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| by experience in construction all the thing that work with propane like a skyjack dosnt work well when the temp are cold,work way much better with gaz.i just hope thats not the same thing for that drill |
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Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | OFM introduced a new product. It IS innovative, and there will be a solid community of ice anglers who love the drill for what it was designed to do. Jiffy was sold out on this model for months and is trying to keep up with the demand from retailers, so someone must want this drill.
We hardly 'oversold' anything...we attempted to correct misconceptions where possible, and even suggested those disinterested or not in the market or looking to act out should simply vacate the debate, but some folks unwilling to learn about the product because the 'prefer' other brands, or already have a drill and see no need for a new one, or don't ice fish in the first place or do and do not own a power drill continue to argue. heck, just don't buy the drill if that's how you feel. Doesn't mean I'm wrong to like the concept and the product. I LIKE the quiet operation when compared to the gasoline models and will be very happy to rid my self of gasoline stink and exhaust stink, but that's me...and I own both. Heck, now I own all three...the new electric with the new glass mat deep cycle on board passed muster in testing last year with flying colors, and THAT feller I am very interested in using. 25 holes was no problem, and the unit can run off any 12 volt source whenever necessary. For most of my trips, that drill will be onboard the Frabill. 10" holes...talk about torque. And reelman, Jiffy has a coating on the bottom of the drills that sheds the 'ripper' shavings easily, solving the clogging you insisted had to be happening. Read about it at www.jiffyonice.com. It works!
If you like a competitive model, GREAT...that's not the subject at hand. If you don't like propane, for goodness sake, buy a gasoline drill or stick with the one you have....or be truly green and use a hand drill.
Most folks will use about a half dozen propane bottles on this drill a year...or less. I'll use far more warming the shelters and lighting the shelters. I did, however, buy a couple new Frabill Shelter Lights...maybe the propane lantern will go to the back of the garage for ice fishing due to LED technology just like it did for tracking deer. I enjoyed the cleaner burn than the dual fuel Coleman, but that's me, and if I don't have to light the lantern ever again, I'd be OK with that. Dangerous critters, those are.
Power users like me probably won't use a considerable amount more than 10 bottles. That's about 450 holes if cutting one a minute of operation. Proper disposal of the tank after use is necessary, but I'm already aware of that since I use them for heating and lighting my shelter and use far more than most folks do. They need to be brought to a recycling center, where they are properly handled, or emptied and drilled properly which I sometimes accomplish with an M44 and some FMG Russian rounds 150 yards out. I properly recycle my aluminum cans, and don't drink water from disposable plastic bottles without doing the same. Now I must beg forgiveness from those who refill beer bottles, (s), I have yet to learn that 'green' craft, and should....but I am constantly fooled by Miller brewing's 'marketing'. 
Many landfills will not accept propane tanks of any size without processing by a recycler so they they are many times handled more carefully for the environment than say..plastic pop bottles. Recycling properly is up to the consumer, and there are far more villainous products out there than propane bottles. They are...after all, made of steel.
As far as the green aspect of the operation of a propane ice drill, I didn't see or hear Jiffy claim that at all...they claimed exactly what was posted, that it is OK to run that drill inside at a show, yet not one of their gasoline models could be due to pollution from the two stroke non DFI engine. Until someone comes up with a DFI two stroke small engine for this sort of application, it's absolutely correct to say the 4 stroke propane powered engine burns cleaner, but that's just a feature/benefit, not the only attractive thing to me about this auger. As you said, those cutting holes in permanent shacks will appreciate the cleaner burn.
Look at the huge source of information about gasoline powered two stroke small engines and pollution. Eventually, small engines will be added to the EPA targeted list, just like outboards were.
By the way Sled, didn't you say you liked the Nils? A Tanaka engine was what I had on my last one.
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Posts: 13688
Location: minocqua, wi. | the last one i looked at had a german motor, but i am aware they have also used japanese-made tanaka motors and that's why i was looking at the kluge too. i like the pilot and blade of the nils and have done a lot of research on it vs. all the others because it's a little pricier at $575.00. the other alternative is to just get the unit as a hand-auger based on how nice it cuts and maybe lose some weight this winter exercising. as you stated there are pluses and minuses to all these and that's why there are many products across a wide spectrum sold based on how people use the products.
the main things i like about the nils are:
- unique pilot and blade design and resulting cutting
- the power plant
- can be both hand and power auger in one
- i haven't checked out the weight on them yet but already have a light one if that's ever an issue
- and of-course the fancy color |
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Posts: 582
| ciscokid is now trying to sell this as "green friendly".. oh boy.. I would hardly doubt the amount of gas used in ice augers around the world would have any effect on the so called global warming (even if it was true which its not)..
The tiny amounts of petro used is laughable. Carbon footprint??? what???????? that just took this sales pitch too far. |
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Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Perfect example of what I just posted. This guy attacks Travis, who neither works for Jiffy or OFM because he talked about the emissions from the 4 stroke propane burning engine and mentions it burns clean, and calls that a 'sales pitch'. I can't say what I REALLY BADLY want to here because Slamr would delete it...as he should.
Look up small engine emissions, especially the two stroke oil/gas mix motors. One of the major contributors out there, albeit mostly lawn gear that's the culprit. No one said that the clean burn assisting the environment is the only reason to buy a 4 stroke clean burning engine on any product, but it can't hurt.
Jiffy sells about 20,000 drills a year according to a newspaper article I read recently. If they were ALL clean burning drills, That's not a HUGE impact, but it is an impact.
Perhaps manufacturers who build or sell the small two stroke motors are looking at future regulation of emissions and getting technology ready for compliance.
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Posts: 910
Location: Hastings, mn, 55033 | Steve,
Havent seen the Frabil LEDs in action but if they wok well you will LOVE led lighting in your shack. I made the switch 3 years ago and would never go back to a propane lantern again. I run 2 4" round reverse lights from a semi mounted to my center support bar(the one that runs above the sets) and it gives me plenty of light to fish, tie knots etc. Run it right off my vexilar battery, and have gone as long as 2 FULL nights(a good 8 hours a night) before recharging without any issues. Could probably have gone longer if needed. the only only downside, and its very minor and more personal preference, is that the LED lighting, at least what I have, is very cool/cold lighting color when compared to a lantern light. Its that plain white light vs the more yellowish "warm" light from a lantern. Other than that it is truly the cats meow. |
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Posts: 1906
Location: Oconto Falls, WI | I am not trying to sell the auger. I am not affiliated with Jiffy in any way. So there is no sales pitch from me. Just looking at positive points of the motor unlike some who always want to look at the negative. I list 8+ positives for it and you key in on the "green" one.
As I said to Sled in a PM, what constitutes “green”? In my opinion the motor is *more* “green” than gas engines. Reason being less emissions. Can’t argue the facts.
Again I am not trying to sell the product. I am trying to give a new product a chance though since I have not tried it. You know kind of like innocent until proven guilty deal. Not sure how you can knock a product that you haven’t tried or will never try. This is not just pertinent to the Jiffy thread.
I own a gas auger, and wouldn’t buy this one until that one puked. However, when my gas one pukes I will probably strongly look at a propane auger. I like the concept.
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Posts: 258
Location: Mayville, WI | jonnysled - 12/9/2010 7:06 PM
the main things i like about the nils are:
- i haven't checked out the weight on them yet but already have a light one if that's ever an issue
The nils weighs in @ 13.7 lbs (according to Cabelas). I've got an 8" nils hand auger & don't break out the power auger until 12" of ice. I'm looking at getting the power-head this year so I can go the 2-for-1 route with it & save a ton of weight vs. my 3-hp Jiffy. The jiffy has never let me down, but it's not exactly light.
sc |
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Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | The Nils weight you quoted is the powerhead alone. One has to add the drill weight to that. I think the entire thing weighs in at about 21 pounds if I remember correctly. I have the hand auger, can't get it to cut anymore. I suspect one of my grandkids tried to drill a hole in the yard.
Will be trying the new LED shelter lights today. Hope the 'eyes are going at least a little on Crescent... |
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| Yep, just noticed that. My bad...
Sucks about the dull blades, the darn things are expensive to get sharpened/new ones compared to other models.
sc |
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Posts: 13688
Location: minocqua, wi. | similar to the strikemasters ... the blades are the cat's rear, but you nick it just a hair and it's worthless. plan on a spare set of sharp blades on-hand at all times. of-note though, a spare set can be as high as $45.00, but Kurt's Island sports has them for about half that much in a simple envelope for a package. any of you shopping for spares this winter, give Kurt's a call and check it out. pretty good deal ... |
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Posts: 1536
Location: God's Country......USA..... Western Wisconsin | What this really boils down to, in my opinion, is 2 stroke vs 4 stroke. You can still find two stroke dirt bikes out there but dang few, you have way more trouble finding a two stroke ATV, 2 stroke outboards are still here but for how long? I ran the Yamaha V Max SHO last season and it is AWESOME. Two stroke car or truck....I don't think so. What you are seeing is just the first step in small 4 strokes for the outdoorsman. 2 stroke technology will become a thing of the past eventually I believe. I could be wrong, I have been on several occasions but this looks like the first step that will be followed by others in the near future. |
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Posts: 910
Location: Hastings, mn, 55033 | Actually muskyone, Strikemaster came out with a 4 stroke gas powered auger last year or the year prior. |
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Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | The STX Pro Lectric in use:
http://muskie.outdoorsfirst.com/watch.asp?id=3081
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Posts: 1184
Location: Iowa Great Lakes | castmaster - 12/10/2010 1:25 PM
Actually muskyone, Strikemaster came out with a 4 stroke gas powered auger last year or the year prior.
The 4 stroke Strike Lite has been around at least 5 years now, was out a few years before I went to a Nils. Steve theres a guy in Mn that resharpens those Nils blades sharper than new, cost is around $25 I think. |
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Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Any idea how I can reach him? |
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Posts: 1184
Location: Iowa Great Lakes | Frank DeLuca
5382 Jentoft Rd,
Saginaw, MN
55779
[email protected]
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Posts: 1906
Location: Oconto Falls, WI | For what it is worth a buddy of mine got to use the propane Jiffy yesterday in the cold. Granted not below zero (standard temp not windchill), but a cold temp test non the less. In his words “It ran like a top”. His only complaint was the weight of the auger.
Like I said not terribly cold temps yesterday but close to zero. If it is going to have issues running in cold weather I would think that even at zero degrees you would start seeing issues with how the auger ran.
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Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Keith ran the Pro 4 today in 2 degrees temps. It was stored in an unheated shed, and was carried to the lake in the back of his pick-up. It has a 1/2 full propane bottle attached. The drill started first pull. |
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Posts: 1906
Location: Oconto Falls, WI | No way Steve! Others said it wouldn't be so! |
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Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Update...below zero by 20 degrees last time out, Pro 4 started second pull.
Ran the drill again mid day, started first pull after sitting on the ice for hours in zero range temps. |
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Posts: 1270
| I just spent a couple days on Leech Lake and it was COLD up there, down to -25 degrees. The resort owner had one of the new propane Jiffys so I asked him about how it worked in the extreme cold. He stated that the drill worked good in the cold but that once the bottle got about 1/2 full it didn't seem to have the presure to keep running, but he made sure to point out that this was only a problem in the extreme cold, when it was above 0 it would run the tank dry. He also stated that it started great and that he really did like the engine. Unfortunatly he said it still had the same cutting problems that Jiffy Ripper Blades are known for - it would re-cut a hole in his shack but drilling new holes required pulling the auger out of the hole a couple times to unclog the little side ripper blades. This is the exact problem I had with my Jiffy with Ripper blades. Once I removed the side blades it worked fine. |
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Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Keith and I ran mine in minus 20 with less than 1/4 a bottle with no issues, all the way to empty. We cut dozens of holes in 20" of ice the last couple days during a nasty cold snap with no issues including the blades that are standard, and I was pleasantly surprised that the bottle ran to empty.
If indeed there had been an issue, it's a quick disconnect to warm up the bottle in the shack or truck, but I didn't have to.
When this thread started, you were pretty sure the drill wouldn't work at all in bitter cold and complained about the blades. Now that it has been proven, you add more 'he said' stuff after I JUST said I ran the drill with no issues in well below zero. Odd. |
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Posts: 1270
| Yours worked with a low tank, my resort owners did not. My buddy and I have the same Mr Buddy heaters and while on Leech his would not start in the morning with the tank he used the day before yet that tank worked fine on mine. That's the goofy thing about propane, you never know what you're getting. I expressed concern about this at the begining of this thread since it was new and propane can be goofy sometimes, after hearing and seeing some being used I still think it's a pretty neat idea and works better than I thought it would. I didn't think the engine would work as good as it does in the cold. Was I wrong? I don;t know because I don;t believe that I ever said it wouldn't work, I said I was concerned about it working in the extreme cold.
I'll stand by the blade thing though. My Jiffy blades would clog all the time, as did other people's I talked to. Once I removed the little side blades it worked great with just the "point" as did all the other's that I spoke to that had the same problems. The resort owner valuntered the information about it not cutting right on fresh holes. Refrozen ice is harder than original ice and this is why I believe that it cut better when re-opening holes. Other people who have these blades do not have the problems, why I don't know. |
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Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | I have three Jiffy drills with ripper blades and have drilled hundreds of holes with no issues. I think those who don't like the blades may be trying to 'force' the drill by putting downward pressure on it or are rocking the drill back and forth a bit; I let it run and do it's job at it's own rate...which is pretty quick.
Great drill!
The Electric has been flawless too, although I ran it to dead once going walkabout.
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Posts: 531
Location: Hugo, MN | A lot of the concern about how other propane powered products and machines run in extreme cold is being misapplied to these new augers. You can't say that because a propane grill loses gas pressure in -20 weather that the same will happen to the auger.
The rate at which the propane boils off will determine the volume of propane gas that be consumed at a given rate. As it boils off, heat is removed from the liquid propane. This causes the tank to frost up when vapor is removed. In extreme ambient conditions, when it's colder than snot, an appliance that uses a high volume of propane, such as heaters, may encounter a lack of vapor pressure. This is due to the fact that the tank is unable to boil off vapor fast enough to keep up with the demand. There just aren't enough btu's in the air during these conditions.
In the case of the auger, the motor sips vapor at a very low rate. If usage is rapid enough under severe cold conditions, a loss of vapor pressure "could" occur. Of course, you could just pace yourself, which I'm assuming most people on this board have to do, for cardiovascular reasons. 
I remember the old 49 cc Strikemaster that my buddy had. It leaked gas and unburned oil out of the carbs and exhaust. He had to wrap a garbage bag around it to protect the carpet in his SUV. That's a mess I think anyone can understand. This is a product that completely eliminates this type of mess. I'd buy one if I had a permanent, or didn't have a pickup. It's a great innovation, and more people think so than some on this board would think. |
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| Every one is going back and forth about propane and gas. STRIKE MASTER or Jiffy, I own the pro 4 and have owned gas powered models. This is the way to go, i just bought the ten inch and if your to lazy to drill with this auger even then quit ice fishing. I have two herniated discs and i could and do drill between 6 and twenty holes a day. When ice fishing, My auger is sitting in the entry way of my apartment and the one thing im worried about is getting the carpet wet. This thing is clean. We brought it in our motel room at the Patch at lake of the woods. Also want to say the patch is 65 dollars a night and has a great bar and restraunt. Im a clean freak and this place was clean and the parking lot was well lit. So i didnt have to wory about my gear getting stolen. Back to the auger, my dads friend fust bought a New Strike Master Pro 2 and after his 5th time out wouldnt start. I run my auger 2 to 3 times a week and have never had to worry about my auger starting. If you want clean, quit, power, and reliability then you need to Get a Jiffy PRO 4. Thanks and Good Luck |
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