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| Message Subject: Trolling Equipment Checklist | |||
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| I'm illiterate when it comes to trolling. However, I intend to slowly start giving it a significant effort beyond just "dragging a line". I understand it is a specialized technique that will take years to learn, but what are the essential items needed to "do it right"? I'd like to start slowly purchasing the essential items needed to successfully troll. If you are a troller, can you please list essential equipment needed for this method? You know... what types of rod holders are preferred, planer boards, terminal tackle, downriggers, etc. etc. ????? The more specific (brands, sizes, etc.) the better. Thanks. jlong | |||
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| Jason, Here's what has been working for me. Some I learned from Jason Smith and The Extreme One, some I picked up on my own. Basic equipment: 1. I now have Shakespeare Tidewater line counter reels. So far, they have performed really well, at $35 are a very good value. 2. Fiberglass, 8 1/2' or longer rods. I am using Gander Mountain Guides Series Downrigger rods. I think they're 9', and 2 piece. About $30. Good rod, medium fast tip, with decent backbone. 3. 25 lb mono fills the spool. 50 lb. Flouro leaders, about 2'. Good swivels and snaps. 4. Off shore Planer boards. I tried the "Roach"/Church orange boards, because they have the adjustable weight on the bottom. They will track wider, but I found that they tend to submarine too easily. 5. Good plotting GPS. I love my X-15! 6. Scotties Rod holder with flush mounts on the gunnels. These I rate as just OK. The rod holders themselves are good. What I don't like is the mounts. The holders tend to pop out occaisionally, especially with the down rods, in warm weather, with big, hard pulling baits(Big Believers, Jakes, Slammer Deep Divers). Not really a problem, but can be annoying! Splashing the mounts with water helps some. I'm going to try out some of the RAM holders and mounts this next year. If I could, I'd mount Downeasters. Best rod holder out there, IMHO. Had them on my Tuffy, and really liked them. As far as baits go, I will downsize next year for the water I fish most. Best baits for me overall were Depth Raiders, and Jointed Believers(8 1/2"). Had some success with Db03 and 4's. Hope this helps. Bring a radio, magazine, GameBoy Advance, a kid, and lot's to eat and drink. [;)] | |||
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| Rod holders: Used many...including downeastern that work well but are noisy at times. Scottys have been the best for me for both muskie and salmon. They make good rail mounts. I had the same problem as Shep this summer with them popping up (you wont loose a rod). I fixed it by inserting a set screw to the specific location I wanted it. Now they rock. Reels: Oakama line counters and cabella line counters work fine for muskie. I use mostly Penn 209's because I can fish for salmon with them and muskie and the clickers are the loudest. 8' per pass so you just have to do the math. Drags are great. Line: 20 mono with 50lb florocarbon leaders. Rods: Browning 8.3" down rigger rods. Stiff up to the last two feet so good backbone to fight with. Planner boards....a must...offshore. Jason, there are SO MANY things you can do with a crankbait trolling that can not be done casting and boat control makes it happen. Any questions? | |||
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| Jason, I have more questions than you can imagine. The biggest question is how do you stay awake... but we can answer that one later. First, when it comes to trolling I am totally a beginner... so you gotta talk to me that way. Thus, what do you need a line counter reel for? Is it so you can repeat what has been working? Do you just know that 50 feet of line with a certain lure runs at a given depth? Please explain. Would learning to troll using my casting rods be a mistake? Are the inexpensive rods ($30 range) worth the up-front money? Am I best off learning to troll only using one rod per person.... or should I put out as big a spread as possible to try and contact more fish.... and increase my confidence in this technique? That should be enough for now..... jlong | |||
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| The line counter reel's are nice but not nessesary. You can count the line pawl as it goes back and forth to see how much line is out. Penn 209 about 7 to 8 feet. Start by letting out 60 feet and slowly move shallow. When you bait hits botton take note. Then let out 100 feet and do the same. Over time you'll see how deep you lures are running with "X" amount of line out. The "down rigger" rods have a softer tip and there cheap. Your standard musky rod will work but they take a beating going in and out of the rod holder's. | |||
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| I really don't understand why all this extra equipment is required. My big bait casting rod and reel work. Calcutta 400, with clicker on 80 lb Tuff Line 6'-9" St. Croix Legend Heavy Trolling baits Fish-On rod holders Every fish I've had hit, I've landed. I troll only a few times a year, but using the equipment I already have works, and with no added expenses of buying extra trolling equipment......Is it really necessary to spend the extra money? Just curious. | |||
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| Jason/Jim, You can troll with your existing equipment, ie. rods, reels(they should have a clicker), line, etc. I feel trolling is awfull hard on my good muskie rods, however. So, after getting out more with Smith, and Koepp, I decided to add to my arsenal. The two piece rods are nice, as my mom made some rod sleeves. They are compact, and store easily out of the way. I now like having tools available to best do the job. Sooooo, Yes, I think the extra expense is justified. I nearly busted one of my expensive St Croix rods when the lure stuck on a piling! Then, late this fall, I was trolling, and ended up in the middle of a bunch of 1" ice floating around in the wind. I felt much better knowing I was using fiberglass rods, instead of expensive, fragile graphite rods. While line counters aren't required, the Tidewater is a pretty good reel, and not really expensive. It sure helps for repeatability, and for generating dive charts. Everytime I troll, I write down what depth a certain lure runs with a given amount of line out. As I acquire more data, I get better charts. Also, the added expense isn't rally that great, if you ease into it. As far as staying awake goes, I just crank some music, and keep an eye on the sonar/GPS plotter. Speed, depth, staying on the breaks, watching for suspended baitfish, all require different amounts of focus depending on you location. Some lakes need constant attention, some don't. It's not just setting you lines, and driving around aimlessly. You've got to observe what is happening, develop patterns, try new things, clear weeds/leaves/junk, watch other boats, etc. | |||
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| JLong, you make me laugh![:p] | |||
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| I'm at a disadvantage because I don't know where anyone is fishing, but would love to help if possible. I've trolled every kind of lake you can think of, but the newest lures I know is a Cisco Kid, Swim Whizz, Believer, Creek Chub Pikie and a Bagley. That should tell you how long it's been since I've been in touch. I use to make all my lures and had lures that would dive 50+ feet on 14lb test line. This is not about lures until you know where the fish feed. Many factors come in to play and the equipment I use is the same thing I use to catch Stripers to the mid 60 lb class. If you can double up it won't cost as much, but I have to have big stuff. Here is what you need to do! Tell us rather you are fishing Natural Lakes, Highland, Hilland, or lowland Res, flowage or whatever. Pick one lake or type of lake and stick with it. Once you master that, the others will be much easier. Is the water extremely clear, extreme dark or somewhere in between? I put a white bait in the water and if I can see it 5 feet deep, I figure a Muskie can see it 10 feet looking up. Nothing scientific, just my way of guessing. What is the main forage? Most lakes except Natural, Highland and extremely windy lakes lose oxygen below the thermocline. Most very clear deep lakes I have fished in the summer have a magic depth of 30 to 40 feet. On the other end of the scale was a flatland in PA called Pymutuning that had a magic depth of 2 to 5 feet in the 1970's. At that time a 12 inch white lure disappeared at 6 to 12 inches. Every lake has it's thing. Drop-offs, weeds, roadbed, stumps, flats, buildings or whatever. They use each of these at different times. Rods, reels, lines (Type & size), rodholders, should all be used for a reason. For instance, I can get a #1800 Cisco Kid down to 40 feet with 14 lb test mono or 30 feet on 20 lb test or just over 20 feet on 30 lb test. Anyhow give us more info and I will try not to be too windy. (Impossible) | |||
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| I have to agree with Shep on that trolling can (and is) hard on your equipment. Most of my trolling rods the sponge handle is wore off from going in and out of the rod holders over the years. I would hate to see a Throne Diamond back go thru this abuse. Cabelas has a decent line counter combo for $100.00. A penn 209 and Diawa "rigger" rod runs you about $80.00. | |||
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| "The biggest question is how do you stay awake"............ 1)RED BULL, COFFEE and METALICA! "What do you need a line counter reel for?" 2)SO YOU CAN DIAL IN ON THE DEPTH WITH YOUR SPEED AND HAVE YOUR BAITS RUN THE RIGHT DEPTH OFF THE BOTTOM. EXAMPLE: SLAMMER DEEP DIVER, 55 FT BACK GOES 15FT DEEP AT 2.6MPH IN 16FT OF WATER...YOUR IN THE ZONE!! "Is it so you can repeat what has been working?" 3)YES, OFTEN YOU CAN DIAL IN ON A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF LINE OUT, RUNNING AT A CERTAIN DEPTH AND RUN THE STRUCTURE OVER AND OVER AND CONTINUE TO SCORE. Do you just know that 50 feet of line with a certain lure runs at a given depth? 4)EVERY BAITS IS DIFFERENT AND SPEED ALSO PLAYS A FACTOR IN THIS AS WELL AS LINE DIAMETER. A NOTE BOOK AND SOME TRIAL RUN BUMPING STRUCTURE IS THE WAY TO LEARN. "Would learning to troll using my casting rods be a mistake?" 5) YES, CORK HANDLES WILL GET EATEN UP BY THE ROD HOLDERS WHEN YOU TURN IN AND OUT OF THE BREAKS. "Are the inexpensive rods ($30 range) worth the up-front money?" 6)YES...CHEAP FIBERGLASS RODS ALSO HAVE MORE "GIVE" AND CAN TAKE SNAGS AND BIG HITS BETTER. "Am I best off learning to troll only using one rod per person.... or should I put out as big a spread as possible to try and contact more fish.... and increase my confidence in this technique?" 7) I WOULD START OUT WITH A TWO ROD SET, THEN WORK TO A FOUR ROD SET. SIX ROD SETS ARE A MESS..IF YOU ARE DOING STRUCTURE TROLLING. ANYMORE...MR.LONG!!![:bigsmile:] Happy to answer questions anytime! [:bigsmile:] | |||
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| I didn't have time to read all the responses, so sorry if this is repetitive but here goes. First and foremost the number 1 tool you will need is a GPS to get accurate speeds. No need for an expensive complicated one. You will need for a close second some down easters rod holders, nothing compares to them. Make sure they are the S-10 model. http://www.down-east.com/ Everything else is secondary as you can use your casting outfit to troll with. But here is a list. Reels: Line counters only when you really get into it. They help you get your cranks running at the perfect depths as well as remembering the exact distances behind the boat. Other then that 6500s do a fine job you can count raps to see where your lures are at. Rods: don't spend any big moneys untill you are right into it but make sure to have short ones for inside and long ones for outside as well as stiff ones for down rods ( those can be same as your short rods unless you plan on running both setups ). Lines: I like to use 80# powerpro for most applications and 50# braided lines when I want lift ( runs lures a shallower ). Lures: anything and everything can be trolled out there just find what work where your fishing at. Speed: same as above you need to get the feel of what speed is best for every lure. I may of left the most important part for last LMAO but get out and fish with a trolling expert. Maybe you can replace that LOTW trip for one out east. LOL I am sure we can break you in. [:p] | |||
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| One thing I'd like to add...make sure the drag is very loose if you get plastic rod holders. I usually keep a low drag but somehow ruined a scotty on a snag. My suggestion...stay away from plastic. I had a berkley last year and scotties this year. Next year It will be all down easters. | |||
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| For reels, I have okumas. they work just fine unless you want to pull a dipsey diver, then you wanrt a diawa for that. For planer boards, I like the mr. walleye. They handle the baits better. They only submarine if you make a really sharp turn and the board is on the inside. Line, I use 20lb flourocarbon and 80lb flourocarbon leaders, 3ft long. I reacommend a pipsey diver for getting stuff way down. Experiment with what bait will work. Generally ones with less drag work best. A big jake will roll the dipsey up to the surface. I prefer bucktails for trolling shallow, they are better hookers. Get a couple of keels for that. Line twist ain't fun. A speed guage for your depth finder is a must for consistency. I like my scotty rod holders. I have had them pop out but if you play with rod angles, you can eliminate that problem. Experiment, be different, it works. | |||
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| Get yourself a copy of "Spoonplugging, your guide to lunker catches." Written by Buck Perry. Cost is less than $20. Learn the methods in this book and it will make you a better troller & caster. He does mention his lures (tools), but also says that if you can get something else to do the job, that's ok. I have a link to him (I am not affiliated with him, nor do I make money from him)on my site under "books/videos. | |||
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| Here is my list of trolling goodies: For my depthsounder I like the Lowrance X-85,very good at picking up muskies hugging the bottom in depths of 30 feet or more and well lit up at night.For trolling speed I do not have much faith in the speed paddle wheels on depthsounders,the speed moves around to much for my liking.I use two divices,Osprey Surface Speed Indicator by Moar Tech added together with speed over bottom(GPS),then divided by 2= Lure Speed. For Rodholders I like Downeast Salty S-10 double clamp on Berts Custom Tackle Blocks and Sanction Mount Downeast Rodholders on Berts Slides.Out rodholders are higher then the inside rodholders so the can pass by each other with out touching when you get connected to a Slob.My Net is a Bechman square bag deep holding pen.My out rods are 10' hvy St.Croix Pro-Glass Rods,for great spread from the boat and distance from the inside rods.The inside rods are 7'Xhvy St. Croix Pro-Glass rods,usualy the bigger deeper diving crankbaits are on the inside as well.When running six rods my back rods,straight off the back in the propwash are,6'hvy Ocean Series Standup Rods.I use all Okuma Reels for Trolling,the Magna 30DX Linecounters for the 6' back rods,spooled with 80 lb test PowerPro.The outside and mid rods,10' and 7' rods both have Okuma Titus 50L/Levelwind Leverdrag Reels,spooled with Mason Leadcore Line in either 60 lb or 45 lb test.My leaders are always 3/4 the legnth of my rods and are made of Seaguar Fluorocarbon in 80 lb test.The Swivel between the main line and the leader is an Aussie 250 lb test tight tolerance ballberring swivel,large in size to also catch weeds.The Snap at the end of the leader is a Stringease StayLok # 7,will not open under any fishes stress.Release tools include,Knipex Colbolt Mini Boltcutters,can cut 7/0 hooks with ease and with one hand,long handled and short handled needlenose pliers,jaw spreader,splitring pliers,files and at least 24 hooks of all sizes ready with splitrings to use for quick replacement after cutting hooks that are cheap.Most Important,release note pad,where all information is recorded to add to the computer data base later for reference,write it down then,believe me you will forget some data if you don't.Repeatability is 90% on the Hunt! Capt. Larry D. Jones http://www.mostlymuskies.com/reports.htm | |||
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