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Posts: 2089
| Hahahahaha!! Uncle Sigmund. I love to start the day with a chuckle. Oh yeah, with proper crimps and pliers, just crimping should be fine. Salt guys and gals have been doing it for years on fish that would eat or drown a muskie. I made my own for 25 years but now use Stealth Leaders exclusively. Why? Great components and attention to detail . Also, buying all the components to do it myself, I'd spend over $100 easy(Sampo/Spro swivels aren't cheap). With clients, I go through a bunch each season. I'll leave the leader making to the Professional. And no, I don't get 'em for free.LOL. Steve
Edited by Steve Jonesi 2/12/2009 1:14 PM
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Posts: 231
| I'll give another plug for Stealth (no, I don't get them for free LOL) I have used all different brands, from factory to home made. I have even made a few of my own that seemd strong & passed my personal weight tests that I put them through. With this said, I just would rather buy them through Stealth. I have beat them to death ,like I'm sure alot of you others have, and I'm amazed at how they hold up.!
I admire you guys that make your own, and share with friends. I just don't have the time with two boys who play travel baseball. So one it comes to having to buy my own, I don't think there's any leader that holds a candle to Stealth. Again...(JMHO).
Also, sometimes I think it's hard to get a read of peoples "Intentions" through a "Key Board". I say this B-cuz I have fished with Mike Hulbert before, and I never once saw where mike was "closed minded". I thought just the opposite, I thought Mike was very open minded, and worked his a$$ off for me. No......... Mike did not prompt me to say this (LOL) I'm just an average joe who's lucky to get out 12-15 times a year.
Chas
Edited by Chas 2/12/2009 9:53 AM
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Posts: 2015
| Steve Jonesi - 2/12/2009 9:13 AM
Also, buying all the components to do it myself, I'd spend over $100 easy(Sampo/Spro swivels aren't cheap).
You do need to make a one-time investment of a quality crimp tool $30, but this will last a lifetime. I use the Sampo/Rosco Barrel Swivels (American made) in the 225lb test and they are .25 cents each. String Ease Stay-Lok Snaps are about .30 cents each... I can make a ton of leaders (like 50) for $100.
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| the biggest beating a leader makes is throwing and working a bait.
I agree that the salt guys have been simply crimping leaders for years with success, but I doubt they have tried to heave a Pounder have way across a lake that resulted in a backlash.
there is not a fish in the world that puts the stress/ shock to a leader and line that a backlash does. when you fight a marlin, the rod and drag are working for you, when you backlash its 200 mph to 0.
I'll take the tied and crimped leader. |
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Posts: 531
Location: Hugo, MN | I make my own because I like to. I also make the majority of the baits I fish with, and have made three of my rods myself. Do I save money doing it? No. My work bench looks like Larry Dahlberg's basement. I've spent more money experimenting with baits and leaders than my wife needs to know about. However I enjoy the time I spend doing this stuff throughout each winter. It's what gets me through an otherwise miserable season. Sounds like a few people on this board would benefit from a winter hobby.  |
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Posts: 968
Location: N.FIB | sounds like some guys know how to crimp a fluoro leader and be good,about 5-6 yrs ago I bought one from rollies that was crimped(not sure if it was hard mono or fluoro)that I think was a smittys brand.Well I put it on to see what it was like and got a snag,got over top of the snag and gave it a rip and the crimp gave,luckily the lure came out also and floated to the suface.After that I started using knotted and crimped fluoro from charlie who sells them on ebay, with no fails,and also tried out the stealth with no fails,now I use both kinds,both are great.The only leaders I make are on my sucker rigs,I`m too lazy to make all my leaders so I buy them,no way I`m gonna sit around and make leaders all day,too lazy for that. |
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| I found myself very intriqued by this post. As a result I went out and obtained a few crimpted only flourocarbon leaders. One of them a very well known brand.
FYI
I did not run just a weight test, but a stress test with pulling twisting bouncing and jerking. Every crimpt only flourocarbon leader eventually failed at the crimpt. The one 130lbs seagur tied only still has yet to fail on the same test. It is night and day the durablility of the hold compared to the crimp only. I presume if given enough time it will likely fail at the loop where the snap or ring is on and not at the knot??
In the future I will be tying and possibly crimping, but am now scared to use a crimp only based on my results. Confidence is nearly everything in fishing. |
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Posts: 3868
| I make mine with 80# Climax and just tie them, no crimps. I can't imagine why a crimp is necessary when just knots have never failed me or anyone I've given/sold them to. I also don't understand why folks need flouro over 100#. Wouldn't such a stiff heavy leader compromise the action of various lures?
BTW - I use Extreem Mike's design on making the leaders. Hope he doesn't mind the mention.
Last, c'mon, lighten up on Mike Hulbert. I think he's just a intense dude, works his a$$ off and really wants to get things right. This is a totally unsolicited opinion; in fact, I don't think Mike cares for me at all!
Congrads to the Stealth sucess, another good guy.
Edited by Ranger 2/15/2009 11:15 AM
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| stop talking more fishing good guyes |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | I have made my own leaders for several years now. There's nothing to fear, if you understand what you need to do...and why. First of all, the technology is pretty much exactly the same as crimping collar (sleeves) on cable. Any aircraft you've ever been on has a bunch of crimped cables--I'll guarantee that. Anyone who says they don't trust crimps, has no clue how to crimp. A couple of million aircraft flying around seem to have no problems with the technology, and neither will you...providing you take a bit of time to learn the technique, and practice making leaders. Sleeves MUST be double-barreled, as mentioned already. Do not use single barrel sleeves. Also, don't crimp right to the very edge of the sleeve. Rather, leave the last 1/16th of an inch or so uncrimped. The crimping tool should have a flare on the outer edge, so the edge of the sleeve curves away from the leader material at the sleeve ends. It's simple, and once you see it, it will make perfect sense. I learned how to crimp sleeves onto cable many years ago in aircraft mechanic's school, and it's a simple and easy technique to learn. All it takes is a little practice.
Using 135-pound nylon-coated cable (from Seven-Strand), I make trolling leaders for use on Green Bay. I also make them out of 100-pound Seaguar fluoro, but only for friends who want them for clear lakes. I see no need to use these in the south of Green Bay as there's nothing *stealth* about fishing in water with 2-3 foot visibility. Actually, the color of the nylon-coated steel leader material perfectly blends with the discolor of the water, and the things are virtually invisible in the water anyway. But we've caught numerous fish in excess of 30-35 pounds, without a single problem. I've tested the crimped ends to failure a couple of times, and the cable always fails first.
I use Berkley #5 ball-bearing swivels, and a Malo tackle black delrin "tuna ring" on the distal end of the leader. The swivels are rated to 175-200 pounds, and the black delrin rings are rated to about 350-400 pounds as I recall. Massive overkill. I also use the 400-pound split rings to attach the lure, so there is no chance of a snap opening. I can take some pictures of the completed product, if anyone is interested in the components.
I have absolutely nothing against Stealth leaders, because I've used them in the past and they seem to be very good. But the nice thing about making your own leaders is that you are then set up to refresh the ends as needed. For instance, I will routinely cut the swivels and about 3-4" of leader material off the ends of the leader, at the first sign of any kinking in the material. Kinks are stress risers, and sources of potential failure. And when you fish in an area like Green Bay where you are one hit away from a huge fish, why would you ever take a chance on your terminal tackle? Sleeves are all of 2-3 cents each, and it takes all of 5 minutes to refresh the leader. I have several made up and ready to go, so I can just cut the line at the leader (which you should do anyway, after a big fish) and attach a new leader. Then I refresh the old leader while I'm trolling. I carry a 1000-yard spool of the 135# leader material.
All told, I have about $150-200 into leader making materials and supplies. If you buy high-quality ball-bearing swivels (about $4 each) and the tuna ring (about $3 each), you can make your leader for well under $10 each. But then the terminal components can be re-used time and time again--as they are so much stronger than the actual leader material, and thus are far from the weak link.
I have no interest in selling these leaders, but I'll gladly show anyone who is interested how I make them. With only a little investment of time and money, you can learn how to make your own leaders correctly. Then you can refresh the ends as needed, instead of trying to get every last cast out of the one you've purchased. Not that there's anything whatsoever wrong with buying leaders if you don't want to make your own mind you, it's just not for me...
TB
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Posts: 112
Location: Nielsen's Fly-In Lodge, on Rowan Lake | Just forget the crimps forget the knots just use a single wire good snaps a good swivel and eleimenate what ever else can go wrong at the moment of impact beacuse thats when many hearts are brcken and the pain is there forever just keep casting Don |
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Posts: 230
| knooter - 2/12/2009 6:42 PM
I make my own because I like to. I also make the majority of the baits I fish with, and have made three of my rods myself. Do I save money doing it? No. My work bench looks like Larry Dahlberg's basement. I've spent more money experimenting with baits and leaders than my wife needs to know about. However I enjoy the time I spend doing this stuff throughout each winter. It's what gets me through an otherwise miserable season. Sounds like a few people on this board would benefit from a winter hobby. :-)
Amen, brother.
I make my own leaders because I enjoy it, and frankly as an 18 year old kid I can't spend $5-7 for every leader I use. Plus I get very good deals on leader making materials, so why not. |
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