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Posts: 1270
| I understand that the idea is to try to get rid of single hooks for muskys but the way it's written an over zelous Warden could write out tickets for a bunch of different things. |
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Posts: 52
| Might really be an all-or-nothing situation. Go all the way and forget the 8-inch limit so that would take care of that grey area and measuring suckers when you buy them. I think the Chip Study had some information about this as well.
Right now I think education should continue first and see how that goes. |
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Location: The Yahara Chain | Pointer, thanks for digging that up. You couldn't find the Green Bay 54" proposal because it is not officially on the ballot, the process was started to late. The 54" Green Bay proposal will have to entered by somebody at each meeting, it will be more or less a "write in" proposal. AFTER it passes it would probably go into effect in 2008.
"The objective of this proposal is to gauge public interest in requiring the use of “quick-strike” rigs when fishing with large live bait for large predatory fish such as muskellunge."
I take the first sentance to mean that they are feeling the public out and it really isn't a final law. We as concerned musky anglers should vote for the "quick set" rigs. If this gets voted down J hooks will be here to stay.
Justin Gaiche - 3/19/2007 6:57 PM
If someone wants to kill a fish, they'll find a way to do it. It's not the J hook's fault that people use them the way they do. I use single (non circle) hooks all the time, they are perfect for forage smaller than 8 inches.
Justin the problem is a lot of the people that are using the J hooks are not intending to kill the fish. They don't realize that it kills the fish. They gut hook it and release it. It swims away strong and they think they have released a healthy fish, not realizing that they tore a hole in the fishes stomach and given it a death sentenace. You can still use them when you are using forage smaller than eight inches. I fail to see how this law would have an adverse effect on your type of fishing.
I see so many people complaining about the native spearing, which none of us can ever change. That ship has sailed, The Supreme Court has spoken. IMO more fish are killed by swallow rigs than die by the spear. We now have a chance to eliminate a proven kill method. We as concerned musky anglers need to unite and VOTE for this proposal. It is for the good of the resource. |
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Posts: 299
Location: Nowheresville, MN | reelman - 3/19/2007 9:24 PM
Don't a lot of quick strike rigs have a single hook on the front of the rig? As I read it those rigs would be illegal.
10-4 Watson. They don't work worth a flip anyway.
reelman - 3/19/2007 9:24 PM
Does this mean that if you are using a bait over 8" ice fishing you would need to have the tip-ups right next to you so that you could "immediatly set the hook upon strike"?
Again, great induction. Show me a "LIVE" bait over 8" that won't spring off a tip-up as soon as you set it and I'll come and drill your holes. Large Pike are just as important as muskies. Remember Swedish hooks?
As far as your Enzyte induced creepy-crawly, when a google eye strikes your harness do you stop the boat, pull out a samich, and allow the fish to fully appreciate the delectableness of said creepy-crawly? Or is the hook set immediately by default do to the forward momentum?
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Posts: 8781
| Bytor - 3/19/2007 5:35 PM
Are you serious? I don't think anybody is going to care how big your night crawler is....
Hmmm
Don't get around much do 'ya Troy?
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Posts: 1270
| I use a lot of minnows over 8" for ice fishing for pike. Give me a great big Golden Shiner, 10" sucker, or 10" live smelt anyday for northern fishing. I can set my tip-ups to not trip with these minnows on. And most of the fish I catch are smaller (30") eaters, not monsters on these big baits. The monsters I let go. If this law were enacted I would have to keep my tip-ups right next to me so that I could "immediatly set the hook"
As for my Enzyte induced creepy crawlers, I prefer Viagra!, I use single hooks as do most of the walleye guys I know. According to this law I would have to switch to treble hooks just to be legal. Trebles will do more damage than a single hook will. And what about the 10 year old kid fishing with a crawler and a bobber? Technically he would have to be using treble hooks and set the hook immediatly.
Like I said I am not nesseccarily opposed to a law like this but it has to be worded much more precisly. I support our Wardens but I hate any law that's enforcement is "up to the discretion of the Warden", I would sooner have the law written out in black and white so there is no mis-understandings. I would bet that the Wardens would also prefer that the laws be written without any wiggle room or room for mis-interpetation.
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Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | NO.
Bytor is correct, this proposal is to gauge the public support for the rule change.
This rule would be eventually written and directed specifically to Muskie angling with Live bait. Forget the Ice application and walleye/panfish guys; no effect there.
The new rule would be written carefully to avoid misinterpretation. |
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Posts: 189
Location: Barrington, Il | For those of you pushing education , how are you going to do it. The people using single hook swallow rigs don't read Musky Hunter or belong to Muskies,Inc. They don't go to the musky message boards. They use single hooks because that is what they have always used and always will. |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | I educated my roommate who is not a big musky fisherman. His uncle is and was still using single hook rigs. I told him how the single hook rigs worked and he said he would stop using it. |
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| Not mentioning any names here but I know a guide who still continues to use single hooks today! I asked him why and he said it puts fish in the boat for his clients and that's all that mattered. Now his clients who many of them probably are first timers are going to think this is an accepted method and that's how their going to do it. Hands down it needs to be outlawed!
Mr Musky |
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Posts: 285
Location: NE Wisconsin | Question 37 on page 27 of the spring questionaire, is about the use of quick set rigs. If you look to the top of the page, it is NOT a proposed rule change, BUT an advisory question, meaning the DNR, namely the Secretary, from what I hear, is looking for public input on the question. No matter what the results are this year, it will not be a rule change next year!!!!
http://dnr.wi.gov/org/nrboard/congress/springhearings/
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Posts: 8781
| Mr Musky -- I know of one who uses circle hooks for the same reason...
As much as I like to believe people will just "do the right thing" and that we don't need more laws?? Experience has shown me otherwise. People will do whatever they feel they can get away with unless the penalty for being caught doing it outweighs the benefit of doing it.
Add in those who you will never convince because they have released gut hooked muskies and watched them swim off, the "just a fish" crowd who doesn't care of they kill one or not and just want to catch them any way possible?
This law, if passed, would be good for the resource. They have the same law in IL and it hasn't caused any mass confusion. Guys aren't getting tickets fishing with 8-1/16" nightcrawlers, nobody is scrambling to buy 7" suckers so they can use single hook rigs. People stopped buying the single hook rigs, and when that happened the retailers stopped keeping them in their inventory...
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| Musky Magic,
Here are the guidelines for submitting proposals.
http://dnr.wi.gov/org/nrboard/congress/springhearings/
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| Also the 54 inch limit for Green Bay is looking for more "authors" for each county. This site has a list of people who will bring this topic up at their counties meeting.
http://www.titletownmuskiesinc.org/
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Posts: 999
| Esox Addict, I dont believe alot of people are still using single hooks, 90 percent of musky fisherman who truly care for the fish wouldn't even think about using a single "J hook" kill rig. We treat them like fragile glass once in our hands! It's the other ten percent that I was talking about that we need to put a stop too. And I'd say 5 % are new people to the sport and need more education and the other 5 percent are the old generation musky fisherman that want to remain blind to all the studies and will never change. A LAW CHANGE WILL TAKE CARE OF THESE 10 PERCENT and I could be very far off percentage wise I dont know it was a logical guess.
Any thoughts?
Mr Musky |
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Location: Lake Tomahawk, WI | I hope they ban the single hook rig. Yeah, it's more regulations. Yeah, not a high percent of muskie fishermen use them.
But...
This fall was the first time I've guided late into the year, only had 4 days in mid-October before returning to Montana. On the 3 lakes I fished, observed 3 groups shore fishing using single hook rigs. A buddy talked to them the day before I was there, and 2 of the groups had a total of 7 fish from one lake (gullet hooked/cut leaders/swam away fine/turtles and eagles eating like kings). Quick strikes snag up too much when used in shore fishing situations, and would help eliminate this problem. Education is great, but this would be the ultimate form of it.
Maybe at the spring hearings we can hear from locals standing up and saying how this regulation will kill tourism in Vilas/Oneida just like they said a 50" size limit would.
JS |
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Location: The desert | Right on Sloan, I agree 100% |
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Posts: 691
Location: nationwide | Just as a note . . . . . . if you see a group of people shorefishing do not assume they are using single "J" hooks.
Not everybody who shorefishes uses "J" hooks, or single circle hook rigs either.
Corey Meyer |
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Posts: 8781
| I agree that there aren't great numbers of people using single hook rigs. But those who are using them are killing muskies whether they choose to believe it or not. And that's why I believe we need some legislation here, because education will only go so far. Even if its only 2% of musky anglers and only 25% of the fish they catch die, add it up and its significant.
As for getting the necessary suport, all we need to do is make our voices heard in an intelligent and non threatening fashion. It's cheaper to avoid killing a musky than it is to stock a new one. But its cheaper still to do nothing at all, which is exactly what will get done if we don't show our support for these sorts of things.
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| Corey,
I suppose I shouldn't assume ALL who shorefish use single hook rigs. But the vast majority of those I run into do indeed use them. I've hooked several of their rigs while rowtrolling and looked inside their boats at the landings and baitshops. Over here in Vilas/Oneida single hooks for shore fishing are the rule rather than the exception.
JS |
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