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Posts: 341
| I'm 0-9 this fall with suckers!!! I've had one gill cut and 8 fowled up with hooks enguaging back into the sucker ripping the sucker out of the muskies jaws. I've tried every type of quick set rig, waited for direction of fish setting away from fish, varied time before setting hook. You name it I've tried everything except letting the #*^@ fish swallow it!!
How is everyone else doing??? I have friends who have gone 0-13 but I also talk to others who claim 9-9...I think they are full of B.S.
What a rotten fall. The skunk has found me and the water wolf and bucks want nothing to do with me! |
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Posts: 561
Location: Monee, Illinois | Hate sucker fishing but you have to do it in the fall....It slows me down....
Edited by pgaschulz 11/23/2004 2:51 PM
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Posts: 2427
Location: Ft. Wayne Indiana | What angle are you getting on these fish when you set the hook?
How many hooks are you using?
What size of hooks are you using?
How big of suckers are you using?
How long after the musky takes the sucker until you set the hook?
This would help out.
Thanks, |
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Posts: 1046
| I got some friends that were 2 for 17 and by the time I got out with them to see what they were doing, the #1 thing was way to wimpy rod. 8`2" med./heavy/glass/catfish not near enough kahonas for setting steel, the other thing was the crumby quickstrike(package bought-nameless?) rigs they were using. The first day out with them I went 2/2 and they went 1/2 on my equipment, after using the correct rod, correct hookset and my super handmade suckfish rigs. There are many different varibles to success in suckfishing and the littlest things mean so much. |
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Posts: 2427
Location: Ft. Wayne Indiana | handy,
check your pm |
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Posts: 341
| What angle are you getting on these fish when you set the hook?
Usually oppisite direction of their movement
How many hooks are you using?
I have used two trebles, mostly one stinger and thru lip. Herbie rigs. Home made one stinger with very small hook for lip barely piercing it.
What size of hooks are you using?
All sizes based on sucker size.
How big of suckers are you using?
Med to large now. 12-20''
How long after the musky takes the sucker until you set the hook?
10 seconds to 1 1/2 minutes. Until I know where the head is
St croix rods, hvy action to med action rods 6' 6 to 8'
If you pierce the lip and have one stinger. The direction of force is natural pulling the stinger back into the sucker because the lips are lower then the suckers back. Even If I used a 2x4 to set the hook it's still either going back into the sucker or pulling it out of ski's jaws. What about putting stinger hook in the middle of suckers fin? That way the hook at least has 1'' more of chance to advance before hitting it's back again?
Thanks
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Posts: 1046
| On suckers shorter then 14" I am using 1-5/0 and a rubber and putting the single hook in the buthole, yes the buthole and set asap, right on the hit. Direction & time with the smaller baits mean nothing, just pound`em. Remember that is only on that size baits, its changes big-time on bigger bait. |
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Posts: 341
| I must say I've never tried the balloon knot. I'll give it a try.
Do you just hammer it once or do you do a snap set then hit them again with a ton of bricks?
Thanks |
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Posts: 2427
Location: Ft. Wayne Indiana | From just the quicks notes, I would say your angle is causing your failure.
I like to move directly on top of the fish, or very very close to on top of the fish. Just be sure he is not under the boat!!!
Once you are within a few feet/yards of the musky, start putting some pressure on the fish to make him move. Very slight pressure will get the fish to move.
Then while you are right on top of that fish, WACK THAT MF'ER AS HARD AS YOU CAN, THEN DO IT AGAIN!!!! I like to use a double hook set, and STRAIGHT UP, not off to the side.
Getting on top of the fish, which sometimes means only having 10+ feet of line out, and setting the hooks STRAIGHT UP, TWICE, should increase your hooking percentages. I usually like to have as little as line out as possible, and wack the piss out of them, just remember, straight up on the hook sets! |
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Posts: 1046
| Me too! I am always very close and nearly vertical, but I hammer them only once with 8`6" monster glass salty rod that takes 2-men and a boy to handle(almost) for me I tend to loose fish with trying to double and triple set, one time only, thats just me though! |
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Posts: 341
| Mike that's the way I always had succes in the past right on top of them. But this year is different. I'm cursed...I was up in PI this weekend and had a fish hit in 10 feet of water got right over her and jammed it straight up lifting the mid 40 fish almost out of the water...sucker came flying out and hit my partner.
I'm going for the ballon knot technique, but have a feeling weeds may discourage me since the hooks are on the bottom and I always drop them to the bottom.
Thanks guys |
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Posts: 1046
| You will be happily surprized how weedless the hinderhole can be! It ends up kinda being tucked up in there. |
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Location: Somewhere on the water!!!!!!!! | Core,
Your problem is not the hookset, the suckers you are using are too big, the bigger the sucker the more your hooking rate goes down and I mean WAY DOWN.
Use suckers in the 10"-12" range and you will see a drastic change in your success.
Another thing, don't wait so long to set the hook, as soon as you KNOW it's a fish and not weeds, SET THE HOOK............I only set once and make sure you rip his head off.
I use a 6'9" St. Croix on my down rod and the 8' St. Croix Classic Cat on my bobbers.
So far this year I am 15 for 19 on suckers. |
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Location: Minneapolis, MN | Cory:
Try using a Ralphie Rig and smaller suckers for better hook ups. The great part about the Ralphie Rig is that you don't have to poke the fish anywhere but a lead head jig in the lip. That means they live longer and you don't have to try to pull the hooks out of the sucker when you do a hook set.
Edited by Luke_Chinewalker 11/24/2004 10:45 AM
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Posts: 2427
Location: Ft. Wayne Indiana | Ralphie is correct as well.
The size of the sucker is also a key factor to hooking percentages. Like Ralphie said, 10-12 inch suckers have a lot higher hooking percentage than the 15-20 inch suckers.
The Ralphie Rig is a good system, he came up with a great method of rigging up suckers. |
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Posts: 341
| That's what I'm talking about....thats why I use this site. Info & techniques that could take years to figure out on own. You guys rock!!!
I thank you muskie geek central  |
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Posts: 1245
Location: Madtown, WI | I do two things.
First. I use a SMALL hook that I bend ALMOST in a complete circle. I keep it opened just enough to get the suckers lips to thread onto the hook. So on the hook set the hook doesn't steal some of the hooking energy by getting caught in the muskies mouth.
Second. To prevent the hooks from driving into the sucker I take the two tips that are on either side of the safety pin and bend them up...away from the pin and the side of the sucker....I have never had a hook drive into the sucker after I did this. I figure it helps angle the hooks up into the jaw of the muskie as well!
Good luck
Cory |
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Posts: 341
| Cory
Where do you set up the stinger, side, top or bottom? So you use the Herbie rig but bend the hooks away from pin creating a better angle?
Thanks |
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Posts: 354
| I'd like to second muskycore's comment on what a great post this has been. A lot
of new information for me to consider. I've always used big 18-22" suckers and my
luck has been poor. Thanks guys for the pointers.
Bill C. aka the greenduck |
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Posts: 1046
| Always remember and never forget, you still will get the biggest hawgs with the biggest suckfish. Granted there are situations when a small bait shines, BUT big bait still smokes big fish. 14-16" is my best fall Wisconsin suckfish and sometimes those small fish still crack them! But with these size I see many of those 28-32"`s take a look see and thats it! |
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| I have had a much better hook-up success after I started putting both hooks in the top of the sucker. I have a small hook in sucker to keep it straight then two 3/0 round bends one on the left side and one on the right side of the sucker. I have the hooks staggered, one in front of the dorsal fin and one back behind it. I only had two hits on suckers this year, but stuck them both a 44.5" and a 48" fish. Both were on 17-18 inch suckers. QUICK-STRIKE RIGS ARE THE ONLY WAY TO GO WITH LIVEBAIT!
I believe a fish that comes up from the bottom to hit the bait pushes the hooks into the soft tissue in the belly of the sucker and results in not being able to break the hooks free on the hookset. Most of the fish I used to lose was when the hooks get caught back in the sucker. I don't have this problem much anymore with the hooks positioned on top.
I would also echo the previous posts on boat positioning and hook-sets.
Great information here for newbies to learn from.
Brett Waldera |
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Location: Minneapolis, MN | Here's a couple of pictures of the variation on the Ralphie Rig that I use. Its been a great rig for me. You could modify it to use two hooks if you are into larger suckers but I prefer medium suckers for better hookups. I opened up the loop on the bead so you can see it better.
Attachments
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 Ralphie_Rig_01.jpg (53KB - 219 downloads)
Ralphie_Rig_02.jpg (59KB - 215 downloads)
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I like the prop!!
Brett Waldera
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Posts: 341
| Wow just like that I found a technique that works. Today I landed a ski on a new rig that is 1/1!
The muskie hit while Iron Maiden the trooper was playing and made it's last run to Iron Saint. Heavy metal draws them I tell ya.
I tried to make it down to Indiana using Mike as a guide but he was booked and nobody else was intrested in going so I hit a local lake for a few hours and boom bloody knuckles.
Edited by muskycore 12/11/2004 4:07 PM
Attachments
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sucker rig.JPG (176KB - 416 downloads)
ski 48.JPG (118KB - 217 downloads)
ski.JPG (107KB - 232 downloads)
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| Nice musky, see they do work afterall! |
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Posts: 663
| OOH nice musky and open water too! I spent a few hours on the ice today in a raging wind/snow storm. My son happened to catch a musky on his tip-up Wednesday. Released the fish as soon as the head came through the hole and saw what it was. Probably about mid 30" range but peeled some line off on him for a little fun. |
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Posts: 341
| Never got a muskie ice fishing....must be a rush thinking it's a huge eye. Yea I'm afraid after this week the lakes will be guarded until ice out. The water temp was 38 so it only had one solid run 360 around the boat and then head thrashed at the boat until I get my hands/rod almost in the water to stop her from head shaking. Always a fire run with one guy=) Any way it was a nice way to end the year with a birdie......keeps you coming back for more.
Time for tip ups!!!!!!
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Posts: 2378
| Luke_Chinewalker,
How does that loop in the wire work? Looks like it would put extra stress on the wire when fighting a fish and cause a breakoff. Any problems with that? |
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