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Posts: 31
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f718oJ4S-pk
If i or someone I'm fishing with catches either a likely personal best or a certain 50 + I will probably be putting the fish on the bump board. Other than that... I totally agree with what Pete is saying. Other than fish getting old in MN, its not shocking to me why fishing isn't as good as it used to be... where it used to be good.
We as a muskie fishing community should also consider either bending down our barbs or maybe manufacturing barbless hooks. I think it would be a huge improvement towards protecting our hobby / past time / sport.
Here's another product that I think is safer for the fisherman and the fish... I think the same company that makes the floating measuring sticks Pete is talking about makes the Grabb-it-tool also.
https://www.muskyshop.com/tools-measuring/grabb-it-hook-holder/
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Posts: 294
Location: Sakatchewan,Canada | Not often, but they are a great tool to get an accurate measurement when a monster is landed. I really don't see the issue with a wet down high quality bump board, so I don't agree with Pete on this one. It should only be used for very large fish however, and used properly and efficiently. A floating ruler is a joke if you want an accurate measurement... |
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Posts: 1767
Location: Lake Country, Wisconsin | Misguided and ridiculous.
Bump boards are about the last thing on earth worth worrying about. Takes what, 3-5 seconds to measure one?
The floating sticks are about as valuable as the CD player and flip phone I keep in a box in the basement...
Edited by Musky Brian 9/5/2017 11:21 PM
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Posts: 31
| Less handling of the fish. Less time out of the water. Less flopping and banging against the bump board and possibly other stuff. Less slime rubbing off.
Like Pete said, even anglers who have handled tons of muskies can't always control them on a bump board. Try banging your head on a hard surface anywhere from 1 - a handful of times (as we all know can happen when measuring a fish) as hard as muskie does at times.
For sure you're entitled to your opinion Musky Brian but i disagree that the opinion Pete and I and maybe some others hold is misguided and ridiculous.
We have to ask ourselves... in general, is a measurement to the nearest 1/8" more valuable, or potentially having more large fish to catch in the future?
Again, if i catch a special one... I will be bumping it. Other than that though, aside from hooking it in the face with enormous treble hooks, I'm going to limit the amount of contact myself or my boat and anything in it have with the fish... water releasing too whenever possible. Bloody split fins are bad. MMMk.
P.S. I love my 10 year old flip phone.. still use it.
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Posts: 1901
Location: MN | Pete is the last one should be lecturing on muskie handling as poor as he's been at it all his career. I think we should remove hooks from baits, only throw certain kinds of baits, and use only equipment that will allow us to bring them to boat in 20 seconds or less so we don't tire them out. And anybody that catches one accidentally on 6 lb test while fishing for walleyes with only a butterfly net should be shot on sight. |
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Posts: 791
Location: North Central IL USA | Mania makes good points that are hardly 'misguided and ridiculous'. I don't even have a bump board. An in the water measurement with the stick is close enough.
My flip phone and cd player are just fine too!! :D |
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Posts: 580
| If I am understanding Maina correctly, his problem isn't really with the bump board itself but rather it is the issue of taking the fish into the boat for a measurement, (because of the possibility of losing control of the fish while laying it down on the board).
If I'm correct in my understanding, I suppose I can sort of see his point...though I do disagree completely. The fact is, he's taking fish handling to quite the extreme. I mean, if he is THAT concerned about the safety of fish then I think he needs to rethink the entire proposition of fishing for muskies, period. Does the act of hooking, fighting to exhaustion or near exhaustion (regardless of water temp, but especially in warmer water), netting, unhooking, lifting, any additional handling for photos, etc. not all carry at least an equal if not much greater risk of harm to the fish's well-being (as compared to the risk of a bump board measurement)? I mean, geez, if bringing the fish on board to measure on a bump board is apparently now unethical, what's next? He is essentially saying water release only, since anytime you are in the act of taking the fish out of the net there is the potential for the fish to thrash and fall into the boat. Is that really where we're going?
Perhaps he's well-intentioned, but I think Brian described this best as "misguided".
Edited by Matt DeVos 9/6/2017 12:56 AM
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Posts: 4269
Location: Ashland WI | Maybe it's unethical to jam 5/0 hooks into the fishes face and yank them around the lake? That seems a lot worse than a bump board. |
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Posts: 504
Location: Ludington, MI | Don't have a bump board, but I've been considering it because I'd like to get to St. Clair this fall. I only catch about five or six muskies a year, mostly on trips to the UP. I'm considering a trip to St. Clair and the trophy waters north of me and I wondered if my 60-inch stick-on ruler on the gunwale of my boat is adequate? I would guess if I got one near the end of that ruler I'd be calling my DNR buddies to bring a scale down to the ramp. |
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Posts: 13688
Location: minocqua, wi. | the sport gets sillier and sillier each year ... |
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Location: Contrarian Island | measuring a fish on a bump board has far less of a chance at harming them than the hooks we use... while I respect his viewpoint, I completely disagree...the ridiculous line has been crossed w that vent...As a former guide in the sport maybe he could take a stance about all the guides these days that seem to "pass the fish" around for pics?!
Edited by BNelson 9/6/2017 8:14 AM
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Posts: 859
Location: MN | I don't agree. I think the lost message is don't handle the fish any more the necessary. Which I think many would agree with and practice. I don't find it necessary to measure every fish nor do I take photos of many either. However, I don't have issues with those who do. Everyone worries too much about everyone else is doing in this sport. |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | Wearing pink fuzzy hats can potentially blind muskies. We shouldn't do that either
Good gravy. Your outboard exhaust is more dangerous. |
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Posts: 135
| This one is getting spread around quick! And...since that's how he makes his money (views = sponsors), being a bit "misguided and ridiculous" might be generating exactly the reaction he was hoping to get: attention. His last episode of "Fishing Maina Style" - which is quite good! - got only ~600 views in 6 days on YouTube. This "rant" already has 26,000 views in less than one day on Facebook.
And to be fair, he doesn't use a bumpboard to measure fish. Or anything at all.
Edited by Glaucus_ 9/6/2017 7:55 AM
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Posts: 568
Location: Lake St Clair | Musky Brian - 9/6/2017 12:06 AM
Misguided and ridiculous.
Bump boards are about the last thing on earth worth worrying about. Takes what, 3-5 seconds to measure one?
The floating sticks are about as valuable as the CD player and flip phone I keep in a box in the basement...
hahah yeaaaaaahhh |
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Posts: 7039
Location: Northwest Chicago Burbs | Watched the video, and in the least I can say it was less painful to view than his usual "rants". Like the one about toll booths...
But I digress. Hard to argue with better handling of muskies, less time out of the water, less pulling slime off the body BUT...
It's a fish. First we couldn't kill them. Then no gaffs on the mouth. Then no swallow rigs with suckers. Then total C&R. Barbless. Don't troll because it hurts fish. Guys advocating NO HOOKS on sucker rigs. Etc etc,
At some point we're going to steer ourselves in such a direction that we see harming the fish in any way as a negative. To the above points about 5/0 hooks being bad for the fish...UH YEAH. Fishing is bad for fish. Let's all say that together: FISHING IS BAD FOR FISH. While I am of the mind that not every fish needs to be taken out of the net (or even figure 8-ed) for a pic, not every fish needs to go on the bump board...but that is for each angler to decide in his own circumstances. Personally, I've caught and taken pics of enough fish in the 34-42 ranges, so other than a fish with some kind of "other reason" to be taken a pic of (the only from a brutal week, extra fat, etc), those fish don't get a pic and don't go on a bump board. But I accept that others feel differently and that's cool, too.
But there you are, big fish in the net (big for you) and you've worked for hours and hours (or days, or weeks, or even years) for a fish that big and you're not going to get an accurate measurement? Yeah, no. It's a fish. Yeah, we all love the fish, but still, it's a fish. I've tried the ruler in the water, yeah that sucks. You get at best a guestimate.
It's easy for a guy who has caught 1000s of big fish to tell others not to take measurements. He's been there, done that, and still has the rest of his life to catch more fish. As far as I can tell, fishing on tv and supporting sponsors is kinda what he does for a living. He can guestimate all the fish he wants, because he's got another 200 days on the water next year to catch a few more that size or bigger. The rest of us, not so much.
And for a guy whose facebook page has Wimpy Wednesday (small muskies and pike caught and taken pics of)...I call bs. You can't tell us not to measure big fish because it might hurt the resource where in a way you are advocating extra stress on small fish that are supposed to grow up to be those big fish.
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Posts: 141
Location: Minnetonka | I think a better approach would have been giving some tips on using bump boards properly, for the masses that WILL continue to use them. Have the board wet and in position before you take the fish out of the water. Keep a firm grip on the jaw to control the head, and hold the tail down firmly. If you focus on controlling the fish while your camera man pinches the tail, it shouldn't take more than 5 seconds to measure safely and accurately. Lift up, take picture, release.
Edited by MuskyMatt71 9/6/2017 9:04 AM
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Posts: 227
| Pretty sure Pete has been featured on many TV shows over the past few years where fish have been out of the water for far longer than the two or three seconds he recommends for a quick picture. The host usually asks for all fish to be held up for a camera role. I agree about the need to put the fish back quickly, and the limited need for a measurement and picture. However, one needs to practice what one preaches. |
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| This is one guy's opinion. Maybe it will get people thinking about how they handle fish, which is a good thing. But I remember a conversation I had with a fisheries tech who was doing creel surveys on the lake where I now live. He had been doing the work for almost 40 years at the time, ever since he got back from Vietnam. He felt muskies were very resilient and could take a lot of handling. However, his thing was to not keep the fish out of the water for extended periods of time, which he felt stressed the fish. He said when he was working a lake that had a tournament, it was not uncommon to find a floater on Monday or Tuesday after the tournament and that they were almost always large fish. His theory was that while all were measured, the big ones were out of the water longer for pictures, etc.
He had been involved with netting muskies, marking them, measuring, etc. for decades. He had an interesting idea of measuring fish. He said when the DNR netted fish in the spring, they would put them in an aerated tank on the boat and sometimes there would be a measuring scale on the inside of the tank. He would slowly move the fish sideways and once they were against the side they would calm right down and it could easily be measured. Fish was in water the whole time.
I have only fished in one tournament, a transport tournament and actually made an aerated live well since my boat didn't have a big enough one built in. I put a mark on the inside for the legal length and the one fish I caught I did just what he suggested, put the fish right in, gently moved it to the side with the mark. It was very calm and I quickly saw it was about an inch too short and then with my hands still under it put it right back in the water. |
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Posts: 654
Location: MPLS, MN | If I think it's over 40"s I bump it unless it was hooked badly. No regrets |
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | jonnysled - 9/6/2017 6:15 AM
the sport gets sillier and sillier each year ...
This. |
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Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Slamr - 9/6/2017 8:35 AM
Watched the video, and in the least I can say it was less painful to view than his usual "rants". Like the one about toll booths...
But I digress. Hard to argue with better handling of muskies, less time out of the water, less pulling slime off the body BUT...
It's a fish. First we couldn't kill them. Then no gaffs on the mouth. Then no swallow rigs with suckers. Then total C&R. Barbless. Don't troll because it hurts fish. Guys advocating NO HOOKS on sucker rigs. Etc etc,
At some point we're going to steer ourselves in such a direction that we see harming the fish in any way as a negative. To the above points about 5/0 hooks being bad for the fish...UH YEAH. Fishing is bad for fish. Let's all say that together: FISHING IS BAD FOR FISH. While I am of the mind that not every fish needs to be taken out of the net (or even figure 8-ed) for a pic, not every fish needs to go on the bump board...but that is for each angler to decide in his own circumstances. Personally, I've caught and taken pics of enough fish in the 34-42 ranges, so other than a fish with some kind of "other reason" to be taken a pic of (the only from a brutal week, extra fat, etc), those fish don't get a pic and don't go on a bump board. But I accept that others feel differently and that's cool, too.
But there you are, big fish in the net (big for you) and you've worked for hours and hours (or days, or weeks, or even years) for a fish that big and you're not going to get an accurate measurement? Yeah, no. It's a fish. Yeah, we all love the fish, but still, it's a fish. I've tried the ruler in the water, yeah that sucks. You get at best a guestimate.
It's easy for a guy who has caught 1000s of big fish to tell others not to take measurements. He's been there, done that, and still has the rest of his life to catch more fish. As far as I can tell, fishing on tv and supporting sponsors is kinda what he does for a living. He can guestimate all the fish he wants, because he's got another 200 days on the water next year to catch a few more that size or bigger. The rest of us, not so much.
And for a guy whose facebook page has Wimpy Wednesday (small muskies and pike caught and taken pics of)...I call bs. You can't tell us not to measure big fish because it might hurt the resource where in a way you are advocating extra stress on small fish that are supposed to grow up to be those big fish.
This too. |
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Posts: 10
Location: WI | No hooks it is I guess. Don't want to hurt the fish. Soon enough deer hunting will be catch and release. |
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Posts: 323
Location: Elk River, MN | Slamr nailed it.
Sure, if you've got thousands of fish under your belt then I can see not caring about most fish's exact size and letting them go. But for many who only catch a handful a year it's much more important to get a good measurement, and in no means does bumping a fish hurt them.
Guys spend thousands of dollars on a sport and you expect them to take a guess as to the size of a fish? or measure them with a stick in the water? Stick measure a 55" in the water and you'll be haunted the rest of your life.
Should tell the guys at the drag strip to shut off the clocks and guess their times instead, save some electricity. |
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Posts: 617
Location: Clintonville, WI | For people that make their living through sponsors, any publicity is good publicity. His job is to get attention.....which is why he does a lot (all?) of the things he does. His medium for that happens to be fishing.
In the end, just do what YOU can as efficiently as possible to safely document fish caught in order to enjoy your hobby and help maintain the fisheries. Jeez.
Edited by BigMo 9/6/2017 12:28 PM
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Posts: 1209
| Before I knew any better I held a 44" vertically, I think I felt his jaw get dislocated some. No way a bump board is worse than that. However I have said before I do not try to figure 8 small fish even for the practice, and I do not need measurements on all muskies or pictures. But my dad as he gets older really likes to take pictures for his, hours of labor for a picture to cherish, honestly I think most tv fishing boats are harder on fish than many of us.
The weekend angler who catches less than 10 muskies a year can bump them all. People with hundreds total probally don't need to be told not bump them all cause they have came to this conclusion on there own. |
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Posts: 88
Location: Des Plaines, IL | A shred of irony is that one of the other "Maina Vent" videos he has is titled "Do What You Want." Contrarian to his message of getting rid of bump board measurements? A little I think.
From the perspective of someone who works with data for a living, numbers have meaning to me. When I catch a fish, I record every piece of data I possibly can, whether the fish is 24" or 44". I actually girth measure them all too, GASP (while in the net of course). I played baseball competitively for most of my life, and data always mattered to me because I felt it made me a better player. I feel the same way about fishing. Knowing all about the conditions and the fish I catch in them help me make decisions on when I'm willing to ask my wife if she's willing to watch our son while I fish for a day.
My grandfather took pictures and recorded data on all his fish, of which very few were even muskies. I now have all of those pictures with his hand written notes. Now, I have a database where all this is stored, but the principle is the same. Some day I hope to pass that on to my son or grandson so that they can glean some insight from it.
Like has been said here already, just do the best you can to handle the fish appropriately and put as little stress on it as possible. While I haven't caught a ton of muskies in my life, I haven't had one float on me yet. Since no one in my family really eats fish, I C&R everything, but I still measure my bass because, again, I love the data. Yes, the stress does add up over the catches, but unless everyone stops fishing, that's not going to change.
Rather than get people to stop measuring fish, I think it's important to make sure everyone fishing, regardless of the species they target, have tools that allow you to deal with as many situations as possible when you're out on the water. Encouraging bass or walleye fisherman to have extra hooks and some good hook cutters is a good thing. That way, when they catch more muskies than I do, at least they can cut hooks and get the fish back. The reality is everyone will not do this, that's life. But I think having more anglers prepared for the bodies of water they fish on and how they proceed once fish are caught would decrease fish mortality of all species way more than if we just stopped measuring fish. |
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Location: SE Wisconsin | Trying to scoop a fish in a cradle is ridiculous, so is trying to convince the musky community they are unethical for using a bump board. Talk about going off the deep end... |
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Location: MN | So according to the video Mania thinks placing a fish on a bump board is worse than a vertical hold...wow.
He'd have a melt down if he went out with the DNR when they are doing their spring muskie assessments and saw how they handled them.
Like mentioned in this thread, I'd bet TV hosts hold fish out of the water far longer than an experienced muskie fisherman in order to get good footage. They just edit it out. |
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Posts: 815
Location: Waukee, IA | Am i reading this? You guys have lost your minds and it isn't even winternet time. |
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