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| Steve Jonesi - 5/24/2006 9:40 AM
Mille Lacs last October.Post frontal, blue bird day.Fish follows and goes under the boat."Low 40's" is my reply.I continue to to an 8, and A fish comes out from under the boat on the 3rd pass and is right on the Slammer 10" Deep Minnow.Different fish though.Fish cuts the bait off on a turn and eats it by the head.53"X25".Fittante is doing the replica.More than 1/2 of my fish last season were on the 8, several from Mille Lacs.Ya never know.If I see the fish, I do a hard "L".Right/left turn Clyde.Get the bait close and a hard/fast direction change.I see a lot of "L"'s that become banannas.Too soft and rounded.Trigger them NOW!!!!!Just my 2 cents. Steve
But the question was do you figure 8 after every cast? ( you don't  ) neither does Doug Johnson, Bob M. and many other Great muskie fisherman ...if you are not paying attention to you lure blind 8 - if you saw a fish in the last few casts - blind 8 ...heck if your a beginner blind 8 it takes awhile to see shadows and flashes of fish. I would say over the last 5 years 25% of my fish have come on the 8 - it is my favorite way to catch them
PS ...IF YOUR FORGET YOUR POLORIZED SUNGLASSES>>>DO SOME BLIND 8's 
Edited by IAJustin 5/24/2006 12:56 PM
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Location: north central wisconsin | I do them after follows, when I think there was a follow, in high percentage areas, and after dark. otherwise waste of time for me and a big l or c gets the nod, very extended L. Now, to say that one should do them everywhere every cast is ridiculous. I am a river fisherman, and would miss so many spots and cast opportunities if I did a figure 8 after every cast on a river that fish rarely ever hit them. there are definately waters that the 8 is more effective too, and some that the 8 is useless most of the time. It is very lake/river specific for sure. |
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| IAJustin,
Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but it sounds like your saying "Bob M, Doug J, and most great muskie fishermen don't figure-8 unless absolutely necessary. So if you want to be like or learn to be as good a fishermen as them, then you shouldn't bother figure-8ing on every cast." If this is not what you mean then I'm sorry but need more explanation on what you're trying to get across. If that is what you mean, then my comment would be that you need to take a bigger perspective on these "Greats" and what they've done to get to the point of how they fish now and that it does not necessaraly apply to what most people out there should do. From my observation and knowledge, limited as it may be but to take Doug as an example since you've designated him as a reasoning to do things, he doesn't figure-8 anymore because he's seen and done about all there is to do on the Angle when it comes to muskies and he still wants to go out and catch muskies everyday, but would like to do it with as little as effort as he can get away with. Doug is a GREAT fisherman and has caught more fish than I could ever dream about, but day to day he's no longer pushing himself to maximize his efforts to take advantage of every opportunity. Why? Because his body won't really let him do it anymore, and he knows that well, the next day, all season long mind you, he'll get up and try it again. Most of the guys on this site do not have that possibility. Many of us have to take full advantage of the very limited time that we do have. There is also the perspective that, yes Doug doesn't put a lot of effort into follows especially blind one's, but he does work areas extremely slowly and methodically very often working back over spots multiple times. The effect is not much different than blind figure-8ing and giving cautious fish many opportunities to commit to your bait. His tactic might be different although still effective to the same goal, but if you don't look at the whole picture of how and why then you are not getting everything out of the priveledge to fish with these guys that you could be, in my opinion. Many people don't look past what they can directly see.
Fishwizard
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| what about 8's when night fishing? |
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| My point was simple: " You must figure 8 after every cast" to me and some others this is an overstatement!
Some waters, conditions, ect.. blind 8's have a place...no question...SOME DONT ......some guys that fish very clear water catch 50 fish a year and never boat ANY on an 8 much less a blind 8 - should they be doing blind 8's ?
Mr. Johnson is a Great fisherman but I have heard him say many times .....he believes BLIND 8's on lake of the woods are a waste of time...... I think this lake may be the best 8 lake in the world? (watched Mr. Johnson put two in the boat one day 3 or four years ago cause he SAW the fish coming) ...... Some weeks 80% of the fish in the boat are on 8's ..As for me having spent over 90 days on the water last year on LOTW and at least a week the last 5 years...I concur with Mr. Johnson always do an L be ready -if nothing is behind your bait ...throw another cast
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Location: Greenfield, WI | I have yet to catch a muskie while my bait was in the air, although one little guy did his best to change that claim, anything that keeps the bait in the water a little bit longer and takes mere seconds works for me. There are a million things that can go wrong in musky fishing, and that fish of a lifetime only comes once, so one little bit of "8", comma, "L', circle, or bait rise at the boat is worth the effort even if it means only one fish every once in a while.
Edited by Steve Van Lieshout 5/25/2006 6:51 AM
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Location: Eagan, MN | Just to piggyback on what Justin was saying, I've heard Doug Johnson say the same thing, he's tried blind figure eights a lot, and had a lot of clients who do them religiously, but he's never had a fish caught in his boat on a blind figure eight. It's not about working hard, he says the odds are just better with a new cast to a new a spot. Kind of put it in perspective for me. Here in the twin cities it's relatively easy to get follows, not real easy to convert them, and I ask myself do I really want to blind figure 8 for fish that are even lazier than the ones that show up on time? |
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Location: WESTERN WI | Figure Eights are standard protocol after every cast. I will admit after a long weekend they turn in to a large "L" or "C". I usually have trouble consistently figure 8ing "walk the dog" style baits. What are some techniques that have been succesful to end the retreive for "walk the dog" style baits? I have heard of pauses, diving 8, continue "walk dog" action around boat. Any other suggestions?
I did lose two 40"-45" fish last year due to failure to figure 8. I had the bait (bucktail) fouled with a large amount of weeds during the beginning of retreive. I sped up retreive and as soon as the blade left the water as I picked up bait to clean it a nice tiger swiped behind the bait actually grabbing the weeds and tearing them off the bait. Still haunts me sometimes. 2nd time was a fouled jackpot. A high speed retreive to get bait in and remove weeds was in order. As soon as the bait left water the fish went Airborne after the jackpot and weeds. Missed hooks unfortunately but not the side of the boat.
SO DO YOU FIGURE EIGHT FOULED/SEMI-FOULED BAITS? I would never have thought of doing prior to last year, but if the action of the bait is not severely impaired I still do one complete eight.
Edited by Got Esox? 5/25/2006 8:19 AM
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Location: WESTERN WI | To reinforce the 8's at night 3-4 after every retreive at night has been 1/2 of myfish at night the past 3 years. I beleive it gives the lethargic fish a chance to wake up and get a easy meal.
Edited by Got Esox? 5/25/2006 8:19 AM
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Location: Minneapolis | As you well know, DJS, I do NOT do a full 8 after every cast. I prefer to get in more casts and save my back and fig 8s for following fish. I do some sort of direction change at the boat after every cast, but only do a full 8 when I see a fish, it's night, or some other reason leads me to believe it may be worthwhile. And yes, I have caught fish on blind 8s, so I know it's not a total waste of time.
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Location: Wausau | Great points from guys who could figure 8 in their sleep...
For me the 8 is more of a mental challenge to help me be prepared when I do see a follow. Being ready to perform the 8 is important so you don't freak out when a big fish is at boat side.
PREPREATION!
Edited by agrimm 5/26/2006 1:56 PM
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| I suspect Mr. IAjustin-what-ever is a better stick than me. Much better. Regardless, while we're still young and our backs can manage the load, do yer 8's, mu-fu's. I doubt you'll regret it. I do fewer round-and-rounds than I used to, but still, never just an L, unless in clear water and less than 6' or so. If nothing else, have your big-wide turns down perfect come dark.
And I don't know why folks who talk nightime boatside fish on 8's don't also talk about drag settings. My boatside fish get a ways away by drag, and if necessary, I give 'em some more thumbed freespool, and then I bring them back. All 3-4 per year.
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| "IAJustin" I heard him say. I believe him. Check the fish he's holdin', that's real stuff.
Back to the original post and the question therein, "I can't think of a bigger waste of time."
You should maybe ask folks, "What amazing fish have you hooked on an 8 and what were the conditions?" and then assume relative waste of time. My suggestion is to sQwirell the waters until you feel confident to back down to the pace of IAJustin and others who know better than you or me.
Otherwise..the fish is ALWAYS there, make her bite. 8's every time and don't be lazy. |
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| Ranger - 5/26/2006 12:06 AM
"IAJustin" I heard him say. I believe him. Check the fish he's holdin', that's real stuff
What are you even talking about? |
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Location: Black Creek, WI | I don't understand the idea of PRACTICING the Figure8.
In my opinion the power of the figure8 is having the ability to READ the fish and adjust accordingly. Every fish is different... and so should your Figure8 routine. Not sure how you can "practice" that without a fish in pursuit.
Put me in the "L" group. Blind 8's are a poor investment of time and energy.... in my opinion of course. |
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Location: Eagan, MN | I don't know why this thread had to take a negative turn, it's not like we're talking about world records, WI stocking, flourocarbon leaders or vertical holds! MF has always been a place to exchange ideas. No need to get salty just because someone's techniques differ from your's. I'm sure results vary on different waters anyway. Just go with what gives you confidence and success. |
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