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| Just getting started with the mighty muskie. I want to buy a new rod and reel, but only 1 for now. I am considering the Abu Garcia Ambassadeur C4 6.3:1 gear ratio (5601) and a 7'6" MH rod. I throw (in order) buchtails, jerkbaits, topwaters, cranks, etc.
Is this a good all-around combination? I am a life-long bass fisherman and am convinced that you can get these on bass gear, but i want to upgrade to a rod/reel combination that increases my odds of landing the bigger ones and making sure they survive. Also looking for something that won't make my arm fall off after 10 hours.
So, what are your thoughts? Abu C4 5600 series? Abu C4 6600 series? Abu C3? other? Is the only difference in the C4 and C3 the gear ratio? |
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Posts: 605
Location: Marshfield, WI | Hi,
That is what I use for most of my rod and reel setups. This year, I tried the Gander Mountain reel and it has the same specs as the Abu C4 and I liked the reel a lot. For my rod, I like the St. Croix Premier is 7'6"MH. I'd reccommend using 100lb. test Power Pro for line. Stuff lasts forever and I haven't had it break going on 4 years.
Krishna |
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Posts: 1270
| I would opt for a 6500C3 instead of the C4, they are basically the same reel with a different gear ratio. The 5.3 is A LOT more general purpose than the 6.3. As you get more set ups you might want to get a 6.3 for jerk baits, but they are not very good for general purpose. |
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Posts: 1335
Location: Chicago, Beverly | If I could only own one? It would be a 6'9"H St Croix Premier and a 6500C-3 Garcia. For best alround sticks the 6'9"H is it. That 7'6" MH(any brand) rod will not have the backbone for many baits, specifically heavier ones. The C3 is just a good alround reel, whereas for me the C4 I would use for bucktails specifically. You can catch them on Bass gear, most Bass reels will work ok, but the rods is where you will see biggest difference, possibly having to play the fish longer then ideal. With that said, largest Musky I ever saw I hooked on bass gear while fishing for bass/pike.. I now do not fish for bass on Musky waters with bass gear.. |
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| Thanks to all ... good advice. I am curious as to why the focus on the 6500 vs. the 5600. I was thinking about the 5600 because of the lighter weight. Is there concern that the 5600 won't hold enough line? |
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Posts: 1270
| The 5600 will hold enough line for a musky since they really do not pull out much drag like a salmon does. The problem is that after a long cast the diameter of the line left on your spool is pretty small on a 5 size reel, this means that your retrieve rate is quite slow until you pick up a bunch of you line.
Many guys use 5 size reels without a problem but I prefer a little bigger reel like the 6 size. The weight difference is very minimal anyway. |
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| Hey Reelman ... thanks! That makes sense. I am still not sold on the C3 over the C4. I guess i have always like higher gear ratios (ie. for bass fishing). It seems like the C4 would be less work ... especially on buchtails and jerk baits. Why would you want a lower gear ratio for larger baits?
I guess the answer is to buy both the C3 and the C4!!! |
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Posts: 56
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As someone said earlier, the 6.3 is good for jerkbaits primarily. Reason is, you are mostly reeling in slack line with jerkbaits (not pulling the lure with the reel itself) & the 6.3 is nice because it brings that line in faster. If you have to set the hook, it can make a big difference not having a bunch of slack line out. I use a C4 on a jerkbait rod & like it for that reason, though the reel had some issues part way into the season. I'm actually interested in the 2006 C4s which supposedly have some improvements in gears, drag, etc. They should be better--they are now $85 and a long way from the cheap old $55 reels they once were.
5.3 is a better all around gear ratio. You can still easily fish jerkbaits with it, but it will do better for anything where you need the reel to actually pull the bait in, like a lot of bucktails and lots of minnowbaits and crankbaits. (A 6.3 sounds like a good idea for bucktails, but mostly for ones with a small blade that don't create a lot of resistance. Pull a large-bladed bucktail enough with a C4 and it WILL be finished in fairly short order. Same thing with cranking in minnowbaits or cranks, or hard-pulling spinnerbaits. It was not designed for that purpose.) Besides, 5.3 is not exactly slow.
If I were to pick one for an all-around reel I'd go with the new (2006) 6600 C3. Buying both would take care of this, but you'd probably need 2 rods...which is another story. |
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Location: Des Moines IA | I would go with a C3 6600 myself. The C4's don't take burning bucktails very well. Also get atleast a 7'6 rod. A 8 foot St. Croix premier Heavy action would be my choice. 1 - 4 oz rating. And go with atleast 80 lb braided line. Don't forget you NEED good hook cutters. I would recommend KNIPEX. My partner Jeremy was hooked through his wrist, to a 40 incher in the net. No hook cutters made it a VERY BAD ORDEAL. Take my advice, KNIPEX!!!!! |
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Posts: 1270
| Todd, The size and resistance of musky baits is much greater than bass baits! If you try to retrieve a bucktail of any size with a 6.3 you will wear your arm out rather quickly. I know that there are guys who do it with a 6.3 but they must be more of a man than me:-)
On jerk baits your reel really only retrieves slack line, all the work is done with the rod and most hits come on the pause so you want to have the line tight right away. This is why I like 6.3 for jerk baits.
Just an FYI. For 2006 Abu is not making a 6600C3, nor have they ever. If you want a size 6 reel with a thimb bar (that is what the "6" in the second place means) you would have to go with a 6600C4 or a 6600SSC3 which is basically a C3 in maroon. The other option would be to go with a Record RCN60 or RCN60HC. |
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Posts: 56
| Reelman is right about the numbers...I got confused. There is no 6600 C3--I think we all meant a 6500 C3.
I wonder if those Record HCs are any good? Not sure about the reel handle style if that's good for cranking or is it a live bait handle?
Edited by seabass 1/1/2006 9:42 AM
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Posts: 1764
Location: Ogden, Ut | I have found that a good compromise between the C3 and C4 is to put a power handle on the C3 - it facilitates reeling a bit quicker despite not changing the gear ratio. My experience w/ ABUs and muskie baits has been not much short of stellar, and I will continue to use them, but I think that the C3 series in general tends to be a bit more durable in the long run.
Sorno |
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| Thanks again to all. For now, i think am going to go with a 5.3:1 ratio. But since the C3 doesn't have the thumb bar, is that a concern? How about the Ambassadeur D5 series? It claims easier to cast. Is this just as durable as a C3?
I was also checking out the Shimano Cardiff. Anybody have experience with the Shimanos? I use them exclusively on my bass set-ups. |
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Location: Northern Wisconsin | if you get the 6500 c3 you wont be disappointed. i havent used the shimanos but i have heard alot
about them breaking down so i am going to stick with the abus. |
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Location: Des Moines IA | The D series is not what you want. If you want a 5:3to1 with a thumb bar , get a Abu 6600SSC3. |
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| I just ran over to Dick's Sporting Goods to look at the Abu C3 and C4. The C3 seems very basic and i am not sure about the button??? It seems cumbersome ... how does it work? Do you have to push the button and then reach over and put your thumb on the line? Can you do this with one hand? Do you guys like it?
I wish i could find a store that has the new Records in stock. Those seem more of what i would like. |
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Posts: 480
| todd, Joes sporting goods has records in stock, very niiiiice. I would wait to heat the buzz after the masses use them in the spring just to make sure. |
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Posts: 1335
Location: Chicago, Beverly | where you at Todd? chcago area edshirley's has them along with some of the gander mtn's.. Probably Fishing Conection and Henry's too I'd think |
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Posts: 335
Location: Pulaski, WI | Don't buy a C4 for general purpose use. Gears aren't designed to pull the load of a bucktail or large crankbait. I bought a C4 for my first reel, thinking it would be the most versatile, it didn't last the season.
John |
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Posts: 793
Location: Ames, Iowa | Todd-
I've been hard at this only 3 years with three fish so I'm no expert. Seabass makes some good points, as do others- great reading. I think the button on the 6500 vs. the thumb bar on the 5500 matters little. I have 3 6501 C3s (and one 5601) and use the right thumb across the reel to push the button and thumb the spool on the 6501. I'm sure my hands are no way as big as most guys' here. Two handed cast all the time. Very comfortable motion. You won't get tired- its all in the shoulders, plus its exciting- who ever wants to quit because they're tired- quit at least an hour later than you told the wife you would.
The 5:3 gear ratio works great for jackpots, Suicks, Mantas, and twitching, and handles all bucktails, spinnerbaits, even those with Colorado blades. I remove one blade on most 2 Colorado blade spinnerbaits because those would tire me out, or more commonly I replace with a french or Indiana blade. My 2 blade spinnerbaits I use solely for trolling. Any 6:3 would be even tougher to reel these baits.
I may be wrong but I think a shorter rod might tire a guy out who is trying to get more distance on a cast by throwing harder. A longer rod can do that with less effort. I'd also say avoid a cheaper rod and pay more for one that is light. Go to the store, put a reel on an All Star or Lamiglass, or Fenwick (?) vs. an Ugly Stik or Rizzo. I have a 7 foot Ugly Stik but its a second trolling rod. I think I've read from guys here that Lamiglass or All Stars have great guarantees. Abu Garcia and Fenwick certainly do.
Good Luck,
Don
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| The reelman and a few others are dead-on. Don't go with C4 and a 6.3 ratio. FYI abu does make some 6500's that do have the thumb-bar but aren't c4's. Reeds sporting goods has a sale on abu's right now, there's a 6600 that has a thumb-bar and is red but is otherwise the same as a regular 6500, that might be your best bet.
The 6.3 ratio just doesn't work for anything with drag when you are pulling it in, which means that it doens't work well for much muskie fishing. There are guys who use them to take up slack on "glide" baits, but I don't let my baits glide enough that an extra 20% faster line pickup would make a difference. Because of the "high-speed-low-power" 6.3 it is more work to use almost any bait than a 5.3 ratio would be on the same reel.
The only thing that most 7'6 rods won't throw would be big heavy jerkbaits and bulldawgs, I put those in kind of a specialty category for beginners anyway and the 7'6 would be great for spinnerbaits, bucktails, crankbaits, top-water, normal plastics and I have a 7'6MH that I even use for six inch reef hawgs and 9 inch suicks without any problem at all. If you know you are going to throw big wood baits most of the time, then seriously consider the 6'9 st. croix, but if you like throwing hair and normal "shad-sized" crankbaits, then go with the 7'6 for sure. I would rather have a rod that works great for 80% of what I throw than a rod that nice for the big wood baits I throw 20% of the time and is marginal or worse for what I'm doing the other 80% of the time on the water. |
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Posts: 1270
| sally, the reel you are taling about is the SSC3 series and yes it is basically a C3 with a thumbar. |
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Posts: 561
Location: Monee, Illinois | You will like your C4 6500 that is all I threw for a year or two now I got into a Penn and a Tica and a couple of Okumars.......They all work fine but the C4 you cant go wrong with...
pga
I agree with kevin 6-9 heavy is a great rod |
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Posts: 425
Location: Elkhart, IN | I've had fantastic luck with the two C5's I have, one has been used constantly for three years without so much as a hickup other than my son launching it into the lake. LOL |
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Location: Contrarian Island | If you can find one...Go with a Big Game 6500 CL...what do you think of those Reelman? I just picked up 2 with smoothie drags and custom double handle..I loved my 7000CL's so much I had to pick up some 6500's.... |
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Posts: 1270
| MSKY HRN, The 6500 CL Big Game is bascally a 6500C3 on steroids. The frame is chrome plated brass and the sideplates are black anodized brass. They are not light, but they are one durable reel. I happen to have 4 of them that I no longer use if you are interested send me a private massage. |
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Location: Contrarian Island | are any of the internal parts different in the CL as opposed to the regular c3? and you say they are heavy? they feel like a feather to me...but then i'm used to big 7000's and penn 975's too! lol |
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