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Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | If this goes through, the very real possibility of other States implementing this legislation needs to be considered. Please sign the Petition!
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | Do you have a link to the actual bill? |
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Posts: 1360
Location: Lake "y" cause lake"x" got over fished | Wait what? |
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Posts: 2097
| A link would be great, I googled it and only came up on fishing discussion boards. |
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Posts: 280
Location: McFarland | Click on the word petition in Sworalls post and there is your link! |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | ski' patrol - 2/14/2013 9:24 AM
Click on the word petition in Sworalls post and there is your link!
That doesn't take you to the actual verbiage of the bill. |
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Posts: 280
Location: McFarland | true. my bad, Couldn't find anything on the keep America fishing website either.
Edited by ski' patrol 2/14/2013 10:37 AM
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Posts: 1360
Location: Lake "y" cause lake"x" got over fished | is this for WI or a different state? I saw one about Maine on google, but just trying to get a feel if that is the correct one. If it is here is the link to the bill.
http://www.mainelegislature.org/legis/bills/getPDF.asp?paper=HP0037...
The bill seems very non descriptive... at least to me, seems slightly vague and open ended for a lure type that is HUGE accross the whole country. It almost seems as if an idiot wrote it.
they keep saying rubber. If they actually put it into effect with "rubber" as the caption and the ileagal substance, don't you think that there would be a ton of lupe holes to get around it when using "soft plastics" because they are not rubber??? Or am I missing something here?
Edited by FAT-SKI 2/14/2013 11:36 AM
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Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | It's Maine, and it's all soft plastics. |
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Posts: 2687
Location: Hayward, WI | If anybody finds more information about this I'd be interested to see/read it. I might be missing something but I have a hard time seeing how plastics could cause concern to a fishery.
The amount of gas a 2 stroke dumps into the lake must have about a billion times greater effect than dragging a bulldawg or jig through the water. |
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Posts: 1360
Location: Lake "y" cause lake"x" got over fished | heres another link i found about it.
my petition has been sent
http://www.worldfishingnetwork.com/news/state-of-maine-may-ban-soft...
Edited by FAT-SKI 2/14/2013 10:56 AM
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Posts: 415
| I thought this had to be a joke, but unfortunately it's not. My petition has been signed and I sent the link to a number of fishing buddies as well. |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | Very strange and very vague bill, I have a hard time believing it passes as written or with modification. |
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| curleytail - 2/14/2013 10:49 AM
If anybody finds more information about this I'd be interested to see/read it. I might be missing something but I have a hard time seeing how plastics could cause concern to a fishery.
The amount of gas a 2 stroke dumps into the lake must have about a billion times greater effect than dragging a bulldawg or jig through the water.
For context, here you go. Has to do with discarded plastic lures that balloon up in size and are ingested by passing fish.
http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1577/M08-085.1#preview
And for PP, here's the bill: http://www.mainelegislature.org/legis/bills/getPDF.asp?paper=HP0038... |
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Posts: 639
Location: Hudson, WI | I bet the concerned citizens and politicians involved couldn't build a decent campfire if you gave them the wood, kindling and a burning torch. But they are here to save the planet. |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | Well if you read the abstract that guest posted, it gives some insight as to why this may have been proposed. However, there is a big difference in the densities of SP given in a raceway vs a trout stream or pond. I don't think the findings warrant a ban on soft plastics. A push to biodegradable, maybe but even that may be a stretch.
I haven't logged in to read the whole report yet, but will eventually. |
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Posts: 2687
Location: Hayward, WI | Oh wow. Fish eating things that are not food can affect their health? SHOCKING! Maybe we should just go and make littering illegal too so nobody throws candy wrappers and bottle tops in the lake. Wait, I believe we've made that a law already...
If they want to prevent fish from eating foreign objects, they need to enforce the throwing of foreign objects into the water, or ban.... everything. Neither of those is too feasible but the litter law is about as good as we can get.
It's a crazy world these days but I can't see this going through especially with the logic from one brown trout study with I'm sure a very unrealistic amount of plastic per water area. A Mister Twister in the bottom of even a 50 acre lake isn't going to effect the fishery in a great deal... |
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| The northeast is a different place, sign the petition if you don't agree with it. They think different on conservation and also on which fish are more important. BR |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | curleytail - 2/14/2013 11:43 AM
Oh wow. Fish eating things that are not food can affect their health? SHOCKING! Maybe we should just go and make littering illegal too so nobody throws candy wrappers and bottle tops in the lake. Wait, I believe we've made that a law already...
If they want to prevent fish from eating foreign objects, they need to enforce the throwing of foreign objects into the water, or ban.... everything. Neither of those is too feasible but the litter law is about as good as we can get.
It's a crazy world these days but I can't see this going through especially with the logic from one brown trout study with I'm sure a very unrealistic amount of plastic per water area. A Mister Twister in the bottom of even a 50 acre lake isn't going to effect the fishery in a great deal...
It was brook trout, but I get your point and largely agree with it. It isn't really an earth shattering "discovery".
At any rate I don't see this getting much traction if it remains as written. Too vague, and little to no details provided on anything.
But maybe there is a larger picture here. Perhaps this will facilitate a move toward better biodegradable products. Perhaps something like the move from lead shot to steel shot in waterfowl regulations. The effects of that regulation may not be hugely beneficial, but if it makes a little difference, maybe it is worth it. Perhaps there are some alternative products to replace non-biodegradable plastics. |
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Posts: 661
Location: Sussex, NJ | Just signed the petition thanks for the heads up guys |
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Posts: 4080
Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion | Again, Another piece of legislation that totally lacks any COMMON SENSE
Of course fish being Fed SPL's in a controlled environment,.....Is it shocking that the fish ingest this stuff?
In the Wild how many fish starve or die because of eating Soft Plastics??
These people need to get their heads out of their Butt's
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Posts: 84
| It doesn't lack common sense,
Maine's state biologists are the ones pushing this legislation, its been found that 10% of lakers and 65% of brook trout have soft plastics, that never break down and never pass on through, in their stomachs. I'm not saying i support this particular legislation but they have a valid concern.
Edited by Imobley 2/14/2013 2:19 PM
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Posts: 1360
Location: Lake "y" cause lake"x" got over fished | Top H2O - 2/14/2013 2:01 PM
Again, Another piece of legislation that totally lacks any COMMON SENSE
Of course fish being Fed SPL's in a controlled environment,.....Is it shocking that the fish ingest this stuff?
In the Wild how many fish starve or die because of eating Soft Plastics??
These people need to get their heads out of their Butt's
You can't fix stupid! |
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Posts: 4343
Location: Smith Creek | Seems like a knee jerk reaction to a valid concern. Also makes you wonder how many of these plastics end up in the guts of birds and other shoreline dwellers. I agree with Pointer, perhaps the best answer would be biodegradable soft baits. Certainly a good thing for bait manufacturers as consumers would have to replace their baits more often. |
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Posts: 4080
Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion | Imobley - 2/14/2013 2:17 PM
It doesn't lack common sense,
Maine's state biologists are the ones pushing this legislation, its been found that 10% of lakers and 65% of brook trout have soft plastics, that never break down and never pass on through, in their stomachs. I'm not saying i support this particular legislation but they have a valid concern.
Imobly.
Did you read the report?
It was conducted in a Controlled Environment . The fish were fed fish food and
Soft Plastics..... It's a Skewed test.
No single fish on this planet are exposed to that much plastic (in the Wild) in their lifetime. Plus Who throws their used S.P. lures into the water?
I just think there are more Important things to be concerned about.
Quit wasting Taxpayers money on B.S. studies !
Jerome
Edited by Top H2O 2/14/2013 3:42 PM
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Posts: 1360
Location: Lake "y" cause lake"x" got over fished | Top H2O - 2/14/2013 2:59 PM
Imobley - 2/14/2013 2:17 PM
It doesn't lack common sense,
Maine's state biologists are the ones pushing this legislation, its been found that 10% of lakers and 65% of brook trout have soft plastics, that never break down and never pass on through, in their stomachs. I'm not saying i support this particular legislation but they have a valid concern.
Imobly.
Did you read the report?
It was conducted in a Controlled Environment . The fish were fed fish food and
Soft Plastics..... It's a Skewed test.
No single fish on this planet are exposed to that much plastic (in the Wild ) in their lifetime.
I just think there are more Important things to be concerned about.
Quit wasting Taxpayers money on B.S. studies !
Jerome
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Not only that, but even the ones that do come into contact with soft plastics are being fished for and not fed willingly. So when you catch a fish with your bait in its mouth, you don't unhook the bait from the hook and let the fish keep it, you remove it and cast again for the next fish. OR, the ones that do eat it (bait and hook) I'd be willing to bet that a bunch of those fish are kept for substanance by the angler anyway. Thus it doesn't matter if it would effect them or not, their going to die on someones wood plank grill anyway.
It's not like anglers are "chumming" the water with soft plastics in an attempt to catch bigger fish, that would be stupid and an inncredible waste of money. |
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Posts: 1169
Location: New Hope MN | Here's their point of view.
IMO - BS
Abstract
Thirty-eight brook trout Salvelinus fontinalis were fed a commercial trout diet mixed with a free-choice assortment of soft plastic lures (SPLs) over a 90-d period. Fish growth was recorded and compared with that of a control group. The brook trout readily ate the SPLs from the water's surface as well as from the tank bottom. At the conclusion of the study, SPLs were recovered from the stomachs of 63% of the test fish. Several fish stomachs contained multiple lures. Twelve percent of the fish voluntarily ingested more than 10% of their body mass in SPLs. These fish lost a significant amount of weight during the study, had a significant decrease in body condition factor, and began displaying anorexic behaviors. For these reasons, anglers should be discouraged from discarding used SPLs in trout waters.
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| It does sound crazy, I have no doubt many walleye fishermen or dark house folks things 54 plus inch size limits are crazy as well. Better to counter with logic and tact vs accusing people of being crazy. I am sure they don't think they are crazy. Hopefully this does not go through. BR
Edited by BenR 2/14/2013 3:32 PM
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Location: Minneapolis | Seems like better regulations to keep another AIS like Asian carp from entering our country would be a better way to spend our time. AIS will change fish and ecosystems more than soft plastics ever will... |
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| Trash is a bigger problem no doubt, you should see the plastic slicks in the ocean, they are crazy, they never go away. |
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Posts: 1220
| I singed the petition, and got the thank you note back for doing so. I belive you really have to keep up with stuff like this. When anglers agree and work together to achieve common goals, we can be a fearsome bloc. Marty Forman |
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Posts: 84
| Def. read the report doesn't change that the concern is warranted, I completely disagree with the proposed legislation it's too broad, and their has been no real study on wild fish. i spoke with a old friend who is retired state biologist (i will try to have him post on here soon) from Maine and he stated that they've had a concern about plastic lures for some time especially with stocked fish that have been raised on pellets that they pick up off the bottom of tanks. Also remember there was a time the public opposed steal shot for migratory birds. |
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| Not to be a cynic, but is there any consequential threat to signing the petition? I don't mind putting my name out there in opposition, but I would hate for it to have a negative impact on myself or others down the road. One of my main sources of concern stems from the requirement to list one's state and zip code on the petition.
I know this isn't the first instance where legislation and petitions have come about within the sport. I'm just curious what about the protocol and what (if any) long term consequences have arisen. |
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Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Negative? No. None at all.
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | TC MUSKIE - 2/14/2013 2:35 PM
Seems like better regulations to keep another AIS like Asian carp from entering our country would be a better way to spend our time. AIS will change fish and ecosystems more than soft plastics ever will...
Some of us are trying!  |
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| sounds like fishermen need to do a better job cleaning up after themselves. |
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Posts: 4080
Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion | catchandrelease - 2/14/2013 8:03 PM
Not to be a cynic, but is there any consequential threat to signing the petition? I don't mind putting my name out there in opposition, but I would hate for it to have a negative impact on myself or others down the road. One of my main sources of concern stems from the requirement to list one's state and zip code on the petition.
I know this isn't the first instance where legislation and petitions have come about within the sport. I'm just curious what about the protocol and what (if any) long term consequences have arisen.
Are you serious? This legislation is Crap ! Why are you so paranoid ? |
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| I don't want my comment to be misconstrued; I strongly disagree with the legislation itself. I just don't want speaking out to yield a course of action that has more of a direct impact on myself or others in my area in the future. I don't disagree that I'm being paranoid, but I feel it's justified. |
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Posts: 151
Location: West of the metro, MN | Moltisanti - 2/14/2013 11:54 AM
I bet the concerned citizens and politicians involved couldn't build a decent campfire if you gave them the wood, kindling and a burning torch. But they are here to save the planet.
X2 |
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Posts: 4266
| What's next? No matter what we do, how careful we are, seems we are always causing problems. |
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Posts: 210
| That thought, Beav, seems essential to the human condition. |
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Posts: 726
Location: Eau Claire, WI | Looks like they are trying to take the bird issue to the fish in an effort to stop fishing with plastics and I would imagine someone would use it as a spring board to try the same approach on other types of lures/presenations.
Bird eats plastic, and doesn't digest it. The plastic fills its belly and eventually there is no room for anything nutritious. Bird dies.
http://www.businessinsider.com/photos-dead-birds-filled-with-plasti...
Seems a little overboard to apply to fish in a natural environment. Agree that in a lab, the opportunity is higher. Maybe biodegradable is better but I hardly see this as an extremely serious problem requiring a ban. Did they show where this is happening in nature?
Jono |
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NPAA Legislative Alert; Potential State Ban on Soft Plastic Lures