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Zinox |
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Posts: 1100 | Beastly Backlash - 2/10/2018 10:46 AM Zinox - 2/10/2018 11:27 AM The size of the gears does not affect the cranking power, but it effects durability. It effects both, do the research. At the same time, I am going to take what you said and apply it to the Tranx 400; small gear plus micro teeth, equals not a long term investment. Your own words. Could you please show me some data that indicates an increase in "cranking power"? where i would guess you refer to their ability to transmit torque. If you believe you have sufficient data that shows just making gears larger increase their effectiveness, please share it, as they forgot to mention it at any of the Classes i have attended during my mechanical engineering education. Just making gears bigger does not change their effectiveness of transmitting power, if you increase the size of the gear and keep the module (size) teethes the same you can increase the number of teethes engaged with each other, but that effect would not be noticeable to the user, unless you are looking at some extreme cases of change in size. I would love to change my opinion on the subject, if you could provide me with some scientific article or paper that gives a proper explanation. | ||
| curleytail |
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Posts: 2687 Location: Hayward, WI | Beastly Backlash - 2/10/2018 9:55 AM curleytail - 2/9/2018 8:51 PM Beastly Backlash - 2/9/2018 12:21 AM My initial impression of the Tranx 400 is that it is not a true 400. I broke the reel down the other day and compared it too one of my Komodo 471SS's; I will compare it to one of my Lexa 400's this weekend. The main gear size difference between the Tranx 400 and the Komodo 471 was stark, the Tranx had a main gear with a diameter of 34mm while the Komodo had a 54mm dia. main gear. The main reason most of us would get a 400 sized baitcaster is for the increase in power due to the much larger main gears found in 400 sized low pros, the Tranx 400 simply isn't a true 400. Gear size, weight, and capacity are more in line with a 300 sized low pro. What Shimano did with the Tranx 400 would be like Honda listing the CBR600 is a liter class crotch rocket and referring to it as a CBR1000 when it is actually a 600. For glide baits, twitch baits, and Spring time lures, the Tranx 400 would be fine, but if you need power, just stick with a legit 400 sized low pro or go up to the Tranx 500 (but, just keep in mind that the Komodo 471SS has bigger gearing in a smaller and lighter package). What is the range of gear sizes that would be acceptable to you for a 400 series reel? What are the acceptable line capacity ranges? How do your expectations compare to the industry standard that must be adhered to? Perhaps there are no standards and they can configure and call the reel anything they want. No different than the H, XH, XXH ratings of rod manufacturers being far from standardized. They can call their products anything they want and it's up to the consumer to pay attention to the specifics that matter to them. Then the consumer decides if that piece of equipment will meet their requirements or not. Saying that this that and the other thing is misrepresented because of a non standard label name seems to be reaching a little. What is the stated line capacity of the Tranx 400? What are the line capacities of the Lexa 400 and Komodo 471? Line capacity determines what size class a reel fits into, Shimano stuck the Tranx 400 into the size class of the other two 400s. There is no standard for gear size when it comes to any reel, but gear size does matter a lot, especially when it comes to cranking power. If you need a reel with superior cranking power, you should consider the reels with the biggest gears in that reels class, in this case that would mean you need to go with a Lexa 400 or Komodo 471SS. The Tranx 400 fails in comparison to the other 400s. It is not my fault Shimano has falsely advertised the reels capacity, thus falsely representing the size class of the Tranx 400. Since you asked, the line capacity of the Lexa 400 is 300 yards of 55 pound braid. And you said it fits 50 yards of 50 pound 832? OH MY GOD! GROSS MISREPRESENTATION! How dare they include a 4 in the model number name! Looks like they may be even further off than Shimano. Okuma doesn't list braid specs so I can't even conpare. Did you fill your reel up until you couldnt turn the handle anymore? Did you spool under extreme tension? Which product from Powerpro did you use? What are the industry standards for measurinf line capacity? Do all manufacturers follow the STANDARD that makes sure all reels can be 100% accurately compared to each other? Sorry, it doesn't exist. I think you need to find some means aside from a simple line capacity spec to determine if the reel fits your specific requirements. Can you please explain to me how gear diameter makes a reel more or less powerful? My simple mind can understand how inches per crank and handle length can make a reel feel more or less powerful. The physical size of the gears, spool diameter, or even gear ratio it takes to get to that inches per crank? I can't wrap my head around how THAT makes any difference. Being that you've done the research maybe you could enlighten us about how that works or provide some links with the data that proves your point. | ||
| Beastly Backlash |
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Posts: 145 | Zinox - 2/10/2018 1:01 PM Beastly Backlash - 2/10/2018 10:46 AM Zinox - 2/10/2018 11:27 AM The size of the gears does not affect the cranking power, but it effects durability. It effects both, do the research. At the same time, I am going to take what you said and apply it to the Tranx 400; small gear plus micro teeth, equals not a long term investment. Your own words. Could you please show me some data that indicates an increase in "cranking power"? where i would guess you refer to their ability to transmit torque. If you believe you have sufficient data that shows just making gears larger increase their effectiveness, please share it, as they forgot to mention it at any of the Classes i have attended during my mechanical engineering education. Just making gears bigger does not change their effectiveness of transmitting power, if you increase the size of the gear and keep the module (size) teethes the same you can increase the number of teethes engaged with each other, but that effect would not be noticeable to the user, unless you are looking at some extreme cases of change in size. I would love to change my opinion on the subject, if you could provide me with some scientific article or paper that gives a proper explanation. Torque is correct, but you know what was meant. Next. | ||
| curleytail |
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Posts: 2687 Location: Hayward, WI | Uh, and how does gear SIZE affect torque then? | ||
| Beastly Backlash |
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Posts: 145 | curleytail - 2/10/2018 1:09 PM Beastly Backlash - 2/10/2018 9:55 AM curleytail - 2/9/2018 8:51 PM Beastly Backlash - 2/9/2018 12:21 AM My initial impression of the Tranx 400 is that it is not a true 400. I broke the reel down the other day and compared it too one of my Komodo 471SS's; I will compare it to one of my Lexa 400's this weekend. The main gear size difference between the Tranx 400 and the Komodo 471 was stark, the Tranx had a main gear with a diameter of 34mm while the Komodo had a 54mm dia. main gear. The main reason most of us would get a 400 sized baitcaster is for the increase in power due to the much larger main gears found in 400 sized low pros, the Tranx 400 simply isn't a true 400. Gear size, weight, and capacity are more in line with a 300 sized low pro. What Shimano did with the Tranx 400 would be like Honda listing the CBR600 is a liter class crotch rocket and referring to it as a CBR1000 when it is actually a 600. For glide baits, twitch baits, and Spring time lures, the Tranx 400 would be fine, but if you need power, just stick with a legit 400 sized low pro or go up to the Tranx 500 (but, just keep in mind that the Komodo 471SS has bigger gearing in a smaller and lighter package). What is the range of gear sizes that would be acceptable to you for a 400 series reel? What are the acceptable line capacity ranges? How do your expectations compare to the industry standard that must be adhered to? Perhaps there are no standards and they can configure and call the reel anything they want. No different than the H, XH, XXH ratings of rod manufacturers being far from standardized. They can call their products anything they want and it's up to the consumer to pay attention to the specifics that matter to them. Then the consumer decides if that piece of equipment will meet their requirements or not. Saying that this that and the other thing is misrepresented because of a non standard label name seems to be reaching a little. What is the stated line capacity of the Tranx 400? What are the line capacities of the Lexa 400 and Komodo 471? Line capacity determines what size class a reel fits into, Shimano stuck the Tranx 400 into the size class of the other two 400s. There is no standard for gear size when it comes to any reel, but gear size does matter a lot, especially when it comes to cranking power. If you need a reel with superior cranking power, you should consider the reels with the biggest gears in that reels class, in this case that would mean you need to go with a Lexa 400 or Komodo 471SS. The Tranx 400 fails in comparison to the other 400s. It is not my fault Shimano has falsely advertised the reels capacity, thus falsely representing the size class of the Tranx 400. Since you asked, the line capacity of the Lexa 400 is 300 yards of 55 pound braid. And you said it fits 50 yards of 50 pound 832? OH MY GOD! GROSS MISREPRESENTATION! How dare they include a 4 in the model number name! Looks like they may be even further off than Shimano. Okuma doesn't list braid specs so I can't even conpare. Did you fill your reel up until you couldnt turn the handle anymore? Did you spool under extreme tension? Which product from Powerpro did you use? What are the industry standards for measurinf line capacity? Do all manufacturers follow the STANDARD that makes sure all reels can be 100% accurately compared to each other? Sorry, it doesn't exist. I think you need to find some means aside from a simple line capacity spec to determine if the reel fits your specific requirements. Can you please explain to me how gear diameter makes a reel more or less powerful? My simple mind can understand how inches per crank and handle length can make a reel feel more or less powerful. The physical size of the gears, spool diameter, or even gear ratio it takes to get to that inches per crank? I can't wrap my head around how THAT makes any difference. Being that you've done the research maybe you could enlighten us about how that works or provide some links with the data that proves your point. 250yds of 50lb Sufix 832, not 50yds. Sufix 832 is pretty thick. My purpose for bringing up the capacities of other bigger reels was to demonstrate just how much smaller the Tranx 400 is compared to how it is advertised. And you guys were the ones who started up with referring to spool size/line capacity as being the basis for determining a reels size. I called you out on it. And, as pointed out because the engineer wanted to be technical, larger main gears increase torque. As anglers, we define a reel's torque as how powerful the reel is. If a large main gear was not benifical to improving a reel's torque, the Tranx 500 would not have a 50mm main gear, would it? | ||
| curleytail |
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Posts: 2687 Location: Hayward, WI | Spool size was brought up as a general comparison. Sure. And in general they are similar. Seems you felt Shimano is misrepresenting their 400 because you can't put the stated line capacity on it too. Sounds like the same deal with Daiwa...sooo....??? Torque? You've done the research. Please enlighten us. Larger gear sizes can increase durability, which seems like a desirable trait in a large saltwater reel. Can you share your data regarding how it relates to torque? | ||
| Beastly Backlash |
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Posts: 145 | curleytail - 2/10/2018 1:38 PM Uh, and how does gear SIZE affect torque then? The engineer can explain. My understanding is based off observation and experience. Your car's transmission is made up of multiple gears, the first gear generates the most torque inorder to begin the process of moving, it is also the biggest gear. | ||
| curleytail |
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Posts: 2687 Location: Hayward, WI | The engineer asked you to explain because what you are trying to say does not make sense. Gears...wow. The reason your first gear on a car is more powerful is because the engine has to turn it more times to move the car say 100 feet. 2nd gear is less powerful because the motor turns fewer times to move the car the same distance. If you put much taller tires on your truck it might feel less powerful. The gear ratios or sizes didn't change, but the distance the truck moves with each rev of the engine increases, meaning it is doing more "work." In reels, the inches per turn makes the angler work more or less. Only a longer lever - the reel handle makes it easier to reel. A shorter handle makes it harder. A reel with a lower inch per crank is easier to reel because less "work" is done per each crank. YOU may want to do some research. I'm done. These conversations never straighten out. | ||
| Beastly Backlash |
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Posts: 145 | curleytail - 2/10/2018 1:51 PM Spool size was brought up as a general comparison. Sure. And in general they are similar. Seems you felt Shimano is misrepresenting their 400 because you can't put the stated line capacity on it too. Sounds like the same deal with Daiwa...sooo....??? Torque? You've done the research. Please enlighten us. Larger gear sizes can increase durability, which seems like a desirable trait in a large saltwater reel. Can you share your data regarding how it relates to torque? Shimano did misrepresent the size of their reel based on the listing of their line capacity. Most people who don't already have the Tranx 400 are comparing this reel to your Lexa 400, Komodo 400, and Tranx 500 because they assume, based on how Shimano represents the reel, that it is in the same class as these other reels, specifically the true 400 sized reels. I don't see why people are so offended for me calling out the Tranx 400. The reel is what it is, a 300. I don't want people continuing to see the Tranx 400 as an alternative to the other legit 400's. People also need to know that your Lexa and Komodo 300's are a much cheaper, same quality, same size, just as good performing options as the Tranx 400. The Tranx 400 and Beast 60 compare at simular price points and match up well, but the Beast 60 isn't misrepresented in size. | ||
| Beastly Backlash |
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Posts: 145 | curleytail - 2/10/2018 2:05 PM The engineer asked you to explain because what you are trying to say does not make sense. Gears...wow. The reason your first gear on a car is more powerful is because the engine has to turn it more times to move the car say 100 feet. 2nd gear is less powerful because the motor turns fewer times to move the car the same distance. If you put much taller tires on your truck it might feel less powerful. The gear ratios or sizes didn't change, but the distance the truck moves with each rev of the engine increases, meaning it is doing more "work." In reels, the inches per turn makes the angler work more or less. Only a longer lever - the reel handle makes it easier to reel. A shorter handle makes it harder. A reel with a lower inch per crank is easier to reel because less "work" is done per each crank. YOU may want to do some research. I'm done. These conversations never straighten out. I gave an example. An the engineer already admitted that a bigger gear equals more torque. I also explained that he was right in that the correct term was torque; as power and torque are two different things when looking at the technical definitions. I also admitted that when fisherman speak of a reel as being powerful, what they really mean, and what I really meant, is that the reel has more torque. Torque is what allows you to crank a double 12 like it is nothing, and more then likely when discussing that point in the past you referred to the reel as being powerful, not torquey. | ||
| curleytail |
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Posts: 2687 Location: Hayward, WI | Done. Done done done, LOL! | ||
| 4amuskie |
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| I'll gladly stick with the Tranx "400" any day, all day, everyday. Just might be the best reel ever made. | |||
| Beastly Backlash |
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Posts: 145 | 4amuskie - 2/10/2018 2:27 PM I'll gladly stick with the Tranx "400" any day, all day, everyday. Just might be the best reel ever made. It is a great reel, just not when compared to your Lexa 400 or Komodo 400. When looking at the actually size and performance abilities of the Tranx 400, you have to compare it to the Lexa or Komodo 300's, at that point the Tranx is over priced by $100 plus dollars, the only advantage being the seals which are not necessary for FW anglers. | ||
| Zinox |
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Posts: 1100 | Just to be clear I did not say that larger gear gives more torque/power/efficiency in any fishing reels. For that to be noticeable we would have to look at extreme cases, that no manufacturer would ever produce. | ||
| Beastly Backlash |
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Posts: 145 | Zinox - 2/10/2018 3:02 PM Just to be clear I did not say that larger gear gives more torque/power/efficiency in any fishing reels. For that to be noticeable we would have to look at extreme cases, that no manufacturer would ever produce. I wonder why they just didn't put a 20mm gear into the Tranx 500. Tell us, why didn't they? Tells us all! Lol! If gear size doesn't matter, why are you the only person I have ever heard make that claim in seriousness? How about you look up the new video from Tackle Advisors where he talks about main gear size and how it makes a difference, the guys is a Shimano fan boy if there ever was one too. Hell, the makers should just produce reels with main gears the same size as pinion gears. What do you think? Would definitely make a fishing reel much lighter if they just used tiny main gears. I think is interesting that on a previous thread regarding this reel, it is stated that Shimano reps openly admit that the Tranx 400 is not suited for use with high resistance lures. | ||
| Beastly Backlash |
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Posts: 145 | Zinox, you care to send emails to the reel manufacturers and tell them they are making the reels incorrectly? You should tell Shimano that the 50mm main gear of the Tranx 500 is pointless and they were fools for making that main gear so large. You should tell them the main gear should be no bigger then 10mm. Go ahead! How about you email Diawa and Okuma and tell them how much more you know then their armies of engineers. | ||
| anzomcik |
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Posts: 530 | Skimming through this post fast. Couple things. There is an appropriate size range of gears for an application. There are different material that are acceptable. If everything else equal and ipt is 34” , gear ratio of 5:1 and another reel 5:1 only bigger gears= No noticeable difference because your still bring in the same bait with the same feel from the user at the same ipt. Please prove how it could be different. | ||
| 4amuskie |
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Beastly Backlash - 2/10/2018 1:38 PM 4amuskie - 2/10/2018 2:27 PM I'll gladly stick with the Tranx "400" any day, all day, everyday. Just might be the best reel ever made. It is a great reel, just not when compared to your Lexa 400 or Komodo 400. When looking at the actually size and performance abilities of the Tranx 400, you have to compare it to the Lexa or Komodo 300's, at that point the Tranx is over priced by $100 plus dollars, the only advantage being the seals which are not necessary for FW anglers. [/QUOTE I have no idea where your getting your information but it's in error. There is no comparison and it's worth every penny of the 100 and more. | |||
| Beastly Backlash |
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Posts: 145 | anzomcik - 2/10/2018 7:36 PM Skimming through this post fast. Couple things. There is an appropriate size range of gears for an application. There are different material that are acceptable. If everything else equal and ipt is 34” , gear ratio of 5:1 and another reel 5:1 only bigger gears= No noticeable difference because your still bring in the same bait with the same feel from the user at the same ipt. Please prove how it could be different. Try it. Who do you know would pick a Toro Beast 60 over a Tranx 500PG for double 12's? Then get back to me. | ||
| Beastly Backlash |
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Posts: 145 | There is no comparing a Tranx 400 to the Lexa 400's or Komodo 400's because the Tranx 400 can't and won't hold up to the use that those other two reels can tank. If it is worth every penny of the $100 to you, that is good and fine, just don't expect the Tranx 400 to handle cranking in what those other two reels can handle. I have been very objective about this subject, I can't say the same for anyone else. | ||
| curleytail |
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Posts: 2687 Location: Hayward, WI | Beastly Backlash - 2/10/2018 7:20 PM I have been very objective about this subject, I can't say the same for anyone else. Scholar and gentleman, no doubt. | ||
| JTHIRY |
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Posts: 28 | Beastly Backlash - 2/10/2018 7:20 PM There is no comparing a Tranx 400 to the Lexa 400's or Komodo 400's because the Tranx 400 can't and won't hold up to the use that those other two reels can tank. Have you used the Tranx yet? | ||
| anzomcik |
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Posts: 530 | I ask to prove how it could be different, and I get a question for an answer. It is clear you do not know what your talking about. Let’s be honest, you can’t prove what your claiming. Because it isn’t true. You love your other reels, but you needed to find an angle to take a stance that the ones you love are better. The only thing you came up with is a difference in gear size. So your grinding an unprovable argument on how one design has to be better (even though it isn’t, all reels fall into an acceptable size of their designs). It is making you look silly It’s human to make mistakes, the unfortunate thing about posts like this is many people will take what your saying as something that’s really a thing (it isn’t, you have been asked to prove it and you have nothing). But if you keep yelling louder other will believe your misguided information. That hurts their decision making unless your end goal is to have them buy exactly what you are telling them to buy. | ||
| Beastly Backlash |
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Posts: 145 | JTHIRY - 2/10/2018 8:38 PM Beastly Backlash - 2/10/2018 7:20 PM There is no comparing a Tranx 400 to the Lexa 400's or Komodo 400's because the Tranx 400 can't and won't hold up to the use that those other two reels can tank. Have you used the Tranx yet? Yes, but just for initial impressions, as I originally stated. It will get worked over pretty good over the course of the season though, should be fun seeing what it can do well over the course of time. Nothing like an extended stress test to high light strengths and weaknesses; I will be using it the same way as I use my Lexa and Komodo 400s which have proven to be able to handle nearly anything and both already have a record for handling fish most people would never have expected a low pro to be able to handle. Did you ever see the 120lb bluefin tuna caught using an original Lexa 400? That is a #*^@ good feat for a low pro. | ||
| Beastly Backlash |
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Posts: 145 | anzomcik - 2/10/2018 8:50 PM I ask to prove how it could be different, and I get a question for an answer. It is clear you do not know what your talking about. Let’s be honest, you can’t prove what your claiming. Because it isn’t true. You love your other reels, but you needed to find an angle to take a stance that the ones you love are better. The only thing you came up with is a difference in gear size. So your grinding an unprovable argument on how one design has to be better (even though it isn’t, all reels fall into an acceptable size of their designs). It is making you look silly It’s human to make mistakes, the unfortunate thing about posts like this is many people will take what your saying as something that’s really a thing (it isn’t, you have been asked to prove it and you have nothing). But if you keep yelling louder other will believe your misguided information. That hurts their decision making unless your end goal is to have them buy exactly what you are telling them to buy. You can answer my question. I have already explained what I need to in previous posts, try reading rather then skimming. Maybe you can explain how the main gear of the Tranx 400 is more advantageous vs the main gear of the Tranx 500s, Komodo 400s, and Lexa 400's. | ||
| Beastly Backlash |
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Posts: 145 | I don't see anyone recommending the Tranx 400 for anything more the rubber, double 8's max, or smaller cranks. (But, be rest assured, I will be cranking double 12's with the Tranx 400 just for kicks.) Why? Even if the effort to crank a lure in might feel the same on a reel with a small main gear vs a reel with a larger main gear if ipt is similar or the same, how long will that reel with the smaller main gear actually last? Hint, it is why you don't use a bass reel for musky lures. But, please stop ignoring the fact that larger gears improve torque because they are more efficient at transferring that torque through the drive train then a smaller gear. It is why we have bigger and bigger low pro reels to begin with. It is also why a spinning reel like the Diawa BG can crank like a champ vs a Penn Battle. | ||
| anzomcik |
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Posts: 530 | Do you mind giving me a break down of the material of each gear for different reels, the grade ex: 303SS 316ss? Have they gone through any heat treatment. What are their pitch and pressure angles? A gear isn’t just a gear. You are going completely on the most obvious charistic and making a judgment call solely on that. In the example I gave you do understand the gear teeth engage proportionaly the same amount on both reels, if the gears are made of the same material the wear would be the same... | ||
| curleytail |
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Posts: 2687 Location: Hayward, WI | Beastly Backlash - 2/10/2018 8:21 PM I don't see anyone recommending the Tranx 400 for anything more the rubber, double 8's max, or smaller cranks. (But, be rest assured, I will be cranking double 12's with the Tranx 400 just for . Some have. Even in this very thread. But like you've proven time and time again, you've turned a blind eye towards anything that doesn't fit your perception of reality or theory. This is getting to be one of the most comical threads I've seen unfold on here in quite some time. Theory this. Gears that. The proof is in performance. Go beat your 400 Tranx up next year and report back next winter after the season is over. P.s. who ever said that any 400 series reel could take the abuse of high speed cranking of 10s or 12s for an extended length of time in the first place? | ||
| Beastly Backlash |
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Posts: 145 | curleytail - 2/10/2018 9:44 PM Beastly Backlash - 2/10/2018 8:21 PM I don't see anyone recommending the Tranx 400 for anything more the rubber, double 8's max, or smaller cranks. (But, be rest assured, I will be cranking double 12's with the Tranx 400 just for . Some have. Even in this very thread. But like you've proven time and time again, you've turned a blind eye towards anything that doesn't fit your perception of reality or theory. This is getting to be one of the most comical threads I've seen unfold on here in quite some time. Theory this. Gears that. The proof is in performance. Go beat your 400 Tranx up next year and report back next winter after the season is over. P.s. who ever said that any 400 series reel could take the abuse of high speed cranking of 10s or 12s for an extended length of time in the first place? From my experience, the Komodo and Lexa 400's can handle that kind of abuse and do handle that kind of abuse. I think it is comical that so many musky anglers (that would otherwise argue the virtues of bigger gears for greater cranking power) would get their panties in such a bunch over the idea that someone pointed out that it is better for reels to have those bigger gears. In this thread alone I have dealt with guys who claim that the Beast 60 has a smaller gear then the Tranx 400, claims that the Tranx 500 and Tranx 400 have similar sized gears, claims that tiny gears have just as much power/torque (or what ever the heck you want to call it) vs bigger gears, that the Tranx 400 is the greatest large low pro ever (with out quantifying their statement), "engineers" that no more then all the engineers combined from all the major reel manufacturers, etc... The list goes on when it comes to the comical bologna I have had to deal with in this thread and yet I am the one who is turning a blind eye? Comical. And it all started with me simply pointing out how Shimano misrepresented the size of the Tranx 400 by misstating the line capacity, which effectively put the Tranx 400 into the 400 size class of low pro reels. Everyone kept saying that a reel's actual size is based on the line capacity, but they didn't want to admit that the line capacity listed puts the Tranx 400 in competition with the other two 400s. People would rather compare it to the other 300 sized low pros, but then they want to turn around and contradict themselves by saying the Tranx 400 can compete with the other 400s in performance. Comical. | ||
| anzomcik |
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Posts: 530 | Ok let’s try this again. If everything else equal and ipt is 34” , gear ratio of 5:1 and another reel 5:1 only bigger gears= No noticeable difference because your still bring in the same bait with the same feel from the user at the same ipt. Please prove how it could be different. Explain how the bigger gears have more torque? The shafts are turning at the same rpm, but one is more powerful. Using your logic we can increase the gear size so big that it eventually will reel itself in? Perpetual motion! You just discovered a huge break through in science, the world will finally breaks its dependence of fossil fuels! | ||
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