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Muskie Fishing -> General Discussion -> Shad patterned baits
 
Message Subject: Shad patterned baits
Muskie Treats
Posted 6/6/2005 10:55 AM (#149780)
Subject: Shad patterned baits





Posts: 2384


Location: On the X that marks the mucky spot
A lot of people have been asking me to make a shad colored Muskie Treat. Does anyone have a picture of their favorite shad pattern they can post? Descriptions are ok too. I won't do a direct copy, I'm just looking for a starting point.
Shane Mason
Posted 6/6/2005 11:09 AM (#149782 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits




Location: WI
Tennesee Shad is an a great place to start, one of my most productive colors even on lakes w/o shad.
RiverMan
Posted 6/6/2005 12:41 PM (#149793 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits




Posts: 1504


Location: Oregon
This is one that I do.

jed
Bikini Bait Co.


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(bb6ribfoilshad1.jpg)



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divani
Posted 6/6/2005 4:00 PM (#149805 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits





Posts: 2059


Location: Belgium
this is one that I do


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(Picture 002.jpg)



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divani
Posted 6/6/2005 4:01 PM (#149806 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits





Posts: 2059


Location: Belgium
divani
Posted 6/6/2005 4:01 PM (#149807 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits





Posts: 2059


Location: Belgium
these are two that my buddy kjelle paints. They look amazing!


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(divani EP + divani wiley.jpg)



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esox50
Posted 6/6/2005 5:04 PM (#149821 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits





Posts: 2024


I like that bottom one, Divani!
Beaver
Posted 6/6/2005 6:10 PM (#149828 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits





Posts: 4266


Either one of these I use in shad-based lakes.
Even though one is called cisco, I think it's just because you have to name them something.
I also like to add a pinch of mother-of-pearl glitter to the clear coat to give them that flash that you can see at a distance when a real shad moves.
Beav

Edited by Beaver 6/7/2005 8:56 AM
Beaver
Posted 6/6/2005 6:11 PM (#149829 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits





Posts: 4266





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(Cisco-Castor.jpg)


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(Emerald-Shad.jpg)



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2Rodknocker
Posted 6/6/2005 6:54 PM (#149835 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits




Posts: 459


Location: New Baden IL
Here's some of my shad arsenal.
Rod


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(IMGP0045.JPG)



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Keith Eldrup
Posted 6/7/2005 7:26 AM (#149894 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits




Posts: 120


Here is one I call Sunburst Shad this is the Shad Cain Pattern with a Chart spot. I think most white based and some sort of blue,green on top silver scales will do fine.
My best producing shad style color is a simple white base with a green back and light silver scales very simple but it works.
Photos are realy tough on Paint Jobs some you just have to see.

Keith

Edited by Keith Eldrup 6/7/2005 7:30 AM



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(Sun Burst Shad-2.jpg)



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Beaver
Posted 6/7/2005 8:54 AM (#149905 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits





Posts: 4266


Nice looking stuff.
You are dead on when it comes to the picture or scan not doing justice to a paint job.
You can't judge a paint job until the lure is in your hands in the light of day. That's what brings the colors to life. When you can turn it and see scale patterns that don't show up through a lens, or watch it change colors when the angle of the light hitting it changes.........
but you can catch them on all black anyway
Beav
firstsixfeet
Posted 6/7/2005 9:26 AM (#149911 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits


Not to antagonize any of the bait builders but I don't like any of your versions of "shad" and would not use them or select them if I had a choice. They are pretty and probably look fine to the fish or some fish but I really look for more white/grey coloration with black top to match shad down here, and best luck has been on whiter baits than what you are showing. I specifically do NOT like green tops, and am not fond of blue tops either, and any kind of definite yellow is just not a color we see in shad lakes down here.

The shad has a very, very light yellow, and a definite pink cast to it per sunlight spectrum in air, and I would guess that holds for water too. I would rather see a light pink blended into the side, if any color is included beside a white to grey to black shading. There used to be a color called pearl, brought back in recent years by bomber bait company, that included gentle light shadings of pastel yellow, pink and blue botches blended on a white background, very subtle color. Pearl is a nice color if you can pull it off, study White's book on collectable baits and you can probably find a couple good examples. I would take white belly, pearl sides and black or dark grey top as a shad color any time.

Superman from Maina baits isn't much of a color but it is a good "shad" color down here.

I don't think color will neccessarily cause rejection of ALL baits but I do think it can be a very positive influence on the acceptance of a bait, and can make the difference between a strike a look. I do think there are "best" colors in various systems, in spite of the fact that ALL colors might catch a fish on a given day, but the "best" colors work again and again, and I think the fish are looking for that "favorite forage", and that "certain color" helps them find it.

Beaver
Posted 6/7/2005 4:25 PM (#149982 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits





Posts: 4266


6 of one, a half dozen of the other.
Same thing for Cisco patterns. Everydody thinks blue is part of the Cisco pattern though I have never seen a cisco with any blue in it. The are silver with a flash of gold near the top and sometimes some flash of green. Doesn't matter if they are shad or cisco, you could paint the lure white, pearl or metalic silver and white and add some scales that are just a shade darker and you'd have it. But what fun would that be? I believe that you have to add some color to it so there is some contrast for the fish to key in on as the lure moves. I've got lures that are all white, 90% white and all sorts of tints near the top. Bottom line, the fish doesn't see the top of the lure anyway. Painting it dark makes it hard for you to see when you bring it in, so I always add a patch of silver or gold to the top so I can see the top, not the fish.
I don't know about the rest of the lure makers out there, but I have never laid a shad or a cisco on the table and tried to copy it. God made it, I'm not going to be able to copy it.
Give me 100 colors and some lure bodies and let me amuse myself.
Shad, cisco, perch ............ gotta give them a name, or nobody would know what to call it.
Like walleye lures that are brown and yellow....ever see a yellow and brown walleye? Not me.
Paint what you want, and call it what you want.
Beav


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(Golden-Shiner.jpg)



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RiverMan
Posted 6/7/2005 9:02 PM (#150007 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits




Posts: 1504


Location: Oregon
I would agree Firstsixfeet that most immitations of baits are not as close as some would like them to be. I haven't seen the resident forms of shad that inhabitat many musky lakes, here in Oregon we have an anadromous form. On Sunday I caught a whole bunch of these and from a distance they look silver/#*#*e. When you catch one tho and turn it in the light you will see silver, blues, and greens, they are a beautiful fish. This is another pattern that I make that probably does a better job of "matching the hatch". The foil on this bait is "irridescent" and changes colors depending on the angle and guys report to me that they do quite well on it. A simple white with a black back would argueably work as well as any pattern out there.

Jed


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(bb6martinishad1.jpg)



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firstsixfeet
Posted 6/7/2005 10:13 PM (#150015 - in reply to #149982)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits


Beaver - 6/7/2005 4:25 PM

6 of one, a half dozen of the other.
Same thing for Cisco patterns. Everydody thinks blue is part of the Cisco pattern though I have never seen a cisco with any blue in it. The are silver with a flash of gold near the top and sometimes some flash of green. Doesn't matter if they are shad or cisco, you could paint the lure white, pearl or metalic silver and white and add some scales that are just a shade darker and you'd have it. But what fun would that be? I believe that you have to add some color to it so there is some contrast for the fish to key in on as the lure moves. I've got lures that are all white, 90% white and all sorts of tints near the top. Bottom line, the fish doesn't see the top of the lure anyway. Painting it dark makes it hard for you to see when you bring it in, so I always add a patch of silver or gold to the top so I can see the top, not the fish.
I don't know about the rest of the lure makers out there, but I have never laid a shad or a cisco on the table and tried to copy it. God made it, I'm not going to be able to copy it.
Give me 100 colors and some lure bodies and let me amuse myself.
Shad, cisco, perch ............ gotta give them a name, or nobody would know what to call it.
Like walleye lures that are brown and yellow....ever see a yellow and brown walleye? Not me.
Paint what you want, and call it what you want.
Beav


Most of the lures I actually use, tip enough so the fish DO see the top a little when retrieving. I don't want them to see blue or green in certain hues.
I really don't agree that it is 6 of one and half a dozen of the other. I believe color matters and there is a "best" color.

As for what you want to paint and what you want to call your lures Beaver, paint what you like and call them what you like. As for copying the life like colors of a fish, I believe it can be done to a remarkable degree, but that an exact duplicate is not neccessarily the key, it is more a case of presenting fish with the main ingredient of either the key color(even if it is white), detectability or maybe the flash of contrast that tells the fish, that yes, this is my favorite meal!

As for cisco patterns, you are waaaaaaaaaaaaaay off on those, but I didn't want to tell you that because it seems you get a little defensive!

I have seen lots of fresh cisco, and they are definitely the color of either batter or crumbs that have been dipped in a pot of hot grease. Have eaten a tubful and every one of them looked just like that. do you want me to describe the exact shade of brown I look for?

firstsixfeet
Posted 6/7/2005 10:16 PM (#150016 - in reply to #150007)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits


RiverMan - 6/7/2005 9:02 PM

I would agree Firstsixfeet that most immitations of baits are not as close as some would like them to be. I haven't seen the resident forms of shad that inhabitat many musky lakes, here in Oregon we have an anadromous form. On Sunday I caught a whole bunch of these and from a distance they look silver/#*#*e. When you catch one tho and turn it in the light you will see silver, blues, and greens, they are a beautiful fish. This is another pattern that I make that probably does a better job of "matching the hatch". The foil on this bait is "irridescent" and changes colors depending on the angle and guys report to me that they do quite well on it. A simple white with a black back would argueably work as well as any pattern out there.

Jed


Mmmmhhh, mmmmh good, and edible pink if ever there was one!
mm12463
Posted 6/8/2005 1:22 AM (#150030 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits





Posts: 207


Location: Mpls, MN
You mean my fire tiger stuff doesn't really look like a tiger on fire? SOB.
Beaver
Posted 6/8/2005 7:53 AM (#150033 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits





Posts: 4266


The hell with match the hatch.
FSF...me, get defensive? Keep talking like that and I'll send a blue lure to you.
I think the naming thing is over-rated. You paint a lure that looks like it will catch fish. Nice color pattern. Nice contrasting colors. Good visibility. What do I call it?????? Hell, I sold 20 lukes called "Pepto Puke" this year.
From now on I'm going to run this like a Chinese restaurant....everything will have a number, not a name.
"Gimme a #4, a #7 and a taste of #13 but without the mustard sauce."
mikie
Posted 6/8/2005 7:59 AM (#150034 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits





Location: Athens, Ohio
http://www.mepps.com/mepps/library/article.asp?ID=77

Hopefully, this Mepps color-under-water article will add to the discussion. Beav, you do good work!

I'm hoping Treats got what he wanted; RAZE 1 painted a Tuff Shad for me and I wish I had a photo of it, thing looks just like local shad. I'll post a photo of another one of his shad baits when I get home, he had a shad hit the lure! m
Red Man
Posted 6/9/2005 6:09 AM (#150136 - in reply to #149780)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits




Posts: 152


That is a very interesting article at the Mepp's site. Knowing how light is filtered and seeing the results are two different things. My best producing crankbait this spring was one with a black head and fluor. rd. body. Running at 10 ft. it must have looked like two different shades of black. It also explains why blk. and gold, and fire tiger have produced so well when trolled deep. So far as shad colored lures, I never paint them or use them, exept for blk. and wht. I want something that stands out when it is down there with hundreds of shad. Mother of pearl is very easy to do. I use a silver base, then put on transparent colors, and a thin reduced white over that.
ESOX Maniac
Posted 6/9/2005 7:34 AM (#150140 - in reply to #150034)
Subject: RE: Shad patterned baits





Posts: 2753


Location: Mauston, Wisconsin
Guy's some very cool paint jobs. LOL " Beaver's House of Bait Stir-Fry".

Mikie- Check out the MF Research Forum arhives. ->
http://muskie.outdoorsfirst.com/board/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=13...

Have fun!
Al
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