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Posts: 58
| How's it going? New member from PA, caught my first musky last summer. A 45 in. beast, don't bother w any other species anymore, guess I've got the sickness. Don't no of alot of guys from my area that hunt these monsters, so nobody understands my enthusiasm when I talk about it. Hoping to learn alot , and its good to no there's more like me out there. Looking forward to talkin!!!! |
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Posts: 8781
| Run! Before it's too late!!!  |
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| Welcome. What part of PA are you from? |
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Posts: 58
| Im from Southern York co. PA, about 10 min. from the MD line, I fish the Susquehanna river. Looking to catch sum deep water musky. Any tips would be greatly appreciated. |
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Posts: 86
Location: colorado | I got bite recently myself. Tigers are all we have here in colorado but their bite is just as bad. This site has taught me so much. it is nice to know im not alone... |
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Posts: 661
Location: Sussex, NJ | You'll learn a lot from here. I just a couple months ago and put my time in on this site. Already boated a couple muskie this year and a lot of it is due to the guys on this site. They're the best there is. |
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Location: Northern IL | 32, when you say deep water how deep are we talking? |
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Location: APPLETON, WI | Welcome to the non-stop addiction. |
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Posts: 58
| Were talkin anywhere from, 20 to 50 ft, do musky hang as deep as 50ft or is it prob. Just big cattys? |
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Posts: 688
Location: Northern IL | 20-50'...? Don't say that too loudly, ha ha!
For just getting started your not only off to a great start but you're asking a very good question!
A question that not many think about. I'd say 95% of fishermen I see, excluding the walleye, great lakes and trout guys never fish deeper than 15'. Nothing wrong with casting the bank all year if that's where the fish are, but you better get use to a lot of fishless days if that's your path.
Remember one thing if nothing else, the fish, "all fish" are in the "Lake", maybe shallow, they maybe deep, how deep? And how deep can we catch em? There's probably been a thread on who's caught the deepest somewhere on this site. Let's just say, they're not always or hardly ever in the shallows (8'-10') or less.
A muskies average sanctuary depth, where he spends the greatest part of his life is, 45'-55', depending on water clarity, the clearer the water the deeper he'll be.
The problem with fishing in sanctuary
depths, and I'm sure you'll here a few more, is our timing has got to be just right, meaning when the weather and or water condition put fish down stairs they can very dormant and non chasing. 20' and plus, no problem, very catchable!
Hope you have a good year!
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| A muskies average sanctuary depth, where he spends the greatest part of his life is, 45'-55', depending on water clarity, the clearer the water the deeper he'll be.
Although I've never heard the term "sanctuary depth" I'm going to assume that's the place they like hang out most of the time. If so, 45-55'... Really? Could you cite your source, please? That would fly in the face of conventional wisdom and scientific knowledge of the species. |
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Posts: 143
Location: La Crosse, WI | Welcome aboard Susky. I don't have as much information on fishing muskies deep as some of the other members on here so hopefully some of them can chime in as well.
However, I do know a couple things:
The topic was brought up pretty recently and most people agreed that catching muskies any deeper than 25 ft was dangerous to the fish. The swim bladder expands from the difference in pressure and the fish have difficulty being able to swim upright. Something to keep in mind.
Also, depending on where you fish, whether it be a river or a lake, small or shallow, the lake might go into stratification. This stratification will determine how deep muskies can and will go on a particular body of water. Trying searching stratification and read a little bit more about it, it really changed the way I fish and how I view a lake. Really is interesting and something I had never heard about until recently |
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Posts: 540
Location: MN | BillNye - 3/14/2012 3:55 PM
A muskies average sanctuary depth, where he spends the greatest part of his life is, 45'-55', depending on water clarity, the clearer the water the deeper he'll be.
Although I've never heard the term "sanctuary depth" I'm going to assume that's the place they like hang out most of the time. If so, 45-55'... Really? Could you cite your source, please? That would fly in the face of conventional wisdom and scientific knowledge of the species.
How dare you question the great bafoonpluger Jerry B! |
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Location: Northern IL | Thanks for your question Bill,,, real alias? Either way, I'd be happy to answer it, but first please tell us when the fish are NOT up and active in the shallows where does "conventional wisdom and scientific knowledge of the species" or even better where have YOU found them?
Also, on an average fishing day how many hours does conventional wisdom and scientific knowledge of the species spend fishing in deep water, 20'?, 30'? ect?
You get the point CW & S is in many areas put forth by fishermen with an agenda (sales) or preconceived ideas, ole wives tales handed down from generation to generation.
This term "sanctuary depth" when explaining where a fish spends the greater part of his adult life was first discovered, used and coined more than 70 years ago, by Elwood "Buck" Perry, nothing new. Here is a link to a blog recently written by Ron Lindner, if you are skeptical of this source. You should come away being skeptical of "cw" after reading this.
http://www.fishhound.com/blog/opening-salvo-chicago-57
Tracking studies,,, hmmm, they often loose site of the fish after a cold front don't they? Not able to relocate sometimes for days. Why is that? Is it because the equipment has a limited in depth range? The only place a fish can go to get away from a hostel ever changing environment "if available", is deep water. In Fla where deep water is often not available the bass have been known to bury themselves in the muck, the term black bass, check with cw& s to verify.
Let's understand one thing we're talking in generalities, "Where he spends most of his time during his "entire life", not necessarily the entire fishing season.
"Conventional wisdom"? NOT so much!
Good luck
Edited by jerryb 3/14/2012 6:53 PM
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Posts: 540
Location: MN | Let's understand one thing we're talking in generalities, "Where he spends most of his time during his "entire life", not necessarily the entire fishing season.
Jerry what dose it matter if you can't fish for them? |
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Location: Ontario | Its all relative, based on what a fish has in greatest abundance, in terms of water depth options. Big difference between a pond measured in acres where the 'holes' are fifteen feet deep and a Great Lakes environ where structures are measured in acres and fish are surrounded by water 60-200+ feet deep. A fish that spawns, feeds and rests surrounded by the option of 60+ fow will be comforatable and used to being in and around these depths. A fish from a shallow pond is surrounded bt 6fow and slop and will likley be comfortable and used to operating in these types of areas. I'm of the opinion that huge fish in big water settings may never see the need to live shallower than 20-50feet. The golden years of successful spawning are probably past, and they'll be where the trout, smelts, whitefish, alewives etc are. They're in shallow water for very brief periods if at all, much more of a deep/suspended lifestyle. People spend next to no time in these areas, so its probably not a coincidence that productivity is low. The ethic of not taking fish out of deep water no doubt adds to this. I agree with Jerry 100%. If everyone was forced to spend a full season or two fishing over a minimum of forty feet of water targeting these zones, the results might be terrifying. Probably 80% of guys pound weeds, shoals, shorelines, visible spots in less than twenty feet of water. Its probably not a huge stretch to assume that this is why people beleive they can't get over seventy pounds. Look at a map and graph some of the forage and spawning areas on big water and the possibilty of giant fish that never see a lure to me seems at least plausible. Zero science or sources, just an educated idea. Fifteen years ago if you told people that Jon Bondy would be jigging channels etc in 18-30fow with a hunk of rubber nowhere near weedbeds or shorelines, they would think he was nuts. A new frontier. Fishing in those 40-60foot 'sanctuary depths' Jerry's talking about might well be the same thing. Any fish hanging out in no man's land is just as likely to hit in my experience with pike, lake trout, walleye, rainbows etc. Being away from traditional, shallow structure may make a fish harder to locate, but no harder to make bite, in my experience. It's long been my theory that the record will likley fall on a Great Lakes spot by a guy trolling a five inch crankbait for walleyes over 40-100fow very late in the year. Accidental at that time, but far from a fluke. Who knows lol? |
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| Santuary was a rather disturbing book by Faulkner. Read it and you'll never puff on a corn cob pipe again.
But in this context what you describe of santuary seems to me to be fishing open deeper water using the thermocline as the structure. Pods of baitfish wander around at and above the thermocline and predator fish follow that food like lazy wolves. Find the baitfish and pick off, hopefully, the wolves in the area. |
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| Jerry,
Buck Perry coined the term in a general context, did he not? Referring to a type of "habitat", if you will, that fish - all of them, not just muskies - spend their time. To me, such a general statement holds little merit. I will concede that muskies probably spend a fair amount of time in deep water. More than 50% of the time? In my opinion, most likely not. However, in a system where a narrow littoral zone is present then perhaps they do spend the majority of their time in "deep" water. Like JBush pointed out, if 75% of the available depth is 20'+ then yeah they will probably be spending a lot of time in water over 20', particularly with little vegetation to give them cover to forage and ambush in. If I'm on a system that has lots of weeds and shallow structure, you're going to find me shallow. It's as simple as understanding their biology and predatory behavior as sit-and-wait predators. If I'm on a body of water with mostly deep water, clear water, and a narrow littoral zone... you'll still probably find me in shallow water because to me it's more fun to fish, but I will look to deeper water more often and will fish deeper water if I've determined the fish are not shallow.
I also think there's tremendous amount of individual variation; muskies are as unique, from a personality standpoint, as people are.
Furthermore, I take issue with the term "sanctuary" and would argue Buck about it if he were alive. The definition of sanctuary is "a place of refuge or safety" suggesting safety from some adverse stressor. A fish spending the majority of its life stressed out, ergo in a sanctuary, is not a very healthy fish and if the species as a whole lived in "sanctuaries" most of their lives then natural selection should select AGAINST those fish. A stressed fish is a weak fish (immune response declines) and weak fish are not long for this world.
Clearly I nor anyone else is going to sway your opinion and, frankly, you probably won't sway mine, particularly when your only argument is that Buck Perry said so.
Maybe we can agree to disagree... |
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Posts: 2753
Location: Mauston, Wisconsin | Welcome, susky musky 32. The number one rule is ->Have fun! It's not unusual to see forum threads hijacked like this, its a normal thing for some guys. Learn to sort between the BS & the real world, most members @ MF are willing to share and will not hide behind "guest" or pseudo names like "BillNye".
Muskies can hang anywhere, and at any depth where sufficient oxygen is present, a 48" fish @ 100ft is only ~ 25 body length's away from the surface. It's not rocket science.
Connect with local muskie guys, listen carefully & enjoy the chase.
Have fun!
Al |
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Posts: 58
| Thanx for all the info. fellas, wearher in PA has been great and im headin out this wknd. Feelin al lil more knowledgeable about whats goin on, thanx for takin the time to respond. Ill let yall no how i fair. Thanx again!!!! This site is awesome!!! |
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