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| Message Subject: That's The Brakes | |||
RAZE1 |
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Posts: 938 Location: NeverNever Lake | Thought we might as well get a thread going on centrifugal brakes and how they function as well as how to maintain them. First off, on the cast, the minnowsecond our thumb releases the spool those little ju ju bees that are attached to those tiny posts start to spin wildly. Since this is the fastest point of acceleration the brakes will generate more friction at this point. My first muskie reel was an ABU, and I still have several, but I am now a big time Calcutta fan. These brakes are easy to adjust by removing the side plate and sliding one or more of the tiny plastic brakes out of their fastening clips. On the CT the spool needs to be removed partially, but the TE is way too easy to access. Anyway, this is what some reel surgeons have to say: Most advanced brake systems Recent high-profile casting reels are equipped with "innovative" brake systems, but manufacturer doesn't tell us the details. This topic is about brake systems, from the scientific point of view, to help you understand the difference of those NEW brake systems. Where do we need brakes? Brakes of casting reels has two major objectives, 1) to set the maximum spool speed and the lure speed just after line released, and 2) to control the decelerate rate to prevent birds nest. As the maximum speed is higher, it will cast longer. As it has slow spool speed, the less brake force, the better. To satisfy those requirements, the best brake system should 1. have little brake at slow spool speeds, 2. can be widely adjusted at middle spool speeds, and 3. has relatively less or saturating brake force at higher speed to maximize the initial spool speed. Brake systems As you know, there are two major brake systems, centrifugal and magnet systems. Those two systems will continue to dominate the reel brake systems because they are easy to manufacture, and reliable. Followings are brief explanation of those two major brake systems. Centrifugal system utilizes the friction of brake blocks pressed inside of brake ring. The brake force is proportional to the square of spool speed. Therefore, when the spool speed is fast, brake force is much larger than when spin speed is slow. You might have noticed that centrifugal reels cast well even with slow casting speed, like pitching, and you feel that lure flies at the end of casting. This is because of the basic exponential shape and ineffective brake range near speed 0. However, you might also have noticed that even if you try harder, casting range doesn't change much. This is because the exponential brake force at higher speed strongly regulate the initial speed. Therefore, centrifugal brake basically does not satisfy two requirements at the same time, saturation at high speed and enough middle speed brake. Also, conventional centrifugal system does not have adjustability. SVS system (Shimano) lets you change the brake profile proportional to the number of brake blocks activated. 4x4 SVS (Scorpion 1000) is the system which allow you to choose a setting from outside by sliding brake ring attached to the dial. By choosing active/inactive of 3 outer blocks, you may choose a setting finely. Both system allows us to change the brake profile up and down, but does not satisfy the two requirements at high speed and middle speed at the same time. If you activate more brakes to have more brake force at middle speed, the casting distance will be proportionally reduced. And this is the reason that centrifugal brakes are not relatively effective when you cast a lure against winds. Magnet brake system utilizes the electromagnetic force, which occurs between magnets and moving metal, in this case the spool. The brake force is directly proportional to the spool speed. The brake force is proportional to the distance between magnets and spool, and the magnet brake system was the first brake system to be able to adjust the force from outside, by changing the distance through dial. It has wider adjusting range at middle speed, but has too much brake at slow speed and not good for pitching. The brake at high speed is less than centrifugal system and allow higher initial speed. The conventional magnet brake systems were composed of a brake panel with 3-5 small magnets sitting close to spool. Recent magnet systems use inductor rotors for smoother casting. Dial changes the magnetic force between two C shaped magnets. Because of great middle-speed adjustability, and relatively high brake force at slow speed, magnet systems are quite good for difficult casting situations like casting against winds. *Casting control, or mechanical brake works to change the initial brake point, and have almost stable brake force regardless of speed. The stable brake force will be added, and push up the profiles of centrifugal, or magnet brakes upwards. The brake force is relatively smaller than other system at high-middle speed range, but effective at close to speed 0 where other systems don't conduct enough brake force. In skipping, lure decelerates brutally after it hits water. Casting control is the only effective brake at the situation. Tight up the cap. What's available today? In the category of centrifugal brakes, SVS and the 4x4 SVS of Shimano are advanced to have some extent of adjustability as explained above. However, those systems haven't addressed the challenge of modifying the brake profile shape itself. The development of new brake system has been the challenge to achieve the best brake profile shape. After the first magnet brake has been invented, several interesting modifications have been invented related to the magnet brakes. One innovation to change the brake profile was ABU's Ultra Mag brake system equipped to Ultra Mag, XLT-FL, 1021FL around 1982-1986. It achieved the saturating brake at high speed by letting brake panel move away from spool at high brake situation. The panel holding magnets were suspended by springs, and as the panel receive the brake force from spool, it slides through a guide and moves away. The adjusting dial was to set the spring tension and change the brake-saturating point. The system doesn't change the brake profile at especially slow speed, and it remained as the brake profile of magnet system at slow speed. Combination of brake systems was another trial. ABU's S3000C/T3000C (Promax) were equipped with both centrifugal and magnet brakes. By changing magnet brake dial, we could control the magnet brake force. The system could have had the advantages of centrifugal system at slow speed, and the advantages of adjustability at middle speed of magnet system. However, the magnet also adds the brake profile at the higher speed, and reduces the casting distance. It turned out at high speed, brake is dominated by centrifugal profile, and at middle-slow speed it is dominated by magnet system. Even though S3000C had 0 magnet force on dial, its brake at slow speed was too much for pitching. Mag ForceV (Daiwa) is the first and only brake system to have the profile proportional to the cube of spool speed. It is advanced magnet brake system combined with centrifugal position control system. Before it reaches at speed S1, the rotor does not move and the system conduct little brake. At the speed between S1 and S2, the inductor rotor held by centrifugal brackets moves in and out of magnets, depending on the speed of the spool. After it reaches at S2, the rotor does not move any more, and it has the magnet brake profile, directly proportional to the speed. MagForceV system enabled us to change the centrifugal-like brake profiles finely and widely. Adding to this, because of its steeper profiles than centrifugal brakes, it cast very well with slow speed. What is innovational to the Mag ForceV is the fact that it addresses the requirement at slow speed by changing the brake profile. By inserting cubic profile in the middle of magnet brake profile, it maintains the advantage of magnet brake at high speed, and achieves the little brake at slow speed and relatively wide range of adjustability at the middle speed. As you max the dial, you'll have more brake at middle, but brake at high speed is still on the line of magnet profile, not exponential. Even with max, the brake at slow speed is minimal and you may pitch easily. And, if you choose the min, it will conduct little brake at middle speed, which enable long flying casting. Flying Arm (Ryobi) and IVCB (ABU Morrum SX) are advanced centrifugal brake system, which can be adjusted from outside with non-step, continuous basis. They utilize the centrifugal forces of leverage arms connected to the spool. The brake profiles are the same as conventional centrifugal brakes, and has too much brake at high speed, or if you have little brake at high speed you will have more birds nest in winds. As spool rotates, the black leverage arms (brake block) will receive centrifugal force and pushes the blue brake panel attached to the reel body. By changing the position of brake panel, the pushing force will change. When the angle of brake shoe is 45 degree, it has the max brake, and at zero degree it has no brake. Because the brake shoes are small, the brake panel should be placed accurately to make the system effective. It requires very precise design and manufacturing technologies. And, it needs to be well designed otherwise it could happen that 7 out of 15 dial settings are useless that they have too little brake. Conclusion? From this study, I conclude Mag Force V system of Daiwa is the most advanced brake system currently available. What makes it the most advanced is the ability to address the requirements at all speed ranges, and relatively wide adjusting range at middle speed. The Flying Arm, IVCB comes to the second, a little a head of 4x4 SVS, because of continuous adjusting range. Shimano's SVS, Conventional magnet, Combination of magnet and centrifugal will come next. Although SVS is very refined system, troubles of changing setting is a large drawbacks. If you don't cast against wind, SVS will come close to 4x4 SVS though. This conclusion doesn't immediately mean that the reel with Mag Force V is the best fishing reel. Performances of casting reels are affected by more factors, like inertia of spool, smoothness of ball bearings, stiffness of frame, weight and etc. I admit Shimano's SVS casts very well in normal conditions, and I love it. Hope this help you understand the differences of brake systems and find the best performing reel to you. This is probably a little too much information to list here, but if one can take in just a piece of this, hopefully they will have a better understanding of the purpose of these brakes. ...............................................RAZE | ||
| Tim Kelly |
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Posts: 358 Location: London, England | Wow! And I thought I was an anorak!! Good info, but at the end of the day, if you have a braking system on the reel that's not set too high, your thumb can do the rest. | ||
| Sponge |
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| Thanks for posting this, I have never been able to find the words for such a topic! Now if the car manufacturers can grasp this idea... The use of brakes stretches back to the dawn of history; after the invention of the wheel, ancient man struggled to stop their carts/wagons on downward slopes, and the first braking methods employed were indeed primitive; a person was shoved under the wheel to slow or stop the cart to prevent lossage. On a really steep slope, 2 peeps were shoved under the wheel, giving us the first "emergency" braking system As fights often broke out as to who was going to be next, someone finally figured out it was easier and safer to place a large rock under the wheel, bringing us the "chocking" method at this time. As time passed, braking methods slowly improved, yet perfection appears to be just beyond our grasp. Another little known brake is the "cane" brake; this useful plant has many uses, and can be utilized as a food source, a fire starter, and also makes an excellent "educational tool" when brought sharply across a persons backside or across the back of their hands; southern schools made good use of these years ago... In conclusion, the variety of brakes we have today, expounded upon by Raze, allows us many options, making many things optional, and gives us the option of choice as never before; I have a hunch that from now on, whenever you hear the word brake, you'll think to yourself, "If they only knew"... | |||
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| For most lures used to fish Muskie the only break needed is slight thumb pressure enen in heavy wind conditions. | |||
| Sponge |
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| LOL X 100!!! Just think, if one were "all thumbs", then no matter where the reel was in relation to the hand, braking power would be easily accomplished... I'll give that a thumbs up! | |||
| RAZE1 |
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Posts: 938 Location: NeverNever Lake | Lol, Sponge Thumb, so you are saying that us seasoned anglers should go ahead and remove the brakes and rely on thumb braking solely? I find that when throwing a flat sided bait such as a Suick into say a 10 mph headwind, that brakes seem to come in right handy. I personally don't need to use my cast control adjuster. I just screw it in enough to keep the spool from having any lateral movement. Hoping to get some feedback from Tom Thumb................. Edited by RAZE1 4/9/2003 10:09 AM | ||
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| Just saying that even the most basic system will work when one is throwing muskie size lures. I do not believe there is any reason to pay for an upgraded break system; a little pratice and the gentle use of the thumb will do the trick with even the most basic system. | |||
| RAZE1 |
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Posts: 938 Location: NeverNever Lake | Thanks Thumb, I couldn't agree with you more on that one. | ||
| Sponge |
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| How can such a thought provoking, time tragedy... Edited by Sponge 6/26/2007 6:21 AM | |||
| Ranger |
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Posts: 3920 | Wow, I see what you mean now, Raze, about thoroughly discussing these sorts of things. I didn't realize there was so much to it. I'm going to print it out and read it right after I finish Slamr's Match Fishing rules. (I honestly don't have anything useful to add, being new to the technical nature of the subject.) | ||
| sworrall |
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Posts: 32957 Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Thanks for this one, RAZE1, great stuff! Way more to this than I thought, too. | ||
| fishpoop |
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Posts: 656 Location: Forest Lake, Mn. | No matter what type of brake your reels has,if you don't adjust it correctly you'll end up with a break in your line. So there is another type of break to deal with. Oh,boy all this technical talk has given me a headache. I think I need a coffee break. But then as someone has already pointed out,"That's the brakes." | ||
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