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| i have been running a tuffy 1760gt tiller boat for the past year,great boat.as most tiller guys know you spend alot of time looking "across" the boat at your electronics instead of looking forward where you are headed to.this can make for tough navigating in rough hazard strewn water,trying to look out for underwater rocks and size up the next wave,ect.i solved part of my problem by mounting my gps/sonar on a butt seat pole about 20 inches in front of the drivers seat.it puts my lowrance 111hd right in front of me where i can see it and operate it easily without having to "look away".it is also low enough as to not to obstruct my sight line.after using it several times i started thinking how nice it would be to have a COMPACT console built in to the boat[s] by the manufacturer.[i thought of it when i noticed how weird my 111 looks mounted on a pole!]my boat only runs 40 but some of the bigger tillers would be way safer with their equipment located in a "dash board" type of configuration,i'd think.the top could execpt the radio,sonar or whatever device while the lower part could have the tach,trim,fuel,voltage,ect gauges mounted right there in front of the driver just like in a wheel boat.possibly the back or front side of the console could have some type of storage.there could even by a windshield configured to protect our tender faces in nasty weather.[especially at 60 mph!]it seems like a simple idea to me and i would think it would make tiller boating safer and more enjoyable in less than ideal conditions.i know that it would be nearly impossible to retrofit a boat due to wire issues ect but it could be built into new hulls.[i know,it will cost more]any thoughts out there?
rudy |
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| so what is the advantage of having a tiller / console you describe over just buying a single console boat? |
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Posts: 131
| boat control and more floor space.when trolling wing dams,reefs or shorelines a console just doesn't have the control i need to fish these structures effectively.i know,there have been zillions of fish caught with wheel boats but i prefer a tiller, that's just me.i don't want to start an argument over which is better tiller or wheel it's just that there are alot of us who prefer to fish a tiller and this seems like a good idea to me. |
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| I think Ranger at one time had a tiller with a console right in front of the driver on the right side...or maybe it was triton, i'm sure i have seen a boat with it though.
I agree that looking to the side is one reason I wouldn't buy a tiller |
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| Ranger had it. I imagine it got in the way vs. the wide open layout most tiller guys are used to. Maybe it would be easy to build one on your own? |
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Posts: 2323
Location: Stevens Point, WI | Lund has had this option on the 2025 Pro-V for some time. I think boat manufactures don't offer this do to the extra cost and most don't buy a tiller to have a console in the way. People buy tillers for two main reason, room and boat control. So if most buy tillers for the room and boat control, why would someone want a tiller with a console? I personally think most manufactures don't offer this because the demand isn't there.
Lund 2025 Pro-V tiller with console:
http://www.lundboats.com/tournamentseries_2009.html
Edited by Merckid 11/24/2008 3:26 PM
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Posts: 388
| I have a single sonar and have it mounted on the casting deck up front just behind the nose cone. The front deck is where I do most of my fishing and when I am running the boat I can make quick checks of the depth by simply looking down slightly from the front of the boat. As long as the digital readout is large enough for you to see (can adjust this on your sonar display options) as well as the trend of where the depth is going, i think you might find this a better alternative to looking off to the side. Only thing you need to consider is where your passengers are seated and if they are in your way of viewing the sonar.
I have to quallify my suggestion with the fact that I run a console, but thought this was a better alternative to looking down at my console dash when I can keep my eyes forward while driving the boat. Also eliminates the need for me to run two separate sonar units because the display is up where I fish.
Pete |
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Location: Stevens Point, WI | lambeau - 11/24/2008 4:37 PM
So if most buy tillers for the room and boat control, why would someone want a tiller with a console?
well, apparently at least rudy would like to run his electronics without looking/reaching across the back of the boat...
having run tiller, console, and windshield boats, i liked the boat control aspect of the tiller especially when trolling. however, in october and november i really really like having a console to "hide" behind from the wind and weather. best of both worlds with a tiller control console boat...
I personally think most manufactures don't offer this because the demand isn't there.
sometimes making something creates a demand for something consumers didn't even realize was possible.
a Tuffy X-190 tiller boat with power assist "remote" steering to allow a 150hp motor plus a console to sit behind at 45mph? cat's ass.
So if most buy tillers for the room and boat control, why would someone want a tiller with a console?
Your taking what I said to literally.
Key word here, most. Asking the question why would someone want a tiller with a console? In other words, those that would prefer this boat are far and few between, hence why you don't see many. I think I've seen 2-3 of these Lunds on the walleye tournament circuits. These boats are special orders for a dealer, carrying a $50,000+ rig that probably won't sell as easily as a regular tiller or console is probably not a good bet for dealers, especially in the economy at this current time.
sometimes making something creates a demand for something consumers didn't even realize was possible.
If the demand was there, boat manufactures would be building these types of rigs. Perhaps, the demand wasn't there in the past, hence maybe why consumers don't see this option available by boat manufactures?
Edited by Merckid 11/24/2008 5:17 PM
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| If the demand was there, boat manufactures would be building these types of rigs. Perhaps, the demand wasn't there in the past, hence maybe why consumers don't see this option available by boat manufactures?
yep, you're exactly right in a typical manufacturers-are-always-right kind of way.
no demand means that the same-old companies make the same-old boats. it's sort of a very "safe" way to approach business; just responding to market demands means that you're always selling something you know people already want.
the companies that steer the market are the ones that INNOVATE, which is taking a new idea and creating something that people aren't aware of yet.
the companies that take these kinds of risks drive the market in certain directions when they get it right. (when they get it wrong the product disappears.)
before Musky Innovations came out with the bulldawg, there was essentially no demand for this kind of soft plastic swimbait. now it dominates the market.
before Musky Mayhem came out with the Cowgirl, there was essentially no demand for double-bladed bucktails of that size. now? beyond huge.
if those companies had simply made the "safe" bait that consumers already wanted, we wouldn't be catching as many big fish.
a tiller boat with a console is an innovation; yes, it's likely to have limited demand since the tiller slice of the market is already relatively small. however, a company that makes it and advertises it just might sell a couple boats that would have gone to a different brand instead. the market's tight enough that a couple boats here and there definitely matters, especially for the smaller regional builders.
it would be nice to see more innovation in all sectors of the market. unfortunately, you're also right that recent sharp declines in sales could definitely limit the chances that we'll see many "risks" taken by boat companies who may be hesitant to pour money into developing new designs for small market slices.
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Location: Stevens Point, WI | lambeau - 11/24/2008 7:27 PM
yep, you're exactly right in a typical manufacturers-are-always-right kind of way.
no demand means that the same-old companies make the same-old boats. it's sort of a very "safe" way to approach business; just responding to market demands means that you're always selling something you know people already want.
the companies that steer the market are the ones that INNOVATE, which is taking a new idea and creating something that people aren't aware of yet.
the companies that take these kinds of risks drive the market in certain directions when they get it right. (when they get it wrong the product disappears.)
before Musky Innovations came out with the bulldawg, there was essentially no demand for this kind of soft plastic swimbait. now it dominates the market.
before Musky Mayhem came out with the Cowgirl, there was essentially no demand for double-bladed bucktails of that size. now? beyond huge.
if those companies had simply made the "safe" bait that consumers already wanted, we wouldn't be catching as many big fish.
a tiller boat with a console is an innovation; yes, it's likely to have limited demand since the tiller slice of the market is already relatively small. however, a company that makes it and advertises it just might sell a couple boats that would have gone to a different brand instead. the market's tight enough that a couple boats here and there definitely matters, especially for the smaller regional builders.
it would be nice to see more innovation in all sectors of the market. unfortunately, you're also right that recent sharp declines in sales could definitely limit the chances that we'll see many "risks" taken by boat companies who may be hesitant to pour money into developing new designs for small market slices.
Trying to sell to a market that from the sounds of it, manufactures have already dabbled in previous years is basically asking for bankruptcy at this point in time imho. This side console on tillers is not a new innovation, it's just an old concept that really basically never took. Supposedly Ranger has used this concept before, Lund has at least one model in production and willing to build upon request but you expect other companies to step to the plate in something that from what I can see on the water is not what consumers want? Be real here. Sure, some smaller more regional builders might be able to make a somewhat go at it, but if a boat like this requires new tooling or a new design in order to build wouldn't probably be worth the money put into the tooling. Tooling for boats costs A LOT.
The marine industry is in the worst shape it's EVER been. You've got Ranger who's letting more employees go and cutting more and more than ever before. You've got Brunswick doing god knows what with all there lines of boats, you've got the largest outboard motor company in the world cutting back what seems an every other week basis but think that by trying to RE-INNOVATE a product that didn't take before is a good idea?
Did you honestly just compare Musky Innovations with building boats? What? Are you kidding me? Your talking about boats, boats that cost thousands of dollars, your talking about a tackle company that sells baits for what, a maximum of $30-40? How can a company justify building a boat that didn't take before?
"An innovator or pioneer (pronounced /?p???'n??r/) in a general sense is a person or an organization who is one of the first to do something and often opens up a new area for others and achieves an innovation." That's an innovator.
You want an innovator, an innovator is a company like Lund. WalleyeFirst was at their 2009 Lund Boat Dealer conference in Red Wing this past September and got to see the whole 2009 Lund lineup. WalleyeFirst got exclusive video and images of an innovative product. They've got a new boat coming(actually a couple) out that has at least one feature like I've never seen before. The new 2075 Pro-V tiller has a new console setup that can be stowed and locked and adjusted like nothing ever before. Take a look at the new setup in the 2075, it's pretty cool!
http://walleye.outdoorsfirst.com/watch.asp?id=1139
I think if there are a select few that think this kind of boat is what they would like, they'd be better off looking to find an engineer or some kind of person who can make this side console custom. Not trying to sound pessimistic on your view of manufactures needing to innovate, but with the current market, and boat sales the way they currently are, don't see too much what I would call "high risk" moves like this. |
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Location: Ogden, Ut | I guess I would be one of those 'sliver share' of the market guys that would love to hide behind a small console in my tiller boat. I think innovation goes way beyond coming up w/ something new. It can also involve coming up w/ a new way to do an old thing better. Or less expensive. I know that I would be interested in a 'tiller boat' that has a small windbreak to hide behind - but NOT at $50K+. Innovation in my market share would involve bringing a modest fishing platform at a blue collar price to the dealer floor. Now, why not market a 17-18' boat that is a tiller, but has a small console that folds down into a slightly raised casting deck (like jump seats)? THAT would get me interested.
Or if they could turn a Bulldawg into a small console, or a cowgirl into a spare prop for the trolling motor....  |
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Location: The desert | sorenson - 11/25/2008 8:40 AM
Now, why not market a 17-18' boat that is a tiller, but has a small console that folds down into a slightly raised casting deck (like jump seats)? THAT would get me interested.
Only if it comes in World War I camo pattern. |
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Location: Milwaukee | I run a '87 Tuffy that was a console, I took the it out for the space, and to run a tiller. I built a small box out of marine plywood to hold the bilge, livewell and light switches. On top of that mounted the locator. It sits right on the sidewall where the console used to be. Out of the way, easy to see while driving, and for my netman to see while fishing on the back deck.
Sad to see the year end.....
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Posts: 131
| dewman-that's exactly what i was refering to.i think i'm going to build one using weather proof vinyl material.i won't have any gauges mounted,just the 111 but it will be a great addition to an awsome boat!gonna take it out today and see if i can put a hog walleye in it![yes,there are other fish than muskies!] |
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Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Tuffy offers a custom 'tiller console' option, and has for years. The last request was in 2001 or 2002, I think. Rudy, give me a call and I'll give you the details. Sorno, Tuffy makes a 1760 GT with that option, and it's under 50K. 
Tommy Mac ran one (Basically a 2060 ESOX DEEP V model) on Leech for years.
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