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Posts: 699
Location: Hugo, MN | Can anyone explain to me why someone would post nearly exact locations of fish on a named lake? The only thing missing is GPS co-ords!! Do people that do junk like this know that 18,000 people view this board each month?
Sorry for the rant folks just want to see what other people think about this. If you absolutely have to tell everyone exact spots where you caught fish then use the PM's.
Happy hunting boys your favorite spots may be crowded this weekend. |
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Posts: 32958
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | If someone wants to share a spot, that's OK with me. A very good percentage of the anglers out there won't ever even see that water, much less fish it, and the anglers who actually do fish that water probably know about the spot anyway. If not, they may try it, may not.
I disagree with you strongly, sharing good areas to fish and actually sharing a boat seat on good water with a contact made on the MuskieFIRST board has been part of the tradition of community here. No one HAS to share ANYTHING, so if one has a small honey hole, one can keep it a secret, no problem. There are more Lake Xs in the archives at MuskieFIRST than I can count! |
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Posts: 1769
Location: Algonquin, ILL | I agree with Steve, Sharing is what this board is all about.
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Posts: 2427
Location: Ft. Wayne Indiana | Again, sharing is what this board is for. Read some of my fishing reports. I give the lake, the spot, the lure, the time, ect..... So what if 18,000 people read my post. Does that mean my favorite lakes will be ruined by fisherman?? NO WAY. Are you afraid somebody is going to catch more/bigger fish than you, and you will be mad?
What is wrong with giving out information. This sport is hard enough to figure out by yourself, a little help sure goes a long way sometime.
Do you ever ask for help? Do you ever read the fishing reports? The rule is the same if you are a little kid with toys, or a grown up musky man..... sharing is ok. |
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Posts: 699
Location: Hugo, MN | With all due respect I disagree. I am not against people sharing information. That's why I am here. I just don't believe that it should be specific. |
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Posts: 91
Location: Wausau | I have never understood the "secrets" when it comes to spots people fish. I learned along time ago bowhunting Whitetails it is about being in the right place at the right time. Musky fishing is no different. I could fish a spot 100 times and never catch a fish, the next guy can fish that spot once and catch the fish. He just happened to be throwing the correct bait for that spot under those conditions and the fish was hungry. If I am not catching fish I al least want to help someone else catch fish, if that means telling them a spot, Great then that is what I will do. I can also learn from them catching a fish at "my" spot, maybe they did something that I hadn't thought about and next time I am a little wiser. |
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Posts: 32958
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | That's the beauty of the board, everyone makes a decision on sharing spots and techniques, and practices same. |
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Posts: 1137
Location: Holly, MI | With over 400 square miles of open water and the Muskies roaming all over with very little structure to relate to I'll be happy to give out exact GPS coordinates of my last fish or any fish for that matter. That's Lake St Clair for ya! I've always been happy to tell folks where, speed, depth, color, conditions, etc. With the CPR practice as high as it is today I have not the slightest worry about not being able to find fish to catch. |
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Posts: 699
Location: Hugo, MN | Lambeau the city lake stuff is my concern. I am not so naive to think that if you sat out in a boat on a Saturday morning that you wouldn't be able to figure out where the spots are. It's really a pressure thing last year a walleye guy caught a 52" and to his credit he released it. But they put his photo in the paper and listed the lake, something else I disagree with unless it's LOTW, Mille Lacs, Leech, Cass, et. al., the following Saturday there were noticeably more guys chucking baits. When my partner and I finished fishing that morning we got to the launch and some clown in a Bayliner had a crowd and just couldn't wait to get to the bait shop to get his mid 40 inch fish weighed. He attributed his day's journey to the guy in the paper. These are the people I don't want to see on the lake. I have heard from a few people who agree with my post and a few who don't that's fine. I honestly wanted to see what people's opinions were. The key to continued success is finding the spot on the spot. However, as we both know from our Mantrap outing even those spots don't work somedays. I still refuse to believe that we didn't catch any fishies on the one spot next to the channel. We had Rocks, wind, cabbage but no muskies. |
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Posts: 699
Location: Hugo, MN | LOBI,
400 Sq. Miles? That would be nice. But the lake I am talking about is a measly 3.77 Sq. Miles with a Littoral area of just under 2 Sq. Miles.
Edited by marine_1 8/27/2004 12:50 PM
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Posts: 117
Location: champaign, illinois | I have a number of reasons to share specifics, and to be perfectly honest, they are selfish reasons.
If I share specific info on one lake, I usually receive specific info on another.
If I turn somebody on to muskie fishing because they caught one where I said, then I now have another ally for muskie fishing in general (read: more money for resource, more members in my clubs, yes, two.)
I enjoy seeing other people enjoying themselves. Or at least, hearing about it afterwards.
I've been offered (not bribed with); steak dinners, countless beers, lures, entry fees, etc., you get the picture.
So you see, in my selfishness, I actually gain by sharing. Did I mention comraderie?
Jay
Lake Shelbyville Muskie Club www.shelbyvillemuskie.com
and
Illinois Muskie Tournament Trail www.illmuskie.com |
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Posts: 32958
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Big difference between an article that goes out in a newspaper to a wide demographic group in the same community as the lake mentioned, and a post on a Muskie only website steeped in CPR ideals. My bet is the 'clown' in the Bayliner probably doesn't visit MuskieFIRST much. I sincerly hope he does, so he learns CPR ideals.
What makes the guy a 'clown'? The fact he probably had just boated his first muskie? Or the fact he has a Bayliner? Or is it the fact he obviously was uneducated as to the values of catch and release? Alienate those who do not yet know what we here take for granted, and everyone loses.
One cannot have it both ways, if one wishes to educate folks who need the new perspective, one needs to be able to communicate with them on a reasonable level, with patience and understanding, and bring them into the CPR community. Everyone has to start somewhere. |
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Posts: 1996
Location: Pelican Lake/Three Lakes Chain | Very well said Steve.
Many years ago I was the clown taking my first 45"er off the lake. Now, better educated and more versed in the CPR thing (plus I have the mount of that fish glaring at me as I type), I have been able to reach others on the benefits of CPR.
Knowledge of CPr is not something you are born with, at some point something has to awaken you to its obvious benefits. You will not awaken this knowledge in someone else by being confrontational.
Thankfully it was many years and many many muskies ago I learned the value of CPR.
Oh yeah, with the right attitude and demeanor, people will get a lot of spots from me too!!!
Edited by nwild 8/27/2004 1:06 PM
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Posts: 699
Location: Hugo, MN |
Norm,
My point was not that the info should not be shared. I just don't like to see specifics on boards. Seeing as I have heard from 2 guides here I am a bit surprised as this is your liveliehood. Nonetheless, points well taken and I will stop my whining about it in public thanks for a great discussion fellas. Have a great Weekend and someone catch a big one to post for all of us to ogle over on Monday morning!!! |
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Posts: 26
| Can I be in the middle of the road on this? For those of you not in the Mpls Metro, it might not be a big deal, I don't know your level of pressure or size of your lakes. But, it is an issue for lots of us here, not all, but lots. I'm all for sharing info at some level on a public forum, but why post exact spots on a 18K viewer site? Be helpful and post the pattern, lake, or time of day, etc. Let someone learn the lake themselves so they can do it elsewhere. But posting specific spots that might not be the milk run of every tom, dick, & harry in the however many million population here? I just don't get it. If somone wants more detail, we have ways of emailing each other if you'd like to ask me about where I got fish successfully, heck people have done it to me off this site after I posted a 49.5 a couple weeks ago. I corresponded and we exchanged good info. You can be helpful and exchange info without overdoing it. But to put all that out there for everyone to read...; get in line 'cuz the pressure just got worse. Herein lies the gospel of TMan.... over & out. |
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Posts: 1046
| I would have to agree with Marine 1 as in a sense that some spots are just to small to be broadcast over the internet period. Its a doubled edge sword, sharing is great but exact spots on small waters just spells trouble toward each other as fisherman, many times on said small waters! As some one said Mn. Metro, but I see it in Wi. and Mi. too! Seems to me some want there cake and eat it to, as the lake, baits, times,structures. We are musky fisherman not sheep. I like the info but the small waters you will never here a mention from myself or the many, many I fish with! Musky fishing would suck(to me) without all the fruitless trips, it builds musky fishing charater. I will always find and catch my own fish and patterns as I did before the internet, maybe I am just old school but the small spots stay in the mind not on the screen! |
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Posts: 7123
Location: Northwest Chicago Burbs | Give spots to the pinpoint detail.....or give areas of lakes.....just give the lake name.....or just the geographic area where the lake is in. Give the lure type.....give the way you worked the lure category.....or dont even say what the lure type.
Its all personal choice, we all have our opinions on what we should or shouldnt share.
One thing I will make personally clear, and I KNOW that both MarkH and Steve Worrall stand with me on this: MuskieFIRST will forever be the place that NO ONE will ever feel that they can't give details to WHATEVER level of specificity they feel appropriate. We want MuskieFIRST to be THE site for continuing education on muskies, one that will help to aid muskie fisherman of ALL levels in their pursuit. That will only happen as we maintain (and I dont mean just the moderators, its a tone we ALL set at MuskieFIRST) a community of muskie anglers who see one another as their brothers (and sisters) with a common goal: to learn more about muskies, to promote C&R, focus on the positive directions muskie fishing will take, help each other out with questions and quandries, and grow a community where information on all subjects muskie can be freely discussed.
Thus endeth the sermon, I need a smoke. |
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| one other thing i want to emphasize:
i understand that Marine_1's concern is about protecting a limited resource - so this isn't an issue of who's "right" and who's "wrong." everyone's right in that conservation is king.
he gives good examples about how listing details about success can be bad (newspaper article, etc.). personally i feel that in this setting, the good outweighs the bad. my opinion.
bottom line: i think we're all concerned about wise use of the resource and not "strip-mining" it. look at what a good discussion his question generated!
(Slamr, don't do it - that stuff will kill you...)
Edited by lambeau 8/27/2004 2:14 PM
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Posts: 184
Location: Rockford Il 61108 | To not share is simply selfish. Insecure people dont give out there spot or share the info on how to succeed. |
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Posts: 1769
Location: Algonquin, ILL | One thing to consider is if you go to a exact spot that someone tells you about you may not catch a fish there are a ton of variable that need to be considered time of day, weather, season, ETC. so don't blame the person if you blank on the spot but use your own experience as a tool to eliminate or add same type spots for future reference
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Posts: 484
Location: St. Louis, MO., Marco Is., FL, Nestor Falls, ON | Most of you who know me, know I am very specific about sharing information. I find that hard to do over the internet, but have had a number of folks who went the extra mile and contacted me directly. I have taken these folks fishing, marked maps for them and shown them the specifics of when, where and how. I'm 61 years old and have been fishing LOTW for 51 years. I learned so much from those who went before and I feel I have an obligation to pass that info on to others. I only ask that they not share some spots with guides because then the spots get hammered and these are spots that are not normally fished by others. I live on LOTW for 4 months each year and have plenty of opportunity to catch muskies. Others come up here for a week or two each summer. I am happy to help make their experience productive and enjoyable. If I can fish with them, coach a little and pass on my love of this area and by so doing, help preserve the habitat by CPR and also make a new friend....great! You can never have too many friends. Frequently I learn as much from them as they do from me. Who loses when that happens? If I say that I have been catching muskies on a perch Believer, in the Blueberry Narrows area, when the wind is blowing in from the West; that's about as specific as I can get without giving GPS coordinates. Of course, Marine 1 and I could give coordinates based on a thrust point and without an overlay everyone else would be out of luck. Want to give it a try, Marine 1? This old Gunney is willing if you are. Have a good one. Oh, by the way...did you notice that the continent shown on your USMC emblem is Africa, not North and South America? Weird!
Edited by rpieske 8/27/2004 7:02 PM
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Posts: 44
Location: St. Louis, MO | Hey Bob P, how many muskies this year?? Our annual trip to North/South Twin was my personal WORST this year. Caught a 44" within the first 15 minutes after launching the boat, then lost 8 muskies throught the week...
Send me an email in mid Sept. and perhaps we can hook up and go to Kinkaid or Otter.. |
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Posts: 699
Location: Hugo, MN | Gunny, with all due respect you're comparing apples and oranges. LOTW is nearly a million acres White Bear is 2,000. Again, I'm not saying we shouldn't share. I'm saying specifics shouldn't be posted. |
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Posts: 32958
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | To paraphrase Mick Dundee, this is sort of like the fleas arguing over who owns the dog they are on. Those 'spots' were there before any of us, will be there AFTER all of us, and in the case of a 2000 acre lake are probably pretty much common knowledge. It is probably one heck of a bunch better for the fishery to expend energy towards conservation/cpr ethic instead of protectionism, which doesn't work anyway. Those spots will, with good management and conservation ethics, be good spots to fish long after we are all pushing daisys.
If the learning curve is shortened here out of courtesy, I think that's fine. I have had some pretty high profile folks tell me I shouldn't give up exact spots, that everyone should have to EARN that information. I disagree. That's elitist, and in my very humble opinion, extremely inward looking. Since when do I have any claim to any 'spot'? What makes that spot MINE? OK, so one argues, "Yes, but WHY give up exact details??" To that, I answer, "Because I can. I know these things from time on the water and learning from others who were good enough to help me along the way. Pass it forward, gentlemen and ladies, and we all benefit."
The only exception to this for me is water that was passed on to me in confidence. That I will respect. Social mores are weird, aren't they?
Even well armed with the knowledge of a 'spot' on a map, one still has to apply a very impressive array of technique, boat control, presentation, and adaptation to conditions to produce results.
Last argument:
What the heck is the difference if a spot is described for an angler who is fishing the Metro lake anyway? That boat is already going to be on the water ( that is why the question was asked), that angler will already be on 'your' lake, and I am betting you will have to share a spot or ten anyway. At least if the guy is fishing it 'right', you won't have him cut you off cross drifting. Will a post on MuskieFIRST suddenly increase the pressure on a lake anywhere? Not by much. I can assure you most of us will not fire up the rig and head for the Twin Cities to fish today. So to get to the point, passing on better information to increase an angler's chance of success will not do any harm to that lake, but it might make some folks feel that way. Just remember the Mick Dundee analogy.
Marine_1, if you DO see anyone out on a Metro lake with a MuskieFIRST sticker you can rest easy your fish on your spot, if caught, will be returned in good health. Great topic, sir! |
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