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Posts: 3511
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | Hi Everyone,
It's getting to the point in time where my ride is ready to give up the ghost, so I am starting the process of looking for a new truck to pull the toys with.
Guaranteed I will be looking at an HD truck in either 3/4 ton or 1 ton depending on price, options and capabilities, but here are my questions:
1. I'm not very familiar with diesel power plants(although I do know all makes have good solid dependable engines) and the idea of a DEF exhaust system needing to be refilled had me puzzled.. I think I understand how the system works well enough, but how often does that fluid need replacement or filling? And...what kind of cost would I be looking at? I did notice the 2012 Cummins power plant for Ram does not have that system, but that particular model year has lower towing and payload specs as well... 2013 specs have yet to be released, but the new power plant will have a DEF system on it.
2. I noticed gas prices in town today ($2.85 reg unleaded, $3.83 for Diesel). Given gas tanks are the same size (35 gallons just to throw out a tank size), it would cost me roughly $35 extra to fill a diesel tank. Is the gas mileage of a diesel good enough to offset the extra cost of running unleaded? (I know running E85 is no better than gas...I end up saving money by running unleaded since I didn't have to fill up as often and mileage was better...worked out to be about 4 tanks of e85 to 3 tanks unleaded) I know you can buy a bunch of unleaded for the extra $7 - 8K dropped on a diesel engine, but some deals are good enough now you are not really paying for the engine upgrade...
3. If you have a 2011 or newer Diesel engine on an HD truck (any brand, but please do not disclose that or the engine manufacture..I don't want to start the war as I am looking at all 3 brands) what kind of MPG are you seeing in town and on the road (normal use) and what do you see pulling your toys along with the gear ratio you running? I'd really like to hear from anyone pulling a 5th wheel as well....even better if you are double towing at all as I would like to have that as an option since it is legal to do in the states I normally travel to (I would be under the max length for each state..already checked that).
I know...long winded, but my analytical mind does this to me. Sorry...
And...thanks in advance!!
Steve
Edited by VMS 1/10/2013 10:15 PM
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Posts: 13688
Location: minocqua, wi. | i've been running diesel trucks most of my life and back in the day there have traditionally been 3 main advantages ... 1. lower fuel cost, 2. better mileage and 3. longevity.
1. gone
2. gas engines getting closer
3. still there ...
if you choose to you can own and drive your diesel much, much longer. this doesn't come without expense. oil changes ... 13-15 qts. of oil to change (yes, that much) and repairs can tend to be more expensive. it's even more critical to find a really, really good mechanic and don't think for a second that the dealer knows what they are doing. if you leave repairs and service to dealers they will steal you blind.
i've got 247k on my current truck and plan to run it to 500k miles. it truly runs better today than it did when it was new. 100k is break-in.
pulling comfort and power unequalled
if you live in cold climates they can be inconvenient but its a way of life for me so don't think about it anymore and just think and plan ahead on bitter cold days/nights.
if you buy a diesel they are all great trucks ... went through transmissions on dodges at 90k miles (you could set your watch to it). the ford is fantastic and the biggest and best interior in the market. chevy charges more for theirs (at least they did when i bought) and i just don't see the value.
best diesel truck - ford chassis, allison transmission and a cummins HO ... wish they made that truck!! |
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Posts: 3511
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | Hi Sled,
I hear you on that final combination!! I'm curious on the dodge tranmission, though...how long ago was that where you dealt with that experience?
Thanks
Steve |
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Posts: 734
Location: Watertown, MN | STeve the big question is how much will you be driving your truck? towing and regular miles? Think that will answer your queston on the longevity part, for me if putting a tons of miles on the truck, then I would run a diesel, if 5-15K a year I would lean towards gas. MPG is a wash with cost of fuel, maintenance, and initial cost of diesel. Funny thing is everyone love there littel VW Jetta diesel that get 60+ MPG, but reports still show it is one of the highest cost per mile to maintain on the road.
Troy |
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Posts: 3511
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | Hi Troy,
I average about 20K a year on the road as highway miles. current truck has 227,000 on it and will be 10 years old in February. Most of the driving is to and from the north country pulling a boat, but it does get a bit of time pulling a 5th wheel as well. The fall sees the ATV in the back and winter gets the ATV and an ice shelter on a snowmobile trailer.
It will get used for some daily driving for work as needed.
Truck will be looking to pull both the 5th wheel and the boat simultaneously at some point.
Steve
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Posts: 4080
Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion | I've been running Diesel's for about 27 yrs. now and love em.
I've only had 2 Chevy's and 5 Fords.
The 3/4 ton trucks have a higher rear end gear ratio than the 1 ton dully that I drive right now, so the 3/4 ton will get close to 21mpg hwy. while my dully will get 14.5mpg.
The dully has a longer wheelbase and I think a more stable ride when pulling my 36ft Travel Trailer(12,000.lbs)or my28 ft Construction Trailer (18,000.lbs) than the 3/4 ton. Mileage drops down to about 11mpg . These trucks are 2004-2005.
I always buy used and save a ton of cash,... like Sled said "100,000 miles" is just getting broken in.
These trucks will no doubt go to 500,000 miles and more
Winter time just plug it in and no problem starting @ 20-40 below zero.
When pulling my 21ft. Skeeter the mpg drops down to about 13 and you don't even know it's behind you.
Sure wish they still made that 7.3 International. That sucker would pull a house.
Jerome
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Posts: 90
| The EPA seems to have ruined all the great attributes that drew people to diesel power plants. It might seem strange but you would be in good shape if you looked for a lower mileage '06 or older GM or dodge. The 7.3 ford(Int) was arguably the BEST diesel available in a 3/4 -1ton truck EVER and would also be a great option. The 6.0 was nicknamed "power pop" for a reason. I don't know anything about that dual turbo engine they made in '08/'09 but they didn't keep it in production very long. That's never a good sign.
A foreman at work (bridge/hvy highway construction) just bought the new ford 6.7 and is only seeing 17mpg highway. The 5.4 gas in the same platform gets 15mpg.
All the manufacturers are struggling with the new EPA regulations and it looks like the good 'ol days of the diesel are gone....
*Even a Dodge guy will tell you that if you buy a Cummins/auto trans combo, buy a second transmission with it. However, I've never heard any complaints about the 6-speed manual trans.
My .02 |
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Posts: 136
Location: Dane Country | Being a cross country mover (truck driver)and Hot rodder. I have over 2 million miles just in a semi- rig. I think I know a few things about trucks. You asked about DEF fluid. This fluid is used for EPA purposes. You must also factor that cost with your fuel cost. I have a 1997 Ford F250 Super cab, 2wd. 460,auto and 3:55 limited slip rear. I have never had a problem at any ramp, with ice and snow or towing my boat. The original owner towed a 10,000lb. boat with this truck for 14 years before I got it. I love my gas pickup.12- 13mpg local, 16mpg highway. I drive between 55-60mph. Towing my boat 11-12 local and 14-15 highway.
That being said my son owns White's Diesel Performance in FLA. He LOVES diesels and builds hi performance pick ups. Each person has a preference. I live in Wi. Things to consider with diesels
1-must plug in during winter or really hard starts on the motor
2-need fuel additives to prevent water or gelling for fuel
3-Maintance is a lot more than gas
4- repairs and parts cost more
5-diesel is not cheaper than gas
Things about gas
1- not great mpg
2-Maintance cheap and easy (changed everything on the 460 @ 100k, everything was original)
3-gas is cheaper
4-repairs and parts are cheaper
5-motor weighs less and that increases pay load
It really depends if you tow a 5th wheel thru the mountains a lot and a super heavy boat than get a diesel. If you just pull on the weekends than I would go gas.
You also pay a 6-8k more for a diesel and you can buy a lot of gas with that money. Avoid Ford's 6.0 unless it has been bullet proofed,great motor just needs to be fixed from original form. Buy a Dodge get an extra tranny and if you buy a Chevy it's an Isuzui motor. One more thing, there are quite a few 460 and V-10 motors with 300-400k on them. It all depends on how they are taken care of. Good luck with your pick.
Edited by Scooter70 1/12/2013 8:45 PM
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Posts: 13688
Location: minocqua, wi. | VMS - 1/11/2013 10:08 AM
Hi Sled,
I hear you on that final combination!! I'm curious on the dodge tranmission, though...how long ago was that where you dealt with that experience?
Thanks
Steve
had a '99 and then an '04 ... quit and got a Ford ... |
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Questions on Truck engines.... Gas -vs- Diesel