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| I've been making my own steel leaders (80lb) for awhile now but am having some problems with getting the crimps to hold perfectly. Ill admit I have been using a cheap pair of crimping pliers but do you all think that when I buy a better pair it will eliminate this problem? Also I was looking into making some flourocarbon leaders, do you guys crimp those as well or can you just tie those? Thanks for any input |
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Posts: 431
| Two words "Stealth Tackle" |
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Posts: 944
| Losing a fish of a lifetime or snapping a bait off in a fish is not worth the couple bucks you save buying cheap leaders or making your own if you can't do it correctly. IMO 80# is way too small for musky
Buy Stealth Leaders they are the best made.
Jeff Hanson
madisonmuskyguide.com |
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| you think 80lb STEEL is too light? gimme a break... pun intended
to the OP, are you sure you're crimping properly? |
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Posts: 47
Location: Québec, Canada | no need to sleeve, you just do like when you do the loop for a Bucktail |
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Posts: 432
Location: Eagan, MN | Gotta agree there, been making my own for 20 years with 80'ish pound single strand (usually 88lb) never had a single failure. I replace the wire as soon as it's kinked, recycle the swivel (and the snap too if it still looks good) and I'm good to go.
And as was already stated, you don't crimp single strand. I have a couple of old du-bro leader tools that make it easy. |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | Other than the fact that steel isn't as subject to nicks and premature breakage, what's the difference between 80-pound STEEL leaders and 80-pound fluoro leaders? I could argue that the fluoro leader isn't as vulnerable to kinking and then breakage, by the way. Breaking strength is breaking strength.
What weighs more: A pound of lead, or a pound of feathers?
If an 80-pound steel leader is strong enough, then so is an 80-pound fluoro leader. I happen to think both are too light to be honest, and prefer at least 135-pound. But then again, I've never thought much of solid wire leaders either for that matter. They kink too easily, and there you have a nice stress riser. I use stranded, and re-crimp my own leaders at the first sign of any kinking...
TB
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Location: Green Bay, WI | Guest - 4/30/2012 3:28 PM
I've been making my own steel leaders (80lb) for awhile now but am having some problems with getting the crimps to hold perfectly. Ill admit I have been using a cheap pair of crimping pliers but do you all think that when I buy a better pair it will eliminate this problem? Also I was looking into making some flourocarbon leaders, do you guys crimp those as well or can you just tie those? Thanks for any input
I've never crimped a solid steel leader, so take this with a grain of salt. But I have crimped hundreds of stranded wire (cable) and fluorocarbon leaders. I haven't had a failure yet that I know of (knock on wood!), and we caught fish in the 45+ pound class.
I've found that the secret to a good crimp is using a double-barreled sleeve and a quality pair of crimping pliers. You don't want the pliers to crimp the edge of the sleeve, as that will dig into the leader material and create a stress riser. It's the exact same technique used for crimping control cables on aircraft, and there are hundreds of thousands (if not more) of those things flying around with crimped steel cables. As long as you do it correctly, you're golden.
If you search in the forum archives here, there are a couple great threads on crimping leaders. I've also seen a couple nice YouTube videos on the subject as well.
TB |
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| unless someone can prove to me that a muskie can produce 80 lbs of breaking strength via the force of a strong run or massive head shake, i'm going to go out on a limb and say what we think of as acceptable is probably overkill. leaders are used to keep fish from biting through them not breaking them (unless we're talking about saltwater fish, which we're not). steel and fluoro shouldn't be compared because of the materials used to make them. one is made of metal, the other a fluoropolymer (basically a fancy plastic).
now, if jeff said 80lb FLUORO then i might agree, but there are certain situations that might require (or nearly require) the use of a light fluoro leader of 80lbs or less. small glide baits (4" phantoms, baby squirkos) comes to mind. how about jigs and reapers? |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | You're probably right in that 80 pounds, in perfect condition, is more than adequate. Problem is that you don't always know that the leader is not in perfect condition, until it goes SNAP. Then you should have used stronger leader material.
Nothing wrong with using 80 pound leader material, if you're into that. I bought 2000 yards of stranded 135-pound nylon-coated cable for about $75 on e-bay. It's Berkley 7-strand, and is fantastic. So that's what I have been using.
TB |
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Posts: 717
Location: Grand Rapids, MI | I used to make 100lb flouro for casting. I landed many many fish on them. But all it takes is 1 fish that inhales a lure. That's what happened in the pic. Luckily, we got the fish in, but needless to say, I don't use 100lb anymore except for trolling. 100lb steel is probably strong enough, but for flouro, all it takes is the fish's teeth to just nick it a couple times.
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| Ok to specifiy, I've been crimping stranded wire leaders not solid steel ones. I've never had one fail on a fish but its just taken me alot adjusting to get them to hold correctly before I hit the water. I may not be as experienced as some of you at this but I tend to agree that 80lb flouro is too light, not because of the breaking strenght but because of its durability. Just out of curiousity have any of you guys who think 80lb wire leaders are too small, had a fish break your leader not at the crimp? |
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Posts: 218
| If you have a proper crimping tool and are using the correct size sleeves for the wire there shouldn't be an issue with crimps not holding. Make sure you are using the right tooth on the crimp tool for the barrels you are using. I have a friend who will upsize the sleeve one size and then loop the wire through a second time which pretty much eliminates the holding issue. Frankly I've never found that necessary. As to the weight of the material used fluoro or wire remember that it's not necessarily about the weight of the fish that you are catching but the shock that the leader endures on such things as hooksets, the dreaded mid-air backlash, weight of lures, etc. that puts the most stress on a leader. |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | Right--there isn't much "reserve" strength in 80-pound leader material...to that I'll agree. So any fraying of a fluoro leader is bad news, when it's that low in tensile strength. Any fraying weakens the leader of course, but it's more potentially more significant when that material is 80-pounds, versus 160-pounds for instance.
For fluoro leaders, I've made my own with crimps--but to be honest, it's more of a pain in the butt. You have to find the exact right sleeves and this can be a bit more challenging, due to the diameter of the leader material compared to that of the available sleeves. So if I was going to use fluoro a lot, I might just buy from Stealth, because it simply might be easier than making them myself. But where I fished here on Green Bay, fluoro was NOT necessary, and so the 7 Strand nylon-coated cable was the ticket for me. It actually blends in with the water and thus is virtually invisible. Use some black terminal tackle, and you're good to go. I've made a few hundred of these leaders using double-barrel crimps and Berkley ball-bearing swivels and black delrin tuna rings from Malo tackle.
As for breakage at the crimp, that shouldn't happen. If it does, it's most likely because the edge of the sleeve is being crimped. It shouldn't be.
Check out this link: http://www.leadertec.com/tipsandtechniques/crimp_techniques.html
...and look at the pictures of the properly crimped sleeves. I'll attach the one I am specifically referring to. The sleeve on the LEFT is correctly crimped, and you can see how the ends are not crimped. The sleeve on the right is incorrectly crimped, and has likely introduced stress risers into the leader material. So you cannot trust it, and it should be discarded.
TB
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| This is probably a stupid question but has anyone tried just tying flourocarbon leaders instead of crimping? Would knot strength be the issue here? By the way the only flourocarbon leader I've ever used was a stealth 135lb and I pulled one of the crimps loose on a snag resulting in a lost lure. |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | Yes, people do indeed tie fluoro. I've not done it, but I have seen a number of people do it--in fact, I believe that Stealth ties their fluoro leaders...or at least they used to. I haven't looked at their stuff in a while, as I don't have any need for a fluoro leader. But I've also seen people tie the swivel on, and then put a crimp on the tag end to secure it further.
But you can definitely tie fluoro--up to a certain diameter anyway.
TB |
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Posts: 2037
Location: lansing, il | Guest, Our leaders are knotted and crimped. The crimp has nothing to do with the holding strength of the leader. It is in place to hold the loop where we want it and to keep the tag end down. If a crimp were to slide free it would not affect the strength of the leader at all. If it was crimped only it was not our leader. |
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Location: Contrarian Island | i've made my own 180 lb for many years...i only crimp them w a double barrel crimp...no failures and they are rock solid. (the weakest link is not the leader if you are using 80 lb line!)
finding the correct sleeves is simple.
180 lb use 1.6mm
130 lb use 1.3mm
imo anything less than 130 is not smart...
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Posts: 5874
| I've caught hundreds fish on tied flouro leaders. I use 50 and 80 lb Flouro. Never had one break. I do check them after every fish, and recycle if I feel any nicks.
My biggest fish, 52 1/2" X 24", was caught trolling a Baby Sahllow Raider, 3' 50 lb Flouro leader, and 50 pound Crystal Fireline, on a 6' fiberglass bass rod. Many other fish up 50" came on this same combination. |
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Location: Contrarian Island | yah well then there are A LOT of guys who have had big fish swallow baits like dawgs with less than 130 and bu bye...shep I'd venture to guess your sample size isn't all that many either...guys who put 100s of fish in the boat a year know that 50 and 80 in the teeth/mouth of a big fish is asking for failure, too thin, easily cut....but whatev. you'll tell us all different i am sure
my biggest pike at 45" was caught on 6 lb line and a jig no leader so are you telling us since it 'can' be done it 'should' be done...c'mon ...really? |
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Posts: 540
Location: Leech Lake, Walker MN | Just go with single strand wire like Windels leaders and just go fishing nothing else to worry about IMO . Never has failed me yet and I don't worry about it |
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| muskihntr - 5/1/2012 10:02 AM
Guest, Our leaders are knotted and crimped. The crimp has nothing to do with the holding strength of the leader. It is in place to hold the loop where we want it and to keep the tag end down. If a crimp were to slide free it would not affect the strength of the leader at all. If it was crimped only it was not our leader.
I thought it was a stealth but I guess I was mistaken since it was only crimped. Sounds like tying and putting a crimp on the tag end is the way to go, guess I'll be trying that soon |
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Posts: 2687
Location: Hayward, WI | I make my own fluoro leaders with 150 lb. Seaguar. I knot them and then crimp the tag end like Stealth does. I use the knot shown here: http://leetauchen.com/lees_leader_knot.pdf. You'll need to give yourself a good 6-8 inch tag end since the leader is fairly stiff, but it's easy to tie. I leave a little loop in mine rather than tighten it all the way down so I can change the snap if needed. You could say my crimp holds the tag end in place but also keeps the knot from sliding down tight.
I've also crimped 7 strand wire for live bait rigs and with the right size sleeve/wire and a good crimper, they should hold well.
Tucker |
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Posts: 5874
| BNelson - 5/1/2012 10:45 AM
yah well then there are A LOT of guys who have had big fish swallow baits like dawgs with less than 130 and bu bye...shep I'd venture to guess your sample size isn't all that many either...guys who put 100s of fish in the boat a year know that 50 and 80 in the teeth/mouth of a big fish is asking for failure, too thin, easily cut....but whatev. you'll tell us all different i am sure
my biggest pike at 45" was caught on 6 lb line and a jig no leader so are you telling us since it 'can' be done it 'should' be done...c'mon ...really?
Real nice BN, calling me a liar. And you know exactly how many fish I've caught in the past 15 years since I started using flouro leaders because I report every single fish to you.
Typical of you to attack me because I don't buy leaders from your buddy. It's not the first time. I knew there was a reason I stopped posting here. Azzwipes like you, for one. |
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Location: Contrarian Island | oh come on...take a chill pill...guess it just touches a nerve when i hear guys saying you can use light stuff and honestly I just don't think you catch as many as the other guys I know who are on the water 500+ hours a year that have the horror stories of losing big fish to light leaders getting cut..I think Andy Hamm has a bad one to share if he wants to. not trying to be a jerk but you know the point. take it or leave it.
the analogy you used of catching a 52 isn't really worth it in my book. yes, you can, and some do...but is a 52 that eats a dawg and cuts your 80 lb leader worth it? i know my answer. use equipment that is right for the job at hand. simple. |
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| I agree with bn 100 percent! At least he says it how it is. Stone Cold |
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Posts: 2037
Location: lansing, il | 1. Anything can fail.
2. Simple formula. The lower pound test you use, the higher your RISK of being bit off or having failure will be. This applies to Fluorocarbon as well as Steel.
3. Use what your comfortable with and what works best for you. |
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Posts: 5874
| I agree with #3.
As for #2, it's a risk I'm willing to take.
Using 50 or 80 lb flouro for some presentations doesn't make it wrong. I should have just said I tie flouro, and don't use crimps, and left it at that.
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Posts: 253
Location: On the water | tcbetka
I like the clear coating on the 7 strand. What kind of wire is it and what pound is it.
Also what size sleeves do you use for the wire.
Thanks, Tom |
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| i have to agree with bn,i have seen a100 lbs leader that have been cut by a fish like buttter,i have seen that only 1 time ,for me 1 time is enough.
you dont use any sleeves for wire leader making |
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Location: Latitude 41.3016 Longitude 88.6160 | Just buy STEALTH LEADERS they have a nail knot, a crimp and are glued. they come in 130, 150, and 180lb, Also any one using F/C Leaders under 130lb why ???? |
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Location: Green Bay, WI |
tcbetka
I like the clear coating on the 7 strand. What kind of wire is it and what pound is it.
Also what size sleeves do you use for the wire.
Thanks, Tom
I am not sure what kind of wire it is--I thought it was just steel, but I'll have to dig up a roll and look at it. But it's 135-pound test, and it does indeed have the nylon coating. I thought I was using 2.4mm double-barrel sleeves, but I'll have to confirm those as well.
I can dig out that stuff this afternoon and have a look.
TB |
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| A lighter leader is more likely to fail...period. I am not sure how you can argue against that point??
I know of many horror stories where guys do not even use #130 fluoro anymore. Why risk losing a giant fish if you know #180 is better?? I am not aware of one #180 leader failure...probably has failed too...but I haven't heard of any??
I still will not throw dawgs with a fluoro leader because I don't trust them when a piggie grabs the head or inhales the bait. I use 49 strand #175 leaders I make myself and they are flexible and work great. I do not believe that fluoro will outfish these leaders so I will continue to use them.
Brett Waldera |
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Posts: 431
| Next thing is that everyone is going to start making their own Bull Dawgs. Keep America employed buy Stealth. |
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| juhas you got the post of the year!!!!!
muhaaaaa |
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| PIKEMASTER - 4/30/2012 3:17 PM
Just buy STEALTH LEADERS they have a nail knot, a crimp and are glued. they come in 130, 150, and 180lb, Also any one using F/C Leaders under 130lb why ????
is that possible for me to make my own?
do you think that company is the only that can make leaders under these specs? |
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Posts: 432
Location: Eagan, MN | learntoswim - 5/1/2012 4:46 PM
is that possible for me to make my own?
It is possible, but very un-American, apparently. |
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Location: Latitude 41.3016 Longitude 88.6160 | learntoswim - 5/1/2012 4:46 PM
PIKEMASTER - 4/30/2012 3:17 PM
Just buy STEALTH LEADERS they have a nail knot, a crimp and are glued. they come in 130, 150, and 180lb, Also any one using F/C Leaders under 130lb why ????
is that possible for me to make my own?
do you think that company is the only that can make leaders under these specs?
I have tried to make my own, and what a mess, F/C line is very hard to work with in 130lb and up and the nail knot is almost impossible to get it to close up. I just don't have the time to mess with leaders, plus they are one of the most important parts of catching a musky and I don't want to have a leader fail on me and loose or kill a Musky just to say I made my own leader. |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | Actually, the larger the F/C line is...the easier it is to crimp. By this I mean that you're not as likely to over-crimp the edges inadvertently. That's what I've found anyway. I've crimped 100 and 150 (I think it was 150) pound F/C line, and much preferred the heavier stuff. Very slick.
I made several of those F/C leaders for a couple angler buddies, and they had good luck with all of them...even the 100-pound stuff. So I wouldn't hesitate to crimp that stuff again, it's just that the heavier material is easier to work with in my experience.
TB |
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| Reference this for crimping fluoro.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEF7rdI2YR4 |
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Posts: 540
Location: Leech Lake, Walker MN | I read this stuff and I'm just biting my tounge about this crimp stuff
I have seen many a broken heart using crimps and this is just my observation over the years. Sorry |
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Posts: 540
Location: Leech Lake, Walker MN | And the bottom line is not loosing the great fish that you had on IT'S LEAVING THE LURE IN HER FACE. ,!!!,!!!!!,!!,!!,!,! |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | You're right--people that don't know how to crimp properly risk losing fish. Period. This is why I tell everyone to spend time learning about it, but of course that takes work. Some will do it, some won't--and they may very well lose a fish to a broken leader.
Of course that never happens with tied leaders though.
TB |
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Location: Contrarian Island | really tcbetka do tell..you're now telling us that a tied leader can't fail? c'mon..so a guy can improperly crimp but can't improperly tie...this is a fun day on the ol m1st...i was making and using fluoro leaders before a big percentage of people, many of my friends use them...i would venture to guess somewhere in the neighborhood of 1500 fish have been cpr'd w the leaders I make..up to 45 lbs..not one failure and i only crimp them....get a good crimping tool, do it right and why would it fail ? do tell...is 1500+ fish a pretty big sampling? i'd say so... sorry but i have to laugh when i read posts like yours...guys are out there using 65 and 80 lb line in a lot of cases ..hello but the knot will break before a 180 or even 130 lb leader...i've put my weight into my leaders hanging them from a nail in the garage and it held....do tell why crimps fail? good crimps don't fail, improperly made crimps might |
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Posts: 413
Location: Madison WI | BN I have agreed with almost all you have said so far on this subject, but I think tcbetka was being sarcastic with his line of tied leaders not failing. I too have been using crimped leaders that my friend makes, every year we crimp a couple up and test them by hanging a trolling motor battery from them. I can't say that during this testing a "crimp" has ever pulled out, it is normally the loop that breaks. We do this to 1st test to make sure the floro hasn't deteriorated over the winter and 2nd to get back in the groove of crimping leaders. I haven't had a crimp break while fishing with these leaders either, I have had them get bitten through (80 and 100lb). I now use 130 or 150#. To each their own, if you want to make them yourself do that, if you want to buy them from a retailer do that. Just make sure that if you are going to make your own leaders to please do it right so you don't have the fish gone with a nice 8 inch + bait stuck in its yapper. Is fishing season here yet so we can stop bickering so much? |
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | BNelson,
You need to sharpen up your reading comprehension. 
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Posts: 2037
Location: lansing, il | wow |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | BNelson - 5/1/2012 6:50 PM
really tcbetka do tell..you're now telling us that a tied leader can't fail? c'mon..so a guy can improperly crimp but can't improperly tie...this is a fun day on the ol m1st...i was making and using fluoro leaders before a big percentage of people, many of my friends use them...i would venture to guess somewhere in the neighborhood of 1500 fish have been cpr'd w the leaders I make..up to 45 lbs..not one failure and i only crimp them....get a good crimping tool, do it right and why would it fail ? do tell...is 1500+ fish a pretty big sampling? i'd say so... sorry but i have to laugh when i read posts like yours...guys are out there using 65 and 80 lb line in a lot of cases ..hello but the knot will break before a 180 or even 130 lb leader...i've put my weight into my leaders hanging them from a nail in the garage and it held....do tell why crimps fail? good crimps don't fail, improperly made crimps might
Lighten up Francis, I was agreeing with you.
Anyone that knows me knows that I make crimped leaders, and have for years. My "luck" (preparation meets opportunity) is the same as yours for the most part...except for the number of fish that have been caught on it, most likely.
You can screw up a crimped leader just as easily as you can screw up a tied leader. But for someone who puts in the time and effort to learn the techniques, either should work just fine. I've used Stealth's stuff, and it's great. But I love making my own, so I do that instead. But being that Green Bay isn't exactly the picture of a crystal clear spring-fed pond in most places, I don't need F/C. So I use nylon-coated steel--although back when I used to cast a lot, I really didn't see much of a difference (in terms of fish caught or seen) with any given material.
So keep crimping my friend, I'm singing in your choir...
TB |
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Posts: 1144
Location: Minnesota. | Does anyone still use twisted, coated supple wire and fire the coating to melt it?
Been doing that since 1981 and have never, never had a single fail yet.
I use 80 to 100lb coated, braided (?? well, not a solid wire....been years since I needed to buy any) and twist approx. 4-5" along itself and pass a cig. lighter along the coating to melt it.
Ring on one end and large ball bearing swivel/clip on the other.
Maybe I've just been lucky ??? but it's done me very nicely thus far.
Jeremy. |
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Posts: 432
Location: Eagan, MN | Yup I used the twist melt method a bit back in the 90's. Finished product isn't pretty but never had any problems. |
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Location: Latitude 41.3016 Longitude 88.6160 | go to http://www.leadertec.com/tipsandtechniques/crimp_techniques.html
then go to http://www.sportfishingmag.com/techniques/rigs-and-tips/can-you-tru...
and if you still want to try you will First need a good set of crimping pliers $40-$60 then a 30m roll of Seaguar Premier Big Game Leader F/C about $80.00 - $90.00 then the right crimp sleeves $10.00, so just to get started you will spend over $150.00.
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Posts: 218
| If you're looking for pure strength Don Pursch is right on the money. Solid wire leaders won't fail but make sure you bring a handful because they will get kinked. They may also have some affect on the action of lighter lures or surface baits but they are no doubt the best "bite material" available. |
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Posts: 582
| comparing Flouro to steel is kind of stupid. Its not the # of the leader, its about the fish biting thru it.. Try nicking a flour leader at 80# with a sharp knife and then do the same to a single strand steel leader and tell me what you would trust more.
your 80# steel is plenty good. I would go more personally but it will work. |
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Location: Contrarian Island | i think Bette's top 3 are decent but just using what you are comfortable with isn't enough imo...a guy might know any better and be "comfortable" with 50lb fluoro throwing dawgs...once informed and armed with the knowledge they will get cut like a hot knife thru butter one should make the wise decision to go with a thicker fluoro.... lots of guys have stories of 130 getting sliced ..it's fairly easy to cut w a shart filet knife.....it's quite a bit harder to slice thru 180...so i use 180.... hopefully threads like this will inform those that don't know any better..... |
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| I have never try a just crimped leaders,but i am sure of 1 thing if thorpe really use the leader he make on the utube video,they are SAFE!
Hey the guys catch more than 30/50 inchers each year so i think his leader can be considered safe no??
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Posts: 458
| PIKEMASTER - 5/1/2012 2:17 PM
Just buy STEALTH LEADERS they have a nail knot, a crimp and are glued. they come in 130, 150, and 180lb, Also any one using F/C Leaders under 130lb why ????
X2 |
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Location: Contrarian Island | saltwater guys just crimp leaders and catch 1000 lb tuna w "just" a crimped leader....and we are worried about a 40 lb musky if we are lucky enough to hook a 40 lber... |
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| BNelson - 5/2/2012 10:43 AM
....just using what you are comfortable with isn't enough imo....
.... lots of guys have stories of 130 getting sliced ..it's fairly easy to cut w a shart filet knife.....it's quite a bit harder to slice thru 180...so i use 180.... hopefully threads like this will inform those that don't know any better.....
so just using what we're comfortable with isn't enough, but you're comfortable with 180# so it's ok, as judged by yourself? why stop there? why even risk leaving a bait in a fish period? why even use a material for leaders like floro that obviously CAN be cut by a fishes teeth, just because it's less visible in the water. nevermind you're pulling your bait straight back to the boat every cast, think the fish doesn't know you're there?
let's be honest with ourselves and admit anything that's not wire has a much higher potential to break, and anything that's crimped is absolutely subject to fail. not trying to ruffle any feathers but there's a reason i only use single strand wire, looped and twisted. crazy thing is, if it gets kinked i bend it back. or it costs me $.04 for another foot of wire and i'm retied.
i got sick of hearing about big fish breaking floro leaders for whatever reason last fall, all of them coming from guides and people who should know better, hence the rant. people use 180 because 150 didn't work, what happens when 180 doesn't work? does everyone have to kill one big fish before they rethink floro? at $8 a pop I'm surprised it's taking so long. |
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Location: Contrarian Island | let me know when you hear a 180 got cut...as i mentioned me and the guys i know who use the ones i make have zero occurrences of that happening. 1500+ fish....
one can play devils advocate all day long if they want to ...at the end of the day does that prove much? |
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| BNelson - 5/1/2012 2:09 PM
saltwater guys just crimp leaders and catch 1000 lb tuna w "just" a crimped leader....and we are worried about a 40 lb musky if we are lucky enough to hook a 40 lber... ;-)
lol so true,some musky guys just love to exaggerate other thing than the size of their fish |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | ...there you go, using logic again. Sheesh!
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Location: Latitude 41.3016 Longitude 88.6160 | learntoswim - 5/2/2012 2:19 PM
BNelson - 5/1/2012 2:09 PM
saltwater guys just crimp leaders and catch 1000 lb tuna w "just" a crimped leader....and we are worried about a 40 lb musky if we are lucky enough to hook a 40 lber... ;-)
lol so true,some musky guys just love to exaggerate other thing than the size of their fish
Wait till you backlash a New Mag Dawg or Pounder with your home made crimped leader. LOL LOL |
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Location: Grinnell, Iowa | PIKEMASTER - 5/1/2012 5:13 PM
learntoswim - 5/1/2012 4:46 PM
PIKEMASTER - 4/30/2012 3:17 PM
Just buy STEALTH LEADERS they have a nail knot, a crimp and are glued. they come in 130, 150, and 180lb, Also any one using F/C Leaders under 130lb why ????
is that possible for me to make my own?
do you think that company is the only that can make leaders under these specs?
I have tried to make my own, and what a mess, F/C line is very hard to work with in 130lb and up and the nail knot is almost impossible to get it to close up. I just don't have the time to mess with leaders, plus they are one of the most important parts of catching a musky and I don't want to have a leader fail on me and loose or kill a Musky just to say I made my own leader.
I agree with you that they are one of the most important parts of catching a musky. That is why i started making my own leaders. I got tired of paying for leaders that had cheap snaps instead of good stay-loks. Also purchased many with poor knots and/or poor crimps. I put the opportunity for failure squarely in my own hands and feel more confident with my own. It's the same principal as to why most musky anglers will change out the split rings and hooks on a brand new lure. Poor/cheap terminal tackle only benefits the producer/seller not the consumer/user. |
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Posts: 2015
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"Wait till you backlash a New Mag Dawg or Pounder with your home made crimped leader. LOL LOL"
Ya what will that do? My 80 or 100 pound braid will snap before any of my homemade crimped leaders will fail. |
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Location: Latitude 41.3016 Longitude 88.6160 | IAJustin - 5/2/2012 2:53 PM
"Wait till you backlash a New Mag Dawg or Pounder with your home made crimped leader. LOL LOL"
Ya what will that do? My 80 or 100 pound braid will snap before any of my homemade crimped leaders will fail.
On my Mag dawg and Pounder setup I run 130lb Suffix or 150lb Power Pro Braid with 180lb STEALTH LEADERS. |
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| Once again,you fail because you can not force us to buy the''leader''
think again and comeback my friend.
btw i have never made a single backlash on a mag or on a pounder.and anyway iajustin point is true.
cant remember what was the tittle of the topic? |
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Posts: 1716
Location: Mt. Zion, IL | PIKEMASTER - 5/2/2012 2:46 PM
Wait till you backlash a New Mag Dawg or Pounder with your home made crimped leader. LOL LOL
I have had plenty of backlashes with my home made leaders and I have never had a problem or a failure. I have also load tested my leaders where I work and they held over 275 lbs for 175 lb leader material. I load tested leaders that have been used (nicked) as well as leaders that were brand new. The crimps did not slip or fail in any way on the sampling of leaders I tested.
I will never pay retail price for leaders again because the quality control is in my hand. I am not hinting at the quality of any one particular company, but I have had leaders that I have purchased fail due to poor quality. If a leader or crimp is not up to snuff, I have the ability and capability to fix it or scrap it.
With the amount of time it takes to make your own, make them in the off season and forget about it.
If you don't want to make your own, buy Stealth. They are the best leaders I have personally found. |
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Posts: 332
Location: Neenah, WI | Shep,
You are a smart man!!!! Flour is just more subject to issues with teeth rocks gravel ETC!!! Check your leaders often!!!
SAINT |
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Posts: 432
Location: Eagan, MN | BNelson, you're not the only guy with substantial experience on this board. You dismissed Shep's sample size as being inadequate, apparently without even knowing what it was, and yet your 1500 is enough? The way you're coming across is not a good look. |
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| Does Shep even fish muskies anymore? Stone Cold |
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Posts: 218
| If you want to try tying fluorocarbon do yourself a favor and buy the Du Bro nail knotter tool. It really isn't that difficult and after selling thousands of Smity, Tug Of War, and Stealth leaders (all use nail knots) along with tying my own I have NEVER seen a properly tied nail knot fail. If you want to see a quick tutorial on building solid wire leaders here's a short film I put together about a year ago http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8N5R74HPjs8 |
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Posts: 2894
Location: Yahara River Chain | Pete nice video. But you should have instructed them on how to beak off the wire and not cut it. When you cut it it leaves a very sharp burr and that can cut you when you handle the leader to take off weeds or whatnot (you RFGuys like saying that )
Folks what should be done is place a 90 degree bend in the tag end about a 1/4 inch from the shaft. Grab the tag as close to the shaft as you can with a locking needle nose pliers (aka vice grips) and twist on its axis. If you see the wrap coming undone, twist the other way till it breaks free.
Attachments
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leader pics 002.jpg (5KB - 148 downloads)
leader pics 003.jpg (17KB - 152 downloads)
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Posts: 218
| Good point. In retrospect I would have done that differently...and what not. Most of the time what I do is to just make a cut or knick partially through the wire with my cutter and then bend it until it makes a clean cut. If I see that there is any of the tag end sticking up that could be sharp I usually press that down to the wire shaft using my round nose pliers. Thanks for posting your pictures too. |
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Posts: 2894
Location: Yahara River Chain | Peter Stoltman - 5/2/2012 10:49 PM
Most of the time what I do is to just make a cut or knick partially through the wire with my cutter and then bend it until it makes a clean cut.
That works too. But the trick comes in not nicking the wire too much and cutting it off or having it break too quickly. I also tried crushing the burr end with the pliers, but never can get it where you can run a hand on it without getting cut.
I also like to use that needle nose vise grips to hold my hooks while I sharpen hooks, Makes it easier. |
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Posts: 5874
| SC - 5/2/2012 5:15 PM
Does Shep even fish muskies anymore? Stone Cold
Why does that matter? |
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