couple even came at 40', but the one fish that really opened our eyes was when we decided to cross the lake and happened to leave the lures down, that one hit in 60'+. The thing was not one single Muskie was caught in the "so called abyss" as some refer. The fish caught at 20'-30'+ were all caught off a horizontal suspension, the one caught in 60'+ was caught at the same 12'-14' down directly over the main river channel, a vertical suspension. Again, the fisherman may not know where he is but the fish always know where they are! There are no accidents. Good luck! Don't get confused in what Jerry is saying about suspended fish as I think obviously he has a different idea on what exactly constitutes a suspended fish. From what he has stated I take it he doesn't consider a fish that is located 10' down over a hump that tops out at 40' (coming up out of 60' of water) a suspended fish. To me that is a suspended fish. One that relates to structure at that. To say fish only suspend 5-10% of the time just means to me he either has a different defintion of what a suspended fish is, doesn't spend a whole lot of time for suspended fish, or fishes lakes that don't have a good suspended fishery. Or perhaps myself and others are just pretty dang lucky to be able to consistently catch fish that only suspend 5-10% of the time! Fact of the matter is most people don't know how to fish in water that is deeper than 20'. Doesn't matter if you consider it suspended fishing or structure fishing. What matters is gaining the confidence to be "out there" beyond the typical depth most people fish, and gaining knowledge in how to target those fish in the water bodies you fish. For me or anyone else to sit here, look at a map, and tell you right where you are going to catch fish in deep water without having any knowledge of the lake is just throwing darts blindly. My comments about just going out there and drifting to cover water is to get the angler to learn on their own what will work best on their lake. I was a little confused because I would call about every one of those fish suspended too. A fish relating to the thermocline is not suspended? How far must a fish move horizontally from structure to be suspended? 20 yards, 70 yards, 2 miles? I guess we'll agree to disagree on the terms. Travis, not trying to disagree but maybe creating a little more discussion. You say that looking at a map and telling somebody where to fish is throwing darts blindly. I understand you mean that you just need to get out there and DO IT, and there are no guarantees, but I wouldn't say making judgements from a map is throwing darts blindly. A lot of my best deep water/suspended fishing spots are near pretty obvious places on a lake map. Out from big structural areas with sharper breaklines, and especially points and turns seem to draw fish, even if they aren't holding right tight to them. I took a trip to Vilas last year where I caught a fish on a deep lake with very, very little structure. Caught it 12 feet down over a slight rise into 70 feet of water between 2 80 foot holes. Coincidence maybe, but maybe not. Either way, I looked at a map and targeted that spot - it resulted in a nice fish. Again I realize you are getting at every lake is different, and suspended fish can be anywhere. At the same time, there can be defined patterns, and studying a map can shorten the learning curve, especially if fishing a new lake where you might have only a day to spend there. Not enough time to learn the lake, but looking at a map should up your odds. Don't you think? Tucker Edited by curleytail 7/23/2012 10:32 PM | ||
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