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Posts: 1906
Location: Oconto Falls, WI | The Green Bay fish post has had the use of the livewell considered bad in several posts. What is your stand on the issue of using a livewell? Why do you consider it good? Bad?
Personally, the livewell should be used as another tool for releasing fish in my opinion. If used correctly, I think it greatly helps in releasing fish in a much better state of health. Relating back to the Green Bay fish in the other post. Regardless if the fish was put in a livewell or not, the livewell could have aided greatly in releasing that fish healthy. The fish was caught on light tackle, which usually results in a long battle. Not sure if the anglers had a big net or not, but if not the fish would have needed to be played out to almost complete exhaustion before it could have been handled. By placing that fish in the livewell with the water recirculating, the fish would have had a safe place to recuperate in a highly oxygenated water. As is often a case on big waters it can get quite rough with a bit of wind. Is it safer for the fish, and angler for that matter, to place that fish in the livewell where there is no need to worry about the fish being dragged along and possibly drowning? I say yes.
Of course a large livewell is a necessity if you are going to employ its use. Again, the water should stay recirculating to keep fresh, oxygenated water flowing in. The fish should also be placed in the livewell as safely as possible, and not just dropped/thrown in.
In the case of out of season fish, not sure how lenient the wardens would be with you putting that fish in the livewell. It is considered in your possession once it is in the livewell, so they may just nail you regardless if you were intending to release it or not. It is a dirty shame that a fish has to "immediately" be released if it is in very poor shape as it's chances of survival would be slim. I think if the DNR was watching a guy fight the fish, put it in their livewell, and release it shortly after without transporting it that they should be lenient. However, if the person started transporting the fish, the DNR should follow them and issue a citation once the boat stops.
Let the debate begin! |
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Posts: 32934
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | I see in several state regs the use of the livewell to revive a fish is OK as long as the well is NOT used to transport a fish. In Wisconsin, I believe that the minute the fish is put in a well, it's reduced to posession; but there are special circumstances that allow using the livewell to revive a fish, I think.
If the surface temp is cool, and near that in which the fish was caught, I have used livewell additives (salts) that are designed to revive and 'freshen' fish. I'm sure you have seen these products, and I do believe they work. Maybe Sorno or another biologist can put in a word or two here, but I also don't think that the livewell high oxygen content (if it's properly aerated) hurts the fish if they are not banged around during transport. |
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Posts: 2068
| I have a 50" livewell but I guess I never have even considered using it to release fish ...you will have the "freashest" water going over the fishes gills by puttting it back in the lake ASAP..Then you stay with the fish..... 10 minutes is as long as I have personally ever stayed with one but would stay 2 hours if I thought it would help......but in the end we are talking about a fish ..if we choose to rip 7/0 hooks into thier heads we will loose some. ...CPR works, getem back in the lake ASAP!
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Posts: 2427
Location: Ft. Wayne Indiana | Never have I put a fish in the livewell and I never plan on it either.
236 fish released last year, not one in the live well, 220 fish last year, none in the live well....
I see no need for it. That just seems like to much picking up, and touching of the fish.
I have never understood why people need to have a 50 inch livewell on a musky boat. I use my two livewells for storage. One if full of lures, one is full of life jackets. I would rather have one little livewell for suckers that is about 2 foot x 2 foot. |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | I think the livewell can and should be used. If the water is fresh and relatively cool then the fish can be put in there and the cover closed. Then just sit QUIETLY in the boat for a few minutes. Let the fish calm down and relax in a cool dark place without a body hovering over them. This will reduce stress on the fish greatly, which lessens the amount of lactic acid build up which is bad. Learned this tip from someone who learned it from a biologist. Yes there is the debate about it being in possesion etc. As long as the fish lives I'm happy.
Mike |
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Posts: 28
| The reason people mentioned the livewell being open is because it is illegal to have an out of season fish in your posession.Ie. in a livewell. If you were to accidentally catch a large musky,or any other fish for that matter,out of season ,you are supposed to unhook it and release it unharmed immediately. To bring it into the boat and put it in your livewell constitutes posession in most cases and probably would be considered poaching.Thats what the fuss about having the open livewell in the picture was about! By the way it is possible to fit a 40 to 50lb musky in a relatively small livewell if you try but this may not be in the best interest for the fish! |
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Posts: 2515
Location: Waukesha & Land O Lakes, WI | If the fish was hook released quickly, in cool water and not removed from the net for other "stuff" there shouldn't be a need for it. I too never use the well to recessitate. Proper tools and net for release are key as is knowing how stressed a fish may have become during the fight. If that fish built up alot of lactic acid because it was fought on mono while bass or walleye fishing...then one should understand that and never even remove it from the net. |
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Posts: 3518
Location: north central wisconsin | I, like Mike H, never have used one(for Muskies), and do not see myself using one in the future. Even in the heat of the summer, it seems best to keep the fish right in the water, or get them back there as soon as possible. Also, fishing rivers alot, there is no need for the employment of a livewell, with highly oxygenated water beneeth the boat at all times. I haven't seen any situations where they would have been an aid in my fishing to this point. Some guys, though, use them effectively and I don't think they are doing anything 'wrong' by using them, though I do feel some do 'overuse' them a bit.
Edited by Reef Hawg 4/17/2006 11:42 AM
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | Just to clarify, I'm not saying toss every fish in the livewell to "revive" it, just if a fish is really struggling getting going it could be used to help just let the fish sit in a dark quiet place for a few minutes. I am all about leaving the fish in the water in the net, take a quick picture then back in, but in a desperate situation I think the livewell can be a very helpfull tool.
Mike |
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Posts: 32934
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Some articles I have read say that C&R chemicals used are good for the fish, some say that they are bad. I haven't livewelled a Muskie in years because I've had no reason to. I don't disagree with the idea that a fish is better released from a net, that's why I have the big Frabill aboard. I'm just not certain that a fish is harmed by livewelling, or that the C&R compounds out there don't help. Too much conflicting information. |
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Posts: 1906
Location: Oconto Falls, WI | Only in dire need is the livewell used. I have only put one fish in the livewell (outside of tournaments), and felt much better about it's survival chances than if I wouldn't have. |
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Posts: 3518
Location: north central wisconsin | I have never looked into the release compounds much, but wonder if I should check them out and inform a couple of the local bass clubs of their existance. I would think they might really be beneficial in some of the catch and release outings early in the season when fish are in or just recovering from the spawn. Are they available in Cabelas? Are some better than others?
I could see instances whare they'd help Muskies and pike too. Could some of these compounds help reduce the effects of the 'Bends'?
Edited by Reef Hawg 4/17/2006 12:11 PM
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Posts: 1764
Location: Ogden, Ut | Aside from the legal minefield it conjurs up in many states (a fish is considered reduced to possession once it hits the livewell here as well), I don't see a big advantage to it. I don't think the water is appreciably more oxygenated than surface of the water your vessel is sitting on. Depending on the time of the year, it may be substantially warmer and warmer water will hold less oxygen. Unless you have a livestock watering tank-sized livewell, and have the ability to refresh the water quickly, it's probably better to just use the lake/river you are on. When water temperatures are cool (normal time of the year OOS fish are caught), I see no advantage to it. Perhaps an argument can be made for giving the fish a 'calm' sanctuary when it's exceedingly rough water, but even that may be stretching it a bit if the livewell is not somehow stabilized. I'm not completely familiar w/ the physics of it all inside a pitching boat's livewell. As far as the 'release chemicals'...anyone's guess; I have not ever used them - either professionally or recreationally. I know of no fisheries agencies that routinely use them. They may have an application in the culture and transport end of things however, so I will stop short of saying that they are never used.
S. |
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Posts: 1168
| In those dire situations I'm all for using them. These are the ones where you just can't get it to go no matter what you try. Judged a tourney with a biologist and we ran into this problem. No matter what we did we couldn't get a fish to go. We pumped a livewell full of water and kept the aerators going, put the fish in and closed the lid. He laughed and said "give her 10 minutes and you'll be suprised at what happens." Just sat there for 10 minutes and he told me to open the lid and pick the fish up to release it. This fish that was belly up when we put it in the livewell was now as green as could be. Got it back in the lake and it was gone in a shot.
I was skeptical before this but as a last resort when you have a fish that simply cannot right itself why not try it? Sure the legality of it comes into play in some places but if you leave that fish floating belly up it's more than likely a goner so why not try something else if you have the means to do so? Hopefully I won't run into a situation like this too much in the future but it is nice knowing that there is still another measure you can take that was endorsed by a biologist in the event you find yourself struggling with a fish. |
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Posts: 32934
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | posted for bnelson
Posted 4/17/2006 1:09 PM
I have never put one in the livewell and see no need to...with todays HUGE nets I leave the fish in the net, in the water..it's nice having autopilot for releasing fish alone...strap down the net so the hoop is over the side of the boat, fish unhooked in the water...point the autopilot into the wind and turn it on just fast enough to move slowly out away from the structure...works like a charm..
if water temps on top are too high why are you out there fishing for them in the first place??? |
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Posts: 1243
Location: Musky Tackle Online, MN | Travis,
I completely agree with your initial post that the livewell is a great tool if needed. I always hit the switch on my livewell pump when I'm fighting a fish so that I have fresh water in there just in case. The pump stays on the entire time in case I do put a fish in there. Sometimes I use it, sometimes I don't, it all depends on the situation. I fish a lot of big water like Mille Lacs and Leech. When you're fishing in big rollers, as you said, it's sometimes a lot easier and a lot safer for both you and the fish if you're not hanging over the side of the boat in those situations. Whether it's cutting hooks or simply getting them out with a needlenose, it's just sometimes easier to do when the fish is in the livewell.
I had a situation last fall where I believe I would have had a dead 49" fish on my hands if not for my livewell. It was a relatively quick fight and the fish was released quickly without the use of my livewell. It was windy, I was bouncing pretty good and drifitng pretty quickly. Temps were in the 20s, water temps in the 30s, winds at around 20 to 25 mph. For whatever reason, this fish would not stay upright. (She was only caught in 12 feet of water). Even while keeping a hand on her tail, she would continue to want to turn upside down. After about 10 minutes of this and getting wet up past my elbows, the boat bouncing and drifting at a good clip, I couldn't even keep her straight, let alone upright. I knew this wasn't going to work and I needed to do something quick for a successful release.
So with the livewell water still running, I put her in there and slowly motored in towards shore about 75 to 100 yards. This got me behind a point where I was more protected from the wind and into some shallow 4 to 5 feet of water. This is where I then released her. After another 10 minutes of being elbow deep in 30 some degree water, the calmer water that I was in allowed me to be able to stabalize her and help her get her strength back. With the conditions I was in, I don't think this would have been possible in my original location. I would bet quite a large sum of money that my livewell saved the life of this fish. So is there a place for a livewell? Absolutely!
It's the only time in 16 years of musky fishing that I can say that my livewell absolutely saved a fish's life. But one fish, especially when you're talking 49 inches, is well worth having that livewell for.
Aaron |
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Location: Munster, IN | My livewell has my planer boards, RAM rod holders and my boat bumpers in there.
I have never had another need for it.
I would be afraid of doing more damage to the fish trying to get it in and out of the livewell.
I drop anchor to hold the boat from drifting into shore.
I have the BIG stowmaster that does a great job boatside
I know a couple guides that have revived fish in their livewell and swear by it.
Just do what you think is best for the fish in a given situation.
www.lakeshorelureco.com
EZ-E Does It.
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Posts: 255
| Let's just look at this very simply for a second. This guy and his kid are fishing walleyes right. They accidently catch a HUGE musky and want a picture of it of course. When this youngster finally gets this fish in, what do you think they had in the boat to land a fish this size with. A musky net. Probably not. We cannot see the rest of the boat or if they had a net large enough. Only what is in the picture.
I realize this was just a thread about weather or not to use the livewell as a tool for releasing musky. But sometimes you have to make do with what you have. The livewell may have been the only way to secure the fish while removing the hook if it were buried in it's throght My guess is that it may have been their only option. Just a guess. Later, Tom |
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Posts: 355
Location: Wausau, Wisconsin | The only reason I don't like using livewells in the heat of the summer is that the pure oxygen blowing over their gills in a non-abrasive, dark enviroment does such a good job reviving them that when I go to release them I am apt to loose a finger, hand or possibly the whole arm. I didn't catch 1,348,295 muskies last year but when needed, the few that went in the livewell were better off because of it. As far as needing a 50" livewell? You don't. You need a 60" livewell because that's what comes with a Tuffy Esox. 
If you're going to ride, make sure you've got a Magnum! |
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| For those that have tournament rigged livewell systems, they can deliver much more oxygen to a fish than sitting in the net. I agree with the poster above, sometimes if you leave them in the oxygen rich livewell too long you end up with a very green fish. That can be a little dicey trying to wrangle it out of there. A good livewell system can be a great place to put a fish for a few minutes after taking pictures to avoid the possiblity of losing grip of the fish while hanging overboard before it is ready to take off. |
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