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Posts: 203
Location: Alexandria, Minnesota | Just wanted to get your guys input about the season closing on Dec 1st. I know I am little upset because the fishing has been good and seems to be only getting better. I just wish the Dnr would have set the season until first ice or something along those lines. I know that I could still be fishing on a couple of my home lakes until mid Dec. I am not a fish biologist but I have heard that the DNR set the date to help protect the females that have started putting on their eggs. Please someone let me know if that is accurate reason.
Edited by Dave Williamson 11/25/2009 9:19 PM
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| I don't think that is the least bit accurate. This season closing agenda was pushed by muskies inc. to stop harvest throught the ice. The closing date is plain nonsense. |
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| I heard they did it to protect fish from being harvested by ice fisherman and since first and hard ice are different from lake to lake regarding what date they happen, they had to pick a date that was the same everywhere so they could enforce it.
Wish they would have just said "catch and release only season" from December 1st to January 15th. Too bad for the guides, they could still be getting income for quite a few more weeks. . . Might help them pay for some the coast guard license costs they will get slammed with next year. |
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| or you could just fish for pike  |
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Posts: 1184
Location: Iowa Great Lakes | Over down here for us to Dec 1, at least localy, rest of the states open year round. |
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Posts: 203
Location: Alexandria, Minnesota | You guys have any suggestions for southern Wisconsin lakes? |
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| Dec 15th was the date requested as a closing date from the DNR but they went with the 1st instead. There are other MN organizations that are probably more involved with shaping policy and regulation than MI. No, some things about it don't make a lot of sense a |
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| If you look at the almanac you will find that it is rare to have open water in all but the metro after December 1 and most often the metro would be locked up by Dec 1 too. This November has been extremely warm so it looks like a lousy rule this year. Think back to last year and the year before and wait to see what happens next year. The numbers of fish getting thumped in many spearing hot spots was extreme enough to do something about it. |
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Posts: 3157
| I do know this the Dec 1st closing just may save my life,,couple years back I was out open water trolling walker bay on Dec 9th with 4 ft'rs and flow ice,,that wasnt gutsy or hard core just stupid,,,so since Im one of those guys who dont know when to quit/stupid Im glad we have Dec 1st |
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| I personally think its a joke that the MN DNR closes the musky season in early December to keep organizations such as MI happy. The catch and release rate including mortality would be much better if they kept the season open until february, especially being hardly anyone takes the time to go fish specifically for muskies through the ice, and then closed it july and august. I love the way MI pushed so hard for a closing yet these are the first guys out there fishing when the water temps are over 70 and the fish are driven to feed.
I still fish muskies and "NORTHERNS" through the ice with great success and i can honestly say I have never had a fish that didn't swim away, where as when the water temps have exceeded 73 I have had two die including a 56.5 and 53.5. Personally I believe that the season should continue until february but should be catch and release starting in early Nov and close it down all together in July and August! I'm sure many people will a oppose to this being that is the only time some people get to fish, but seriously it would help us grow numbers of muskies in a hurry! I can back this up being I get out and fish almost everyday all year long.
Please understand my intentions are not to bash MI especially being I have been a member for 11 years but seriously we just need to look at better ways to protect this fishery we have tried so hard to build, and by allowing us to fish muskies during times of the year when they are most vulnerable "mid- summer" just really isn't helping us build our overall numbers and increase size. Ok now im sick of typing! lol Mike C. |
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Posts: 2384
Location: On the X that marks the mucky spot | Funny how some of the people here will absolutely BLAST a guy for keeping a 50 (or any other fish), but at the same time whine because we were able to put a regulation in place that saves a dozen plus 50's a season. Over the last 2-3 years we've been locked up by this time in 90% of the lakes in the state. Given the water temps I've been hearing we'll be locked up on a lot of lakes by next weekend so what, you might lose 1 or 2 days on the water? Small price to pay in trying to keep a resource that's getting absolutely hammered at a high level.
For the record the DNR wouldn't go with the Dec 15th date because they wanted the closure to coo-inside with the beginning of the dark house season. By having the season start at "first ice" it could have been construed as a reg against ice fishermen and the DNR didn't want to deal with that, especially with all the fuss that the dark house guys seem to raise.
I guess you can't please all the people all the time... |
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Posts: 3157
| some other info
when the MMA did the angler survey at the Minnesota muskie expo about 4 years ago one of the questions asked on it was "would you favor an early muskie closing" the response was pretty high I think around 70% for one
it was also a dec 15th closing that was originally wanted but the Dec 1st date is what the DNR wanted to coincide with spearing opener.Because their the pro's I think we should go with their wishes.
A chance to respond by the public with comments about the proposed early season closer was put on the DNR website before this was passed
If you think the DNR is directed by muskies inc,,we wanted a 54 inch minimum on some of the states heavy fished waters but they said "no' shoot for 48 first.
and if we had our way there would be Muskies stocked in Gull lake after all the hard work the Brainard chapter did but that got shot down.
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| You want a regulation that will save a dozen +50s a year how bout closing the season from july 1-sept 1. That would be saving hundreds of 50s if not thousands. This is why i get a kick out of these forums because people are only looking at short term efffects. As for the 54 inch minimum, that would be great but the only way we are going to make these fisheries better is by leaving these fish alone during high stress times.... Thats the only way that I will be for it!
Mike C |
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Posts: 4080
Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion | Mike C,
With all due respect, something is wrong when you have fish dieing in 73* water........are you playing the fish a long time? or bring it out of the deep to fast? or is the fish deeply hooked way down inside of it ?
Whats up? Just surprised that anyone had fish die in 73* water...
Also it's a lot more pract ical to close the season Dec. 1rst than when the water temps are in the 70's like June,July,Aug, and into Sept.
Common sense IS a good thing..............
Jerome |
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If hundreds of 50's (not thousands) were dying each season there wouldn't be any left in most MN lakes.
The fish being protected are ones that are intnetionally killed in Dec., not ones that die from delayed mortality.
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Posts: 654
Location: MPLS, MN | I also don't get why we can't fish Tiger only lakes on the pike opener. |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | Mike C - 11/27/2009 10:40 AM
You want a regulation that will save a dozen +50s a year how bout closing the season from july 1-sept 1. That would be saving hundreds of 50s if not thousands. This is why i get a kick out of these forums because people are only looking at short term efffects. As for the 54 inch minimum, that would be great but the only way we are going to make these fisheries better is by leaving these fish alone during high stress times.... Thats the only way that I will be for it!
Mike C
Hundreds if not thousands? MN people crack me up. |
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| Table 7C. Earliest, latest and average day of ice on, and number of years of record.
Lake
Earliest
On
Year
Occurred
Latest
On
Year
Occurred
Average
Ice On
Years of
Record
Birch 11/1 1991 12/16 1998 11/25 18
Brownie 11/5 1991 12/20 2001 11/27 22
Calhoun 11/25 1996 12/31 2001 12/21 34
Cedar 11/18 1989 12/21
1998, 1999,
2001 12/20 22
Diamond 11/20 2000 12/20 2001 12/3 9
Harriet 11/25 1996 12/31 2001 12/22 31
Hiawatha 11/1 1991 12/21 2001 11/28 23
Isles 11/5 1991 12/21 1999 11/28 29
Loring 11/1 1991 12/21 1999, 2001 12/19 19
Nokomis 11/1 1991 12/20 2001 11/28 24
Powderhorn 11/1 1991 12/20 2001 11/26 19
Spring 11/10 1995 12/20 2001 11/28 13
Webber 11/10 1995 12/20 2001 11/28 14
Wirth 11/5 1991 12/21 2001 11/27 23
The table is a little hard to decipher but the high points are the average ice on for Calhoun is 12/21 over 34 years of record keeping and the average ice on for Harriet is 12/22 over 31 years of record keeping. The "your only missing a couple days of fishing" mantra is nonsense we are getting robbed of three weeks in the city. FACTS ARE FUN!
Here is the link. http://minneapolisparks.com/documents/caring/wq_Annual_2003/7-ice20...
Edited by DJS 11/27/2009 7:50 PM
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Posts: 1184
Location: Iowa Great Lakes | Well I'm official done for the year, tried today but nothing happening. Saw 1 low 40 and a couple high teens and the normal hammer handle pike. Time to get the ice gear ready. |
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| This thread is starting to crack me up as well. I don't think people understand how many giant muskies are caught in MN over the course of a year! I have averaged 80 a summer over 40 inches for the last 15 years and usually between 15-25 over 50 in my boat thus stating that i may have a decent idea of what im talking about. I love hearing the people on here that believe they have never killed a fish being it 50degree or water temps of 80! It just cracks me up..... So yes H2o I have handled a few muskies over my last 15 years of skiing and will be the first to say that warm water kills big fish when stressed! Its a FACT! thus leading to many of 40+ fish that will eventually become 50+ inch fish dying! As much as i don't want to, I actually have to applaud the guides from down south who are smart enought not to beat there resources when the water gets to warm! I have never had problems with 40 inchers dying due to hot water at least not immidiatly following the catch but we all know it happens. But the 48+ fish really seem to struggle from the stress of warm water fighting. It would be like humans running marathons when its 115degrees outside! some would die from the stress! Also being why the don't plan Marathons when its that hot! Same goes for fishing! Why not shut it down during the extreme water temps? Its not Rocket Science people!
Its sad that some people just can't leave the fish alone during the peak water temps of the summer thats all i'm saying! Some people are just greedy i guess....... |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | Alright Mike C....you essentially talk about delayed mortality during the summer in this post by stating that 40 inchers swim off but, "we all know it happens." Yet in a previous post you talk about how you've never had one not swim off when caught through the ice. Don't you think it's entirely possible that delayed mortality can happen any time of year at any water temp? The fish aren't immune to stress in cold water. Yes cold water helps, but it isn't miracle water when it gets below 70 degrees.
You're analogy about the marathon is ridiculously weak. Look up a little thing called the Badwater Ultramarathon. 135 mile race in temps nearing 130. And some people run it start to finish and turn around and run it finish to start. They have to run on the white lines of the road to prevent their shoes from melting.
Amazing isn't it? Hundreds if not thousands? Come on.
Edited by Pointerpride102 11/28/2009 1:58 AM
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| This closure has completely stopped Muskies from being brought in to 1 local taxidermist, he use to do many large fish a year from French lake alone, since the Dec 1 closure he has taken in Zero.
The people fishing that one small lake have noticed the difference and commented on it to some of us, how the fishing is getting better and citing the closure as what felt made the difference.
Delayed mortality is one thing a gaff in the head is another.
If it helps the resource its worth a few complaints.
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Posts: 299
Location: Nowheresville, MN | .
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 Stop%20Whining.jpg (40KB - 144 downloads)
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| I agree with the comments of another about this topic dragging Muskies, Inc. down. In the end what Hooker said is correct...The DNR are the officials. They make the decisions and MI had little influence. But, so what if they did? Do you think when MI started the CPR program that it was met with widespread support? I imagine there were piles of people that poo poo'd it just like those whining that a couple city lakes are getting "robbed of 3 weeks of fishing". Keep in mind that all of the people who do great things for this fishery that YOU benefit from are all volunteers, deciding to spend time on this sometimes overwhelming project instead of fishing or spending time with their families. When you take shots at this effort only because you selfishly want a chance (that you may not even get or use) to add an outing or two on a local metro lake it really becomes less rewarding to be that volunteer you depend on to ensure the fishery is what it is today and will grow in the future. Remember those 8 lakes the DNR committed to? They are not going to happen if MI and other's don't make it happen because the DNR is afraid to push for them with so much opposition and they don't have the money to stock them....so who's going to make it happen? You? Obama? Maybe Harry Pelosi will hide it in the 2000 page healthcare bill? It really sickens me to see how apathetic the Muskie community is when there is a movement to improve something that they will benefit from and they don’t show up, represent themselves or contribute any of their time (no money required often). BUT when they don’t agree with outcome of something they could have helped shape or change, they show up and kick holes in everything they can, from the comfortable seat behind their computer. Next time there is a reason to show up that you will benefit from, I bet all of you the Muskie supporters will be outnumbered by at least 3 to 1.
If you don't believe there will be a positive impact from this new rule, ask Brad Hoppe or others from Miltona of fish pics with obvious spear marks in their heads. This is just one lake example of many that can be documented.
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| Mike C;
High water temps don't kill fish, fishermen kill fish.
Every muskie angler can do things to ensure good releases in summer.
Some simple things;
Don't un-hook or measure out of water.
Go barbless.
Don't take marathon photo sessions.
If water is to warm, DON'T FISH.
The season closure is to prevent people from intentionally killing them.
You seem to be advocating preventing people from fishing in conditions where they can release fish just fine with a little common sense.
C&R anglers don't have to fish if it's to warm, it's a choice we all can make, even guides.
As for how many big fish you catch, what does that have to do with this discussion??
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Posts: 3157
| DJS
those are cool stats thanks for compiling them but I dont think they totally reflect the "fishable" condition of city lakes.
Harriet for example can stay half frozen for two weeks sometimes before it finally is officially iced over,,,if the half thats frozen is on the boat landing side the lake is unfishable
Calhoun also seems to freeze first on the north end where the landing is too some times long before it too is considered "iced up' |
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| Seems to me that a higher size limit or mandatory C&R regulation would be the best solution to people keeping fish. Closing the season completely saves fish, sure, but at what cost? If French lake is getting hammered during early December, it sounds to me like there is a real opportunity being taken from muskie anglers with the 12/1 close. With higher size limits, more education, etc., people would continue to catch big skis but they would also be released successfully.
This regulation seems well intentioned. However, I think the extremists are too quick to say it's a great thing. |
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Posts: 4080
Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion | Closing the season on Dec. 1 ONLY HELPS the Muskie resource !
Most lakes in the state on 12/1 are usually covered in ice anyway.
Again, we need more common sense in our little World......Don't ya think .
Jerome |
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| Which lakes are currently frozen and which are not? Good test as it is almost 12/1... |
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| Let me comment on a few good points the guest brought up. 1) start using barbless hooks 2) Don't measure fish out of the water 3) No long photo sessions
That is how it starts first shorter seasons then we must use barbless hooks, hell why stop there lets go to only single barbless hooks. Then no fish pictures at all because it could lead to delayed mortality. As suggested, let's close the season the last two weeks of July and the first two of August. By the time you realize the fifteen added regulations have gone to far it won't matter because PETA will have WON and you won't be able to fish anyway. STOP OVER-REGULATING THE SPORT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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