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Posts: 1106
Location: Muskegon Michigan | I decided to post pictures of several different Baits that I own that have loose screw eyes. I went through a couple dozen lures to find these. I will not name the builders of these baits and would appreciate others to not name them either. All of these lures catch fish and I consider these lures to be in the top ten on Lake St. Clair. What I am showing you is what goes wrong when you do not take extra steps in securing screw eyes into soft woods like cedar. Enjoy.
This first bait is brand new and has not been in the water. I was able to turn the .092 screw eye with my fingers without using the hook as a lever. I will glue them in before using this lure because if I dont ,water will enter the wood around the hole and start blowing the paint and softening the wood.This will eventully lead to the eye pulling loose or having to be constantly tuned. |
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Posts: 1106
Location: Muskegon Michigan | These next couple of lures have the same trouble but are a couple years old and have seen some water time. Note the paint breaking up around the holes. Also note the automotive paint cracking on the yellow one. When water get in only bad things happen. Unless you take extra steps to seal screw eyes in they will eventually fail.
Edited by Kingfisher 10/28/2008 4:04 PM
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| i can read the tittle of the pics,so we all know who make them :D
Edited by mota 10/28/2008 4:18 PM
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Posts: 1106
Location: Muskegon Michigan | Now for the wire thru baits. These next lures were built by John Mulliet of Loke lures. I bought hese baits in 1996 and one of them in 2001. Anyone who knows Lokes can tell by the smaller joint bevels that these are very old. The first one has logged many hours and boated 64 Muskies with many of those over 40 inches. It has stood the test of time and I could run it tomorrow and catch another fish on it. Note that even with most of the paint missing or chewed the integrity of the lure is intact. No bent wire or loose lip. You will even see that John does not seal the lip in but just uses two little nails to hold it in place. Very easy to fix if it breaks. The others have caught tons of fish and all have stood up to years of abuse and the best part was they cost me 15 dollars each. As a lure Manufacturer this is what I feel I have to compete with. My screw eyed baits do not match the durability of this lure but they do match the fish catching ability as do most of the others building Cedar baits with screw eyes. As you can see Mahogany repels water very well as these lures are not rotted at all. enjoy
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lokes2.JPG (18KB - 136 downloads)
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Posts: 1106
Location: Muskegon Michigan | I will not give out the names of those screw eye lures. But I will say that screw eyes will turn and let water in if they are not epoxied in or glued in with some kind of high quality glue like Gorilla glue. I have a buddy who uses Gorilla glue and you will twist off the end of a screw eye before you will break one loose using that stuff.
Now I have tried to coat Lokes with extra top coats of envirotex and the baits looked great but they stopped catching fish. I learned that the extra weight was the problem. You see at 6 inches the Loke is about as good as it could be built from Mahogany. If it were cedar being lighter you could double coat it and end up with about the same weight per mass. But why go throught the extra steps when Laquer over Mahogany lasts for years even with just one coat of varnish.
They dont look like the customs that have been coming out of many of the new high end lure makers that visit these forums but they are proven big fish catchers and own almost every record on Lake St. Clair. So you guys be the judges,bullet proof wire thru or screw eyes that sooner or later get loose. Kingfisher |
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Posts: 1106
Location: Muskegon Michigan | I can only edit once so this is the pic from the first post.
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Posts: 1529
| mike. the older lokes were heavier honduras mahogany. the newer ones are a lighter mahogany. coating with epoxy would give you the equilevant of the older ones . does that make sense. i have re-coated a few, guys are not having issues. any thoughts ??? |
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Posts: 1106
Location: Muskegon Michigan | That could very well be George. He also uses that Jetlong or what ever its called and that stuff is not anywhere as nice as the old Honduran Mahogany. It has been getting hard to find Honduras mahagony in any quantities. I know that Loke has to use the regular at times. It is lighter and yes the epoxy added to them would probably be all right. I know the the ones made from that other wood dont do much for me. Ill tell you what ,if John would make some from cedar I would buy a bunch of them. Cedar baits just rock out there know what I mean?
But the truth is the Loke is almost a perfcet trolling lure when its the older mahagony. I think the cedar baits are slightly more productive but cant match the durability or Johns Lokes. I wish I could figure out how he makes those lures in two halves. And that would only be half of it. How does he make so many and how does he route the wire lines into the blanks and etc. etc. etc. The guy is amazing. If I were half as good at the machining end of it as he is I would BE flying high. mIKE |
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Posts: 1504
Location: Oregon | I fully understand what you are saying about the screw eyes and cedar, it is very soft. One thing to keep in mind though is that many like HR and Trueglide that are building gliders out of cedar also have a very thick topcoat that completely encases the screw eye making it virtually impossible to turn. I always wondered why HR puts the very back screw eye in without glue but this certainly isn't a criticism...........he makes a wonderful lure.
Jed |
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Posts: 1106
Location: Muskegon Michigan | I hope know one thinks I am hacking on any of the other bait companies. I have the same issues as a lot of guys. I absolutly have to glue my screw eyes in or they turn way to easy. I have tried going up to .092 but my lure doesnt handle the extra weight very well. So I use longer .072's. There is a huge price increase at H.E.B. manufacturing when you jump from 1 inch to say 1.5 inch eyes.
Mike |
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Posts: 1058
Location: Medford, WI | Kingfisher, thanks for bringing this topic up. I often wondered what the best/most effective way to "lock in" screw eyes was. You mentioned that simply putting Gorilla Glue on will ensure that the screw eyes won't twist out. Doing this, do you just take out the screw eye, fill the hole in with the glue and then screw the eye back in?
Thanks for this post and any help, Jake Bucki |
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Posts: 1106
Location: Muskegon Michigan | Jake, I probably go a little far in how I do it. When using .072 screw eyes I drill the holes with an .050 drill. Ill do like 24 to 64 baits at a time. Then I mix up a small amount of 30 minute epoxy(clear) with a tooth pic. I take a 3 inch length of .032 Wound guitar string and dip it in the epoxy and push it into the holes. The windings on the guitar string hold lots of the glue forcing it all the way into the holes. I keep running it in and out until the glue is mixed with sawdust and the hole is completly filled or coated on the inside. Then I roll a stainless steel screw eye in the glue and thread it into the hole. I use small thin cardboard rectangles to scrape off the excess glue. My screw eyes are nice and tight when the glue dries. So far no problems at all. I have a buddy who uses Gorilla glue and he swears by it. I think either one would be a good choice. When I do .092 screw eyes I use a .078 drill and a slightly larger guitar string. Its a great way to recycle old guitar strings. Mike
Edited by Kingfisher 10/29/2008 6:39 PM
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Posts: 2089
| This season, for the first time, I had a screw eye come loose on the nose of the bait. It was a Weagle that I put together when I owned the company(2nd time). As I handed the bait to a client, I noticed the screweye was turned. Upon straightening it, it just kept turning. I pulled it out with my fingers!!!!!!!!!!!!! Devcon epoxy had been used, but apparently water had gotten into the nose and rotted. Check 'em all!!!! Steve |
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Posts: 76
| Mike,
Very good info and all true. As you know I do use .092 screweyes. My process is: seal the blank with epoxy. add screweyes with marine epoxy then coat all with epoxy, paint and 3 more coats of epoxy. This has locked the screweyes down better than anything else I've tried. I have twisted the eyes off trying to remove them.
If water gets into the bait your done. Just a matter of time.
Don
Edited by Hoosierbaits 10/31/2008 11:28 AM
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Posts: 1106
Location: Muskegon Michigan | What steve just posted is why wire thru is superior. Wire thru does not depend on the integrity of the wood. Could have heppened with 50 inch fish attached to it. Now certain woods will weaken faster then others. Cedar and Mahagony have oils in them and resist rot for a very long time. But they do get punky(soft). Like Steve says check them all. Make repairs or toss the baits. Mike |
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Posts: 27
Location: Calgary, Alberta | Gorilla glue does work well but I find it a little more labour intensive than epoxy. With epoxy you add it to the hole, then the screw eye, screw together, wipe off excess, then leave to dry. With the Gorilla glue it is reccomended to lightly moisten the wood portion of the gluing surface first, then add a little glue into the hole & a little onto the threads, screw together, wipe off excess then babysit for at least twenty minutes. The reason you must babysit the process is because the glue will continually foam-up & make a mess of your lure if you leave it to dry on its own. Once this stuff dries it's VERY DIFFICULT TO CLEAN UP. Last time I used it I had to wipe the foam off my gluing points at least three or four times over twenty or so minutes before it set up enough to not worry about anymore. Holds good once dry though! |
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Posts: 929
Location: Rhinelander. | when I made baits I used hard maple and never had a problem with screweyes. It so depends on the material the baits are made of and how much caution given to predrilling the holes. If ifs plastis or a soft wood I want wire thru. You won't have a problem with small fish but just wait till that big one gets ya..
Pfeiff |
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