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Posts: 221
Location: Detroint Lakes, MN | I certainly don't consider pressured fish a problem, meaning I'm not in this discussion to complain about pressure.
To me the observations about fish behavior is more about how I approach my fishing and where I decide to fish.
To my knowledge there hasn't been a "scientific" study about muskies and the unique behavior of chasing lures to the boat in regards to pressure, or number of times being hooked in regards to how they may or not react.
I guess that's why we are discussing this subject now.
All I know is many of the most experienced fishermen in MN (meaning guys who have been chucking lures on MN waters before the stocked lakes came about, including MN biologist in know) are sharing the same thoughts.
Again, it's been fun.
Agree to disagree I guess??
JS |
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Posts: 32944
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Plenty of old anglers who have experienced stocked lakes from zero muskies to good to excellent populations and even worse, to over population and decline and over harvest beyond what you folks in MN can imagine. Some of us spent 20 years exploring waters that were rumored...just rumored... to have truly big fish in numbers in the US and Canada. Some did, some didn't. Experience with new stocked waters isn't limited to MN, but you knew that already.
Plenty of information about fish learning/conditioning/etc in the literature. Lots. Plenty of opinions from the geneticists to area fish managers to the most renowned muskie experts on the planet. They don't all always agree. I have no problem asking them the same questions, and questioning the answers until those answers make sense based on the realities of the capacity of the fish to learn/remember/etc. according to those same folks.
I think lambeau nailed it. I have no problem fishing 'pressured' fish. I kinda like it. Presents a challenge that is unique to every lake and river.
I'm not sure any one who holds an opposing viewpoint should agree to disagree...that's a cop out that stifles thinking beyond just reading what a few are willing to publish RE: their thoughts on the matter. But that's me.
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| One last post on this from me and then I guess I'll just have to think on this for a week or more, in the boat (going fishing!)...
Back to my initial post - Bob Strand and Co. out of the Bemidji office may have never realized where this stocking program in MN was headed. I guess I'll ask him next time I see him... My guess is that they never guessed how good it would get. The spirit of the program was to provide greater angling opportunity (succeeded), improve population in a few lakes that historically had muskies and numbers had decreased (succeeded) and provide a few brood-stock lakes to gain eggs/spawn more readily from (succeeded).
1. The fishing range was increased from 44 "historic" bodies of water to more than 90 (there are lakes that have muskies other than those who were initially stocked via rivers/creeks).
2. The number of fish caught and the number of large fish caught increased substantially in the state. I am aware of a handful of fifty pound-plus fish being taken/found prior to this stocking program, in MN. The state record fish, two fifty-plus pounders out of Inguadona (both speared-I have pics of one of them), a dead fish found by CO Everett Jeske on Big Boy in the 70's (50-some pounds and partially decayed/diminished from racoons eating some of the internal organs) the 51 lb 1 ounce fish out of Leech and several other less substantiated/confirmed fish speared or taken in other questionable manners.
In the last few years, a fair number of fifty pound plus fish have been caught and primarily released. A huge success.
Too bad all government agency programs aren't this successful! Good job/kudos to those hard working folks (who were also avid anglers) who started this program.
Dan Craven |
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Posts: 123
| Fishing pressure has increased on many muskie lakes because of more anglers getting into the sport, which may have accounted for muskies becoming more boat shy, conditioned, etc. There are still guys who have been catching the same numbers of fish, if not more, while other guys are seeing their numbers dropping on the same waters. Why?, because they've learned to adapt their tactics to the conditions at hand. I know guys who catch fish wherever they go because they do this very well, pressured lakes or not. On one lake there were guys who used to throw a certain lure 90% of the time they were out there, and now they throw that same bait on that lake probably 5% of the time. I don't think it's because there's newer baits out there as much as it's because the bait isn't as effective as it was earlier because the fish have seen it so much. I'll bet people 2 years from now or even 30 years from now will still be catching fish on double 10s, but I bet they'll be baits more effective to come along. I know of guys who caught 3-6 fish a day on Bulldawgs for a while, but they don't now. I think the fish are still there, but want to see something else.
I caught 52 bass one day using spinnerbaits, and a week later on the same lake caught 14. Maybe I'd have caught more had I used a Rattletrap or Zara Spook? The fish were still there. ::
I think fish become conditioned to baits more than they become boat shy, you just have to use a different tactic to catch them. If it's slow during the day fish at night, if they're ignoring the Weagle try a Rad Dog, etc. Pressured fish can still be caught in my opinion. Good fishing. |
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Posts: 221
Location: Detroint Lakes, MN |
Agreeing to disagree is a copout??
Fail to see that. When neither side can provide proof of thoughts, than you either agree to disagree or you argue forever.
There has never been a muskie specific study done to prove or dismiss the thoughts on either side here, so it's a matter of opinion with some truths sneaking in from both sides I would guess.
JS |
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Posts: 32944
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | It's the truths soaking in from all sides that are the value here. No one 'wins' a discussion like this, and no one should. This is great thread for those who are interested in fish behavior. Lens Creep, agreed. |
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| sworrall - 7/28/2010 8:41 AM
It's the truths soaking in from all sides that are the value here. No one 'wins' a discussion like this, and no one should. This is great thread for those who are interested in fish behavior. Lens Creep, agreed.
Very True! It was reassuring for me to see that others have come to the same conclusions I have, however right or wrong they may be, but at least I am not the only one experiencing the dramatic shift on the lakes I have the most experience on.
Looks like my youngest son needs some new musky baits, maybe that will get them to go, because the stuff in my box now, which "belongs" to me and my 2 oldest boys, does not seem to work. LOL |
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