Rusty Crayfish Observations
esox99
Posted 9/1/2012 9:59 AM (#582031)
Subject: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 95


I am working on a story about Rusty Crayfish and their impacts on habitat for muskies, pike and other species. I would appreciate the perspective of muskie anglers from OutdoorsFirst.com based upon your personal observations and experience.

Thanks! Kevin, MUSKIE Editor

http://www.muskiesinc.org/indy_files/mimag.html

ARmuskyaddict
Posted 9/1/2012 11:46 AM (#582042 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 2024


I was up in MN on Vermilion on a family trip this June and did some musky fishing with a friend who guides up there. I had done some fishing alone on the east end of V before fishing with him and some of cabbage spots he had pointed me too were simply not there. However, on the west end we were able to locate more weeds. However, he noted to me that there were several cabbage spots that no longer are as big due to the crayfish, and one of his favorite spots in the narrows didn't even exist anymore. I grew up around Vermilion and was shocked at the sheer number of crayfish I saw on the shoreline of the resort we were staying at. Since I no longer live up there and rarely get to Vermilion when I am home, I had not heard of the invasion and explosion. I'm not a biologist, but maybe people need to start having more crawfish boils up there! Or maybe the DNR needs to stock more fish that target crayfish.
seabass
Posted 9/1/2012 1:14 PM (#582054 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: RE: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 56


Over the past 5 years at Eagle Lake in Ontario some of the best weed beds have been steadily disappearing, to the point where it really isn't even worth fishing them anymore. The locals and guides say this is the result of crayfish.

Hard to say how this will affect fishing, but it definitely reduces some of the better weed areas. I worry what will happen in 5 years. Nothing is going to eat those crayfish fast enough.
ToddM
Posted 9/1/2012 3:14 PM (#582070 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 20230


Location: oswego, il
The rusty crayfish seem to impact weeds in hard bottom areas. They do not seem to wipe out weeds in muck filled bays. Take vermillion for example, bays like bystrom, armstrong and canfield are nearly void of weeds but rice bay for example is all muck bottom and has plenty of vegetation.

If you get a small lake with rusty crayfish and they take out all the weeds, the forage base can be wiped out.

Edited by ToddM 9/1/2012 3:16 PM
dfkiii
Posted 9/1/2012 5:30 PM (#582082 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Location: Sawyer County, WI

Stock smallmouth bass and create a new trophy fish destination.

(Awaiting pointer's view on how stupid that would be... )
Pointerpride102
Posted 9/1/2012 5:31 PM (#582086 - in reply to #582082)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 16632


Location: The desert
dfkiii - 9/1/2012 4:30 PM


Stock smallmouth bass and create a new trophy fish destination.

(Awaiting pointer's view on how stupid that would be... )


Why would that be stupid?
dfkiii
Posted 9/1/2012 5:50 PM (#582089 - in reply to #582086)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Location: Sawyer County, WI
Pointerpride102 - 9/1/2012 5:31 PM

dfkiii - 9/1/2012 4:30 PM


Stock smallmouth bass and create a new trophy fish destination.

(Awaiting pointer's view on how stupid that would be... )


Why would that be stupid?


No idea, but I'm not a fish biologist so I imagine there was something missing in my logic.

All I know is that the smallies on the lake where our cabin is in Sawyer County chow down on crayfish, and anything that remotely looks like them is a successful presentation.
Pointerpride102
Posted 9/1/2012 7:01 PM (#582097 - in reply to #582089)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 16632


Location: The desert
dfkiii - 9/1/2012 4:50 PM

Pointerpride102 - 9/1/2012 5:31 PM

dfkiii - 9/1/2012 4:30 PM


Stock smallmouth bass and create a new trophy fish destination.

(Awaiting pointer's view on how stupid that would be... )


Why would that be stupid?


No idea, but I'm not a fish biologist so I imagine there was something missing in my logic.

All I know is that the smallies on the lake where our cabin is in Sawyer County chow down on crayfish, and anything that remotely looks like them is a successful presentation.


Smallies like crayfish. Having a big number of crayfish as a main forage can yield some very nice bass. While they likely won't eradicate the rusties, you can create a decent bass fishery.

Now if the bass are to be stocked in a non native area then some other issues should be addressed. See the Yampa and Colorado rivers.
Doug Dible
Posted 9/1/2012 9:12 PM (#582112 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: RE: Rusty Crayfish Observations


I think like on Eagle the bass wont eat the rusty crayfish
dougj
Posted 9/1/2012 9:41 PM (#582118 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: RE: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 906


Location: Warroad, Mn

Here's some things I've seen on the LOTWs

There are plenty of smallie and walleye in the LOTWS who love to eat crayfish, yet the Rusties seem to be doing well.

I don't quite remember the first year they where found in the LOTWs, but I would think a call to the Kenora MNR office would give you this info, If I remember right it was somewhere around 25 years ago. As I recall they where first found in Snake Bay just off Whitefish Bay. No doubt brought in by a smallmouth fisherman. Surprisingly, from what I can tell the weeds in Whitefish haven't been effected as much as the dark water areas of the lake. They seem to have slowly worked their way up the east side of the lake toward Kenora, with many weed beds missing. Around 10-12 years ago they started to show up in the Angle area, and the weed beds are slowly but surely disappearing. They seem to be slowly working their way south and east and there are areas in Miles and Sabaskong that used to have great cabbage seems to be gone. Surprisingly one bay that used to have great cabbage will be empty and a half mile away the next one will still have cabbage. However, this changes every year with more and more bays and islands missing cabbage. I've seen weed beds the size of football fields disappear over the course of one year. The green cabbage is the first to go and there's very little of this left in the Angle. The Red Cabbage and the coontail are the last to go as their stems are larger and harder or the Rusties to clip off. What's left is a few patches of densely clustered Red Cabbage (must be a different species than the old ones), but so dense that it would be hard for a fish to swim through it. later in the season there is a growth of what I call spaghetti (tall stringy shots of string like weeds). These seem to show up where their used to be cabbage.

Not real sure what this will do to the fish populations on the LOTWs, but I doubt that it'll help. The young of the year use weed beds as nursery spots as they provide cover and food. Without them I sort of wonder about the potential for natural reproduction. However, in the last ten years since the weeds have started to disappear i still seem to see many small fish. This year I've probably seem more 20" fish than I've every seen, but I have no accurate records, so it may just be a personal perspective. 

I still see plenty of Young-of-the-year, so maybe the muskies don't think it's as big a deal as I do. Time will tell. Fishing still seem to be good, but I have the feeling that the number of big fish available is falling. I've also sensed that this year the catch rate is somewhat lower than in past years. Who knows if this indicates a lower population of fish or something else.

Wish I could met the guy who brought the Rusties to the LOTWs, as I'd like to have a little talk with him!

Doug Johnson



Edited by dougj 9/1/2012 9:59 PM
ARmuskyaddict
Posted 9/1/2012 10:10 PM (#582121 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 2024


Stock the local communities with some some cajuns. They love crayfish!
jerryb
Posted 9/1/2012 10:42 PM (#582122 - in reply to #582121)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 688


Location: Northern IL
It all sounds so scary.....

AR, you know they're  showing off when you hear, "suck the brains out". Ha ha!

The good thing is I won't have to pull weeds off my lure when I make the mistake of running into them while trolling a weedline, ha ha! 

The little guys will still have the shallows to get away from those big nasty predictors,,,,, how long have muskies been in lakes and reproducing "without human intervention" just fine thank you,,, and what are you gonna do to stop this awful atrocity, nothing.... Sleep well my friends it'll all be okay..... 

Edited by jerryb 9/1/2012 10:44 PM
sworrall
Posted 9/1/2012 11:40 PM (#582131 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 32895


Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
Doug's response is spot on. The rusty is a stream crayfish, not native to lakes, and once introduced, they very quickly over run the native population and begin the process Doug describes. Rusties made a mess of Pelican for years, and still have a significant impact despite TONS trapped out and sold overseas. They are a destructive invasive that bass don't control well at all. The destruction of most of the vegetation in any body of water is bad, but the added impact of a living carpet of Rusties eating nearly every egg dropped during the spawn doesn't help NR. Nasty critters, and one should not make light of the impact.

There are lakes in this area with ZERO vegetation left as a result of this invasive.

http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/invasives/aquaticanimals/rustycrayfish/i...
esox99
Posted 9/2/2012 10:02 AM (#582150 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: RE: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 95


Thanks to the many replies so far. Steve and Doug really highlighted the challenges.

Several observations and discussions got me fired up on this:
1. The stark difference between the east and west basins of Lake Vermillion.
2. The changes I have observed in Sabaskong Bay over the past 5 years.
3. My observations in July and August this year of the surface of several Sabaskong Bay bays littered with small pieces of tape grass, and then my son landing a big Rusty Crayfish on a double 8 spinner in one of those bays after a backlash; it wouldn't let go.

Please keep the reports coming. I may contact a few of you for additional details.

Kevin, MUSKIE Editor
http://www.muskiesinc.org/indy_files/mimag.html

Pointerpride102
Posted 9/2/2012 1:33 PM (#582172 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 16632


Location: The desert
If you want some scholarly articles about them, let me know.
beerforthemuskygods
Posted 9/2/2012 4:36 PM (#582201 - in reply to #582172)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 410


Location: one foot over the line
Most of the rustys have disappeared from my cabin lake in north-central WI. I used to trap them and eat them by the bucketfull and now I can barely get six. Lookin for a new spot to trap hundreds or thousands, so if you are inundated with rustys and are close to the tomahawk area let me know. I realize that this isn't a solution, however, you might get some satisfaction out of helping a hillbilly with a meal. thanks
Top H2O
Posted 9/2/2012 5:37 PM (#582208 - in reply to #582201)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 4080


Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion
Seams like a lot of work to get much to eat from these little buggers ?
How do you cook, and eat them ? is there Brain sucking going on?
curious. They tend to be to small to bother with.. a Crawdad is much bigger, isn't it?
jdsplasher
Posted 9/2/2012 6:34 PM (#582212 - in reply to #582208)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 2279


Location: SE, WI.

Pelican's weed beds use to thrive when the common bullhead was present. So did the musky and walleye!!!

After the commercial netting and the eradication of the bullheads from Pelican seemed to lead to the mass invasion of the rusty crayfish. What do you think ate the rusty's when in their soft shell state....THE BULLHEAD!!!

Maybe they should start stocking bullheads again???

Probably also helped the jig fisherman who used to fish black creatures...Huh! :

Lunker_1
Posted 9/3/2012 12:00 AM (#582235 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: RE: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 87


Location: Brainerd,MN
On the west end of Vermilion we would trap rustys for a meal the past couple years or so. We would set traps about 1/3 mile from one of our weedy milk run muskie spots. We would get about 100 or so rustys per night. We would only keep the rustys and throw the natives back. This year when we set the trap in the same area we noticed a big change. Only got about a dozen caught. Noticed that the weedy area where we set the traps have disappeared. This year we've noticed that our good muskie spot has gone dormant as well. No weeds left. So within the past 2 years the little buggers have made a big impact and are heading rapidly to the west.

I haven't seen any change in the muskies at this point other than they have been displaced. My primary spot has become an after thought and my secondary spot in the area is now my primary. The concerns for me would be loss of habitat not only for their home but possible spawning grounds as well. Fish do adapt to other structures but how long would it take for fish to adapt to those without disruption in spawning? A year or two of disruption could cause a big effect on year class populations. On the positive side to rustys is that the perch and smallmouth have thrived on them. Lots of jumbos being caught. Only problem is that rustys reproduce much faster than they can be preyed upon.

All invasives cause problems with the ecology of a healthy fishery. Everything from zebra mussels to milfoil to rusty crayfish. But I do believe it's a 50-50 problem thou. 50% bad for the lake and the other 50% it just flat out screws with us fisherman. Sometimes us weekend warriors have a harder time adapting to the changing conditions that invasive species cause. And of course when that happens the mentality is that the lake has become a sewer.

Jeff Young
leech lake strain
Posted 9/3/2012 8:47 AM (#582252 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 540


the famous seven mile weed beds of portage bay leech lake were wiped out basically 3 yrs ago all that was left was a 1/4mile chunk close to 2 points, most weeds in the big lake were gone. yrs ago we used to catch way more burbot (eelpout) than we do now and the big eelpout festival as had a huge impact on the lake population of pout. From what I have gather over the yrs is crayfish are the #1 source of food for the pout so it doint help that they are thinned out as much as they are. In the last 2yrs I have heard that the rusties had taken a big hit, no one knows why but the weeds are coming back and portage bay has alot more again, like doug johnson said alot of coontail and stuff has replaced the cabbage though. One theory that I wonder about the the rusties taken a hit was that they litereally ate themselves out of house and home.
djwilliams
Posted 9/3/2012 2:27 PM (#582292 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 781


Location: Ames, Iowa
99-
Get hold of Gretchen Hanson at the Univ of Wisconsin. She's the expert. I suggested to her years ago that the rusty was responsible for the walleye decline on Leech as much as or more than the cormorants. My opinion was that the rusty was consuming walleye and perch eggs at a rate that would destroy local year classes. I think that rusty crayfish experience boom and bust population cycles based on how much of a lake's weeds are consumed. I think they eat themselves into population decline. Most of the perch, rockbass, bluegills we get on leech have been feasting on rustys.
jerryb
Posted 9/3/2012 3:30 PM (#582300 - in reply to #582292)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 688


Location: Northern IL
It's the world we live in today and no one's ever happy when invasive species invade. Change causes change, if the zebra muscle comes calling on your body of water, the weeds will grow to a deeper depth and we can anticipate fish movements to be deeper as well. The zebra muscles have cleared many of our waters forcing fishermen to fish deeper than ever before, the fish are still there just harder to catch.

I 'll be honest I don't get too caught up in many things I have no control over, say what you want about that, theres a lot of others to fill that void. So I admit I'm not totally up to speed with all the negative effects of these little critters besides,,, now, ha ha the destruction of weeds and the eating a few eggs, don't blue gills eat eggs? When I read less weeds, I thought "hooray"' were always looking for less weeds.... But that has more to do with water color and fish movements being more shallow. I may have been a bit sanguine, that happens,,, earlier about the subject however if the loss of weeds, which I'm sure there's probably a big long list Im not yet aware of is the only bad thing, I still say so what! Nature will right herself, she always does, but for now I actually like the idea..

This is exactly the kind of thing I talk about all the time, distractions... Do you fish to catch fish or since you don't catch fish do you get all caught up in distractions.

A lake is no better or worse if it has weeds or it doesn't, I get the caster like having something to throw at but some of the best waters in the world are body's of water with NOTa single blade of grass!

Mr. Johnson said, "I still see plenty of Young-of-the-year, so maybe the muskies don't think it's as big a deal as I do. Time will tell. Fishing still seem to be good, but I have the feeling that the number of big fish available is falling. I've also sensed that this year the catch rate is somewhat lower than in past years. Who knows if this indicates a lower population of fish or something else."

My answer to that which I agree with, is guys are casting at weeds, or a "break" that are either not as large as they once were or not there at all, meaning the fish wont be hanging around as long which equals less fish being caught, Okay, time to make a change.

Edited by jerryb 9/3/2012 3:33 PM
sworrall
Posted 9/3/2012 3:55 PM (#582303 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 32895


Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
You might want less weeds in a eutrophic, over fertile systems that have been aged 1000 years in less than 50 by pollution and rimmed in Milfoil, another wonderful invasive, but I sure don't want less weeds in the mid to late Meso systems here and Mesotrophic systems in Canada. Rusty crayfish eat more than 'a few' eggs when they are there in numbers, the bottom can and does literally move with a carpet of the things.

If the substrate Muskies use to spawn in is damaged or altered significantly by an invasive, NR can nearly cease and stocking is the only answer to maintain healthy populations.

That wouldn't be my choice, and I bet it sure isn't our DNR's.


Not everything is answered by a spoon plug. And no one is saying they don't know how to use a spoonplug or adapt to changing condiftions, Jerry, we get it that you are a disciple. Spoonplugging is one method of many that are effective. We can't troll up here at all.
Pointerpride102
Posted 9/3/2012 4:04 PM (#582306 - in reply to #582300)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 16632


Location: The desert
jerryb - 9/3/2012 2:30 PM

It's the world we live in today and no one's ever happy when invasive species invade. Change causes change, if the zebra muscle comes calling on your body of water, the weeds will grow to a deeper depth and we can anticipate fish movements to be deeper as well. The zebra muscles have cleared many of our waters forcing fishermen to fish deeper than ever before, the fish are still there just harder to catch.

I 'll be honest I don't get too caught up in many things I have no control over, say what you want about that, theres a lot of others to fill that void. So I admit I'm not totally up to speed with all the negative effects of these little critters besides,,, now, ha ha the destruction of weeds and the eating a few eggs, don't blue gills eat eggs? When I read less weeds, I thought "hooray"' were always looking for less weeds.... But that has more to do with water color and fish movements being more shallow. I may have been a bit sanguine, that happens,,, earlier about the subject however if the loss of weeds, which I'm sure there's probably a big long list Im not yet aware of is the only bad thing, I still say so what! Nature will right herself, she always does, but for now I actually like the idea..

This is exactly the kind of thing I talk about all the time, distractions... Do you fish to catch fish or since you don't catch fish do you get all caught up in distractions.

A lake is no better or worse if it has weeds or it doesn't, I get the caster like having something to throw at but some of the best waters in the world are body's of water with NOTa single blade of grass!

Mr. Johnson said, "I still see plenty of Young-of-the-year, so maybe the muskies don't think it's as big a deal as I do. Time will tell. Fishing still seem to be good, but I have the feeling that the number of big fish available is falling. I've also sensed that this year the catch rate is somewhat lower than in past years. Who knows if this indicates a lower population of fish or something else."

My answer to that which I agree with, is guys are casting at weeds, or a "break" that are either not as large as they once were or not there at all, meaning the fish wont be hanging around as long which equals less fish being caught, Okay, time to make a change.


Oy.
beerforthemuskygods
Posted 9/3/2012 4:38 PM (#582318 - in reply to #582208)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 410


Location: one foot over the line
Top H2O - 9/2/2012 5:37 PM

Seams like a lot of work to get much to eat from these little buggers ?
How do you cook, and eat them ? is there Brain sucking going on?
curious. They tend to be to small to bother with.. a Crawdad is much bigger, isn't it?



With a little practice, a seasoned crawdadder can consume a hundred in 15 min. A good sized rusty is around 4 inches (not including the claws). I empty my traps into a large cooler and cover them with water, then pour some salt on them (this makes them crap out) and then rinse or leave the hose on them. Get yourself a large pot, boil water, throw in some old bay seasoning, chunks of lemon and onion. drop crawdads in water, boil for 8-10 min. drain. dump onto paper-lined picnic table. Feast! Serve with lots of cold beer and melted butter.
I'm still looking for those lake suggestions. and, YES, there is alot of brain sucking going on, that's all part of the fun. thanks
ARmuskyaddict
Posted 9/3/2012 4:53 PM (#582321 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 2024


Beer, you can also boil some corn and new potatoes before you add the crawfish and it's all done at the same time.

Edited by ARmuskyaddict 9/3/2012 5:30 PM
Top H2O
Posted 9/3/2012 6:36 PM (#582332 - in reply to #582321)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 4080


Location: Elko - Lake Vermilion
Dang,...... That sounds pretty good.

Vermilion's East End has lost most of it's weeds and still has a good Muskie bite.

The Rusty's have moved into the mid section now, so they aren't as numerous on the East side as they once were. I noticed them 13 yrs ago , and watched them move about 8-10 miles since then.
Greenwood Bay used to be thick with weeds 4 yrs. ago, now it's very sparse,......But you'll still find Muskies there, same with Stuntz Bay.

Smalley's love em too.

Jerome
beerforthemuskygods
Posted 9/3/2012 7:29 PM (#582344 - in reply to #582332)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 410


Location: one foot over the line
If you ever get a chance to go to a crawdad feed, it will be well worth your time! Surprised more wisconsinites don't do this. Maybe its just the redneck in me. AR, I do my potatoes and corn in a seperate pot to preserve their flavor and not have everything taste like crawdad. Anyway you slice it, with enough butter and beer you can never go wrong. Shoot, i'm gettin hungry!
dougj
Posted 9/3/2012 7:49 PM (#582357 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: RE: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 906


Location: Warroad, Mn

I suspect that on lakes that rely on mother nature to produce the fish we pursue that weed growth is quite important, and that's why I'm worried. I've watched many a  muskie spawn on the LOTWs and it has always been in areas that would have emerging weeds about the time that the young-of-the year are born. I'm worried that without the natural nurseries that the weeds would provide (cover and food) the small fish will be food for every thing that swims. As I say I see less and less weed beds every year and that worries me. As I also say time will tell. I sort of have doubts that the LOTWs muskie can adapt to a very new environment in a very short period of time, as they have been spawning on emerging weeds for thousands of years..

On lakes that are stocked I would guess that weeds are nuisance.

I doubt that a spoon plug will produce little muskies!

Doug Johnson



Edited by dougj 9/3/2012 7:52 PM
stephendawg
Posted 9/3/2012 8:16 PM (#582362 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: RE: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 1023


Location: Lafayette, IN
Being from Indiana and having been on Big Winnie back in the 60's and now Vermilion for the last 12 years there has always been something exciting, challenging, romantic, even euphoric about the vast cabbage beds of Minnesota. Although I've never seen cabbage on Big V like I saw on Winnie when I was a kid the overall decline in weed beds on Vermilion in the last 12 years has been startling. I've slipped back into bays on the northeast end that had depth and a soft bottom with reeds around the edges and not a single weed present! Only the presence of rusties moving across the bottom like a wave. Almost creepy. Thankfully, I know there are many trophy fish still present on this beautiful lake. I simply have to work harder and smarter to get them. Not something I typically do on vacation... but, the point remains. I'll leave it up to the experts to come up with a solution (if one is needed). In the meantime I'll CPR so you can also catch the memories and will keep my boat clean of invasive species. Interesting thread.
djwilliams
Posted 9/3/2012 8:17 PM (#582363 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 781


Location: Ames, Iowa
>>A lake is no better or worse if it has weeds or it doesn't...<<
Meso lakes with a healthy growth of naturally occurring weeds at the bottom and the surface of the water have far greater micro and macro invertebrate diversity and therefore increased capacity to grow more fish of each species. More habitat equals more fish per acre.
djwilliams
Posted 9/3/2012 8:23 PM (#582365 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 781


Location: Ames, Iowa
http://limnology.wisc.edu/personnel/hansen/index_files/Page465.htm

http://limnology.wisc.edu/personnel/hansen/index_files/Page465.htm
kjgmh
Posted 9/4/2012 9:41 AM (#582452 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 1091


Location: Hayward, WI
The lake my family's cabin on had LOTS of them 6-10 years ago. We would trap them and eat them when ever we where up. The fishing was great (walleye,musky, small mouth), the water quality was great and the lake seemed happy and in balance. Then it got commercially trapped 2 years for crayfish and the crayfish disappeared. The lake now seems out of balance to me. The fishing has dropped off (except for largemouth), the water quality has declined (it is now greener and there is lots of crud on the bottom), we now have terrible siwmmers itch and the weeds are growing out of control. I can't say that the cray fish is the cause of this or if there are lots of other factors to look at, just my observations.
dtaijo174
Posted 9/4/2012 2:05 PM (#582525 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 1169


Location: New Hope MN
I hate to hijack the thread, but what are some lakes with Milfoil and rusties? What does that combination look like?
LarryO
Posted 9/4/2012 2:15 PM (#582526 - in reply to #582321)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 192


Don't forget to throw some andouille in the pot also.
beerforthemuskygods
Posted 9/4/2012 3:17 PM (#582534 - in reply to #582526)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 410


Location: one foot over the line
LarryO - 9/4/2012 2:15 PM

Don't forget to throw some andouille in the pot also.


How could i forget the sausage??????....must have been the beer....
Clark A
Posted 9/4/2012 10:08 PM (#582621 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 626


Location: Bloomington, MN
If the "Rusty" is from the south, and the northern Wisiconsin lakes only had "Fantails" prior to the late 60's/early 70's the stories I have heard may hold some relevance. A successful bait shop owner and "Crab Trapper" that also sold to restaurants knew that bigger crayfish meant more profit. "Supposedly" he introduced them to his home waters after making a trip down south. My friend worked for his during hs High School years many years later and would ofter trap over 300 lbs. a day. The lake were Pelican and Metonga.
KenK
Posted 9/5/2012 11:52 AM (#582728 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 575


Location: Elk Grove Village, IL & Phillips, WI
Is that the same "Crab Trapper" that got kicked off another website over all his comments on the Pelican lake forum? I think he also made some trouble here for a while too calling out Mr. Worrall and Norm Wild about the increase to 50 on Pelican. If so, he should be flogged!!

Edited by KenK 9/5/2012 12:20 PM
Dan Klis
Posted 9/5/2012 7:17 PM (#582806 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: RE: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 153


With repsect to LOTW I think Doug's response was spot on. I will say that I am far from an expert!

Having spent the last tweny five years running around LOTW's (as a Flag Island guide for four years and "weekend warrior" for the rest) has been interesting, I have a B.S in Biology and watching the Rusty's change the environment has been fascinating, but concerning as well. We literally (over two years) watched the disapperance of weedbeds from Kennedy Island down to the Windigo's, hell Burnt Island used to be surrounded by weeds. There are none there now. I haven't been in Miles or Sabaskong for six years, but understand the Rusty's have taken out the weeds. Also - in October I used to catch muskies just outside the weedbeds while trolling. Trolling has gotten tougher for me since they arrived.

I had two spots that were almost "automatic", Jack Burns and I called these: "Its a Sure Thing" and "No Respect". Doug once told me that "No Respect" was Doug Stange's favorite spot on LOTW's. I haven't seen a fish in those two spots in four years. I kills me each time I fish those, we caught a bunch of big ones in those two spots. Even the area named (I believe by Doug) "Big Fish Country" the fish have become harder to catch.

It also seems that the more fish just following. Who know's???

One thing I have noticed (but will mention that I have no proof) is how the past two years the Angle has become clearer with less algae blooms earlier in the seaon. I remember in 1993 or 1994 there was an algae bloom on Muskie opener (although last weekend there was bloom in quite a few areas). Some have said that this is due to lack of rain and lack of runoff, but I have no idea. They may be right. But with this years early ice out, I expected an early algae bloom.

I have noticed the smallies are on average bigger. Its very interesting to see walleye's and smallies cough up Rusty's when they are molting.

Prior to muskie opener, my friends and I fish smallies in the Angle. This year I purchased a Dahlberg Clackin' Crawfish Bait (River to Sea). I believed this would give me an edge over my buddies. So I fished with this for two whole days, my buddies fished with tubes, cranks, and spinnerbaits. They kicked my tail. Maybe I need to paint it to look more like a Rusty. However, I do believe this is a great bait and maybe I didn't fish it right.

No matter what most invasive species are not a good thing, especially for a naturally producing lake like LOTW's. It's possible on stocking lakes that the Rusty's have less of an impact, but would defer to a Fisheries Biologist on that one. Rod Ramsell or Bob Strand would be good person's to speak with.

I am just happy I have the opportunity (and a job that allows me) to spend a bunch of time on LOTW's. And want to mention that my friends and I (and many tourist's or visitor's) are still catching some nice fish. But as Doug mentioned the catch rate has seemed to declined.

Dan



Edited by Dan Klis 9/5/2012 7:23 PM
elTim164
Posted 9/5/2012 10:13 PM (#582835 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 24


They reduce weeds and are a favorite for the second best freshwater fish, smaillies.
sworrall
Posted 9/6/2012 8:06 AM (#582873 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 32895


Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
'reduce'?
jerryb
Posted 9/6/2012 9:26 AM (#582887 - in reply to #582362)
Subject: RE: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 688


Location: Northern IL
Ok somebody help me out, milfoil, "it's a wonderful invasive", what's the problem with it?

Mr. Johnson,
Point taken! 
sworrall
Posted 9/6/2012 9:29 AM (#582888 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 32895


Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
Get caught with a bunch on your trailer trying to launch somewhere. Drive through Oneida county trailing some off your trailer bunks, the County Sheriff will give you a special piece of paper.

There's your answer.
Propster
Posted 9/6/2012 5:22 PM (#582981 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 1901


Location: MN
This morning the DNR Fisheries guys on Vermilion let us pull up close to their boat and watch them pull in one of their test nets. Besides several keeper walleyes, a couple big suckers, some good size perch and a couple small ciscos, there was a carpload of rusties in the net. They estimated over 500. The net had been out less than 24 hrs. This was on the east side near Comet. Side note - saw another invasive when I left V for Bemidji this afternoon. Had a wolf cross the road right in front of me on 53.
Jeremy
Posted 9/6/2012 5:48 PM (#582983 - in reply to #582981)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 1144


Location: Minnesota.
Propster - 9/6/2012 5:22 PM

Side note - saw another invasive when I left V for Bemidji this afternoon. Had a wolf cross the road right in front of me on 53.


Cool! Consider yourself lucky. I saw one once outside of Virginia after we stopped for breakfast. Awesome critters indeed.

Nature, it's amazing...

tundrawalker00
Posted 9/6/2012 5:56 PM (#582985 - in reply to #582983)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations




Posts: 504


Location: Ludington, MI
Michigan is currently experimenting with special smallmouth regs on Ottawa Lake in Iron County and they're having promising results. The number of large rusties is down significantly.


Edited by tundrawalker00 9/6/2012 6:04 PM
cphilli
Posted 9/6/2012 8:55 PM (#583022 - in reply to #582985)
Subject: Re: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 175




http://www.trapperarne.com/


Website has traps and recipes. Rusties beware. We don't come in peace!!!

If they are going to be everywhere we might as well enjoy.
esox99
Posted 9/7/2012 9:57 AM (#583096 - in reply to #582031)
Subject: RE: Rusty Crayfish Observations





Posts: 95


Thanks to all for sharing your observations and your insightful comments. I have also been in touch with some fisheries biologists and other crayfish experts. Look for more about this in the November issue of MUSKIE.

Invasive species can cause very serious problems. We all need to be diligent about taking precautions not to spread aqautic invasive species such as rusty crayfish, zebra mussels, invasive plants, etc.

I also enjoyed some of the lighter comments about eating rusty crayfish. I think I'll start including a crayfish boil during some of my summer trips to waters invaded by the rusty. It won't solve the problem, but it will provide a tasty way to get even with at least some of the invaders!

Remember, the Sept/Oct issue of MUSKIE is available free to the public on the Muskies Inc. website: http://www.muskiesinc.org/indy_files/mimag.html
Most issues are only available to our members.

Kevin, MUSKIE Editor