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Posts: 68
| I understand that this is a sore subject with many people and most feel that because it's June and it was a fast warm up that 80 plus degrees is fine to fish in. I feel that this is just dumb wrong. I have a place in the Hayward, WI area and we had a 48" fish float up Friday. There was a league fishing Thursday night. I checked temps out of curiosity and had 85 degrees 2' down at 8:30pm. You can say the water is cool 4 or 5 feet down, but this fish had obvious signs of being hooked and otherwise looked extremely healthy. With all of the time and money that we spend on this sport, people need to put the rods away when its like this. If guys would have held off for 3 or 4 days, the temps have almost gotten back to normal and we probably could have saved a very old fish to be caught over again. It's truly a wasted resource in my opinion. |
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Location: Athens, Ohio | In my state, there seems to be some with an attitude, "fish all you want, the state will stock more!" We have clubs here that fish contests in July. Go figure. m |
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Posts: 742
| Cdubs, I understand your point. But, what would you tell the resort owners in Hayward that rely on tourists during the summer for their livelihood. Hey, come to our resorts but you can't fish for muskies? It's to hot. And what about the guy who had planned a trip with his family during the summer, waiting for his kids to get out of school on summer break? Water's to hot so cancel your musky fishing trip? It is as you say. a sore subject. Kdawg |
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Posts: 68
| I would think that any resort making a living off of people muskie fishing would promote safe practices. The problem that we're facing is that anglers, guides and resort owners although educated in the fact that muskies will die when caught and released in extreme temperatures will in fact die, continue to fish for and promote fishing for muskies when temperatures are high. Someone talked about Pete Maina's post in an earlier discussion. If you read the comments, he was very quick to add in that he did indeed experience warmer water temperatures deeper in the column while swimming. In all reality, if you take a 1000 acre lake near Hayward with 500 muskies in it and kill 25-50 a year because of hot water fishing will a resort have muskie fisherman in the future? Take a season like last year where temperatures where sky rocketed for well over a month with muskie fishing pressure way greater than ever seen in the area, how many fish do you think sank to the bottom? I know people will continue to fish, but hopefully there is some sense of guilt while doing it. |
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Posts: 1139
Location: NorthCentral WI | Do you truly believe there is that much difference between 79, 80, 81 degree water temps? Why is 80 the magic number to halt but 79 is green light all day? Explain the logic behind that. I understand the importance of proper handling in warm water but the virtue signaling is out of hand. The 48" floater you found could have died for any reason. A multi-species angler hooking into it and fighting the fish for 20 minutes or more could easily stress and kill a fish compared to most muskie anglers getting the fished bagged within a minute or two. Just my opinion...
Edited by MartinTD 6/15/2021 10:19 AM
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Posts: 68
| Actually 78 should probably be the shut off as fish start to lose slime and stress hard in the bag. 80 is death. You're right, it could have been a multi-species angler, but that doesn't make it right for the club or anyone for that matter to be targeting muskies in that extreme of water temps. The point that people continue to argue this is going to be the death of the sport. If anything, look at the size of the fish that are floating! These fish are well over 20 years old, some closer to 30! Stocking is way down. It didn't hardly happen last year and DNR is pushing any funding towards other projects, but it will take years to recoup from the deaths of these large fish in our small bodies of water. |
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Posts: 4080
Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion | Kudo's to the FOMP  |
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Location: Athens, Ohio | There are several states now that are studying warm water release mortality for muskies. Anticipate regulation in the future if the studies show significant increases. Meanwhile, the proverbial resort owner needs to tell folks that during hot water season, they need to concentrate on walleyes or smallmouth so the muskies will be here next year for them to enjoy.
Meanwhile, he (and you all) can write or call your US senator and tell them that climate change is changing your way of life adversely, and to get on the stick with starting to repair the damage while there may still be time. m
Edited by mikie 6/15/2021 12:14 PM
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| It will be interesting to see what the studies show about safe release and water temps.
As to the 48" floater, about 15 years ago the WI DNR studied the fish population on the chain where I lived, using fyke nets, followed by shocking. After that a veteran fisheries tech was on the water doing creel surveys regularly. He was a hard core fishermen but did not fish musky, preferring pike, walleye and trout. He told me that after virtually every musky tournament, he would find floaters a day or two later and almost always large musky. His theory was that big fish get handled longer, are out of the water longer. More pictures, more measurements, etc. He said water temps might have played some role, but he felt the biggest problem was excess handling. |
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Posts: 52
| It was irresponsible to hold the Metro tournament during this heat wave. |
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Posts: 526
Location: WI | mikie - 6/15/2021 12:12 PM
There are several states now that are studying warm water release mortality for muskies. Anticipate regulation in the future if the studies show significant increases. Meanwhile, the proverbial resort owner needs to tell folks that during hot water season, they need to concentrate on walleyes or smallmouth so the muskies will be here next year for them to enjoy.
Meanwhile, he (and you all) can write or call your US senator and tell them that climate change is changing your way of life adversely, and to get on the stick with starting to repair the damage while there may still be time. m
The alternative to regulation would be cuts in stocking. It’s already a short season in states like Minnesota and Wisconsin. Take away 1-2 months during the busiest time of the year and what’s the value of stocking? |
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Posts: 68
| In Wisconsin the Northern season is roughly 6 months or 27 weeks. It doesn't kill me to take 4-6 weeks off, but I don't make a living fishing. I hope that the weather we're having this June is not going to be the norm. I honestly don't think there needs to be a halt on the season, but rather guys are smart about it. Fish bigger clear water, fish at night, fish moving water, or don't fish. One of the biggest issues that I see is that guys around me hit their confidence waters which are usually the smaller lakes with some stain and they are the ones that boil. And we all know that fish eat well in warm water. |
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Posts: 178
| MartinTD - 6/15/2021 10:14 AM
Do you truly believe there is that much difference between 79, 80, 81 degree water temps? Why is 80 the magic number to halt but 79 is green light all day? Explain the logic behind that. I understand the importance of proper handling in warm water but the virtue signaling is out of hand. The 48" floater you found could have died for any reason. A multi-species angler hooking into it and fighting the fish for 20 minutes or more could easily stress and kill a fish compared to most muskie anglers getting the fished bagged within a minute or two. Just my opinion...
It's like a speed limit. 1 mph wont make the difference but there needs to be a cutoff somewhere. 80 is easy to remember and is pretty agreed upon to be hot as #*#*. Lots of factors go into it (just like a speed limit) but you pick the number that best covers most scenarios. Simple as that. |
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Posts: 561
| raftman - 6/15/2021 1:19 PM
mikie - 6/15/2021 12:12 PM
There are several states now that are studying warm water release mortality for muskies. Anticipate regulation in the future if the studies show significant increases. Meanwhile, the proverbial resort owner needs to tell folks that during hot water season, they need to concentrate on walleyes or smallmouth so the muskies will be here next year for them to enjoy.
Meanwhile, he (and you all) can write or call your US senator and tell them that climate change is changing your way of life adversely, and to get on the stick with starting to repair the damage while there may still be time. m
The alternative to regulation would be cuts in stocking. It’s already a short season in states like Minnesota and Wisconsin. Take away 1-2 months during the busiest time of the year and what’s the value of stocking?
If you are relying on stocking then why is there a closed season. I thought the closed season was not to interrupt the spawn for the lakes that are supported by natural reproduction. |
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Location: Chisholm, MN | muddymusky - 6/15/2021 2:36 PM
raftman - 6/15/2021 1:19 PM
mikie - 6/15/2021 12:12 PM
There are several states now that are studying warm water release mortality for muskies. Anticipate regulation in the future if the studies show significant increases. Meanwhile, the proverbial resort owner needs to tell folks that during hot water season, they need to concentrate on walleyes or smallmouth so the muskies will be here next year for them to enjoy.
Meanwhile, he (and you all) can write or call your US senator and tell them that climate change is changing your way of life adversely, and to get on the stick with starting to repair the damage while there may still be time. m
The alternative to regulation would be cuts in stocking. It’s already a short season in states like Minnesota and Wisconsin. Take away 1-2 months during the busiest time of the year and what’s the value of stocking?
If you are relying on stocking then why is there a closed season. I thought the closed season was not to interrupt the spawn for the lakes that are supported by natural reproduction.
That is correct. There are many natural populations in minnesota that are protected by the season. |
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Posts: 8745
| muddymusky - 6/15/2021 2:36 PM
raftman - 6/15/2021 1:19 PM
mikie - 6/15/2021 12:12 PM
[...]
If you are relying on stocking then why is there a closed season. I thought the closed season was not to interrupt the spawn for the lakes that are supported by natural reproduction.
The real reason for that is that lakes have varying degrees or natural reproduction success. Some lakes rely 100% on stocking, some lakes have marginal reproduction supplemented by additional stocking, and some lakes have limited or no natural reproduction. The way I understand it is the fish still spawn, but the eggs do not survive to maturity due to several factors. That can be depredation, loss of suitable spawning habitat due to runoff, shoreline development, water too warm early in the season...
You'd have to have a different seasons on different lakes, and how would you enforce that? |
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Location: Safe Space, MN | Ernie -
Agreed... I was finding 90's on the river two days before the tournament. |
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Posts: 1247
| Well I've head of places like Kentucky, Illinois, and Indiana where the locals don't fish muskies in the summer hot water months and guides head north to places like Minnesota , Wisconsin . and Michigan.
now two years in row where its getting too hot (water) up north and its only June, Sure when I was a kid I remember waiting for the end of June for the water to warm up so the Muskie would turn on. I first started fishing Muskie in the drought years of 76 and 77 and Tony Rizzo wrote of this in his book "the Summer Muskie" and this mostly addressed the dog days of summer July and Aug. And its only second week of June. It was 101 in the front range of Colorado yesterday and 100 today . It's going to be another long hot summer. The earth not getting warmer ? |
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| At least for Oneida County we have, for the time being, returned to more seasonable temps. Got down to 42 degrees last night, will get into mid 70s today and then back into the low 50s tonight. The really bad scenario is where it only cools into the upper 60s. low 70s at night. Hope this continues
Edited by North of 8 6/16/2021 2:59 PM
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Posts: 4080
Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion | It's really common sense. If it's to hot to fish, do something a little more productive.
After all we all know that Muskie fishing is non-productive... Just ask my wife ! Haaa...
For those who planned a resort vacation or tournament 7-8 months ago, well... again, use common sense. fish early (4-10 am) if possible. |
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Posts: 32829
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | As with everything, there's what's absolutely proven and what's anecdotal and gray areas surrounding both. The studies underway will shed a lot of light on the subject.
80 degrees is not necessarily a 'death sentence' on every muskie caught, but is at this time the 'accepted' zone for either extreme caution or fishing for other fishes. A lot depends on the water fished, handling techniques, and what the actual culprit, DO levels, actually are. EG: Moving water, by its nature, has higher levels of DO in warmer conditions.
Please read the following for the efforts underway to clarify things.
https://www.wvgazettemail.com/outdoors/hunting_and_fishing/dnr-hopes...
https://muskiesinc.org/indy_files/files/3%20-%20southernmuskyproject...
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Posts: 20188
Location: oswego, il | Fishing LSC I see a huge difference in releasing fish in June, early July, oct-dec than I do in August and September. The latter fish take time to swim off, sometimes over 10 minutes. They sit on top for awhile. Water might only be 75 but it's never over 80 in that scenario. |
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Posts: 44
Location: Mississippi | I will not take a musky out of the net if the water temperature is in the mid to upper 70's. I will release musky without handling as much as possible. The older I have gotten, I very rarely take muskies out of the net, at all water temperatures, seems to help. |
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Location: Sawyer County, WI | My neighbor came across a 46” floater last night. Bummer.
That said, there’s a simple, two word solution for this problem: “smallmouth bass”.
Heck, at least I can get them to bite ! |
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Posts: 32829
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | chlohop - 6/17/2021 8:59 AM
What happened to the thread exposing the IMTT regarding holding a tournament in hot water? Are we now censoring posts that may make an organization look bad? Thats ridiculous!
No, we are not allowing any bashing of anyone, ever, as it has always been. You didn't offer any indication you had spoken directly with the IMTT to get their take on the event, so I will and will offer both sides, at which time the thread may be returned to the tournament board, where it belongs. I'll try to get them by phone Monday.
It's where it belongs, and still onsite. It was your intent to bash them, you said so, so there it is.
And by the way, it isn't 'we' and it isn't 'censor'. It's OFM and our publishing guidelines. Haven't changed in 20 years. |
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Posts: 57
| https://muskyroadrules.libsyn.com/jordan-weeks-of-the-wisconsin-dnr-... |
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Posts: 512
| sworrall - 6/16/2021 8:30 PM
As with everything, there's what's absolutely proven and what's anecdotal and gray areas surrounding both. The studies underway will shed a lot of light on the subject.
80 degrees is not necessarily a 'death sentence' on every muskie caught, but is at this time the 'accepted' zone for either extreme caution or fishing for other fishes. A lot depends on the water fished, handling techniques, and what the actual culprit, DO levels, actually are. EG: Moving water, by its nature, has higher levels of DO in warmer conditions.
Please read the following for the efforts underway to clarify things.
https://www.wvgazettemail.com/outdoors/hunting_and_fishing/dnr-hopes...
https://muskiesinc.org/indy_files/files/3%20-%20southernmuskyproject...
interesting Steve, thanks for posting this. well if it indeed goes to show it isnt the temps as it mentioned in the first article, then i would say its the handling.. i have witnessed people have fish out of the water for soooo long it makes me cringe.. i've always been anal about getting them back in the water ASAP, so 15-20 seconds is about the longest i have them out.. same with in the net, i have seen a bunch of videos where they net the fish, hooks get caught high up in the net so the muskies head is out of the water, and they are celebrating and high fiving, when im yelling for the pliers and or hook cutters! hopefully the majority arent like this...
Edited by Dave T. 6/20/2021 8:44 AM
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