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Posts: 4266
| I have been using nothing but House of Kolor paints since I started painting years ago. I never had the patience for water-based paints and putting on multiple layers and I loved their Kameleon Kolors that changed colors right before your eyes. Lately the price of Kameleon Kolors has tripled, so I called tech support to ask why. I couldn't believe the answer. The US Treasury has purchased all of House of Kolor's Kameleon pearls to use in currency. Different bills, different colors. This way if they buy it all, and get it exclusively, they will be the only ones with it. The hell with muskie lures that change color, they want it all. I talked to another guy who makes the actual pigments, so I can buy those and make my own paint, more or less. I don't think they willbe the same as the originals.
Thought you would find this just another amusing way that lure painting gets affected by outside agencies. I'm going to ration what I have left. To think I used to use it on every lure. |
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Posts: 283
| I was actually going to send you a PM about the House of Kolor paint after the holidays as I want to switch over from water based, I didn't have a big budget so I wanted to get some insight on what I would need to start out but it sounds like I may need to go a different route now.
Edited by Tigerhunter 1/3/2015 6:20 PM
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Posts: 4266
| It's only the Kameleon Kolors that were affected. I highly recommend the rest of the paints. One coat coverage and 60 second drying time. You'll love it. I do. |
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Posts: 791
Location: WI | Beaver , I use DuPont chromalusion paints which achieve the same effect. It's $50 an ounce but available.
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Posts: 4266
| I can get color-shifting flakes, but Kameleon was/is the only color changing pearl. Guys who got lures with Kameleon pearls on it can attest that it was something that you had to see in the sun. I used to use lots of Copper/Red in sucker patterns or anything for stained waters, but I just find it amusing that Uncle Sam needs it for money.With all of the people that they employ, they have to take color shifting paint away from people who paint cars, motorcycles and fishing lures. They make all sorts of color-shifting products, but the Kameleon colors were something new and different. I still have a few bottles, I wonder if I have to worry about the feds coming into my garage?
I can get the flakes that are one color on one side and another on the other side but the pearls are different. It shouldn't matter when we still catch fish on all black lures or red headed bumblebee. Does color-shifting paint really matter to the fish? Even if it doesn't, it sure looks cool. |
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| industry secret; paint catch the fisherman, the lures action catch the fish. We all know that , yet continue to bite. love it! |
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Posts: 791
Location: WI | I'm telling you beaver check out DuPont chromalusion paints. They have a dozen or so different colors |
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Posts: 4266
| That is similar to HOK's Metalust or it's Purple/Blue Kameleon. They had a dozen Kameleon colors...Green'Gold,Gold /Silver, Copper/Red, Copper/Green, Purple/Blue, Blue/Red and more, but now they are selling them all out to the mint. They have others that are still mind blowing, like Prism effect and Metalust, where the lure never looks the same, but in the end, I'll settle for a pattern with contrast and eyes that stand out to catch fish. Yes, colors catch fishermen and not fish. But throwing a black Mepps or Suick all day will drive you nuts, and also catch a bunch of fish. What fun would it be if we all painted different shades of black? We'd still be throwing Weagles painted with appliance paint. |
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Posts: 1202
Location: Money, PA | I use nothing but water based paints...I never have to apply multiple layers...The water based paints of today can compete with the best of lacquer based auto paints IMO. And you DO NOT have to deal with PIA clean up OR fumes from harmful inhalants, IMO the best part. Also, reducers and thinners are much harder on airbrushes than latex, alcohol and water. I am using the same Iwata airbrush I started painting with along with its original components.
I can also achieve the same color changing properties by using water based iridescent paints...
Edited by ShutUpNFish 1/5/2015 7:29 AM
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Posts: 283
| Hey Paul- I love your paint jobs. I would love to stay with water based since I can spray it in the house and clean it up in the kitchen sink. Maybe I am interpreting what you said wrong but I'm not following what you said about not applying multiple coats with water based.
I tried the spaz stix mirror chrome with a respirator in my garage and I loved the fact that by the time I rinsed the brush with the lacquer thinner I could spray the chrome on over the backer I sprayed a minute earlier. The only con is that I practically have to spray it outside. I don't mind the cleanup too bad...yet. |
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Posts: 4266
| When I started making and painting lures more than a decade ago, I tried water-based paints and tossed them in the garbage. Multiple coats, hanging the lures in a heated cooler for 20 minutes before you could touch them just wasn't for me. I started using House of Kolor automotive paints right after that and have never changed. One coat coverage and super fast drying time. Clean up is nothing. I use a little bit of reducer each time I change colors and a little when I'm done. I have a painting room that has a vent in it and I wear a respirator when I paint. I do that when wood working too. It should be the same for water based paints. I love the paints that I use, the quality and the convenience so I won't change. I can paint a lure and put scale netting on it by the time I change colors in the cup. I realize water based paints are different now than they were ten years ago, but I like what I use. I just figure if The Treasury Dept. wants to use them they must be good. As far as color changing paints, HOK came out with Kameleon Kolors and color shifting pearls and flakes long ago. Others have followed suit since then and apparently I'm going to have to find something different. But since I mix many of my own paints, finding color shifting dry flakes won't be hard, it's color shifting pearls that are hard to make. Most color changing paints are ultra small pieces of Mylar that are one color on one side and a different color on the other blended with an agent that helps them to lay flat. Even though the Kameleons are being bought up, they have come out with different special effects to make lures pretty. Like I've said before, we can make them fancy colors that do crazy things and still catch fish on black. |
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Posts: 1202
Location: Money, PA | I never said anything about your paints being bad Beaver...I have been working with "paints" all of my life being an art teacher and designer. They all have their pros and cons...for years, you could never achieve the crispness and brightness of automotive lacquers with water based...thats why MOST lure makers used them. However, these days, the water based paints are pretty close or as good in brilliance and or brightness/crispness. As for drying time; that is different as well....if you reduce with water, you will have a longer drying time because water evaporates much slower than reducers or thinners....Many of the water based paints come with specialized alcohol based reducers which increase drying time and there are other trade secrets which inhibit almost instant drying allowing for immediate layering of water based paint. I have used both at their best and FOR ME, water based is better because of a few factors as stated before.....Not near as toxic and easier more economical clean-up AND less harsh on my equipment - Bottom Line. Not even mentioning other conveniences such as disposal...
With all this said STILL, I believe ANY paint is as good as the coating which protects it...The one beauty of epoxy clear coating is the depth, magnification and clarity it creates which makes the color detail underneath "POP" so nicely. I can create "chameleon" effects as well, but it is certainly a little more work than just pouring it out of a bottle of pre made paint made that way. I'm willing to bet there is probably a water based chameleon style paint out there now anyway.
Edited by ShutUpNFish 1/6/2015 9:35 AM
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Posts: 31
| Has anyone used the Dupont Mirage kits? |
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Posts: 791
Location: WI | DuPont mirage kits are just a spray can version of DuPont chromalusion paints. If you have an airbrush you can buy it by the ounce at your local automotive paint supply. The reason it comes with black is because it shows up best over black or dark colors. |
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Posts: 1202
Location: Money, PA | I forgot to mention two important factors in regards to water based paints....One, it is much cheaper than lacquer based paints. Two, a common mistake many people make, IMO, with the water based paints is to dilute the paints....There is NO need to do so with any of the paints except for some pearls and metallics. And if dilution is necessary, do not use water...water just washes out the pigments...use an alcohol based dilution. Many of the latex based paint manufacturers today offer reducers that work great.
Beav, it really sucks that what you are used to using may no longer be available. However, one thing I have learned about this business is that suppliers/components/materials come and go and change often...I guess we must learn to go with changes and be open to trying and dealing with getting used to new or updated materials to make our products the best they can be. If that makes sense.
Edited by ShutUpNFish 1/7/2015 7:28 AM
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Posts: 531
| Beaver, I understand where your coming from. I also started out using water base, and lived the same frustration... I get it. Only I started out with water base maybe 3 or 4 years ago. So I am still green compared to you. If you still want to use that paint you may end up having to charge a couple bucks more per bait, most people understand. Heck if the US mint is using that paint it must be good stuff!!!
When I used the water base products of today I |
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Posts: 531
| Beaver, I understand where your coming from. I also started out using water base, and lived the same frustration... I get it. Only I started out with water base maybe 3 or 4 years ago. So I am still green compared to you. If you still want to use that paint you may end up having to charge a couple bucks more per bait, most people understand. Heck if the US mint is using that paint it must be good stuff!!!
When I used the water base products of today I get a headache and need to use my respirator. So regardless I wear it for which ever type of paint i use. As I do have some water base i still use, but mainly use automotive paint.
Beaver Hope you find a solution, i know TCP global has that paint, probably still a higher price than what you want |
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Posts: 910
Location: Hastings, mn, 55033 | No offense to anyone but I find this very hard to believe. In all likelihood its an excuse made up by some salesman. Th US Treasury would not use some off the shelf auto paint to print currency, for cripes sake. They contract for very exclusive, i.e.illegal to sell to outsiders under penalty of law, materials for printing currency. Heck it is against the law to possess the same rag stock paper used for printing bills!
Perhaps someone found this paint is being used to counterfeit currency and was being removed from shelves because of that? But I can about gaurantee there isn't some guy dumping 2oz bottles of Kameleon paint into an offset printers ink trays! |
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Posts: 4266
| I heard it right from the guy who heads up the tech department. I figure he has no reason to lie. Right now 2 of my favorites are impossible to find and all the others have tripled in price, I'll find something else to use, it's not like those are the only colors that I used. |
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