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Posts: 512
| morning all, looking at purchasing a boat and it will come with surge brakes. ive never had a trailer with brakes, and I'm reading a lot of horror stories about problems going through mountains with them, overheating and such.
just wondered about your experiences, and if it would be hard to switch to electric or just turn em off when going through the mountains?
thanks,
Dave |
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Posts: 3469
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | Hiya,
Surge brakes will activate when you are going downhill, given the trailer is pushing against your tow vehicle...that would be the issue people would run into.
I know you can lock them out for going in reverse using a manual lock out, but many trailers have that as an automatic feature built into the electrical system/actuator for when you are in reverse...the lock will engage so the brakes do not engage if you were backing up a hill...
I would think there would be a way to get it done to lock the brakes out of use somehow... I'll do a little research to see what I can find. I could see your main thought here...that pull to florida... 
Steve
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Posts: 512
| VMS - 4/4/2019 8:56 AM
Hiya,
Surge brakes will activate when you are going downhill, given the trailer is pushing against your tow vehicle...that would be the issue people would run into.
I know you can lock them out for going in reverse using a manual lock out, but many trailers have that as an automatic feature built into the electrical system/actuator for when you are in reverse...the lock will engage so the brakes do not engage if you were backing up a hill...
I would think there would be a way to get it done to lock the brakes out of use somehow... I'll do a little research to see what I can find. I could see your main thought here...that pull to florida...
Steve
ha yep, that's it exactly Steve..
ill send ya the boat I'm looking at in a few..
thanks man.. |
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Location: Eastern Ontario | Is there no option for electric brakes on the trailer. I've had no issues with surge brakes on some pretty big hills but never towed in the mountains. The new trailers i've been looking at all come with electric brakes. |
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Posts: 512
| horsehunter - 4/4/2019 9:16 AM
Is there no option for electric brakes on the trailer. I've had no issues with surge brakes on some pretty big hills but never towed in the mountains. The new trailers i've been looking at all come with electric brakes.
well that's a thought I had, was looking to switch from surge to electric
might go that route if its doable, and not terribly expensive
just always thought that could be an issue launching and such but not sure driving in a rainstorm would be any wetter than launching. |
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Location: 31 | There will be a pin you can insert in the trailer tongue that will prevent the surge brakes from activating, I use it all the time to move my boat with my skid loader.
I also tow with a large vehicle and really don't need trailer brakes, with my old boat I towed most of the time with the surge brakes completely disengaged.
Edited by Jerry Newman 4/4/2019 3:08 PM
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Posts: 512
| Jerry Newman - 4/4/2019 9:38 AM
Not if you know this or it's even going to matter to you but there will be a pin you can insert in the trailer tongue that will prevent the surge brakes from activating, I use it all the time to move my boat with my skid loader.
I also tow with a large vehicle and really don't need trailer brakes, with my old boat I towed most of the time with the surge brakes disengaged.
I thought I saw that, but do all actuators or surge brake systems have this option?? |
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Posts: 3469
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | Hiya,
I believe they might.
You can make the change over to electric brakes but I believe unless you go to electric over hydraulic, you would need to replace your whole brake system with drums. Then the brakes are controlled by the brake actuator on your truck and you can adjust the amount of braking the trailer does through the actuator.
For electric over hydraulic, you would need to install an actuator on the trailer that when you press the brake it sends a signal to an actuator that controls the trailer brakes via hydraulic pressure. Not sure where you would mount it, but this would be the ideal system if your trailer would come with hydraulic surge brakes. you'd keep them on, and plumb the trailer lines to the actuator, which is then hooked to your brake system on the truck.
Steve |
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Posts: 512
| hmm, food for thought
hopefully I can just lock them out while going through the mountains
if not, I may look into this option..
thanks Steve |
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Location: Eastern Ontario | I wasn't suggesting switching surge to electric but would suggest ordering the trailer with electric brakes. |
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Posts: 93
| VMS - 4/4/2019 8:56 AM
I would think there would be a way to get it done to lock the brakes out of use somehow... I'll do a little research to see what I can find.
Do you own surge brakes on your trailer such that you have firsthand experience?
Asking for a friend.
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Location: 31 | Dave T. - 4/4/2019 9:42 AM
Jerry Newman - 4/4/2019 9:38 AM
There will be a pin you can insert in the trailer tongue that will prevent the surge brakes from activating, I use it all the time to move my boat with my skid loader.
I also tow with a large vehicle and really don't need trailer brakes, with my old boat I towed most of the time with the surge brakes completely disengaged.
I thought I saw that, but do all actuators or surge brake systems have this option??
Not 100% sure on this but I have not seen one without that option. I've had 2 Ranger trailers and they both have had it. |
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Posts: 512
| horsehunter - 4/4/2019 2:24 PM
I wasn't suggesting switching surge to electric but would suggest ordering the trailer with electric brakes.
its a used boat, it has surge on the trailer |
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Posts: 229
| Like was mentioned above, mine has a hole that can be locked out with a pin or a large bolt and nut. When I was having some master cylinder issues I locked my brakes out completely for a couple months. |
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Posts: 1209
| I would run them as they are, if you come across a 10 mile decent stop after 5 and pour a bottle of water on each wheel. I wouldn't want to not have breaks encase I need them. So your saying the boat pushing down hill applies the breaks, you are right but as soon as the breaks grab, it releases most of the pressure and just ever so lightly drags along. Add in wheels roll resistance and wind resistance it's minimal when they are working correctly.
A old trailer that may have an issue as simple as air in one line over working the other side will definitely get hot. Just run itthe wind flowing past the wheels will cool a lot.
My experience with performance motorcycles and spots cars is they can glow orange and it won't hurt much al least not in 5 minutes |
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Posts: 512
| true, but I'm not worried about the brakes getting hot, I'm worried about the hubs/bearings/grease getting hot and ruining the seals and such
then I have a huge fail up in the mountains which wouldn't be fun at all! |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | Should have a lock out ability. I don’t think I’ve seen any that don’t. You probably already know this but your engine should do most of the braking coming down the mountains. Shift down gears rather than using your brakes. You can always smell the tourist vehicles coming down the mountains! |
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Posts: 512
| yep yep, hoping for this
and yes, I use engine for jeep braking, but the boat doesn't know this!
and on another issue, my jeep has a terrible downshift between 6th and 5th, terrible clunk on occasion! |
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Posts: 3469
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | undersized - 4/4/2019 2:27 PM
VMS - 4/4/2019 8:56 AM
I would think there would be a way to get it done to lock the brakes out of use somehow... I'll do a little research to see what I can find.
Do you own surge brakes on your trailer such that you have firsthand experience?
Asking for a friend.
Nice try...
And yes... since I know you are really the one asking...
installed them myself but never had to consider the situation DaveT is needing to. Never explored it and cannot recall from when I had that trailer. The trailer I have now does not have them...yet. If I do t have an answer to someone’s question, I’ll admit it too, but I certainly won’t stop there... I’ll go find out the answer....and if they want help with something and they are local, I’ll give them a hand with my full name... you?
Steve
Edited by VMS 4/5/2019 8:23 AM
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Location: Eastern Ontario | Over the years Steve has helped countless people with his knowledge of props, gear ratios, and algebra thanks Steve. |
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Posts: 512
| VMS - 4/5/2019 8:14 AM
undersized - 4/4/2019 2:27 PM
VMS - 4/4/2019 8:56 AM
I would think there would be a way to get it done to lock the brakes out of use somehow... I'll do a little research to see what I can find.
Do you own surge brakes on your trailer such that you have firsthand experience?
Asking for a friend.
Nice try...
And yes... since I know you are really the one asking...
installed them myself but never had to consider the situation DaveT is needing to. Never explored it and cannot recall from when I had that trailer. The trailer I have now does not have them...yet. If I do t have an answer to someone’s question, I’ll admit it too, but I certainly won’t stop there... I’ll go find out the answer....and if they want help with something and they are local, I’ll give them a hand with my full name... you?
Steve
get him Steve! :p |
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Location: 31 | Yeah, be careful undersized... Steve's takes lessons on debate from Ben Shapiro
Edited by Jerry Newman 4/5/2019 9:10 AM
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Posts: 3469
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | Awww man!!!
My secret is out!!  |
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Posts: 482
| i recently got a new to me trailer with surge brakes and learned a lot since i work on it myself and my system is hydraulic without electric backup solenoid (1997 drums) i do not believe the brake lock shim would stay in place on my model (A60)and pretty shure the solenoid is used only on disk brakes system but if its solenoid type the back-up lights turn it on so easy tu install a switch to actuate it . |
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Posts: 1209
| So I pulled over some "big" hills quite possibly steeper than an actual mountain downhill, and I watched my trailer couple/surge brake actuator and it is so minuscule the amount it compresses. (My truck will let me look at the backup camera while driving and it is very noticeable on my trailer). Like I think I said, a properly functioning trailer this shouldn't be an issue, and my truck was 100% at idle going down, the rolling resistance and wind resistance is enough drag without the brakes |
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Location: 31 | danlaboucane - 4/6/2019 9:50 AM
i recently got a new to me trailer with surge brakes and learned a lot since i work on it myself and my system is hydraulic without electric backup solenoid (1997 drums) i do not believe the brake lock shim would stay in place on my model (A60)and pretty shure the solenoid is used only on disk brakes system but if its solenoid type the back-up lights turn it on so easy tu install a switch to actuate it .
I was moving my boat around and thought I'd pass this on... it stays in place with a strong magnet.
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 trailer (1).jpg (49KB - 406 downloads)
trailer (2).jpg (15KB - 416 downloads)
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Posts: 1516
| Jerry, where did you find that magnet lockout? |
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Posts: 482
| good idea jerry , tanks |
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Location: 31 | https://www.ebay.com/itm/Lock-Out-Key-for-UFP-Surge-Brake-Trailer-Ma...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/MAGNETIC-LOCK-OUT-KEY-KEY-FOR-ATWOOD-TYPE-S...
Edited by Jerry Newman 4/24/2019 6:04 PM
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Posts: 512
| Jerry Newman - 4/24/2019 11:56 AM
danlaboucane - 4/6/2019 9:50 AM
i recently got a new to me trailer with surge brakes and learned a lot since i work on it myself and my system is hydraulic without electric backup solenoid (1997 drums) i do not believe the brake lock shim would stay in place on my model (A60)and pretty shure the solenoid is used only on disk brakes system but if its solenoid type the back-up lights turn it on so easy tu install a switch to actuate it .
I was moving my boat around and thought I'd pass this on... it stays in place with a strong magnet.
thanks, I found this as well, hopefully it stays on going down the highway if I try it! |
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