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Posts: 4080
Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion | Ok,
I spend about 90% of my time fishing Vermilion,, (Westend) and this yr. the numbers were way down....(not just me) It was a colder year and I think the Whitefish and Ciscos thrived,.... There are tons of baitfish in this Lake, so my question is:,.. do you guys think the over abundance of bait fish was the cause of the lack of catching or what?
A lot of you guys fish up here,...What was your experience this yr.
Jerome |
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Posts: 441
| I fish the east end of Vermilion, almost everyday.
It was really slow for me, this year!
Didn't see nearly as many, as last year. |
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Posts: 1169
Location: New Hope MN | I heard the fish were jumping in the boat November 11 & 12th this year  |
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Posts: 98
| How much do you think it has to do with fishing pressure? Seems like every lake I was on this year in MN was just getting hammered, boats on every spot. In fact, a perfect example was a small northern MN lake in late September I was on had 7 boats parked on the same reef right at dusk, all you could hear were lures zinging through the air. Tougher fishing seems to be the trend with only 85 musky lakes state-wide and the number of musky anglers growing exponentially right now. |
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Posts: 3165
| I think a COLD spring effects fishing for the year,,and we had the coldest shortest spring in Minnesota history,,,In Tony Rizzos book "secrets of a muskie guide ll" which is a "bible" for me he talks about how a cold spring will effect the entire season,,,I talk to a big network of Minn guys here and just about everybody had a down year everywhere |
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Posts: 286
Location: Eagan, MN | PM'd you.
BrianF. |
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Posts: 1828
| I'm confused about your notion that the whitefish and cisco thrived. I understand that this was one of the coldest spring seasons ever and that the summer may have been cooler than average, over all. Remember last year was one of the warmest springs ever and we had some sick hot streaks in the summer months, and there were major whitefish and cisco die-offs on many lakes.
Do you think one cool year created an overabundance of baitfish? What about last year's greater-than-normal baitfish die-off? I don't understand how just one cold spring/summer can result in a sudden spike [within the same year] in prey-able sized whitefish/cisco.
I'm not trying to be argumentative, just wanting you to expand on the theory so I can understand. |
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Posts: 1828
| And my experience this summer -
Tougher than usual through the summer months, but did well this fall. I pretty much only fished three bodies of water, and one of these sucked more than usual, while the others were good. |
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Posts: 221
| Numbers seemed to be about half of last year in my boat, but we definitely got into some bigger fish this year. |
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Posts: 4080
Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion | jaultman - 11/26/2013 2:42 PM
I'm confused about your notion that the whitefish and cisco thrived. I understand that this was one of the coldest spring seasons ever and that the summer may have been cooler than average, over all. Remember last year was one of the warmest springs ever and we had some sick hot streaks in the summer months, and there were major whitefish and cisco die-offs on many lakes.
Do you think one cool year created an overabundance of baitfish? What about last year's greater-than-normal baitfish die-off? I don't understand how just one cold spring/summer can result in a sudden spike [within the same year] in prey-able sized whitefish/cisco.
No die off = an abundance of food for predator fish,.......2012 wasn't very hot on Vermilion either......Yes I think there is an over abundance of bait fish,....There always has been a good amount on V...But since it's been cooler than normal more bait fish survived,......What other reason could there be to the crappy muskie bite this yr.? Most of the people that fished there this season said the same thing : Crappy fishing.
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Posts: 3514
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | Hiya,
I would say it was a very tough year in Northern MN this year. I fish a bit further west of vermilion, but the same issues seemed to prevail.. Less fish caught and seen.
I have a tendency to believe that the fish found bait deep because the normal shallow water baitfish moved into the shallows much later than they normally would due to a very very late ice out this year. By the time other baitfish moved in shallow(like perch...a preferred shallow prey species), I think the predator fish had to search out food...they found food out deep and just stayed there.
I don't necessarily think it would be due to an over-abundance of open water prey, although I think that can be lake-dependent as well. I just think the predator fish never stayed in shallow because food was not there.
Steve
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Posts: 93
| This happened to me in Bemidji back in 2011. Too many bait fish. I also believe that we have a tendency to over think this, and we might never know why. Oh well, just hope next year's better.
Edited by muskymagnet 11/26/2013 5:02 PM
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Posts: 222
| Had my best year for fish a little further north on LOTW 15 days on the water 49 fish boated and a bunch lost, even had an 8 fish day and 9 fish day so I don't think the weather played much into tuff fishing. My 2 cent ! |
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| These fisheries are changing very rapidly. One of the major contributors is the rusty crayfish. These are little eating machines and coat the bottom of the big V and other lakes. They eat everything including vegetation and fresh spawn. They change the lake environment and fish movements. Read up on them. They are fairly new to LOTW so who knows what is in store for there.
Lots of factors to a lakes condition. I doubt it was the weather. |
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Posts: 833
| I do not fish V much, but down on Tonka the Zeebs and Cold Spring made for a very challenging season. The normal Aug/Sep shallow bite never happened, the shallows were a deadzone. That being said, the fall bite was the best I've experienced in my 4 seasons. I think the spring played a role for sure, guys were getting Open Water fish well into July, but I also think the Invasives played a huge role on Tonka. |
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Posts: 441
| I hope the cold spring was the problem.
I think fishing pressure is a big part of it, too.
These fish get pounded on!!!!
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Posts: 4080
Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion |
I'm sure fishing pressure has some impact,....but with that said I believe the pressure on V peeked 2-3 yrs ago...(Except Full Moon weekends)
Even this Fall up here was pretty slow.
Also most of the Spring/ early summer fish were caught out in deeper water than normal... Just an observation.
Jerome |
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Posts: 229
| Vermilion will never be the same as it once was. Same thing happened to Mille Lacs. Both should produce some decent numbers of big fish for a while though, but sad to say the glory years of crazy numbers of big fish are over. That is just my opinion though and you can believe whatever you want. |
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| There is heavy fishing pressure every year...nothing new there. That's just the way it is and will probably never change. Guides pounding the water everyday and showing everyone their patterns. Very hard on these fish, no doubt! I think in MN we have some declining fisheries that we are now starting to see. A fish can only be caught so many times before it makes a mistake and swallows a bait/sucker too deep. Or is caught by the wrong person and gets the crap beat out of it before it's released. Starting to see a few more smaller fish which is good for the future, but also seeing less big fish. |
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| Read an article about those crayfish when I was up there this fall. Said a lot of bait has moved off shallow areas cause those little pinchers were aggravating them. Whitefish netters have been complaining a lot in recent years about declining numbers. Since whitefish spawn before tullibee, when the water is a bit warmer, it seems to reason those crayfish may be gobbling up their eggs. The crayfish are still out and about at least in 45 degree water and they will devour a walleye carcass in a day. Might be a reason some of these fish are now in deeper water
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Posts: 286
Location: Eagan, MN | Wimuskyfisherman, you may be right about the glory days being over considering Vermilion came into musky maturity at precisely the same time as the advent of the Double Cowgirl - arguably a 'magic' bait when first introduced to the musky population and probably the best big fish bait ever invented. It was a 'perfect storm' there for a while, at least until the newness wore off that presentation.
The fish population is still in good shape, though seemingly a bit more difficult to trip than back in the glory days. Generally, I think they have also began to hold in different areas, maybe due to rusties, maybe due to forage, maybe due to the intense pressure.
With re. to that last part - pressure - we all know there are few 'secrets' on the lake anymore. Still, I have more than a few little gems that probably receive most of their pressure from my boat. These spots have invariably died over time. I honestly feel that my own pressure - sticking/losing and CPR'ing lots of fish from these little honey spots - has destroyed them. I don't know for sure, of course, but feel that these shield lake are more susceptible to being ruined from over-pressure than other, more fertile, lakes I have fished in and around the state. Just a BST, but one that seems to repeat itself with consistency.
BrianF.
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Posts: 141
Location: Minnetonka | The Rusties have done a number on the weedbeds in Leech Lake, leaving only "clumps" instead of beds. The fish are still in the lake, they just adapt to the change in habitat as they have for thousands of years in Leech. On the positive side, less fish caught results in less unintentional deaths and bigger fish next season. Too much baitfish may be a problem for us, but definitely not for the muskies. In any case, the day this becomes easy, I'm quitting. I'll sell my gear to other suckers, buy a sea-doo, and buzz around boats at sunset. |
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Tuff year