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Location: Athens, Ohio | Celebrate Earth Day, every day! m |
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| Proud to have had Sen. Nelson as our Wisconsin senator, who was critical not just to Earth Day, but pushing for legislation that forced the clean up of our waters. Every time I see guys fishing for walleye and muskies on the Wis. River near where I grew up in Wis. Rapids, I think about what an industrial sewer it was back in the 1950s and 1960s when I was growing up two blocks away. And that is not hyperbole, that is exactly how the river was used by industry and municipalities. They dumped anything and everything into the river. Highly toxic chemicals, partially treated and untreated sewage. When congress was debating the environmental laws of the early 70s, the paper mills spent a lot of money lobbying to get congress to designate the Wisconsin and other rivers as "Industrial Rivers", which meant they could keep dumping waste into them. Fortunately, congress was not as susceptible to big money back then, "Citizens United" was not the law of the land.
So, to all the young anglers who fish the Wisconsin, Lake Erie, and countless other bodies of water that benefitted from the environmental movement that spawned Earth Day, don't forget, it could easily be taken away if you don't appreciate it and hold legislators accountable. |
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Posts: 601
Location: Duluth | The St. Louis River right in my backyard has likely benefited more than any other body of water in the region, and there is still so much to be done.
FIL grew up in Brokaw, WI. he said basically the same thing as North of 8, river used to be a literal dumping ground. |
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| Talk about success stories, and I'm sure there are quite a few, but the Des Plaines and Chicago rivers in Il. are huge. Fishable populations of all species, even stories of muskies being caught in the Des Plaines. Kdawg |
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Location: Northwest Chicago Burbs | kdawg - 4/22/2020 9:14 AM
Talk about success stories, and I'm sure there are quite a few, but the Des Plaines and Chicago rivers in Il. are huge. Fishable populations of all species, even stories of muskies being caught in the Des Plaines. Kdawg
It really is amazing the fish populations and fishing opportunities that exist in N.IL and the Chicago area. It might not be Canada, but versus 60 yrs ago? We have fishable rivers all over, even the Fox Chain (though crowded as always) has a healthy lake makeup.
We can fight all we want about right vs. left politics (and I wont here because I was BANNED from all political commentary on M1st becasue my liberal atheist leanings have already destroyed M1st) BUT clean waters and air is something we all like more than pollution. |
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| CincySkeez - 4/22/2020 9:11 AM
The St. Louis River right in my backyard has likely benefited more than any other body of water in the region, and there is still so much to be done.
FIL grew up in Brokaw, WI. he said basically the same thing as North of 8, river used to be a literal dumping ground.
Cincy, the St. Louis is certainly a success but I saw silver bay up north of Duluth in 1970 when hundreds of tons of asbestos laden mining tailings were dumped into Lake Superior every day. Four of us going to Canada for walleye fishing stood on the bluff and even as guys in our late teens, we knew that was nuts. It spread out for a couple miles, so thick the waves were calmed, like you had dumped crude oil. |
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Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Slamr - 4/22/2020 9:22 AM
kdawg - 4/22/2020 9:14 AM
Talk about success stories, and I'm sure there are quite a few, but the Des Plaines and Chicago rivers in Il. are huge. Fishable populations of all species, even stories of muskies being caught in the Des Plaines. Kdawg
It really is amazing the fish populations and fishing opportunities that exist in N.IL and the Chicago area. It might not be Canada, but versus 60 yrs ago? We have fishable rivers all over, even the Fox Chain (though crowded as always ) has a healthy lake makeup.
We can fight all we want about right vs. left politics (and I wont here because I was BANNED from all political commentary on M1st becasue my liberal atheist leanings have already destroyed M1st ) BUT clean waters and air is something we all like more than pollution.
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Posts: 7011
Location: Northwest Chicago Burbs | Stop taunting me, DAD. |
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Posts: 601
Location: Duluth | Yep, FIL worked for the MPCA (37 years) and his first gig for them out of school was ensuring that the dumping of tailings into Lake Superior had indeed stopped. The toxins from Silver Bay were visible via aircraft for miles. |
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| CincySkeez - 4/22/2020 10:54 AM
Yep, FIL worked for the MPCA (37 years) and his first gig for them out of school was ensuring that the dumping of tailings into Lake Superior had indeed stopped. The toxins from Silver Bay were visible via aircraft for miles.
I think it is hard for a lot of people today to think that back then it was not looked at as a big deal. There was a woman, whose name escapes me, that lead a years long fight to get that stopped, even after asbestos was showing up in Duluth's drinking water. First time I took my kids up along the north shore, told them about that and they were incredulous. In their early years, we lived near Superior in the U.P. and visited often, so they thought of it as this clear, clean lake. Even lived on the other side of a city street from Lake Superior for a year and half (cured me of any desire to own a house on the big lake). |
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Location: Athens, Ohio | I worked for my state's EPA for 30+ years, 18 as a hazardous waste inspector during the start of the RCRA and CERCLA laws' implementation. I got to see some horrible things. One of my favorite stories, though was up in Harrison County. We got a call from the sheriff's dept.
A woman was sitting on her front porch one morning when she saw a dumptruck going down her road. It was full of barrels and was towing a backhoe. An hour or so later, she saw the truck come by empty and muddy. She'd just seen an episode of "Quincy" on TV where something like this happened, so she called the sheriff.
The sheriff followed the tracks to a field and saw recent digging, so our criminal investigators got a warrant and a backhoe and we dug up the drums. Full of paint waste from a body shop up north. Prosecuted with criminal convictions.
But, it was that lady calling in that made her my hero of the day. m |
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Posts: 601
Location: Duluth | When I was younger I always asked my Yooper grandpa why he never fished the big lake or Menominee River, his answer was always the same. Only streams with fish in them are the trout cricks, and lakes in logging areas.
I always thought he was being facetious until I understood the environmental damage that was done and left unchecked up until the late 70s |
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| Back in the 70s and into the 80s (and I'm sure prior to that), the Mississippi in St.Paul, was virtually devoid of fish. Now it has a year round catch and release fishery for walleye, and is probably the best place south of Mille Lacs, to catch a 27 to 30+ inch walleye. |
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Location: E. Tenn | Back then...Lake Erie was the Dead Sea, the Cuyahoga River burned, vs. now...
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Location: oswego, il | If lake Erie was the dead sea in the 70's(remember the Saturday Night Live commercial spoof for lake Erie drinking water called swill?), How bad was LSC at that time? We can also look at the world class trout and salmon fishing we have in lake Michigan, the tremendous walleye, sauger and white bass fishing in the Illinois river.
The biggest takeaway is to never be ignorant of history.
Edited by ToddM 4/23/2020 6:38 PM
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Location: E. Tenn | Todd: Even tho I left the South Side (right out of high school) in '73.. still got to enjoy the lake and its bounty until about 15 years ago, when life got in the way.. The last trip up over the holidays. I took the time to explore the old haunts. Never got out to the Illinois River much. |
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| Lake Michigan, for all the improvements, is an example of how far we have to go. Invasive species, like gobies, brought in by ships from the Atlantic, have almost eliminated native species like the yellow perch. 30 years ago, fish fries all over the Midwest were made from yellow perch, and it was as sustainable resource. But today there is a question whether the yellow perch will survive. And of course the inland lakes that have zebra mussels, etc., again brought by ships from the ocean to inland waters. That could have been stopped by regulation of their ballast but the industry has good lobbyists and fisherman and others who love our waters don't quite get it. |
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Location: E. Tenn | ...and there's the Asian carp that are about to find their way into Lake Michigan if they haven't already.. Down south they've made their way through Kentucky/Barkley Lakes, up the Tennessee and Cumberland to Chickamauga and Old Hickory Lakes above Chattanooga and Nashville.. |
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| miket55 - 4/23/2020 8:54 PM
...and there's the Asian carp that are about to find their way into Lake Michigan if they haven't already.. Down south they've made their way through Kentucky/Barkley Lakes, up the Tennessee and Cumberland to Chickamauga and Old Hickory Lakes above Chattanooga and Nashville..
They are in the Mississippi, which means they can go anywhere in the Midwest. Couple years ago I was working as a volunteer at the boat landing on the chain where I live for clean boats/clean water. Guy brought a very nice 24' pleasure boat to the landing, boat and trailer were spotless, looked like it just came from a showroom. I noticed he had Missouri plates. This was mid July and it would be the first time the boat was in the water that year. He said his family have stayed at an old resort on the chain for three generations. The boat was much older than it looked. He told me he had done a lot of boating on the Missouri river with his family but that the carp had gotten so bad, you spent more time ducking carp than enjoying time on the water, so they quit going. Really nice guy, someone who took immaculate care of his equipment, but no longer enjoyed using the boat. |
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Location: E. Tenn | North of 8 - 4/23/2020 10:21 PM
They are in the Mississippi, which means they can go anywhere in the Midwest.
There's a lot of aquaculture in the Lower Mississippi.. Grass carp were introduced to control algae and such. Unfortunately some bighead (Asian) carp got in the mix. Some of these ponds were inundated during major floods, and voila..they're everywhere up and down the Mississippi basin. |
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Posts: 33
| I remember back in the 60's and early 70's what a sewer the Fox River at Green Bay was... 6 inches of scum on top of the water in the summertime and the only fish over 5 pounds were the carp. Nice that that turned around, eh?
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Location: oswego, il | Asian carp were farmed in the Mississippi River flood plain and you can thank a lobbyist for making that happen. The 100 year flood of 96 introduced them to the river.
Funny thing about invasives. The Asians were supposed to destroy the Illinois. They have not. The zebras, gobies were going to destroy lake Michigan. They have not neither will Asian carp.
Edited by ToddM 4/24/2020 10:35 PM
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| ToddM - 4/24/2020 10:34 PM
Asian carp were farmed in the Mississippi River flood plain and you can thank a lobbyist for making that happen. The 100 year flood of 96 introduced them to the river.
Funny thing about invasives. The Asians were supposed to destroy the Illinois. They have not. The zebras, gobies were going to destroy lake Michigan. They have not neither will Asian carp.
They have not destroyed Michigan, but they have almost destroyed the most numerous native fish, the yellow perch. On the other hand, in Green Bay, the native Whitefish have taken off because in a very short period of time they have evolved to eat gobies. |
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Posts: 65
| I don’t like using hyperbole like invasives will “destroy” lakes, but the mussels pretty much did that to the Lake Huron pelagic fishery and are close to doing that in Lake Michigan. Granted, the fishery being destroyed is primarily the invasive/non-native alewife & chinook, but they are also severely impacting perch and whitefish.
It would be a mistake to understate the impact invasives have had on the Great Lakes. |
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| North of 8 - 4/25/2020 6:44 AM
ToddM - 4/24/2020 10:34 PM
Asian carp were farmed in the Mississippi River flood plain and you can thank a lobbyist for making that happen. The 100 year flood of 96 introduced them to the river.
Funny thing about invasives. The Asians were supposed to destroy the Illinois. They have not. The zebras, gobies were going to destroy lake Michigan. They have not neither will Asian carp.
They have not destroyed Michigan, but they have almost destroyed the most numerous native fish, the yellow perch. On the other hand, in Green Bay, the native Whitefish have taken off because in a very short period of time they have evolved to eat gobies.
The whitefish have also evolved to eating the zebes. Was ice fishing this winter with a guy who is a commercial fisherman on Green Bay, and he said that he was noticing that the whitefish had roughed up vents, and was wondering what that was all about. Then he realized they had been eating the mussels, and pooping out the shells had been roughing up their vents. |
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Location: oswego, il | Duke - 4/25/2020 9:32 AM
I don’t like using hyperbole like invasives will “destroy” lakes, but the mussels pretty much did that to the Lake Huron pelagic fishery and are close to doing that in Lake Michigan. Granted, the fishery being destroyed is primarily the invasive/non-native alewife & chinook, but they are also severely impacting perch and whitefish.
It would be a mistake to understate the impact invasives have had on the Great Lakes.
The Huron alewife population crashed if I am not mistaken and the Chinook population was not reduced like they did on lake Michigan (the beauty of hindsight). Agree there is a different balance but there are so many established invasives competing for the same food supply the Asian carp would need to sustain it will be a hard row. It's unfortunate the Chinook never adapted to eating goby like the other species have.
John perch are doing well in LM despite the invasives at least down here in fibland. Smelt on the other hand are gone.
Edited by ToddM 4/25/2020 11:32 AM
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| ToddM - 4/25/2020 11:30 AM
Duke - 4/25/2020 9:32 AM
I don’t like using hyperbole like invasives will “destroy” lakes, but the mussels pretty much did that to the Lake Huron pelagic fishery and are close to doing that in Lake Michigan. Granted, the fishery being destroyed is primarily the invasive/non-native alewife & chinook, but they are also severely impacting perch and whitefish.
It would be a mistake to understate the impact invasives have had on the Great Lakes.
The Huron alewife population crashed if I am not mistaken and the Chinook population was not reduced like they did on lake Michigan (the beauty of hindsight ). Agree there is a different balance but there are so many established invasives competing for the same food supply the Asian carp would need to sustain it will be a hard row. It's unfortunate the Chinook never adapted to eating goby like the other species have.
John perch are doing well in LM despite the invasives at least down here in fibland. Smelt on the other hand are gone.
"Now, in 2018, it may well have hit a new and alarming low.
In the DNR's most recent graded mesh assessment, only one perch was caught over four days of netting in waters off Milwaukee.
The work, done with nets featuring a range of mesh sizes designed to capture fish of different age classes, is considered the single best representation of the perch population.
For reference, thousands of fish were routinely caught in a single night of netting in the late 1980s.
And the only fish caught in the DNR's 2018 assessment was a 13-year-old female perch."
Edited by North of 8 4/25/2020 12:46 PM
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