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Muskie Fishing -> Fishing Reports and Destinations -> Lake Vermilion
 
Message Subject: Lake Vermilion
Schultz345
Posted 7/31/2018 7:07 PM (#913920 - in reply to #913886)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 221


The_Answer - 7/31/2018 2:43 PM

Why are the lakes in Western MN more important than V, Mille Lacs, SLR?

Why is Detroit Lake getting over 6 fish per acre? Its being stocked at FIVE TIMES the rate of V or Mille Lacs......

How is that okay? And WHY was that decision made?


That is just one example of Western MN taking all of the states Muskies.



The hell are you talking about? DL is stocked every other year with 3000 fingerling. That's 1 per acre every 2 years. And those lakes get absolutely pounded all season long. Also happens to be the lakes under the most fire right now to have stocking completely stopped.

Sit down.
nar160
Posted 7/31/2018 8:41 PM (#913929 - in reply to #912851)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 408


Location: MN
The statement is that over the years 2003-2013, DL got 6 fingerlings per acre, while V got less than 0.5 fingerlings per acre. That's a 12x difference in stocking density over that time period. It's no surprise that V is very low density now.

I disagree that western MN is "taking" all of MN muskies. DL has been stocked at that rate for over 20 years. To me the question is why did Vermilion stocking get cut so bad when for many other lakes, stocking was sustained at the same rate?

According to the DNR themselves, the statewide discrepancy between stocking rates was enough to spur them into standardizing the stocking rate to 1 fish per littoral acre every 2 years. DL is an exception to this because it has been stocked at the same rate for so long and is useful for studying the long term effects of stocking - it will remain at 3000 (1/acre) every other year. V is also an exception, but I am not sure why. I've heard recently that there are plans to bump it up to around 0.5 fish per littoral acre every other year, which would be half of the standardized rate. To compare, over 2003-2013, the stocking works out to 0.22 fingerlings per littoral acre every 2 years, less than 1/4 of the new standardized rate. V also gets a bit penalized by the use of littoral acres, being 38% littoral compared to, say West Battle, at 45% or some other MN lakes that are >50%.
Pointerpride102
Posted 7/31/2018 9:08 PM (#913933 - in reply to #913929)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion





Posts: 16632


Location: The desert
I think this is the guide on Vermilion that was supporting the anti-musky bill so more muskies would be stocked in a Vermilion. It doesn't really need saying but thats a pretty short sighted viewpoint to have.
Gottagofast
Posted 7/31/2018 9:19 PM (#913935 - in reply to #912851)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 17


Pointer has the same feeling I do. Rumor also has it his data set dates start and end on stocked years for Dl while starting and stopping on unstocked years for Vermillion skewing the data set.
nar160
Posted 7/31/2018 10:12 PM (#913940 - in reply to #912851)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 408


Location: MN
I can confirm the years part. DL stocked in 03 and 13, V neither. If you adjust to 2004-2013 instead, you get

LAKE -------- ACRES ---- FINGERLINGS -------- FING/ACRE
Vermilion ---- 39272 ---- 18002 ---------------- 0.46
DL ----------- 3018 ------ 15292 ---------------- 5.07

A factor of 11 rather than 12.

Edited by nar160 7/31/2018 10:14 PM
Hammskie
Posted 8/1/2018 10:40 AM (#913985 - in reply to #912851)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion





Posts: 697


Location: Minnetonka
Factor this: This whole topic is a small, irrelevant piece of the universe. It's a fish—a fish that wasn't fishable before the DNR put them in our lakes. Why not show a little gratitude for a state government that allowed us to build the most insane statewide muskie fishery that has ever existed?

I'll keep supporting the stocking in any way I can but I'm not calling anyone "ignorant" for thinking the top predator is eating the smaller fish.
The_Answer
Posted 8/1/2018 10:50 AM (#913990 - in reply to #912851)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 8


Location: Minneapolis, MN
I am not a guide on V. I fish all over the state. But just watching V decline over the last handful of years I did a lot of research on stocking data. Did I cherry pick a specific 10 year stretch to make a statement? Sure. But if you just take the big picture and look at the last 20 years of stocking data on some of the lakes like V and Mille Lacs and the SLR, which used be classified as world class, it just raises a few questions. And most importantly as NAR mentioned: "According to the DNR themselves, the statewide discrepancy between stocking rates was enough to spur them into standardizing the stocking rate to 1 fish per littoral acre every 2 years." Why is that not being followed, like not even close?

Stocking does have a bigger picture effect than just fishing. Local economies like business, resorts see an effect from the declining muskie fisheries, specifically V and Mille Lacs.

If the goal was to have the SLR, V, Mille Lacs to be a low density fishery, I guess i can live with that. But I just cannot wrap my head around why we would want to build those fisheries up to world class like the used to be, and then cut the stocking by a drastic amount. Seems reckless. Will be interesting to watch the next 10 years for the boys over in Western MN. I bet if their stocking got cut by 50% for a 20 year period, they wouldn't stay silent like they want to people in the central and east side of state to be right now

Edited by The_Answer 8/1/2018 10:53 AM
Hammskie
Posted 8/1/2018 11:00 AM (#913993 - in reply to #913990)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion





Posts: 697


Location: Minnetonka
The_Answer - 8/1/2018 10:50 AM
But if you just take the big picture and look at the last 20 years of stocking data...

Stocking does have a bigger picture effect than just fishing. Local economies like business, resorts see an effect from the declining muskie fisheries, specifically V and Mille Lacs.

But I just cannot wrap my head around why we would want to build those fisheries up to world class like the used to be, and then cut the stocking by a drastic amount. Seems reckless. Will be interesting to watch the next 10 years for the boys over in Western MN. I bet if their stocking got cut by 50% for a 20 year period, they wouldn't stay silent like they want to people in the central and east side of state to be right now :)


A.) Walleye, bass, panfish and just general recreation generate more revenue for the resorts than muskies ever could... if we're looking at the "big picture".

B.) I completely agree with you on the state throwing away something they built. It is a dumb idea. I think the DNR accounted for more natural sustainability.

C.) Fighting against Western MN isn't going to bring the muskies back to Vermilion.
Kirby Budrow
Posted 8/1/2018 11:05 AM (#913995 - in reply to #913985)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion





Posts: 2255


Location: Chisholm, MN
Hammskie - 8/1/2018 10:40 AM

Factor this: This whole topic is a small, irrelevant piece of the universe. It's a fish—a fish that wasn't fishable before the DNR put them in our lakes. Why not show a little gratitude for a state government that allowed us to build the most insane statewide muskie fishery that has ever existed?

I'll keep supporting the stocking in any way I can but I'm not calling anyone "ignorant" for thinking the top predator is eating the smaller fish.


You're right in some ways. It's a rich person problem. Not enough fish to catch blah blah blah. But we were used to MN being good, and now it's not, for more than one reason. Now everyone is going to Canada. Which is over pressured as well. We just use and abuse the resource until it's gone. There should be a way to sustain what we have here in MN though. The only thing I can think to do is stock more fish and have the people who are on the fish, keep their mouths shut.
sworrall
Posted 8/1/2018 11:12 AM (#913997 - in reply to #913990)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion





Posts: 32761


Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
The_Answer - 8/1/2018 10:50 AM

I am not a guide on V. I fish all over the state. But just watching V decline over the last handful of years I did a lot of research on stocking data. Did I cherry pick a specific 10 year stretch to make a statement? Sure. But if you just take the big picture and look at the last 20 years of stocking data on some of the lakes like V and Mille Lacs and the SLR, which used be classified as world class, it just raises a few questions. And most importantly as NAR mentioned: "According to the DNR themselves, the statewide discrepancy between stocking rates was enough to spur them into standardizing the stocking rate to 1 fish per littoral acre every 2 years." Why is that not being followed, like not even close? How about asking the fisheries manager for that region?

Stocking does have a bigger picture effect than just fishing. Local economies like business, resorts see an effect from the declining muskie fisheries, specifically V and Mille Lacs. Those systems will never be what they were, this is very common in muskie management, and takes a deeper understanding than one sees on the surface of the issue. One can't manipulate the data to conveniently arrive at any single conclusion.

If the goal was to have the SLR, V, Mille Lacs to be a low density fishery, I guess i can live with that. But I just cannot wrap my head around why we would want to build those fisheries up to world class like the used to be, and then cut the stocking by a drastic amount. Seems reckless. Look into 'new reservoir syndrome'. It's very real.


Will be interesting to watch the next 10 years for the boys over in Western MN. I bet if their stocking got cut by 50% for a 20 year period, they wouldn't stay silent like they want to people in the central and east side of state to be right now
:)
They are not 'silent', they are communicating with the correct people.
Kirby Budrow
Posted 8/1/2018 11:31 AM (#914000 - in reply to #913997)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion





Posts: 2255


Location: Chisholm, MN
sworrall - 8/1/2018 11:12 AM

The_Answer - 8/1/2018 10:50 AM<br /><br />I am not a guide on V. I fish all over the state. But just watching V decline over the last handful of years I did a lot of research on stocking data. Did I cherry pick a specific 10 year stretch to make a statement? Sure. But if you just take the big picture and look at the last 20 years of stocking data on some of the lakes like V and Mille Lacs and the SLR, which used be classified as world class, it just raises a few questions. And most importantly as NAR mentioned: "According to the DNR themselves, the statewide discrepancy between stocking rates was enough to spur them into standardizing the stocking rate to 1 fish per littoral acre every 2 years." Why is that not being followed, like not even close? <font color="#ff0066">How about asking the fisheries manager for that region?</font><br /><br />Stocking does have a bigger picture effect than just fishing. Local economies like business, resorts see an effect from the declining muskie fisheries, specifically V and Mille Lacs. <font color="#ff0033">Those systems will never be what they were, this is very common in muskie management, and takes a deeper understanding than one sees on the surface of the issue. One can't manipulate the data to conveniently arrive at any single conclusion.</font><br /><br />If the goal was to have the SLR, V, Mille Lacs to be a low density fishery, I guess i can live with that. But I just cannot wrap my head around why we would want to build those fisheries up to world class like the used to be, and then cut the stocking by a drastic amount. Seems reckless. <font color="#ff0033">Look into 'new reservoir syndrome'. It's very real.</font><br /><br /><br />Will be interesting to watch the next 10 years for the boys over in Western MN. I bet if their stocking got cut by 50% for a 20 year period, they wouldn't stay silent like they want to people in the central and east side of state to be right now <br />:)
<font color="#ff0066">They are not 'silent', they are communicating with the correct people.</font>


Fisheries managers here have been talked to many times at many meetings. They have heard all the opinions and came to a conclusion. They are planning to stock a few more fish, but not 1 per acre. 3000 every year is the new goal. It's a 15000 acre lake.

The new reservoir syndrome obviously is a real thing, but still, why not stock at real levels? Once the new res syndrome wears off, why stock less fish?
Hammskie
Posted 8/1/2018 11:31 AM (#914001 - in reply to #913995)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion





Posts: 697


Location: Minnetonka
Kirby Budrow - 8/1/2018 11:05 AM
You're right in some ways. It's a rich person problem. Not enough fish to catch blah blah blah. But we were used to MN being good, and now it's not, for more than one reason. Now everyone is going to Canada. Which is over pressured as well. We just use and abuse the resource until it's gone. There should be a way to sustain what we have here in MN though. The only thing I can think to do is stock more fish and have the people who are on the fish, keep their mouths shut.


Pressure: Since muskie stocking started in MN, the world's population has gone from 4.4 billion to 7.6 billion people. So in my fatalistic outlook, there will probably never be enough fish... ever again.
Kirby Budrow
Posted 8/1/2018 11:34 AM (#914002 - in reply to #914001)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion





Posts: 2255


Location: Chisholm, MN
Hammskie - 8/1/2018 11:31 AM

Kirby Budrow - 8/1/2018 11:05 AM
You're right in some ways. It's a rich person problem. Not enough fish to catch blah blah blah. But we were used to MN being good, and now it's not, for more than one reason. Now everyone is going to Canada. Which is over pressured as well. We just use and abuse the resource until it's gone. There should be a way to sustain what we have here in MN though. The only thing I can think to do is stock more fish and have the people who are on the fish, keep their mouths shut.


Pressure: Since muskie stocking started in MN, the world's population has gone from 4.4 billion to 7.6 billion people. So in my fatalistic outlook, there will probably never be enough fish... ever again.


I cannot argue with that. Sadly...
Sudszee
Posted 8/1/2018 11:51 AM (#914006 - in reply to #914000)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 152


Kirby Budrow - 8/1/2018 11:31 AM

sworrall - 8/1/2018 11:12 AM

The_Answer - 8/1/2018 10:50 AM<br /><br />I am not a guide on V. I fish all over the state. But just watching V decline over the last handful of years I did a lot of research on stocking data. Did I cherry pick a specific 10 year stretch to make a statement? Sure. But if you just take the big picture and look at the last 20 years of stocking data on some of the lakes like V and Mille Lacs and the SLR, which used be classified as world class, it just raises a few questions. And most importantly as NAR mentioned: "According to the DNR themselves, the statewide discrepancy between stocking rates was enough to spur them into standardizing the stocking rate to 1 fish per littoral acre every 2 years." Why is that not being followed, like not even close? <font color="#ff0066">How about asking the fisheries manager for that region?</font><br /><br />Stocking does have a bigger picture effect than just fishing. Local economies like business, resorts see an effect from the declining muskie fisheries, specifically V and Mille Lacs. <font color="#ff0033">Those systems will never be what they were, this is very common in muskie management, and takes a deeper understanding than one sees on the surface of the issue. One can't manipulate the data to conveniently arrive at any single conclusion.</font><br /><br />If the goal was to have the SLR, V, Mille Lacs to be a low density fishery, I guess i can live with that. But I just cannot wrap my head around why we would want to build those fisheries up to world class like the used to be, and then cut the stocking by a drastic amount. Seems reckless. <font color="#ff0033">Look into 'new reservoir syndrome'. It's very real.</font><br /><br /><br />Will be interesting to watch the next 10 years for the boys over in Western MN. I bet if their stocking got cut by 50% for a 20 year period, they wouldn't stay silent like they want to people in the central and east side of state to be right now <br />:)
<font color="#ff0066">They are not 'silent', they are communicating with the correct people.</font>


Fisheries managers here have been talked to many times at many meetings. They have heard all the opinions and came to a conclusion. They are planning to stock a few more fish, but not 1 per acre. 3000 every year is the new goal. It's a 15000 acre lake.

The new reservoir syndrome obviously is a real thing, but still, why not stock at real levels? Once the new res syndrome wears off, why stock less fish?


15k? Vermilion is 40k acres.
Kirby Budrow
Posted 8/1/2018 11:58 AM (#914007 - in reply to #914006)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion





Posts: 2255


Location: Chisholm, MN
Sudszee - 8/1/2018 11:51 AM

Kirby Budrow - 8/1/2018 11:31 AM

sworrall - 8/1/2018 11:12 AM

The_Answer - 8/1/2018 10:50 AM<br /><br />I am not a guide on V. I fish all over the state. But just watching V decline over the last handful of years I did a lot of research on stocking data. Did I cherry pick a specific 10 year stretch to make a statement? Sure. But if you just take the big picture and look at the last 20 years of stocking data on some of the lakes like V and Mille Lacs and the SLR, which used be classified as world class, it just raises a few questions. And most importantly as NAR mentioned: "According to the DNR themselves, the statewide discrepancy between stocking rates was enough to spur them into standardizing the stocking rate to 1 fish per littoral acre every 2 years." Why is that not being followed, like not even close? <font color="#ff0066">How about asking the fisheries manager for that region?</font><br /><br />Stocking does have a bigger picture effect than just fishing. Local economies like business, resorts see an effect from the declining muskie fisheries, specifically V and Mille Lacs. <font color="#ff0033">Those systems will never be what they were, this is very common in muskie management, and takes a deeper understanding than one sees on the surface of the issue. One can't manipulate the data to conveniently arrive at any single conclusion.</font><br /><br />If the goal was to have the SLR, V, Mille Lacs to be a low density fishery, I guess i can live with that. But I just cannot wrap my head around why we would want to build those fisheries up to world class like the used to be, and then cut the stocking by a drastic amount. Seems reckless. <font color="#ff0033">Look into 'new reservoir syndrome'. It's very real.</font><br /><br /><br />Will be interesting to watch the next 10 years for the boys over in Western MN. I bet if their stocking got cut by 50% for a 20 year period, they wouldn't stay silent like they want to people in the central and east side of state to be right now <br />:)
<font color="#ff0066">They are not 'silent', they are communicating with the correct people.</font>


Fisheries managers here have been talked to many times at many meetings. They have heard all the opinions and came to a conclusion. They are planning to stock a few more fish, but not 1 per acre. 3000 every year is the new goal. It's a 15000 acre lake.

The new reservoir syndrome obviously is a real thing, but still, why not stock at real levels? Once the new res syndrome wears off, why stock less fish?


15k? Vermilion is 40k acres.


Yeah sorry, that's littoral acres. Which is still less than a fish an acre.
Gottagofast
Posted 8/1/2018 12:07 PM (#914011 - in reply to #912851)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 17


People need to pull their heads out of the sand and look at the big picture. There is more people than ever on all the lakes check out everyone complaining about falling catch rates in lotw(must be lack of stocking right). Oh and then there is the politics does anyone realise we lost last year and got lucky there was so much crap legislation the entire bill got vetoed! Then there is the fact that we are a small minority and stocking is not cheap and the state has limited resources to produce these fish. Furthermore there is not currently a source for leech lake muskies to purchase even if the funds and politics would allow. I wish this was an issue of just the science and on that front we need our higher rate stocked lakes to continue that level of stocking as proof they are not detrimental to help fight off the constant attacks on the man muskie program as a whole. Then there is a Vermillion guide trying to help the ottertail county lake association end their stocking program with the misguided notion Vermillion might get the fish that had been slated for ottertail county creating division in our ranks and doing real harm to the entire program.
dbach17
Posted 8/1/2018 2:22 PM (#914031 - in reply to #912851)
Subject: RE: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 82


Location: Des Plaines, IL
From the perspective of someone who only started targeting these fish a few years ago, think about the following as it relates to pressure.

Would you rather have:
1) A lake exist with few of the target species in it because no one wants to target them so the DNR decides stocking is not necessary.
2) More people fish for the target species but it continues to be stocked because of the interest by anglers.

For me it's number 2. I'd rather know that the fish are there and I'm just not able to catch them (which is my current reality most of the time anyways) versus spending time pounding water where I have small odds of ever even sitting over a fish. The NIMBY mentality somewhat applies here. Musky fishermen want people to catch fish to grow the number interested in the sport, but not in "my spot" or on "my lake."

Double edged sword seems to be grow the sport and the fish become conditioned and maybe start to adapt their behavior and do so more frequently, making patterning more difficult, or it becomes so difficult for new people to catch fish that they give up, the community starts to shrink to a small population, and then eventually the people who want muskies out of "their lakes" because they eat the children and all other fish win. Then you're left with natural reproduction lakes (maybe never that extreme, but it's possible). At that point catch rates might still be low even for the best of anglers.

I will say, having gone up to Vermilion for three previous years, we skipped it this year because we can go to closer lakes and catch 0-1 fish in a week. I know we probably won't be back until a few years after stocking numbers go up, as I get only so much vacation and I would like to catch a fish every once in a while.
KidDerringer
Posted 8/1/2018 3:21 PM (#914042 - in reply to #912851)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 244


Location: Mallard Island Lake Vermilion MN
Still great place to hang, fish, live ~

Nothing good comes easy.


Bonnie & I still meet a few big fish in person now an again, some nice medium peeed off teens also an pike are getting larger each season..all equal fun.
Its all good fun.
More n more people on lake I would agree.
I hear money aint so tight in the world out there so maybe just more loose change for GA$.


One thing I have seen more an more since I stopped guiding years ago or what ever is constantly see 3 people in a big boat an all seem to be doing same thing.
Casting shallows an same mix of lures. Blades, jerk, blades or real fast topwater.
Robot fishen I call it. No real plan or thinking...….kind of odd but if their having fun...….keep on having at it.


Boat one in, zing, fling, zoom off.
Boat Two..Fling, Zing, zoom off.

Never noticed this when running around lake myself until retired from guide deal.

But was never just doing same junk....well unless it was a hot hot thing.....once in a while that was the case in mid 90'z for sure. Guilty as charged...!!!

One has to always be Changing and Challenging the way we did things to better serve the clients, and ourselfs.

If it looked fishy we fished it I been saying for years n years.
Most always had fun an found fish.........geat memories, great people fun fishys…….. but I miss it NOT!
Leave it at that.

Testing ones ablity to beat THE HOME TEAM one on one.

Just finger fumbling here as not on here in long time........


So many different ways to find the Vermilion muskie fish that alone can wear ya down.
Think, relax, react...Don't be that guy on TV........just be.

You never can tell what goes on down below
As this lake is much darker n deeper than you or I know...

Best of luck, be safe, have success and enjoy it all.

New pup name of Fred Bear learning fast......just turned one year.
Wowzaaaaaaa.

Keep on rocken!

T









Edited by KidDerringer 8/16/2018 4:04 PM
tarpon6
Posted 8/1/2018 6:21 PM (#914073 - in reply to #914042)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 17


Location: Florida
I love your posts both here and on the fishing MN board. I'm excited to get back up there even if the end of Sept is supposed to be tough. I was there just a week earlier last year and the smallie fishing was incredible. I learned alot and just felt like I was figuring things out when my time was up. I had a solid follow in my limited muskie time, and saw a big fish caught. Just getting out of the Florida heat and humidity for two weeks will be refreshing.

Funny thing is I saw a boat with 3 guys robofishing just as you described it. All the talk and various thoughts about the stocking program has been interesting as well.
Brad P
Posted 8/2/2018 9:04 AM (#914137 - in reply to #912851)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 833


There is a lot more to the stocking issue beyond the numbers. A few fun tidbits:

I heard a rumor from a reputable source that I will repeat here. I haven't confirmed this, so take it with a grain of salt: DL is stocked at it's current level as an ongoing effort by the DNR to prove the walleye and a stocking enhanced musky population can co-habitate and thrive together.

Now for some facts: The Area Fisheries MGR for V is different than the one who manages DL and Pelican. They have differing views on what is best for their localities. There is a debate in the DNR about the future of muskies, part of which is that they feel that more stocking is not the answer. A lot of this has to do with carrying capacity.

Without diving off the deep end, the basic concept is that stocking a lake with an existing, established population is different than stocking one with no fish. A new lake with no or very few fish will experienced a boom. On the flip side a lake with an established population will see the old fish "regulate". This is happening very vividly on Elk Lake.

It gets murky when you take into account size of lake. Elk is 300 acres. ML is 135,000. One size doesn't fit all. Just to be clear on this, I think the Elk Lake thing is far from a persuasive analysis. You can't determine how to stock a 40,000 or 135,000 acre system based on a 300 acre system, at least not alone. Still, Elk can provide useful information so we are also foolish to dismiss it entirely.

Regardless, one thing the DNR is worried about is the idea that adding fingerlings to an established lake might result in feeding the current adults. At $12-$15 a fingerling that is a potentially a huge waste. Potentially an angler would see their desired level of stocking and then be back on here in a few years asking what happened to all of the new fish?

I'm not saying I have an answer, but this is a slice of some of what the DNR is thinking about. These are issues worthy of our attention, but they are not the biggest threat. The biggest threat is the political storm coming out of Otter Tail County. If you really want to help the fishery, then help find a candidate who can unseat Bill Ingerbrigtsen in a primary. If he went away, all we'd have to focus on is working with the DNR to preserve and improve what we have.


Edited by Brad P 8/2/2018 9:11 AM
CincySkeez
Posted 8/2/2018 9:56 AM (#914146 - in reply to #912851)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion





Posts: 582


Location: Duluth
I'll stop fishing the V, when on hot dead calm days I can no longer sneak up on sunning fish. Me and my buddies call this window shopping, some spots its still common to roll up on 2-3 fish over 50, and a bunch of 44+. Yea, these fish might have lock jaw at the moment, but when windows come or the sun goes down you at least have an idea of where to start.

Also, window shopping with a first timer on a "dead" day is good fun, "OMG, thats a fish!"
ARmuskyaddict
Posted 8/2/2018 10:32 AM (#914152 - in reply to #912851)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion





Posts: 2001


Good way to learn the spot too. If you see my yellow hook file glinting at you off Cherry Island, look 10 yards to the southwest. Nice little pocket a bigun was in laughing after I dropped it overboard.
Nershi
Posted 8/2/2018 11:06 AM (#914157 - in reply to #914137)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Location: MN
The Vermilion walleye population is in excellent shape and if you are a decent fisherman fishing is great. The guys saying musky are eating all the walleye must be making excuses for their lack of fishing skills.

Musky fisherman bring a ton of money to the Vermilion economy. A resort or restaurant owner making comments like that seems to be biting the hand that feeds him. If muskies went away the local businesses would feel the hit.

Totally agree with Brad P's comment below. I think the bigger the water the less likelihood of the adults eating up all the stockers. It would be great to see higher numbers go in to big systems like Mille Lacs, the V and SLR. With the current stocking numbers fishing is going to continue to be very tough on those waters.


It gets murky when you take into account size of lake. Elk is 300 acres. ML is 135,000. One size doesn't fit all. Just to be clear on this, I think the Elk Lake thing is far from a persuasive analysis. You can't determine how to stock a 40,000 or 135,000 acre system based on a 300 acre system, at least not alone. Still, Elk can provide useful information so we are also foolish to dismiss it entirely.

TCESOX
Posted 8/2/2018 1:53 PM (#914199 - in reply to #912851)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion





Posts: 1166


In conversations with a few different DNR folks, I have gotten the impression that your Area Fisheries Manager has a lot to do with how things get done in a particular area, and they don't all have the same ideas. Also, I think there may be particular talking points that the DNR puts out statewide. To a person, every fisheries person I have spoken with, have said an almost word for word version of "Minnesota stocks muskies at a low density with the goal of having a trophy fishery."
happy hooker
Posted 8/2/2018 2:11 PM (#914203 - in reply to #914199)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 3136


But maybe there's a plan to get the sovereign nation do what they want casino involved????
Dirt Esox
Posted 8/2/2018 2:35 PM (#914209 - in reply to #914203)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 457


Location: Minneconia
happy hooker - 8/2/2018 2:11 PM

But maybe there's a plan to get the sovereign nation do what they want casino involved????


I think this was being discussed as a possibility a few months ago, but has since been dismissed, according to an acquaintance that's on the task force/musky stakeholder group.

I hope I'm wrong or something has changed and it's still in the works, it would be the best way to get big numbers stocked in V quickly.
happy hooker
Posted 8/2/2018 2:41 PM (#914213 - in reply to #914203)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 3136


Actually we just got back from a 3 day trip up there we only spent about 3 hrs a day during prime time evening, Days were too flat bright and UV intense, mourning s were hung from the best margaritas on the lake.
We know some spots well and ended up with 7 follows no bitters but they were all solid fish in the 43-48 range.
Has far has pressure,,,my buddy's cabin is off the beaten path on lake and sitting out on porch in margaritaville we saw boats constantly one after another screaming tailbait topwaters with rooster tails that would make a jet skier proud more fat bastards then at a VFW pigroast. Fishing pressure -maybe the Beverly hills police department patrols it's neighborhood more but im not sure.

Edited by happy hooker 8/2/2018 2:57 PM
KidDerringer
Posted 8/2/2018 5:06 PM (#914232 - in reply to #912851)
Subject: Re: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 244


Location: Mallard Island Lake Vermilion MN
Hooker!
Good time just the same I bet. Hey...Fred Bear bought from breeder never let him out of kennel 1st 11 months of his life. Turn one year July 19th. Smart n love learning like a pup. We have a winner in this young man. Actually paid for with $$$ from our Hwy 35 meet n greet last fall with Greg. Thanks!! Fun junk ya do in life. To old for muskie fish good guyen boards n but pop in that buy n sell deal. Never any pups!!! Bargains for dudes ain’t got the jack to play in a big way. I paint up n fix give to them for burger or steaks. :). C ya in the movies!! Keep on rocken! T
SCSU10
Posted 8/6/2018 10:51 AM (#914647 - in reply to #912851)
Subject: RE: Lake Vermilion




Posts: 7


Here is my two cents on Lake Vermilion. I have been fishing the lake since I was 12 years old. Caught my first muskie when I was 12 years old a nice 40 incher. We stay on the lake the same week every year in July. I think the muskies are still there but they are smart. Over the past several years I have noticed I had to resort to something completely new or something old and trusty. I have had very little reaction from anything made in the last 10 years unless its something they haven't seen often. This July I caught two fish one was 41 and the other 48. I spent about a total of 12 hours fishing in 7 days. This is a family trip and the boat is used for other activities as well. I missed 3 others that were hooked. We keep track of how many we see and where. We saw (followed lures) a total of 35 fish over those 12 hours. Although, some may have been the same but were on a different day. I agree people are not seeing them sunning themselves on the top of the rock reefs anymore and I believe this has to do with the pressure. They are sitting just off those reef tops in the darker water you can't see in. The fish are still there just not easy to catch anymore so everyone attributes this to they are gone. For me seeing a fish in the mid 50 inch class keeps me coming back.


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Kirby Budrow
Posted 8/6/2018 10:59 AM (#914651 - in reply to #914647)
Subject: RE: Lake Vermilion





Posts: 2255


Location: Chisholm, MN
You saw 35 fish in 12 hours? I don't think I've seen 35 fish all season on vermilion. Are you interested in giving some lessons?
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