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Muskie Fishing -> Lures,Tackle, and Equipment -> Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless
 
Message Subject: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless
Muskie101
Posted 6/8/2023 4:56 PM (#1021479 - in reply to #1021367)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 150


Location: Rochester, New York
But besides all these is the weedless daredevle actually weedless or does it make no difference like some weed guards
RJ_692
Posted 6/9/2023 8:27 AM (#1021488 - in reply to #1021367)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 357


another one to take a look at is the Northland Jawbreaker spoon. It was designed to fish through and over rice beds. We use bass fishing but have caught lots of pikes on them
Muskie101
Posted 6/9/2023 8:30 AM (#1021489 - in reply to #1021488)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 150


Location: Rochester, New York
RJ_692 - 6/9/2023 9:27 AM

another one to take a look at is the Northland Jawbreaker spoon. It was designed to fish through and over rice beds. We use bass fishing but have caught lots of pikes on them


Looks promising
chuckski
Posted 6/9/2023 9:59 AM (#1021495 - in reply to #1021367)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 1242


The Bass guy's use hollow plastic spoon called a Moss Boss. I have one somewhere in all my stuff, the rubber skirt got rotten and fell off. So I never used it.
chuckski
Posted 6/9/2023 2:20 PM (#1021503 - in reply to #1021367)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 1242


I took a few Spoons over to a little pond in my town to check them out.
I tried out my new Rapala Spoon it's 5" long has rattles and two treble hooks, at first I didn't like the action, but if you reel it real slow it has a wide action with almost a hesitation. WOW His should be a good cool water bait or good bait for large Muskies in Wisconsin since they seem to like slow moving lures.
I have a bunch of old Rapala Spoons and Johnson Silver Minnows, the Johnsons have caught many large fish.
The old Rapala Spoons have no rattles (besides the new big Rapala Spoon I got another and it had rattles and is a little longer and has a bigger hook. On the Johnsons all the bigger fish been caught on the second to the largest size.
On the daredevle I like the Troll Devel size.
Tip the Spoons with Porkrind, Twistertail or Bass skirt. To be the most weedless put the Twistertail on the hookgaurd of the Johnsons or Rapala (on the Daredevle the hookgaurd is not in line with the hook.) With the right tackle they go thru the weeds pretty good.
sworrall
Posted 6/13/2023 1:30 PM (#1021596 - in reply to #1021449)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless





Posts: 32827


Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
Muskie101 - 6/7/2023 8:47 PM

sworrall - 6/7/2023 4:31 PM

Did you have a grub twister on the lure and work it as described? Not just casting out and reeling in.


Yes i did


Then try it varying the speed, almost like using a jig. Don't just try it when you can't catch anything doing something else, start a few days using the tactic. Take it from an old jig fishing specialist, it does work.
North of 8
Posted 6/13/2023 5:13 PM (#1021606 - in reply to #1021596)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Interesting reading Steve's comments. Hadn't thought of it in years, but my late uncle back in the 60s would put a pork rind on a Silver minnow, toss it in the lilly pads and kind of bounce it back. The pork rind tail would really flutter on the fall. He did well with both bass and pike on that. As a young teen, I didn't have the patience. Besides, somebody had to row that darn boat! Don't know how it would do in thicker weeds, but in lilly pads, it was a winner.
chuckski
Posted 6/13/2023 5:45 PM (#1021607 - in reply to #1021367)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 1242


My dad caught our largest Wisconsin Muskie on the Silver Minnow, Pork Rind, and Lily Pad trick. I still have Muskie Strip in three colors and Bass Strip in three colors. I still catch Muskies, Northerns and Smallmouths on the Silver Minnow. (multiple colored Spoon too.
Muskie101
Posted 6/18/2023 7:50 AM (#1021724 - in reply to #1021367)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 150


Location: Rochester, New York
Alright so try 4" kalins grub or 2" berkley split tail with a weedless daredevle, rapala weedless spoon, or johnson silver minnow
In addition to silver minnow color also get fire tiger i know i did get the biggest ones the last time i bought them
Try fishing them as described erratically

For color weedless daredevle i read that copper was the best finish with the 16 red devlet color but since they dont make copper finish for the five of diamonds should i go with the nickel or brass finish

Also what color for the katlin grub and the berkley split tail

And any frogs or other topwater lure reccomendations
chuckski
Posted 6/18/2023 9:05 AM (#1021728 - in reply to #1021367)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 1242


Daredevle comes in a Copper with Orange stripe or Chartreuse stripe.
JSM only has three colors at R&H, but they had a copy of the JSM called a Willy. White is the best trailer and I'm a Porkrind guy
(it's a pain to use but has the best action and since it's a pain to use no one else uses it and the fish don't see it as much)
Silver and Gold has caught most the fish but do have a DQed Perch color but only in smaller sizes. I also use Spoon's with single hooks or Trebles too. Since they are smaller people think of Spoons as Pike lures.
Muskie101
Posted 6/18/2023 9:25 AM (#1021731 - in reply to #1021728)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 150


Location: Rochester, New York
chuckski - 6/18/2023 10:05 AM

Daredevle comes in a Copper with Orange stripe or Chartreuse stripe.
JSM only has three colors at R&H, but they had a copy of the JSM called a Willy. White is the best trailer and I'm a Porkrind guy
(it's a pain to use but has the best action and since it's a pain to use no one else uses it and the fish don't see it as much)
Silver and Gold has caught most the fish but do have a DQed Perch color but only in smaller sizes. I also use Spoon's with single hooks or Trebles too. Since they are smaller people think of Spoons as Pike lures.



So for the copper daredevle should i get the orange or chartreuse stripe which is surprising as i reading that the copper red and white stripe was the best but to use a five of diamonds in muddy water but they dont make copper finish for it so thats new

What does jsm and r&h stand for
chuckski
Posted 6/18/2023 11:49 AM (#1021732 - in reply to #1021367)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 1242


JSM= Johnson Silver Minnow R& H = Rollie & Helens with is the Musky Shop Minocqua Wisconsin tackle shop and on line catalog. Not weedless Little Cleo in Copper is a Pike Killer. And many of my friends kill em on the five of Diamonds. and I do have a Johnson's minnow in Five of Diamonds.
Muskie101
Posted 6/18/2023 12:01 PM (#1021733 - in reply to #1021732)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 150


Location: Rochester, New York
chuckski - 6/18/2023 12:49 PM

JSM= Johnson Silver Minnow R& H = Rollie & Helens with is the Musky Shop Minocqua Wisconsin tackle shop and on line catalog. Not weedless Little Cleo in Copper is a Pike Killer. And many of my friends kill em on the five of Diamonds. and I do have a Johnson's minnow in Five of Diamonds.


Johnson Silver Minnow or eppinger Daredevle weedless 5 of diamonds work better

If eppinger dardevle 5 of diamonds brass or nickel finish those are the only options they offer for five of diamonds

And daredevle vs copper little cleo for pike overall

And johnson vs willy spoon overall for the johnson they offer more colors now
Muskie101
Posted 6/18/2023 2:39 PM (#1021735 - in reply to #1021367)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 150


Location: Rochester, New York
Also what porkrind should i get there is forked tail, pork frogs,big pork frogs ect
chuckski
Posted 6/18/2023 5:25 PM (#1021736 - in reply to #1021367)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 1242


I don't think you can get a five of Diamonds in the Johnson's Spoon (I'm a older guy so lot of the colors I have are off the market) I don't own a Five Of Diamonds in the Daredevle. Pike love Little Cleo's, these are not weedless Spoons.
On the Porkrind I use the strips that are forked. I've never used the Porkfrog ( I hear it changes the action and keeps higher in the water column) this way be what you want.
Muskie101
Posted 6/18/2023 5:41 PM (#1021737 - in reply to #1021736)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 150


Location: Rochester, New York
chuckski - 6/18/2023 6:25 PM

I don't think you can get a five of Diamonds in the Johnson's Spoon (I'm a older guy so lot of the colors I have are off the market) I don't own a Five Of Diamonds in the Daredevle. Pike love Little Cleo's, these are not weedless Spoons.
On the Porkrind I use the strips that are forked. I've never used the Porkfrog ( I hear it changes the action and keeps higher in the water column) this way be what you want.


They do make it now

By little Cleo do you mean the original in copper or one of the other models

for buying myself a weedless dardevle should i go with a brass or nickel finish

with the porkrind do I have to put it back in the jar like a gulp minnow
Muskie101
Posted 6/18/2023 5:42 PM (#1021738 - in reply to #1021736)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 150


Location: Rochester, New York
chuckski - 6/18/2023 6:25 PM

I don't think you can get a five of Diamonds in the Johnson's Spoon (I'm a older guy so lot of the colors I have are off the market) I don't own a Five Of Diamonds in the Daredevle. Pike love Little Cleo's, these are not weedless Spoons.
On the Porkrind I use the strips that are forked. I've never used the Porkfrog ( I hear it changes the action and keeps higher in the water column) this way be what you want.


They do make it now

By little Cleo do you mean the original in copper or one of the other models

for buying myself a weedless dardevle should i go with a brass or nickel finish

with the porkrind do I have to put it back in the jar like a gulp minnow

And between the silver minnow and dardevle 5 of diamonds I will test what performs better with a buddy


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chuckski
Posted 6/19/2023 9:03 AM (#1021746 - in reply to #1021367)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 1242


The Porkrind has to go back in the jar. (the jar is full of water) We keep a coffee can with water for ease of use. This is one reason people like cullytails ,no one uses Porkrind anymore. It will dry out and and you will have a stiff piece of Beefjerky on your lure. The Porkrind has three slits where you thread it on your hook. To take it off pull on the Porkrind to enlarge the hole in the Porkrind, then pull it off over your barb. And after repeated uses the hole in the porkrind gets bigger and bigger and it will fly off your lure when you cast. Now you see with the superior action of the Porkrind you also see bad points (beef jerky/ holes) why folks don't mess with it. I'm going add a snap and small O rind on mine and use a piece of plastic worm to hold it in place for ease of use. You can use a single piece of Rind on the end of your Bucktail too (snap it on the last loop of your Bucktail wire) or if you thread it on the hook itself put in on two trebles so your Bucktail doesn't spin in circles. (the whole lure will spin not just your blade) On the plus side you can catch a million Northerns and your Porkrind will be in one piece and going strong.
Muskie101
Posted 6/19/2023 10:01 AM (#1021749 - in reply to #1021746)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 150


Location: Rochester, New York
chuckski - 6/19/2023 10:03 AM

The Porkrind has to go back in the jar. (the jar is full of water) We keep a coffee can with water for ease of use. This is one reason people like cullytails ,no one uses Porkrind anymore. It will dry out and and you will have a stiff piece of Beefjerky on your lure. The Porkrind has three slits where you thread it on your hook. To take it off pull on the Porkrind to enlarge the hole in the Porkrind, then pull it off over your barb. And after repeated uses the hole in the porkrind gets bigger and bigger and it will fly off your lure when you cast. Now you see with the superior action of the Porkrind you also see bad points (beef jerky/ holes) why folks don't mess with it. I'm going add a snap and small O rind on mine and use a piece of plastic worm to hold it in place for ease of use. You can use a single piece of Rind on the end of your Bucktail too (snap it on the last loop of your Bucktail wire) or if you thread it on the hook itself put in on two trebles so your Bucktail doesn't spin in circles. (the whole lure will spin not just your blade) On the plus side you can catch a million Northerns and your Porkrind will be in one piece and going strong.


Ok thank you Guess i should make color choice in another post
sworrall
Posted 6/19/2023 12:56 PM (#1021753 - in reply to #1021367)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless





Posts: 32827


Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
There are literally dozens of variables why one bait outperforms another on any given day. Some days one wins, other days the other. Try to figure out why by looking at speed of retrieve, length of cast, and more importantly, placement, how the bait is being worked, leader material and weight, line #test and material, boat side technique, weather conditions, and more. If I'm getting outfished, it's usually one or more of those variables.
chuckski
Posted 6/19/2023 1:59 PM (#1021755 - in reply to #1021367)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 1242


Size, depth, and speed trump color. Yes you can play with color, but a lot of times it's where you throw VS what you throw.
Muskie101
Posted 6/19/2023 2:45 PM (#1021756 - in reply to #1021753)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 150


Location: Rochester, New York
sworrall - 6/19/2023 1:56 PM

There are literally dozens of variables why one bait outperforms another on any given day. Some days one wins, other days the other. Try to figure out why by looking at speed of retrieve, length of cast, and more importantly, placement, how the bait is being worked, leader material and weight, line #test and material, boat side technique, weather conditions, and more. If I'm getting outfished, it's usually one or more of those variables.


Lure, how its being fished and location are what matter line and leader lb test dont matter as much

Yes but there almost always is a color that does the best overall

with the dardevle it being red and white and five of diamonds

For the gary yamamoto senko green pumpkin blk flk is the best

When fly fishing they say size 8 olive wooly bugger ect


And thats what I was looking to start with on top of that I have other restrictions right now so i could only go with one at the moment
Muskie101
Posted 6/19/2023 3:07 PM (#1021757 - in reply to #1021755)
Subject: Re: Weedless daredevle/making a spoon weedless




Posts: 150


Location: Rochester, New York
chuckski - 6/19/2023 2:59 PM

Size, depth, and speed trump color. Yes you can play with color, but a lot of times it's where you throw VS what you throw.


Agree in most circumstances but this place I am fishing there is no distinctive structure as fountains are turned off on weekends
(Before you ask why I bother fishing there despite getting maybe 4-6' deep max i have seen monsters in there and have pulled a coupler 28" out of there)

Id say color can make all the difference between catching 3 fish or 9 fish or 1 fish and getting skunked on those days where its tough which is why I look for and in places where you don't know much and the fish are weird
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