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Posts: 79
| I cast 99% of the time and only chose to troll when I am desperate or its to cold to cast. That being said, in the fall it would be nice to hang sucker over the side of the boat while casting. I like that idea because there are times when casting or trolling doesn't seem to get them to bite, but they are more than willing to chase a bait to the boat, and if I can get them moving and then they see an easy meal right in front of them, everyone could possibly boat more fish. I have thought about it a little bit and was looking for more input from others that might have more knowledge about this topic. Personally I would only use the second rod in the fall because it presents a good option of catching more fish, but I don't see it working as well in the summer times. I could be way off, and I have been in the past, on the water and off. Wisconsin anglers can already do this and I would also like to hear from them to see if they have had success doing it and if they have an argument against it. |
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Posts: 4266
| I love being able to use more than one rod, especially when trolling. I normally cast, but have heard from many guys who have had fish follow their lure only to change completely and take the sucker. Heck, maybe I should catch some bluegills or perch or walleyes and rig them on quick-strike rigs throughout the season and suspend them from bobbers near the boat as I cast. I'd make sure and use a little trick that my Dad taught me when we would catch tiny perch and use them for wallete bait on North Twin. To make sure they stand out from any other near-by perch, you cut off the top half of their tail so they can only swim up, and even that's a struggle, and also cut off their front fins so they can't be elusive.
Oh yeah, one rod.....rather be able to troll with two. But you can only cast with one anyway. |
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Posts: 8782
| It works. We've caught a few fish here and there that we raised on lures, that turned off the lure and ate suckers we hade out, and a few more that ate a sucker trailing half a cast from the boat. But it's not as effective as you might think - you waste a lot of time farting around with suckers and sucker rods that would otherwise be spent casting, and you miss the occasional fish on suckers because you were finishing a cast.
I could see some benefit to a 2 line rule for this purpose, but it would also mean that 4 guys in a pontoon could troll 8 lines. Not sure it would be worth the trade off.
Edited by esoxaddict 10/28/2012 10:16 PM
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Posts: 410
Location: Wakefield, MI | In the fall I always have a rod hanging a sucker while casting. In the last 3 weeks we've caught 5 on suckers, 3 of them in the mid 40's and the other 2 were high 30's. Never had a follower take the sucker yet but I keep waiting for that one. |
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Posts: 1289
Location: WI | Multiple lines for trolling is awesome. Great way to find a pattern, or keep one hot bait out and experiment with others at the same time. Also allows you to cover shallow and deep sides of a break at the same time. I've been using 3 lines in WI lately and it's really chaotic and messy when you get a fish. 2 is fine.
Can't you use 2 lines while ice fishing in MN? Makes no sense to me why you couldn't for the whole season then.
Edited by JKahler 10/28/2012 11:45 PM
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Posts: 210
| Jeez, the Minnesota fishery ain't broke. Don't try to fix it! |
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Posts: 8782
| Ebenezer - 10/28/2012 11:53 PM
Jeez, the Minnesota fishery ain't broke. Don't try to fix it!
It ain't broke. Yet. But you are reaping the benefits of relatively new fisheries in a lot of places. You've got the first few year classes of fish, after 10 - 15 years, which came up up in a system of abundant forage, with no danger of predation, and no competition for that forage, in a system where what is now the apex predator was largely absent. And you have this happening in lake ecosystems that were realtively unheard of 10 - 15 years ago, and now are fished HARD.
It ainlt broke, and it's not likely to be broke in the near future. But 10 - 20 years down the road, it's not going to bewat it is now unless you do everything you possibly can to preserve that. |
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| fact is the two line proposal was part of the game and fish bill a couple years ago in MN that got shot down, rightfully so, after a certain lawmaker tried to slip in special regs for the lake his cabin is on. i agree two lines would be nice in the fall and would also be a benefit to a quickly expanding segment of catfish anglers, among others.
i don't remember all the details of the two line provision but i think it involved an extra endorsement on the license. personally it took me a bit to warm up to the idea of two lines but i'd support it next time around and i hope the initiative comes around again soon. |
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Posts: 79
| I completely agree that Minnesota's fisherie is not broken, and I have no intentions of changing that. Being a muskie angler and releasing every muskie I catch, I just havent seen a down side to allowing this, other than having people keep more fish than the law allows, which is happening anyway. Would it come down to having more DNR presence on these precious waters we all call home, probably. Then again there are alot of people who cannot boat a fish of any species with one rod, does a second rod really increase their chances? I find it interesting that some people feel Wisonsin's waters are inferior to Minnesota's, when the it is a way different situation regarding lake size and forage. |
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Posts: 833
| I would definitely prefer to fish 2 lines in fall as well as whenever I decide to troll. However, I follow the law regardless of my preference. I want to cast for Musky in May also, so I go to WI. That is just the way it is. We do have a good thing going in MN. Also, I think part of maintaining our fishery is setting a good example and a big part of that is following the law, whether we like it or not.
That being said, the argument against 2 lines that I have issues with is the 1 about how they effect the fishery. I know there have been studies done that try to argue that 2 lines means double the harvest. Is that really true? Do you catch 2x as many fish trolling 2 cranks vs. 1 for musky? Is the deadstick sucker + casted lure double the effectiveness of just casting or just hanging bait? Some folks deadstick pounders, does that double the harvest? I just do not see how it can be so. The combination presentation is more effective at creating opportuniites to catch fish, so yes you will have more chances to put more in the boat. However, it is the fish handling IMO that determines Musky survival. How would this be different if you had 2 guys in the boat manning a sucker and a casting presentation respectively? Does anyone think having 4 lines out is going to catch 4x as many fish? That is the part of the arugment that just doesn't seem to hold water for me.
I know this topic can become a flame fest, so my statements above are not meant to refute or dissagree with anyone. I just do not get the position on 1 rod vs 2 rods being some major negative force for a fishery from a logical standpoint. Maybe I'm missing some critical piece of information that would change my mind. Right now, I just do not see it. |
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Posts: 280
Location: McFarland | Caught several this fall that were raised on baits and then blasted suckers. This 45.25" is from last Wednesday that followed a cowgirl and then went straight to the sucker. It's fun stuff watching a nice fish line up a sucker and then blast it, and if it's a small fish you can always go and take the sucker out of harms way. 
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Posts: 3480
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | Some interesting reading...
See Muskie Treat's posts....
http://muskie.outdoorsfirst.com/board/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=64...
Steve |
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Posts: 833
| Thanks for the link, that was very educational. I agree with the sentiments about the long term aspects of the fishery. Without a published study it is hard to really say what is the best course of action, but I understand why people would err on the side of caution given how successful the DNR has been here in MN.
I can see why the topic is so incediary. You have the creel study Treats is citing, but without it being published there is no truly "conclusive" result. Thus you have an argument that pits selfish desires of individual anglers (which I advocated above) vs. caution about what might happen to the fishery. It ends up being opinion vs. opinion which really isn't productive.
IMO, the best approach would be to get better information. I like the 2 line thing, but I would not trade that in exchange for a declining fishery. To me that makes an approach of caution the best course of action.
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Posts: 4266
| What a beautiful fish!BTW
I read the old post, and I like the number of rods option. 2 for 1 angler, 3 for 2 etc.
I don't know why, where or when trolling got such a bad rep. There are those who still think that all you do is drive around and you catch a bunch of fish. From my experience, it's just not so. It's just another technique that must be mastered and perfected. Since 99% of us release all of our fish, I don't see any down side to running more than one rod other than it increases your chances to catch fish.
Since I've been plagued with back problems, I've been trolling more. This year I got a Disabled Fishing License which allows me to troll any lake in Wisconsin.......but I can only use an electric motor! Does anyone make an electric motor that will get me up to 3 mph for 8-10 hours? How about a battery that will last that long. I know, off subject. I don't see any down side to fishing with two lines, or multiple lines as stated in the old post. MN allows trolling, but limits you to 1 rod. WI doesn't allow trolling, but lets you fish multiple rods. Because this is first and foremost a muskie site, the opinions go in that direction. What about one guy in the boat with 2 slip-bobbers out for walleyes, or bluegills or crappies? Doesn't seem out of line, does it? Or how about having one slip-bobber out while casting a jig? During most of the fishing season, we are casting and wouldn't have any other rods out, but when you are searching for or targeting suspended fish, trolling is the best option and having 2 lures in the water ups your odds to find fish, but that doesn't mean that the kill rate will go up. We can use under-water cameras and any kind of electronic devices we want that definitely ups your success rate, so why the fear of using more than one rod? I haven't heard one valid reason why we shouldn't be able to do it. When I fish for walleyes on The Mississippi River in early spring, I will troll with Taylor using 2 three-way rig rods in rod holders, and we will also run 2 lures each at the same time on 2 hand-line reels. That's 6 lures in the water at the same time. By the end of the day, we'll have those 6 lures narrowed down to 2 colors or shapes of lures, and we still get skunked! On days when we do catch fish, any walleye 20" or over, or resembling a female goes right back. Selective harvest. In muskie fishing, there is no harvest at all in my boat, but allowing me to use 2 lines if alone or 3 lines with a partner increases my chances of catching a fish, and as I see it, has no detrimental impact on the fishery. But it definitely increases my chances for increased excitement and fun.
Edited by Beaver 10/29/2012 12:37 PM
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Posts: 20219
Location: oswego, il | I remember this being debated heavy on the boards a dozen or so years ago. Most mn uys seemed to be fine with it and their arguement is tgat you can do whatever you want with that one line. it was a good back and forth between the different regs between the different states, especially where the laws are different depending on where you are and what you want to do. Oneline do what you want with it does not sound so badsometimes.. |
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Posts: 553
Location: deephaven mn | JKahler - 10/28/2012 11:44 PM
Can't you use 2 lines while ice fishing in MN? Makes no sense to me why you couldn't for the whole season then.
[/QUOTE
the reason is fishing through the ice you are nearly as moblie as you are in a boat,
wisconsin allows 3 lines per ice fisherman. |
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Posts: 3147
| Minnesota manages the musky has a 'trophy fisherie' not a numbers one,,,,treat it like a trophy,, hanging a sucker over the side while your 12 ft away up front casting a suick/crankbait/bulldawg and then responding when you hear the clicker go off is the muskie world equiz of 'bingo' reelem in,,,or target them with one sucker and use skill while you monitor the line |
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| Two rods is a horrible idea. We all know you just throw a sucker overboard in any location and just reel in fish until your hands bleed. Think of all the delayed mortality from muskies inhaling suckers whole quick strike rigs and all.
Sarcasm!!!!!!!!
Makes me laugh when I read about guys thinking muskies just swallow suckers whole. I have caught hundreds of muskes on suckers and have yet to see it happen, still waiting. |
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Posts: 313
Location: Bemidji, Lake Vermilion | I would selfishly enjoy trolling 2 lines. But in MN, you aren't going to get 2 line options for certain species vs other species. Many fish populations in MN are already over exploited and large panfish and walleyes in many of MN waters simply can't make it with any additional harvest. Where the real numbers may lie is uncertain, but more fish of all types would be hooked, more fish of all types would ultimately be harvested or die via that catching even with the best of intentions. I'll continue to live with 1 line. |
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Posts: 906
Location: Warroad, Mn | As Brian stated. That's the problem with allowing more than one rod. May work fine for muskie fisherman, but other species will suffer. I also have a few doubts about fishing with two lines for muskies, much as I'd like to do it. Both Minnesota and Ontario are very protective of their fish and it seems to be working. I'd let the biologists rather than politicians figure this out. Doug Johnson |
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| Here in Indiana we are allowed 3 rods per guy, we troll a lot with 5 lures out and it is still a big day if we catch ONE fish, we seldom have two fish days, and we let em' go anyway, so I think if Mn went to two rods (all year long) you guys will be fine. |
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Posts: 1529
| some areas have 2 rods in ontario. its legal on st clair,l.ontario.l.erie. populations are excellent. like doug johnson said. let biologist iron the issue. there trained and payed for that job. |
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Posts: 1220
| I made only one trip to Minnesota this year and a short one at that. I had an honest (and witnessed) legit 54" Supertanker take a turn and a half after my bait at boatside (the kind of fish that can require a call to your cardiologist). I fish Wisconsin waters twice a week and saw a very similar fish THREE YEARS AGO! I hate the Vikings (naturally) but simply must give credit where credit is due to a fishery that a lot of folks have clearly given a #*^@ about...AND IT SHOWS! |
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Posts: 285
Location: NE Wisconsin | MN and NW Ontario allow muskie angling with 1 line. WI allows 3.
Multiple line sucker fishing for muskies has been a "tradition" in WI
Many WI anglers go to MN and NW Ontario to catch their trophy muskies.
Very few MN or NW Ontario anglers come to WI inland lakes for their trophy muskies.
Coincidence??? I think not.
MN biologists should be concerned about the fish not the fishermen.
Stay with one line. You have a great fishery now. Don't mess with it!
John Aschenbrenner
Wisconsin |
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Posts: 5874
| This is such a foolish conclusion. 3 lines result in WI not having the trophy fish that MN and NW Ontario have. Hogwash.
Minnesota's muskie waters grew up with Catch and Release. They are relatively new, compared to WI. WI muskie tradition goes back a long way, and C&R was not preached or practiced until relatively recently. That, plus a DNR that doesn't care about trophy fisheries, is the reason, not 3 lines per angler. Years of taking average muskies for brood stock has lead to average sized muskies throughout WI. Lot's of other reasons, with 3 lines being quite far down the list.
I have no problem fishing one line in MN or NW Ontario. That certainly never stopped me from going there. If they were to add a second line for trolling or sucker fishing, it wouldn't cause me to go there more often.
I'd put a Green Bay tropghy Muskie against any MN or NW Ontario fish.
Edited by Shep 10/30/2012 3:45 PM
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| What does one line vs two or three lines have to do with a trophy fishery? I don't believe anybody if given the opportunity to utilize more than one line would say Nah I'll only use one. Whether it be trolling or dragging suckers, more baits in the water produce more fish. For those that drag suckers and you don't get any action casting all day but have an opportunity at a fish on a sucker can make your day. |
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Posts: 3147
| if we were allowed to use 2 lines here in Minn I would have two out,,,casting for muskies and one with a slip bobber and leech for walleye and I would keep the walleye,,,wouldnt increase pressure on muskies but it would increase harvest on wallleyes ,,,how many walleye guys would do the reverse on Mile Lacs,Vermilion,leech etc,,,have a walleye rod and a sucker on the other one,,,or two rods helps you get your walleye limit faster,now lets go fish muskies for the rest of the day
Edited by happy hooker 10/30/2012 7:10 PM
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Posts: 1144
Location: Minnesota. | Really a healthy, nice looking fish Andy!! Way to go. |
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Posts: 4080
Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion | Some pretty good opinions Here,....... But as one of the selfish ones I am for 2 lines in Mn.
I fish about 90% of the time by myself and would only use 2 lines for trolling for the last 2 weeks of the muskie season,......But happy hooker has a good idea..... maybe catch supper while casting for muskies ...
2 lines will NOT decimate the states fisheries.... All species included
Sheeeeeshh ! Gadzooks Batman !!!.......Whata we gonna do??
G-Bag |
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Posts: 163
| You CAN have 2 lines in your boat in MN... All you need to do is bring someone (with a license of course) or a kid out to enjoy the sport with you. Then if you actually catch one, you'll also have someone there to take your picture |
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