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Posts: 164
Location: Bloomington,MN | Up here in Minnesota we have the chance to get a walleye stamp when we buy our license and that goes to the dnr stocking our lakes and what not. Why arent we doing this for muskies?? It would only help and i feel like more people would do this, compared to spending the 35 dollars to join muskies inc. Im sure this idea has been brought up before and i just missed it but when I was thinking about it, it just seemed like common sense. Any thoughts? |
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Posts: 1638
Location: Minnesota | i would buy the stamp but would the extra money go to the muskies or into a slush fund |
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Posts: 1168
| rumbler - 4/28/2012 9:34 PM
Im sure this idea has been brought up before and i just missed it but when I was thinking about it
Nope, it's never been brought up anywhere before. Completely original idea. |
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Posts: 2318
Location: Chisholm, MN | ulbian - 4/28/2012 10:02 PM
rumbler - 4/28/2012 9:34 PM
Im sure this idea has been brought up before and i just missed it but when I was thinking about it
Nope, it's never been brought up anywhere before. Completely original idea.
Cute....
I would buy one |
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Posts: 20211
Location: oswego, il | I know the trout sta.p in illinois goes 100% into that program. I am ok with a musky stamp but mushrooms, forget it! |
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Posts: 2384
Location: On the X that marks the mucky spot | Do a search on it as this has been hashed out many times before. In short it's a bad idea IMOP as most people wouldn't buy one and the DNR has no plans to use the money for what we'd want (more lakes). Is if that's the case it wouldn't be a good idea.
If you want to give back you can join the MMPA ($25) where everything goes back to MN muskies or just donate it to the local MI club for use in stocking, research, etc.
Shawn |
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Posts: 582
| Just donate money or join your local musky chapter. At least that way you know the money is going where it belongs. |
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Posts: 3147
| im pike fishing I dont need a musky stamp,,,prove me wrong
now you dont have a handle on how many actual muskie fisherman there are and the politicians,darkhouse can point to the actual number of stamps sold and say its a small interest group.
Edited by happy hooker 4/30/2012 9:59 AM
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | Cost of implementation vs revenue from stamp, which one is higher. I'll go with the one on the left.
You want more money for fisheries, raise the license fee.
Most on here don't know where their license dollars go anyway so that is usually met with much resistance. |
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Posts: 1224
Location: Okoboji | rumbler - 4/28/2012 8:34 PM
Up here in Minnesota we have the chance to get a walleye stamp when we buy our license and that goes to the dnr stocking our lakes and what not. Why arent we doing this for muskies?? It would only help and i feel like more people would do this, compared to spending the 35 dollars to join muskies inc. Im sure this idea has been brought up before and i just missed it but when I was thinking about it, it just seemed like common sense. Any thoughts?
i wouldnt spend a nickle to stock any lake that gets netted. that is the program we should roll with |
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Posts: 2384
Location: On the X that marks the mucky spot | So Mille Lac should cease to be stocked? Sorry brother but I think that's a bad idea. MANY more fish were killed by Cowgirls night fishing then the indians have killed. If anything we need to stock MORE into that lake to compensate for the delayed mortality and netting, especially when you look at how little is done per surface acre there. |
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| happy hooker - 4/30/2012 9:56 AM
im pike fishing I dont need a musky stamp,,,prove me wrong now you dont have a handle on how many actual muskie fisherman there are and the politicians,darkhouse can point to the actual number of stamps sold and say its a small interest group.
I think it's illogical to think that musky fishermen will not buy the stamp even though they know full well they would be scrutinized by game wardens because they have large nets lures and even figure 8 after a cast. I personally do not know any musky fishermen who would even hesitate buying a musky stamp and the vast majority would comply it's just plain silly to think otherwise. As a matter of fact I would venture to guess that a lot of recreational fishermen would also buy one “just in case”.
Before somebody jumps on that saying that Joe weekender would kill one because they bought a stamp the bottom line is either way they would be just as predisposed to keeping one with or without a stamp. I don't even think there would be much need for enforcement either pretty much would police itself and if somebody wants to musky fish and say they're pike fishing like so be it. It’s a complete non-issue to try to argue that more muskys will be kept with a stamp.
My opinion is that if revenue generated from the stamp goes toward the musky exclusively and just as importantly does not take the place of money already allocated a stamp would be a no-brainer for us as a group. ***********I think every state should have one*****************
Perhaps we should do a poll that if you were a musky fishermen would comply and buy the musky stamp, or be willing to lie to a game or if asked?
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| Pointerpride102 - 4/30/2012 11:38 AM
Cost of implementation vs revenue from stamp, which one is higher. I'll go with the one on the left.
You want more money for fisheries, raise the license fee.
Most on here don't know where their license dollars go anyway so that is usually met with much resistance.
I'll go with the one on the right, and why not raise the license fee and have a stamp? |
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Posts: 994
Location: Minnesota: where it's tough to be a sportsfan! | How many times have MN sportsmen & women stepped up and put their money forward only to have the funds dipped into by the legislature or spend on brick & morter??
The only thing the stamp would really do for MN is show the Legislature & DNR how many anglers really fished Muskie in this State, a number of true surprise! Therefore it would have to be a mandatory purchase to get true numbers. But they would never use the funds the way they are intended or desired by the anglers. Wish this was not the case!! |
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Posts: 3147
| hey we got this already,,,,the lotto has "musky money" google Minn state lottery for details  |
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Location: Minneapolis, MN | jakejusa - 4/30/2012 12:25 PM
How many times have MN sportsmen & women stepped up and put their money forward only to have the funds dipped into by the legislature or spend on brick & morter??
The only thing the stamp would really do for MN is show the Legislature & DNR how many anglers really fished Muskie in this State, a number of true surprise! Therefore it would have to be a mandatory purchase to get true numbers. But they would never use the funds the way they are intended or desired by the anglers. Wish this was not the case!!
+2 Jake is right on! There are countless examples of MN legislature raiding accounts for other uses. Stamp or increased license fee, just the same, they will raid either account if they feel like it. Hooker is dead on too. We're much better off with the number of muskie anglers unknown.
The only way you can be sure that more of your money will go to the resource is to donate to the MI chapters that are able to make investments in the local fishery. Take your extra money you want to pay for a stamp or license increase and donate it to a dedicated stocking & rearing fund of your local chapter. |
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Posts: 941
Location: Freedom, WI | If the stamp is written up right the politicians cannot get there hands on it along with where the money goes. That is key as we all know we can always trust politicians ;), excuse me while I wake up from my dream. |
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Posts: 3147
| has Minn muskie interest peaked???
Id say it has among residents maybe not has much among non residents but think about the posts youve seen here over the past year,,, "Im goin to Lake St Clair instead of Vermilion this year"
" muskies dont figure 8 like they used to they just flash off"
Minnesotas days of 'easy' fishing are past its more WORK now,,been on Mile Lacs lately??? its a ghost town compared to what it was a couple years ago serious muskie guys are still out elsewhere but what about all those central Minn residents who found out they could go out after work on Big Point or an afternoon and have a great big fish follow are they still with it or did they go back to their walleye rods now that the fishing got tough.
10 years ago was Minn even on most peoples radar are we positive we know what the interest will be the next 10 years with places like Green Bay,Lake St Clair, and the new higher minimum size limits in wisconsin.
Start a muskie stamp and what if sales go down some year, what if you have two years of decreasing sales??? you dont think the darkhouse and Politicians wouldnt be ALL over that!!!
A musky stamp is the potential death of muskie stocking,,hope you like leech and cass has a vacation spot
Edited by happy hooker 4/30/2012 3:47 PM
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Location: minocqua, wi. | stop making sense Hook ... |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | What? - 4/30/2012 11:04 AM
Pointerpride102 - 4/30/2012 11:38 AM
Cost of implementation vs revenue from stamp, which one is higher. I'll go with the one on the left.
You want more money for fisheries, raise the license fee.
Most on here don't know where their license dollars go anyway so that is usually met with much resistance.
I'll go with the one on the right, and why not raise the license fee and have a stamp?
It has been noted here several times that very few would actually buy the stamp. |
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| What costs, EXACTLY, would there be in implementing a stamp?
This is a stampless stamp. Literally, there IS no physical stamp. You create an actual fund type place for the $ to go, and the gal at fleet farm has to check the box that says "Yes, I wanna buy a muskie stamp" when you buy your license, and that's where the extra money goes. She then hits "print" and your green license magically comes out with another line that says you bought a stamp.
Argue all you want about whether or not the idea of a stamp is a good idea. Fair argument.
But seriously, where's this big cost? How many bureaucrats and messengers and peons does it take to implement a stamp. Some computer nerd had to go in and adjust the license template to allow one more line of 6pt font. Gotcha.
Someone please feel free to jump in and stop me at the point where I get confused. |
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| Ummmmm..... - 4/30/2012 9:01 PM
What costs, EXACTLY, would there be in implementing a stamp?
This is a stampless stamp. Literally, there IS no physical stamp. You create an actual fund type place for the $ to go, and the gal at fleet farm has to check the box that says "Yes, I wanna buy a muskie stamp" when you buy your license, and that's where the extra money goes. She then hits "print" and your green license magically comes out with another line that says you bought a stamp.
Argue all you want about whether or not the idea of a stamp is a good idea. Fair argument.
But seriously, where's this big cost? How many bureaucrats and messengers and peons does it take to implement a stamp. Some computer nerd had to go in and adjust the license template to allow one more line of 6pt font. Gotcha.
Someone please feel free to jump in and stop me at the point where I get confused.
Yep free money! |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | Ummmmm..... - 4/30/2012 8:01 PM
What costs, EXACTLY, would there be in implementing a stamp?
This is a stampless stamp. Literally, there IS no physical stamp. You create an actual fund type place for the $ to go, and the gal at fleet farm has to check the box that says "Yes, I wanna buy a muskie stamp" when you buy your license, and that's where the extra money goes. She then hits "print" and your green license magically comes out with another line that says you bought a stamp.
Argue all you want about whether or not the idea of a stamp is a good idea. Fair argument.
But seriously, where's this big cost? How many bureaucrats and messengers and peons does it take to implement a stamp. Some computer nerd had to go in and adjust the license template to allow one more line of 6pt font. Gotcha.
Someone please feel free to jump in and stop me at the point where I get confused.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA........breath......HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Oh man, you're beyond help. It is anything but "free" to add in a new regulation. |
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Posts: 2384
Location: On the X that marks the mucky spot | I believe the "management" of the walleye stamp is currently around $30k annually. So if that's the case and we charge $5/stamp we're looking at 6000 people buying it to break even.
Or we could stock all the lakes in the metro on an every other year basis with that money... |
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Posts: 32883
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | I don't get it. Why would you want to stamp a muskie? They are slimy and wet by nature, and a stamp wouldn't work anyway, no matter what kind of ink one uses. If you are talking about a 'stick on' stamp, that's just plain silly, it would fall off almost right away in the water. |
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Posts: 23
| big mistake with the walleye stamp was advertisement, with the first year revenues ending up being just barely over ad costs.
Atleast thats what i had read in outdoor news a while back. |
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Posts: 941
Location: Freedom, WI | Steve - Thanks for my laugh today. |
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Posts: 1168
| Is the stamp idea one where you have to possess a stamp just to fish for muskies or to keep one? If yes...
1a) How do you enforce it? It's tough as it is to enforce fishing regulations, now there's yet another one?
1b) You encounter a guy who you think is "muskie fishing." You report him but how do you prove it? I've fished in bass tournaments and have done very well throwing muskie sized baits. Is the guy pike fishing? This is different than a trout/salmon stamp. You know a guy isn't in the middle of Lake Michigan dragging boards for Alewives and you know a guy isn't poking around a stream pitching flies for chubs. Huge, huge gray area with warm water fisheries.
2) How do you get around administrative costs? If money is pooled into a central location what percentage of your $5 or $10 actually gets kicked back into the resource as opposed to defraying admin costs? I've heard that almost all of WFT dues go to their central office and only a very small fraction go back to the local chapters. We have this already with Muskies Inc. Why create and pay for another top heavy organization to function when you want to see results quickly?
3) We need to strongly assess how many muskie anglers there are. On sites like this and MH and others you can get the sense that everyone loves muskies and fishes for them. Once you break outside of that box you'll see that by percentage there are not as many of us as their are bass anglers, walleye anglers, etc. You'd be looking for funds from a small group to begin with and inside of that small group you have a considerable amount of folks who wouldn't buy a stamp anyway. We're dealing with a small piece of the pie to begin with and it's going to be cut down even more.
If a muskie stamp would simply be a donation in good faith, then....
4) Why should I spend that extra 5 or 10 bucks in hopes of creating a panacea when I can get more out of my investment by sticking it into a local organization where you can see tangible results?
If you want to raise money to improve the fishery the local route is the way to go. You get connected with other anglers, you see a direct impact with your money, and more importantly you create a lobbying group that can put the pressure on the MDNR or WDNR. You have the war chest, you approach them for help, if they balk because of funding...you've got it. Creating a governmental fund is opening up a pandora's box that we don't need opened. |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | ulbian - 5/1/2012 7:27 AM
If you want to raise money to improve the fishery the local route is the way to go. You get connected with other anglers, you see a direct impact with your money, and more importantly you create a lobbying group that can put the pressure on the MDNR or WDNR. You have the war chest, you approach them for help, if they balk because of funding...you've got it. Creating a governmental fund is opening up a pandora's box that we don't need opened.
Or increase the fishing license fee. |
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The MN liscence fee is going to be increased, but that is just to keep the status quo.
If you want to benefit the MN Muskie program than join or donate to the MMPA or a local MN MI chapter.
That is the way to support the MN muskie program, plain and simple.
JS |
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