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Posts: 32926
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Let's continue this by taking a topic most posted on the top ten from the thread originally posted a while back.
http://muskie.outdoorsfirst.com/board/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=30...
Almost everyone agreed that reading the water, aka know your water or be familiar with your water or learn the water was a critical aspect.
I'd like to know what you personally do to learn a body of water, and how you go through the process of 'reading the water' to get that process completed. I'll toss in my 2 cents as well.
What's your process? |
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Posts: 551
Location: Columbus, Georgia | Right now Cave Run Lake (and other southern reservoirs) are at "winter pool." The entire body of water is 5 to 6 feel down (about 25% of capacity). One can see all kinds of rock bars, fallen timber, etc. that is not visible at summer pool. Based upon the fact that such structure is located in some pretty shallow water ... it would be hard to see and map this on a GPS once the water comes up.
I am marking every time I go out now, and look forward to fishing some really great spots that do appear to be fish attractors once the water level comes up.
Craig |
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Posts: 2687
Location: Hayward, WI | I'll bite again. I am still practicing this, but:
I ALWAYS study a lake map a LOT BEFORE I ever put the boat in the water. I like to look for the big obvious things the lake has. Does it have a lot of weeds, rocks, flats, points, etc. I study the map to try to figure out what good spots are that most people will probably not be fishing ("secondary" spots). I'll try to figure out most likely what depth will be the most productive in what areas, and maybe even the best ways to fish them.
When I get on the water I like to more or less remember what the map looks like, but I still study the map and compare it to what is really the case on the water.
When I pull up to a spot, I might either run around on it with my boat, marking key features on my GPS, then come back later to fish, or I might just start fishing, and mark or make note of anything important I notice while fishing.
Depends how much time I have, and how easily I feel the fish will spook if I run the boat over them.
Generally, I will have a bunch of different spots marked on the map (or in my head) I want to try. I usually start shallow if I think it will work, or even sometimes if I don't think it will work. I am more comfortable fishing fairly shallow, so I start there and hope it works. If good weeds are present, I usually start with those. If they are holding fish, great. If not, move and try the next spots, maybe another spot with weeds that are deeper, shallower, more windblown, etc. Maybe rocks, sand, or something else. Depends on the lake I guess.
I hope this is what you were looking for. It probably seems a little cluttered and disorganized, but I guess that's how it is for me right now. I'm still developing a good way to read water fast and efficiently, and eliminate unproductive areas fast. When catching a musky in a day is good, and two is great for me, it seems hard for me to know if the area I'm in is good - will I catch a fish on the next cast? Is it bad - could I fish here all day and not see a thing? I have fished for other fish for years, and eliminating bad water is a lot easier than it is for me while fishing muskies. Still learning these fish!
curleytail
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | Right now I'm like a sponge, taking in every bit of information I learn about each body of water I fish with each different person I fish with. Since I dont have a boat its hard to "learn" and/or "read" water.
My main body of water that I fish is really quite simple to read/fish. Its a section with decent current, I throw up the current and work down looking to work through current breaks, behind rock etc. |
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Posts: 691
Location: nationwide | What I have done to learn a body of water is pretty much fish it exclusively for over 20 years. Sometimes it seems like it has worked, sometimes it feels like I am out there for the first time.
Knowing the fishes seasonal patterns/locations and migrations gives me a general idea of a starting point.
On a daily basis things I check to help me "read the water" would include water level, temperature and clarity along with wind direction and intensity. I will also look at the solunar tables and local weather forcasts as well as what weather is a day or two away.
In a broader range, I too am like a sponge and try to get as much information (past and present) to "crunch" about the lake as possible by talking to other fishermen and guides. I have a map of my lake under a piece of glass at my desk at work, another map in my briefcase, truck, boat and of course at home where there are multiple maps including an original survey map from the early 1900's. I have spent some late winters with low water on the lake with an ATV and video camera to learn more about the areas I fish during normal pool levels for future reference. I read everything I can find specifically about the lake, multiple times. I also read and watch other items regarding musky fishing in general as well. I readily talk to the walleye and crappie anglers at the campground to try and find out if they are being bothered by any muskies to which I will tell them I will try to catch it so it leaves their area.
The lake I fish seems change every year with different idiosyncrasies from year to year and even month to month as the season progresses. Areas that were loaded with fish one year or month are barren the next for no apparent reason, some years night fishing is a bust and others so good over half my fish come well after dark, even in the fall.
I am sure I have missed some items and did not even get into the aspect of "reading the water" once fishing has begun but that will be for another rambling post.
Corey Meyer
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Posts: 4266
| Get a map if possible.
If not, take a ride and watch the locator and the shoreline.
Look for markers on the lake indicating shallow areas.
Sunny, calm days are best for a rde-around, because you can locate lots of potential fishing areas just by looking for color changes that indicate drop offs or weed growth. If you find weed growth, find the depth where the weeds quit growing. Try to run that depth and look for different features.
Look for areas that look like places where you have caught fish before. Points, inside turns, inlets.....etc. If something jumps out at you, cut the ride short and fish some spots that you find.
Find a guy in a Tuffy, and follow him around all day.
Case in point; Heading up to Vilas to fish an extended weekend targeting 3 different lakes, one that I have never fished before. I got a map of it and studied it, so I had a starting point. I motored around and found some areas that I fished immediately, then while motoring form one spot to another, I thought my electronics had gone haywire. It said I was i 8 feet of water with weeds, when the map showed a clear, structure-free basin. Upon further investigation, I located a sunken island that topped of at 3 feet, had a solid cabbage border from 4-12 feet, then dropped into over 20-30 feet all around it. This island was 100 yads wide and over 200 yards long with many weedy fingers and inside turns but it was not on the map. How can you miss something that big? Perhaps it was left off of the map intentionally? Anyway, to this day, that one spot has yeilded many fish, with a 46.5 and 48 coming on the same day. I also missed and saw several fish that were 4 foot or better on or around that island. Still can't figure out how it didn't make it on the map. It's funny to watch first-timers come out to fish the lake with map in hand, and you can tell when they do exactly what I did....run over it and then stop and start idling back and forth across it trying to find the beginning and end of it. Then just like me, the motor gets shut off and the trolling motor comes out. I've checked different GPS maps, and they too don't have the island on the map. I think a map is a great place to start, but I have little faith in them after seeing what they missed, and now just use them as a starting point for reference.
Edited by Beaver 1/11/2007 8:47 AM
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Posts: 3507
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | I am a constant map-reader. I will study a map as much as I can to try and get as good of an idea about what the structure is going to look like. I'll mark the inside turns, key changes in depth contour from a flat, and then take into consideration time of year I am going. If it is early season, I'll look for areas that are shallow flats but deep water near by, etc.
I also will do as much research as I can on the fishery itself in terms of forage, stocking, size structure of the fish, etc. Minnesota does a really good job of this on their DNR website which allows one to check all of these aspects, along with the dnr lakemap. This gives me an idea of what I can expect a bit when I get there. It also can act as a clue of what types of colors to use as a basis. Water clarity can help me determine if I need to be tight to structure or maybe move off structure a bit.
Once on the water, I will check out those key spots I marked on the map and fish them, but I do it with the mindset of finding other key elements that the map does not show...like turns on the weedlines, changes in weeds to rocks or changes between weed types. complexity is what I spend more time looking for than anything. Many times, structure is not mapped correctly or as detailed as it could be. My best spots on my home water has 3 reefs that top out at 12 - 15 feet but are not marked on the map. Other areas have the structure, but it does not show contour on the bar which identifies 2 different saddles, a drop off one side and a 15 foot flat on the other. So...if I raise a fish there as I am checking it out, I can come back to it and have a decent idea as to where it may be....that spot on the spot. In many ways, just running the big motor around the structure shows some of these aspects, but rarely do I feel the best spot is found this way....you got to get out there and pick the spot apart.
Once I have hit the areas that held the most potential on the water, I will go and check secondary spots that I see while moving between my marked areas and explore them. Sometimes, those are the gems of the water...areas that can be overlooked pretty easily. I have found some of my best spots by watching my flasher... If I'm over deep water and all of the sudden it comes up to 20 feet, I'll explore it. (Clear water here)
Sometimes I will run an area with the boat to get a contour, but if the spot looks good or if it's a bit deeper than what allows me to see the structure, I'll just go fish it, watching my flasher to follow contours.
Steve |
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Posts: 1536
Location: God's Country......USA..... Western Wisconsin | Having fished for Muskies on lots of water in MN and WI as well as fished Bass on several large Southern Reservoirs I can tell you that a detailed map is one of the best tools out there for learning the water you are going to be on. That being said there is also local knowledge to be considered. Make every effort to cut your learning time by by inquiring about local patterns etc. for the time of year you are going to be on any new water. Web sites, particularly this one, are great places to learn more about the water you are headed for. I know that Steve Worrall, myself and others here will gladly help with lake info and even mark a map or two if need be. Ask plenty of questions about what usually works in the season you are fishing. My fishing partner and I were rewarded with a 55+ inch fish on Cass lake on our first ever trip there, on the first spot we fished. We picked the spot but had some great info from Paul Thorne as to where to start looking and what to throw.
One thing I always ask about from someone local if possible is what is the prevailing wind direction. From where does the wind blow most of the time. Pick the areas you want to hit hard accordingly. Call a local bait shop to find out what the wind direction has been for the last 3 or 4 days. This is stuff you can do from home before you get the boat wet.
If you are going to fish a very large lake or reservoir you obviously can't learn all of it at one time. Break this body of water down into smaller lake like areas. You can fish a large bay or an arm of the lake much like you can fish a regular lake. Don't bite off more than you can chew. Look for depth breaks and contours. Look for bottom changes from hard to soft etc. Pay close attention to current either natural or wind created. Wind blown points can be great. You can find these areas ahead of time on your map if you work at it hard enough.
I guess the key is to put in the effort of doing some homework. This is becoming easier and easier with the internet and with all the new electronic gizzmos. But there is still no replacement for time spent, either on the water or studying your map etc. One of the best fishermen ever, Rick Clunn, lays the map of a new lake out on his office floor for at least 3 weeks before he is going to fish the lake so that he is forced into looking at it every day.
With all that being said, remember, that fishing Muskie's is a tough proposition at best. You will have to be ready to change and adapt at a moments notice or at the first sign of an oncoming thunderstorm. |
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Posts: 32926
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Great stuff, keep it coming!
For me...
Continuing what has been said above; Reading the water:
A lake or river is really nothing but a field full of varying topography filled with water. The only function the water really has is to hold everything up, after that it's a liability because it makes much of the structure impossible to see. I try to think 3-d out there, using the sonar to tell me where I am in relation to features in that field.
Look at that weedline like you would a treeline or brushline in the woods and learn the inside and outside turns, etc by fishing them. The weeds are not one dimensional as shown on a sonar, so don't THINK in one dimension. The fish are suspended in a three dimensional field, you need to begin to look at all structure that way. I try to see the lake or river bottom as if I am standing on the bottom. Think of what a rock pile looks like in a field, then transfer that concept to the rock pile you are fishing. If the rock drops off sharply on one end, and tapers gradually on the other, imagine that in 3D, add the little structures you find on that rock pile, and you will be able to put your lure where this fish is with better consistency. A 12' high weedline comprised of cabbage that stalks up to 4' before getting any leaves IS structure, and allot of that structure is 8' down where you can't see it.
Keep it coming!
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Posts: 32926
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | More?
Come on, give us a shot at your process out there... |
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Posts: 1764
Location: Ogden, Ut | Well, here's my shot at it. I really only fish one water, so I can get pretty intimate w/ it, that being said, there is always more to learn it seems.
I was playing around on Google Earth one day and happend across Pineview reservoir as seen during the midst of a sever drought...about 30+ feet below full pool. Wonderful resolution with regard to macro elements of structure available. The micro elements are usually pieced together during ice fishing as the reservoir is low during most of the winter and fills w/ snowmelt and subsequent runoff. I literally can look at it nearly every year.
A picture is worth a thousand words...a satellite picture may be worth more than that.
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Posts: 136
| Look at a map and find the spawning grounds. Doesn't work on small lakes but big Shield lakes you can find them. Then you are on the fish. |
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Location: Contrarian Island | Well I'll throw in my 2 cents...
Most of the replies above have some of the exact things I do...before fishing a lake, I look at the map, looking for big key features, big points, humps, saddles, food shelves, if the maps indicate weeds etc look where they are...alot can be learned from just a map...I try to do like SWorrall does and try to envision the lake without water.. this is a great tactic on the water as well...I also look at the stocking records of the lake and if possible try to get any helpful hints from guys I know that have or do fish it..try to figure out what the forage is too before heading there...are there ciscos? is it a sucker/panfish based lake? what are they eating...
Once at the lake I think the best thing to do is have your map in hand, in the boat and just drive around! go look at the humps, points, bays, where does the weed edge stop, is there deep sand grass anywhere etc..looking at your locator the whole time as we all know maps are usually off...look for boulders, hard/soft bottoms, weeds, baitfish, you name it...keep an eye on that locator...
mark the edges or tops of the humps with gps markers, the ends of points etc to come back on later..also, keep an eye out for cribs or other underwater structures...not alot of those are on maps..
also, when driving around and you mark weeds, I often take a big joe or bulldawg, drop it down and pull up the weeds to see what kinds they are...
and underwater camera can be good to look at rocky humps and points just to see the size of rocks etc down there...
I fished a lake this summer for the 1st time and did just that above...not fishing for I think well over the 1st hour just driving around and getting a "feel" for the lake...(Dan gets pretty antsy when I do this!) we had a great day/nite on a day most would have told us to not fish this particular lake with the conditions we had.... also, when driving around take the water out of the lake in your head..that really helps..
Before I make a cast I try to figure out what 3-6 spots I looked at while driving around stood out to me...those are what I want to go fish first...
my routine is pretty simple, and it seems to be effective as I have had good success learning lakes and catching fish just this way...
bnelson
Edited by MSKY HNR 1/17/2007 1:57 PM
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| Seeing the lake's features in 3 dimensions (structures, edges), picturing how the water is moving over and around those features (currents), looking for signs of the food chain (bugs, minnows, birds), then figuring out where they all meet is my process for "reading the water".
DW |
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Posts: 305
Location: Illinois | Like others, I study a map... like Rain Man, daydreaming. Then, I go on line and learn general data about the lake. I might even look at how many resorts. Nothing like a cool property and sometimes those resorts have braggin'boards that may give you a little info. Sometimes very specific info. I might even call a resort owner and ask some musky questions before I book his place. I hit the fishing reports on various sites/local guides, bait shops. I launch in the area of the lake that has the most spots nearby that I want to hit. I hit the spot nearest me and work it very quickly. If I can I will troll to the next spot and really snake pattern to learn bottom features. If there is midlake structure nearby I will troll around that. I will work every spot quickly, but I will throw a bunch of different lures. Mostly, I will be looking for weeds/ rocks, timber.
Generally, I have found the countours of maps more accurate (although not completely), than the density of weeds or timber indicated. For weeds you have to search out the best locations as even on lakes you know weeds tend to change from year to year. You know, I hardly ever catch fish on my first day on a new lake. I don't fish as much and I think my partners get antsy because we've been chomping at the bit to fish. I think in the long run I learn more about the lake and set myself up for better opportunities the next day. On day two I will slow down and fish. If I had to connect in one day I would still fish fast, but I will fish hard and not look around much. |
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