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Posts: 780
| As musky tackle manufacturers move to the extremely heavy side, I'm wondering how much a muskies fighting ability matters anymore. I've caught almost everyway freshwater gamefish and with the exception of King Salmon, the musky can fight with the best of them. But it seems today's tackle is getting heavier, rods able to throw lures way over a pound, lines over 100lb. test, saltwater sized baitcasters, and lures that can be used in the ocean. Before I get lectured that I'm not forced to use that equipment , that's right and I won't. I already use the St. Croix Premier XH 6'9" and the H 7'6". Both rods have Abu 7000's on them. I feel either one of these combos can handle any musky that swims, and is as heavy as I'm going to get. I know it's a good thing to land muskies quickly for an easier fish revival and release. I still value the muskies fighting ability as something special. So my questions to the guys using that extremely heavy gear is , When someone asks you what makes muskies so special, do you respond the fish's fighting ability? And does that matter anymore? KDAWG
Edited by kdawg 1/23/2007 1:26 PM
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Posts: 32930
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Does to me! I use equipment that is 'average' weight, and do not plan to use the super heavy stuff much. |
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Posts: 8834
| If it was the fight I'd be a saltwater guy. It's more about being able to fool the apex predator, the fish that can eat the other fish... And the follows! Watching a muskie swim up behind your bait is just one of the coolest things.
The fight is important, but I don't think heavier equipment takes away from it at all. |
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Posts: 136
| I use very heavy tackle and some fish will still do what they want |
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Posts: 2089
| I use heavy tackle to cast and work the baits I'm using. 40# fish can and will do whatever they want.Turn a 40 pounder...good luck.I fished smallmouth a lot this season because of the fight.The toughest fish in fresh water in my opinion.The fighting ability of a muskie has never been a draw for me either.Odd behaviors(following) and the fact that they are difficult to catch keeps me going.I need to be able to set the hook at a distance on BIG fish.Lighter weight rods won't get the job done.Lighter line, especially braids, are a retailers dream and a guides nightmare.Too thin of diameter and you'll be picking out backlashes all day.It buries in the spool.I discussed line this past weekend while giving some seminars.I use 80lb for the DIAMETER as much as the strength.Ever heard the "rifle shot" when a bait breaks off on a backlash?Saw/heard it several times this season.Costs me $$$!!!!!!!!If clients bring their own stuff, I check it out thouroughly, especially the line.During the KLY Tourney 2 yrs ago, a friend lost a VERY large fish when the line broke.Old and waaaaaay too light.I learned that lesson the hard way.I hope she was able to shake the Jake.Oh, and it's been my experience that a 45" fights better than a 50 pounder.Better?Ok, maybe not better, just different.They all do. Steve |
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| Muskies don't fight that well. Salmon, carp, smallies... |
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Posts: 1061
Location: Medford, WI | Need I reply to this "guest"? ...No, I think all of us who have caught a musky do not need to even be reminded of the way which they can fight! Head shakes on the surface of the water while the fish is swimming straight at you, I would have to argue, is the most difficult "fight" of any species I've ever fished. Pound for pound....Yes, I believe smallmouth have the most strength and it's a blast to catch them because of that.
However, saying that muskies don't fight that well is just a knock on muskies.
-Jake |
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Posts: 3508
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | I personally enjoy the fight of a muskie. Although most battles are short, I ALWAYS back off my drag when fighting the fish. I back it off enough so that if the fish wants to make a hard run, it can, but will wear itself out and the drag will pull smoothly....not in a jerking-type motion. A couple of runs and the fish is pretty much done, and the battle usually lasts no more than 3 minutes. It would be a rare occasion for it to go longer, but it does happen.
So..I believe that the battle is what you allow it to be. Big muskies are going to go where they want, when they want regardless of the equipment you use. If you are in the front and it wants to go to the opposite side of the boat in the back, you're going with it. I have had a couple of fish that hit so hard that there is no fight left in them, but that happens maybe, MAYBE, once every 3 years or so.
I would also agree with Jonesi on the line weight. It is MUCH more about diameter than strength. When I switched to superlines, I went right to 80lb. I have had my share of "professional Overruns" but I have always been able to work it out.
I will max my stuff this year with a 7'-6" rod that I am building later on this winter. It will be an extra heavy blank for casting bulldawgs, but I don't see myself going to any pounder dawgs.
Steve |
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Posts: 32930
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Have to make a point about hook set. The effectiveness of any rod while setting the hook depends on the transfer of energy from the blank through the line to the hooks.
I like rods that I can tell will 'load up' quickly and produce a build-up and release of energy down that blank. I hold the rod at the balance point or as close to it as possible, something Shag Shahid taught me a very long time ago. I'll use an action heavy enough to handle the lure I am throwing, but never heavier than is necessary. I try to match the rod and reel, and the line, to the lure weight as closely as possible. Believe it or not, a heavier action may not set the hook as well as one somewhat lighter.
Line weight for me is diameter based as well once I'm past the capacity of the rod to break the line on a hook set. Theres no way under normal use a rod is going to produce enough energy to break 80#, but a 10 ounce lure moving at cast speed hitting the locked up spool from a backlash sure can. |
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Posts: 1636
| Guest - 1/23/2007 2:25 PM
Muskies don't fight that well. Salmon, carp, smallies...
AHAHA
You usually use very light line for all three of those. Salmon can go longer that is for sure... but Carp/Smallies? I had a carp hit a muskie bait today and it was NO match for my MEDIUM HEAVY rod. The Muskies fought till they had nothing left. In the cold water you can let them do that even tho I suggest to use your head.
So with that being said...
A Muskie on 6 pound test will fight harder and longer than a carp or smallmouth on 6 pound test.
I assume your talking about salmon in the midwest... I think The Salmon would fight longer, but no way would it fight harder or even be more challenging.
Then again, some Muskies just give up, but thats pretty rare. Some Salmon flop on there side right after you release them too.
Edited by Reelwise 1/23/2007 7:41 PM
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Posts: 199
Location: Sandusky, OH | All,
Before I started chasing muskies, I think I dabbled in about every available species in the Great Lakes region, and I still do. I am atracted to muskies for several of the same reasons mentioned above: chasing an apex predator, using large, cool baits, and the rush I get playing tug-of-war with a large fish. Before muskies, I really loved flipping/pitching jigs for largemouth bass (green weinies) in heavy cover; I enjoyed the hand-to-hand combat feeling of wrestling a big bass from its home. Quick bursts of speed and strength from the fish, longer heavier tackle. It was natural to transition to muskies, and I really love it, to the point I've joined a message board (something I'd never do) to learn and share.
And as much as I like muskies, and enjoy fishing for them above all other fish, I don't consider them the strongest fighters in freshwater. Their body is designed for lunges and quick bursts of activity, and that translates into a savage, albeit short-lived, fight. Of course, I have fewer muskies to base that opinion on than most here on the board, and mine have been small to average fish. I'm certain that the largest fish fight extremely hard; and someday I'd like to find out myself. The body morphology of other species, like salmon, is built for sustained runs, and their muscle is more vascularized than found in muskies, which makes them better suited for endurance. I love catching all of them, and don't get to nearly enough. Its almost like comparing a heavyweight boxer to a welterweight; one hits harder, one more likely to punch all twelve rounds, but both capable of messing you up. 
Someday I'd like to try tarpon or peacock bass; may be the best of both worlds.
Eric |
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Posts: 2067
| I have landed several 30-40"skies while walleye fishing - muskies fight incredible when not overmatched by "muskie gear"
Edited by IAJustin 1/23/2007 9:42 PM
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Location: Athens, Ohio | pound for pound, I think bluegill and crappie are the best fighters, with smallies next in line.
I like spring rattletrap season the best, since throwing smaller baits demands lighter tackle. Let 'em run for a while, m |
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Posts: 32930
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | If bluegill got up to 50# I wouldn't have a clue what a Muskie even is. |
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Location: Lake Tomahawk, WI | Don't know if this was mentioned yet or not, but heavy gear and landing fish quickly is much better for the fish. Yeah, it would be a blast to catch a bunch of muskies on 10lb test and medium spinning gear, but 30 minute fights would be very bad for the fish.
JS
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| I agree with what Steve said. Match the tackle to the lure weight. A good flipping stick, a Calcutta 250 with 65 lb superline, and I know I can land any muskie that swims. If a lure is too heavy to throw with this combo, I don't use it. |
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Posts: 1636
| sworrall - 1/24/2007 8:54 AM
If bluegill got up to 50# I wouldn't have a clue what a Muskie even is.
We don't know that for sure. Even a SMALL muskie can put up as good a fight as a decent size smallmouth and bluegill on the same tackle. I've even noticed that the 15" Smallies usually put up a better fight than the 18 inchers. (SOMETIMES) |
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| Some muskies fight, and some don't. Larger males can be crazy, and the really heavy females will give you the fight of your life.
Extra heavy tackle helps you quickly land the fish that don't want to fight and be ready to battle the ones that do want to play |
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Posts: 32930
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | I know that for sure. A 30# bluegill, because of body shape, etc. would be a true tackle buster. Can you imagine the sound of the 'pop' when one sucked a top water down? |
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Posts: 8834
| Trying to imagine what a 30# bluegill would look like...
Here's a 5 pounder:
http://www.jimallred.com/images/bream-in-hand.jpg
Edited by esoxaddict 1/24/2007 1:07 PM
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| Do a Google Image search for Mola Mola, that will give you a very weird, kind of scary idea of what a giant bluegill could be like. Heck better yet take a look at Goliath Groupers (Jewfish) and imagine a smallie that big! I would drop my current job and support myself through the sale of direct drive reels.
Back to the origional question, Musky fishing is definately more about the experience, than the capture. Lots of other fish hit harder and/or run faster and/or jump higher but the overall experience of musky fishing is a tough one to beat. |
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Posts: 1636
| Thats like saying imagine a 300 pound muskie. |
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Posts: 680
Location: Muskoka Ontario,Canada | I was actually surprised at how powerful a musky is when it wants to be. I've caught God knows how many good pike in my lifetime and they didn't have half the power of the few muskies I've caught and released. My gear is extremely heavy as I throw mainly huge glide baits and those fish had zero problem peeling line off and #*^@ near pulling me off the front of my boat! Smallies definitely are powerful fish and I consider the difference between the fight of pike and muskies to that of smallmouth vs largemouth. Similar fish....very different in power. |
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Posts: 2112
Location: The Sportsman, home, or out on the water | When Howie Meyer came to speak at our club meeting he told us of his travel to Alaska. When he asked what lakes had musky in them, he was told "None". they came back to WI right then and there.
My soon to be former co-worker came back from a trip to Costa rica. he said "you would love this place! You should see what htey catch down there!" I looked him in the eye and said, F@#ulk that, they dont have Muskys down there!
Nothing on earth (other than Lori) holds my interest like the fish that binds us to this site. |
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Posts: 32930
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | What's the matter, Reelwise, your imagination busted? Imagine a FIFTY pound muskie...have one yet? Need to be able to dream alittle, because that's what most of this sport is about. All one can hope for in this life is that eventually, one may live that dream. |
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Posts: 1636
| lol nah I'm just posting nonsense. A 50 pound bluegill would look kinda goofy haha |
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Posts: 32930
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | But what a FILLET!!!!! |
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Posts: 1636
| i HATE fish! kinda weird. |
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Posts: 780
| Lots of good stuff here so far,but I originally was not comparing the fight of a musky to other fish but rather, are we losing out at all to the muskies fighting ability by using such heavy tackle?Again, I'm just as guilty using the heavy gear as the next guy. But let me say this. If the smallmouth fisherman who claim that smallmouth bass are the best fighting fish would increase their tackle size to the same way us musky guys choose our tackle, then we will see! I'm not saying to fish smallmouth on musky gear, but let's say if the average musky is 20 pounds and we are using 80-100lb line, then smallmouth fisherman should put away there 10-12lb line and start using 20lb line and heavy action bass rods. Now how well does a smallmouth fight? Like I said, the musky is one of the best fighters in fresh water. Kdawg |
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Posts: 1286
Location: Stevens Point, Wi. | Google search 'mola mola'. Now that's a sunfish that should give your tackle a workout. |
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