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Posts: 2
| Just by looking at the picture of this 16" fish - what is it?
What can be told from the markings?
Thanks,
BLS
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 BigAlkali18.jpg (89KB - 153 downloads)
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| 100% pike |
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Posts: 1289
Location: WI | how many pores are under the jaw? was the tail pointed? |
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Posts: 2865
Location: Brookfield, WI | That's Bill, from Brainerd. From his color it looks like he's been hittin' the sauce pretty hard again. Nice guy. Really likes to have a good time.
Kevin
I'm not angry, I'm hungry. |
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Posts: 929
Location: Rhinelander. | For sure musky.......Looks so much like small ones that I have helped stock.
Pfeiff |
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Posts: 317
| light markings on dark background...Pike all the way. |
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| 100% pike. |
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Posts: 20
Location: Sheboygan, WI | The markings of a pike are light oval or round spots on dark back, but they must be horizontal, these are vertical and look more like bars than spots.
The fins of a pike are mostly round as these look pointed, I believe it is a young tiger, Mark. |
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Posts: 618
Location: Bloomington, MN | The fins do look a bit pointy, but I'm guessing it's a northern. Was the clarity of the water of lake that this fish came from on muddy/dingey side? I've always wanted to fish Wabigoon just to try to get a 40"+ pike for the wall (replica of course!). Fittante's artistic capabilities would shine, and he would save $ on paint. |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | My first thought was a hybrid, but after some research I think it's probably a northern pike. If you look at Becker's "Fishes of Wisconsin" here:
http://www.seagrant.wisc.edu/greatlakesfish/becker.html
...he confirms (p398 & p405) that northerns have oblique light bars on a dark background, while muskies tend to be the other way around. But I also noticed something I had apparently forgotten--that female tigers can be fertile. Wouldn't it be wild if this fish was the product of a cross between a female tiger and a male northern pike??
It would be nice to count the mandibular pores and see the tail better, but I would have to go with Esox lucius in this case...
TB
Edited by tcbetka 6/2/2007 10:43 AM
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Posts: 956
Location: Home of the 2016 World Series Champion Cubs | MUSKY. |
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Posts: 2
| OK....I've seen enough votes and comments that I'll include more info. Just wanted to see how many opinions there would be.
- Juvenile Pike apparently often have (although I've never seen it around here) vertical-bar markings, such as these.
- This particular fish had 8 mandibular pores.
- The lake in question has never been stocked with muskies.
- It has a decent (size wise) population of pike.
- The lake has a sand bottom. Very little weed cover throughout the lake, except in the area this fish was caught.
- Tiger muskies haven't been stocked in this state since 2000.
- The closest possible source of muskellunge (would have been) a lake not too far away which crashed last year due to low water.
Bucket biology with the unlikely reproduction bonus?
Hard to imagine in these parts but....8 pores....
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Posts: 2894
Location: Yahara River Chain | I can remember when the DNR had a display tank at the Madison Fishing EXPO a few years ago and I swore that the juvenile esox they had in the tank was a musky or a hybrid due to the vertical markings like this fish above displays. Even got into a debate with the DNR Field tech about it. It was a pike. |
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Posts: 406
Location: Stones throw away...finally!! | Not trying to steal the thread, but I was forwarded these two pics from an IDNR biologist, and thought they went well with the post. They were netted this spring in the gill nets either in Spirit Lake or the Okoboji's. They are both pike, and the one is classified as a silver, but I have never seen anything like the second one. The biologist stated that it is just differences in pigmentation. The second one could be one of the coolest marked fish I have seen. Has anyone else ever seen anything like it.
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Posts: 143
| that's pretty spiffy. |
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| pike |
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Posts: 2894
Location: Yahara River Chain | Marshall - 6/2/2007 12:15 PMThey were netted this spring in the gill nets either in Spirit Lake or the Okoboji's.
I really doubt that they used gill nets as fish are often kill by such a method. Most likely used fyke nets where a single net leads to deeper water and a series of hooped nets don't allow the fish to back out.
I have caught blue pike in Canada and they look pretty cool, that 2nd pic looks more like a chain pickerel than a northern. |
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| pike. |
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| Marshall, I've caught two fish from the same body of water that bear a similar resemblance to the fish in the second photo you posted. I thought they were Pikerel, but was not sure. I e-mailed a photo of one of the fish to Rob Kimm, but since it was two or three years ago, I can't recall what he said. They were very different from the usual Pike colorings, but not really Muskie-looking either. Wierd. |
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Posts: 1291
Location: Hayward, Wisconsin | First fish a pike "apparently" in "ghost phase". Saw a 33 1/2-pound muskie like that during netting operations in 1986.
Marshall, that second photo is only the second I have ever seen. The first came from Eagle Lake and former Minnesota Research Biologist Bob Strand thought it may have been an F2 back-cross hybrid (between a muskie and a pike). Okey has both, so it is quite possible. The first photo definately a "silver" or "blue" pike as some call them. At one time Okey had about 5% of the pike population silvers according to a research study. At one time many years ago, "silvers" were thought to be "muskies" in the Park Rapids area of Minnesota.
Edited by Larry Ramsell 6/3/2007 12:51 PM
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Posts: 214
Location: Central Iowa | Actually the IDNR uses gill nets quite frequently and I've never even seen them use fyke nets.
Edited by crackpot 6/3/2007 2:16 PM
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Posts: 906
Location: Warroad, Mn | Gill nets are frequently used for fishery samples, and if checked frequently in cool water situations many fish are releasable.
I don't know what this fish is for sure. It would help to know the number of sensory pores under it's chin, the scaling on it's cheeks, and the look of the tail (pointy or rounded). X-rays would prove for sure as muskies, northerns and hybreds have different numbers of vertebra.
I would guess northern, there's lots of color varations. But at this young age almost any Esox is possible
Doug Johnson |
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | I'd venture to guess pike from what I see, catch allot of them on 'pike only' water that look just like that. Many of the clay basin lakes in Canada put Pike out marked like that, too. |
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Posts: 359
Location: Wauwatosa, Wisconsin | esox masquinongy
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| I agree with sworrel it looks like pike I have seen in Wabigoon |
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Posts: 366
| If this "Big Alkali" fish is from the Valentine Refuge lake by the same name then, I would say it is more likely a pikeral. Grass Pickeral are native and somewhat common to the area, although this fish is missing the typical tear drop marking over the eye, but otherwise looks pickeral. Just my personal opinion of course, but if it is then it is a fully grown specimen. I've caught a couple of Silver Pike like in the 2nd of the three photos on West Okoboji, and the lake is well known for Silvers. My complete guess about the 3rd would be some sort of mutated pike. Normal pike with genetic abnormality or mutation giving the unusual markings.
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Posts: 2361
| That third picture is a beautiful fish. I would jump to a chain pickerel hybrid, of some type, for that one. They should have counted pores and checked the scale pattern. Waaaay pretty regardless. Thanks for posting these interesting pics. Any determination as to what we are really seeing here????
PS, depth of body and coarse features of the head make that first one look like a musky hybrid. If somebody gave me a 30 sec look that would be my guess.
Edited by firstsixfeet 6/4/2007 4:34 PM
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | All grown up...
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Posts: 1189
Location: Bagley,MN 56621 | that second pic of marshall's almost looks like the same markings on JLong's son's pike in his thread. |
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