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Posts: 706
Location: Richland Center, WI. | With less than a week to go before the musky season opens here in southern Wisconsin, I go to my doctor for a sore right shoulder. For the record, I am right handed. He sends me in for an MRI and the results are in!
I have a SLAP tear extending from anterior to posterior of the bicipital labral complex extending posteriorly to the junction with the posterior labrum with a large paralabral cyst extending into the suprascapular notch. Also have shallow undersurface partial thickness tears of the infraspinatus and subscapularis tendons.
Doc is sending me to a specialist on May 7th.
My question is, has anyone had any experience with this either personally or professionally? It is killing me not knowing how long I will be out of the game of musky fishing with the season just getting started. Have not made up my mind on whether to have surgery if recommended or to just wait. Waiting will probably screw with bow hunting. Funny how the seasons (hunting and fishing) dictate what we do in our lives.
Thanks, Ken  |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | Depends upon how the surgeon feels. Sometimes an aggressive approach works better--surgery, rest and then rehab. Otherwise, it's one re-injury after another. Connective tissue has a poor blood supply and heals quite slowly. So before you know it, you have significant scarring and loss of range-of-motion from the chronic inflammation that persists. Then you need surgery to clean that out. So often times, it's best to just go ahead and get it done sooner rather than later.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but if the surgeon offers a procedure, I'd think very hard about getting it done. You will lose a couple months, but hopefully not the entire year. With a chronic, lingering injury that is constantly getting re-exacerbated...you might lose the entire season and Fall. But it will all depend on how aggressive your surgeon thinks it should be treated.
TB |
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Posts: 2894
Location: Yahara River Chain | Ken are you able to net my fish??
Just bring a few Musky Hunters to read while I catch them.  :)
Sorry to hear about your shoulder. Can you learn to cast left handed? |
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Posts: 319
Location: Tomahawk,Wis | Ken have had both my shoulders redone and now I hunt with a crossbow.
The surgery is better than letting it try and heal.
Good luck
Wally |
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Posts: 531
Location: Hugo, MN | Get it fixed before it screws up ALL of your musky seasons. |
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| downsize, jig,... whem u cant jerk a glider all day maybe hit all ur favorite lil spots with a diff method |
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Posts: 706
Location: Richland Center, WI. | Thanks for the responses. I will know more on May 7th. Just getting a little freaked out about how much time I will be laid up.
Gerard, I am sure I can net fish left handed but still don't think I can cast left handed. I guess I should look on the bright side, maybe this will give me incentive to troll a little more or fish more for panfish!
Ken |
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Posts: 223
Location: Victoria,MN | I have had the unfortunate opportunity to have 3 rotator cuff repairs performed on me. Two of them were 8 months apart on the left shoulder. I am right handed.
Sorry to say, the surgery sucks. It put a damper on ANY fishing I did for 3 months.
I tried Cortizone shots to try and put off the surgery and they had no effect and were a bit unpleasant also
If you get the surgery done follow the rehab plans and dont over do it. Re-tears are easily done from over exertion.
If you can wait until after the bow season and get the surgery performed in the winter you should have time to recoop.
Good Luck,
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Posts: 956
Location: Home of the 2016 World Series Champion Cubs | get the surgery done asap and learn to troll to get you through rehab
Edited by KARLOUTDOORS 4/29/2012 8:48 PM
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| KARLOUTDOORS - 4/29/2012 8:47 PM
get the surgery done asap and learn to troll to get you through rehab
If you can schedule it, get it done ASAP. In the meantime, cast lefty. Trolling is for ladies. |
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Posts: 283
| I basically had the same thing...I'm right handed and had a Slap tear on my right shoulder. I had surgery over 3 yrs ago and it still isn't right. Cortizone shots didn't do anything for me. I'd wait til after bow season if I was you. The recovery time is over 6 months. The advice I'd give u is if u have surgery baby your shoulder, do all your rehab, and don't push it. As for muskie fishing I; sucker fished more, trolled more, casted left-handed more, and I threw a lot more small spinnerbaits and gliders. That was my best year numbers wise for muskies too. Shoot me a pm if have anymore questions. |
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Posts: 718
| Wait or not...maybe a personal choice...maybe one the surgeon will help you make.
More important, WAY more, get it done by someone good...that specializes in shoulders for athletes....even if it means a little travel. TRIA in the Minneapolis area has done work on me and quite a few others that I know. They are sports guys and they all specialize....no general handymen allowed. |
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Posts: 336
Location: Lino Lakes, MN | Unfortunately, I've had quite a bit of experience with that surgery. I had a SLAP done on both shoulders and followed that up with rotator cuff surgery on both of them a few years later. I was pitching in college and originally elected to go with the injections and physical therapy because I didn't want to be out for an entire season...looking back, I would have been much better off just getting it done right away. I hate to say it, but the surgery sucked, especially the first time I had it done. The 2nd surgery and both rotator cuffs were done by a different surgeon who implanted a pain pump after the procedure and that thing was a life saver as far as pain management. It took me 4-5 months after each surgery to feel close to normal and probably 6-7 months after to feel 100% comfortable with throwing/casting/etc.
You should definitely talk to your doctor and come up with a plan that works for you, whether it be surgery, physical therapy, injections, or a different course of action. Everyone is different and you know your body better than anyone else. A few friends have had similar injuries and were able to get by with PT and injections while waiting for a more opportune time to have surgery. My best advice would be to get multiple opinions from doctors and make sure you go to someone who specializes in sports injuries(in my experience, the sports docs were more often looking to get me back to full physical activity as opposed to just getting me to be pain free...odd as it may sound, there is a difference). Another important thing I learned from my experience: listen to your therapist/doctor, and follow their instructions to a "T". Therapy isn't much fun, but more often than not, the success of the recovery will depend greatly on how seriously you take the therapy...getting your range of motion and strength back will not only help your shoulder recover, but help to prevent you from injuring something else if you start to overcompensate with a different part of your body(elbow/hand). I ended up having Tommy John surgery after my last shoulder surgery because I changed my throwing motion and overcompensated with my elbow in order to keep pressure and pain out of my shoulder. Good luck with whatever you do and let us know how it goes.
Edited by esoxlazer 4/29/2012 11:41 PM
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Posts: 743
| I have a SLAP tear extending from anterior to posterior of the bicipital labral complex extending posteriorly to the junction with the posterior labrum with a large paralabral cyst extending into the suprascapular notch. Also have shallow undersurface partial thickness tears of the infraspinatus and subscapularis tendons.
Sounds terrible . Does it sound as bad in English? |
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Posts: 793
Location: North Central IL USA | Get it done ASAP! My neighbor put it off last summer so he wouldn't miss out on his salmon fishing trips. Finally had it done this January. Because he waited the surgery was much more complicated and he'll be lucky to get the shoulder back to 80% of what it was before the injury. |
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Posts: 20248
Location: oswego, il | My middle son tore his labrum during football. He is still doing therapy and he has actually lost some of his movement. It will be a little bit before he will be cleared to go out for any sports. Dont mess around get it fixed. |
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Posts: 706
Location: Richland Center, WI. | Thanks again to all who responded. I really appreciate it.
My doctor gave me the results of the MRI with pictures highlighted showing the areas affected. He told me he was surprised by the amount of damage I had (whatever that means). I don't really have the English translation of what all I have wrong but know it hurts! Worst part of all this is that it happened at work so I am at the mercy of whoever the insurance sends me to. Being right handed, this really sucks! Really need this shoulder to be in good shape. I guess I have hit that age where waiting a couple weeks for things to feel better does not work anymore. Again, I will know more on May 7th when I see our local specialist. 
Ken |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | You are the patient, and have the right as to who treats you. I am not an expert in Worker's Comp, but many doctors see patients for them. In other words, if you don't like the first surgeon you see...ask for a second opinion. It happens all the time.
I'm quite sure that you won't have to accept treatment from the first physician, if that is your choice. When I was practicing medicine, I saw patients for a second opinion (their choice) on a number of instances. Don't worry too much about it. The UW is near you as well, so you can always ask for a referral there if you aren't comfortable after the first visit. In fact, the Workman's Comp people might even ask for your choice of surgeon right off the bat....
TB |
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Posts: 1149
Location: Minnesota. | Ken,
I feel for you. I really do. I"m a veteran of no less than 8 elbow tendonitis surgeries. Put me down bigtime in fishing. I timed the surgeries over the winter but still it messed the recovery time up.
Here's the scoop...Work related. The work docs are terrible. They play to the co. that employs them.
I had surgery done in the Twin Cities by a "recommended" doc. So/so..at best. Following surgeries were done after a few trips to the Mayo Clinic in Rochester MN (you're close...consider that being VERY fortunate!)
Go to the Mayo. They know ALL the ins and outs and maybe they'll suggest the surgery...you'll find out. They're the BEST. Get it done there.
I did and couldn't be happier. I"m serious here. Been there/done that. I hope you have good results.
Good luck.
Jeremy. |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | Guest - 4/29/2012 9:11 PM
If you can schedule it, get it done ASAP. In the meantime, cast lefty. Trolling is for ladies. :)
LMAO... |
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Posts: 897
| If you have any reservations about your surgeon contact a workers comp attorney and see what your rights are. My guess is you have more options than you think. |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | You have LOTS of options. Wisconsin isn't that big to have an infinite number of providers for the Workman's Comp carriers to choose from. Sure they might have a "preferred" provider list, but most surgeons are affiliated with larger clinics--who, by their very nature (trying to out-do each other), are going to all want to cover that line of business. In other words, lots of different doctors accept patients from WC carriers. So the OP will likely have several different choices. Ironically though, I would not have guessed that Mayo would be one of them; as they have a strong reputation of not letting an insurance company tell them what they'll accept for reimbursement. Insurance providers don't like that however, which is why I advised the OP to consider the UW system. The care there would be just as good, and in all likelihood there would not be an issue with coverage.
Remember--the WC carriers want to get you better as quickly (and with as little residual disability) as possible, to mitigate their losses down the line. I wouldn't think the OP will have much trouble in today's medical world. At least I've never heard of much over in the Green Bay area.
TB |
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Posts: 336
Location: Lino Lakes, MN | I have no idea if you're close to Milwaukee, but a doctor that I had great success with for 3 shoulder surgeries and my Tommy John surgery was Dr. Rick Papandrea. He actually brought in the team doctor from the St. Louis Cardinals when he did my elbow surgery and he went above and beyond working with my physical therapists to get me back to top physical form as soon as possible. I think he works out of Orthopaedic Associates of Wisconsin. Like I said, I have no idea if you're close to Milwaukee or if he's in your network for Workman's Comp, but I know he did surgeries for a few friends who were hurt on the job so I know he's familiar with Comp cases. |
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Posts: 358
Location: London, England | The trouble is, if you go to see a surgeon, he'll recommend surgery. Go and see a physio, he'll recommend physiotherapy etc. It's hard to know what to do for the best. In my experience ligament and tendon related injuries will heal themselves eventually with the right exercise program, but it will take a good amount of time. think 1-2 years. Surgery, I don't know, but it could easily make it worse. |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | But the problem is that connective tissue has a poor blood supply, so it does not heal quick. But if the mechanism that caused the initial injury is still in play, then the person is continuing to do harm to that tissue. In other words, they are causing further harm faster than the body can repair itself. So what you get is chronic inflammation and scarring. Then adhesions. Then loss of range of motion. And pain.
Often the surgeon is the only option. The process must be stopped, the tissue repaired, and then the joint needs rehabilitation. I've seen it hundreds of times in 14 years of practicing medicine. Surgeons operate, that's for sure. And therapists provide therapy. The two work together. But at some point that's about all a person has left. It all boils down to this...
You can pay me now, or you can pay me later.
And we're not talking about money.
TB |
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Posts: 2361
| MY advice,
Beware of taking advice from anybody who has to practice medicine for 14 years, and go with someone who is good enough to provide it in less time(I mean, ya know, 14 years and still practicing?, if you aren't able to get it in 10, might be time to take up another field). No fence meant.
Second, the medical advice you get from a musky fishing board is worth every single penny you pay for it...
And of course third, always wear your PFD, without it, fall in and you can only propell yourself in a small circle, and eventually, your remaining good arm gives out, and you sink like a dang stone.
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Posts: 2361
| On second thought, be a man, skip that PFD... |
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Posts: 706
Location: Richland Center, WI. | Guess the advice I was looking for was if anyone has had the same problem, how long was the recovery time. Don't need any PFD advice.
Ken |
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Posts: 646
Location: In a shack in the woods | I had a labral tear along the back of each shoulder joint from top to bottom and it never healed right. I can't throw a ball or swing a golf club anymore. I had to reteach myself to fish but my arms are glued to my sides. I just use my forearms. Also start casting lighter stuff like bass baits and slowly work into Muskie stuff. Early in the year my shoulders tire soon but by fall time I can cast mag dawgs and pounders for hours |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | firstsixfeet - 5/1/2012 6:48 AM
MY advice,
Beware of taking advice from anybody who has to practice medicine for 14 years, and go with someone who is good enough to provide it in less time(I mean, ya know, 14 years and still practicing?, if you aren't able to get it in 10, might be time to take up another field). No fence meant.
LMAO. Now there's the autistic FSF we all know and love. You're like the Rain Man.
Second, the medical advice you get from a musky fishing board is worth every single penny you pay for it...
OK then, that'll be $500. Cash please.
And of course third, always wear your PFD, without it, fall in and you can only propell yourself in a small circle, and eventually, your remaining good arm gives out, and you sink like a dang stone.
I can't help but wonder FSF...would it help if he would wear flippers in the boat? Besides providing a wider base to stand on, this would have the added benefit of allowing him to hang on to the rod with both hands while swimming after a big fish, should he get pulled out of the boat.
Edited by tcbetka 5/2/2012 6:03 AM
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Posts: 706
Location: Richland Center, WI. | tcbetka - 5/2/2012 5:59 AM
firstsixfeet - 5/1/2012 6:48 AM
MY advice,
Beware of taking advice from anybody who has to practice medicine for 14 years, and go with someone who is good enough to provide it in less time(I mean, ya know, 14 years and still practicing?, if you aren't able to get it in 10, might be time to take up another field). No fence meant.
LMAO. Now there's the autistic FSF we all know and love. You're like the Rain Man.
Second, the medical advice you get from a musky fishing board is worth every single penny you pay for it...
OK then, that'll be $500. Cash please.
And of course third, always wear your PFD, without it, fall in and you can only propell yourself in a small circle, and eventually, your remaining good arm gives out, and you sink like a dang stone.
I can't help but wonder FSF...would it help if he would wear flippers in the boat? Besides providing a wider base to stand on, this would have the added benefit of allowing him to hang on to the rod with both hands while swimming after a big fish, should he get pulled out of the boat.
After reading this, I am feeling better already except that now my sides are hurting from laughing.
Ken
Edited by muskyhunter63 5/2/2012 9:36 AM
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Posts: 133
Location: South Bend, Indiana | Surgery is as last resort. You want to make sure with your doctor that the only option is surgery. Prior to an operation, your shoulder will never truly be the same. I also recommend going to the nearest big city to you (EX: Chicago or Indianapolis). There you will get the most educated doctors around, with the newest technologies and techniques. Hope everything turns out well for you. |
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Posts: 706
Location: Richland Center, WI. | Thanks again everyone for the responses. Been out musky fishing twice so far. No fish, no follows just super sore shoulder. Local specialist referred me to a sports specialist at the UW to see about a fix. Will be in Madison on May 29th. Wish I was pulling the boat to the Mad Chain but we will see what happens.
Ken |
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Location: Green Bay, WI | That's where you want to be, given your location. I'm sure they'll do everything they can to fix you up. Let us know how it goes.
TB |
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Posts: 180
Location: Elgin, IL | I assist in these type of surgical procedures. Heard alot of good advice from alot of people hear. Get er done. The longer you put it of the more damage can be done to where it may never be right.
Find a doctor who is trained in shoulder surgery if you can locate one. Yes most time you can choose a physician, just talk with comp carrier or case manager.
It is extensive from you describe. Do follow your restrictions and rehab program given. Limited and staged rehab which will take time. Yes you won't be out there for some time, no chose really, but you'll get out there eventually. Time is the hardest thing.
May take a year sometimes before you can really get aggressive with it but as you start there may be some ups and down. It's tough hearing all of this but you have to figure that it is the best thing to do. Also don't listen to all the terrible that has happened to others. Everyone is different depending on their expectations or ability to handle pain. First few days a bad but does get better.
We can go on and on..... stay positive, you'll be fine.
Good luck |
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| Do whatever the doctor says--he is the expert. The fish will still be there when you are done. A stitch in time saves nine.
Pick a lake that you can troll on.
Brian
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Posts: 3907
| Essoxlazer nailed it. Others too.
The longer you wait the worse it will get. And the wose it gets the longer the rehab. PT after a rotator cuff repair is pretty tough, but the less you work on it the further you'll be from the best possible recovery.
You'll never totally recover, of course, never back to the 110% you had when you were young and bullet-proof. That's life, as we age our parts start not working.
Hope you have good insurance, the surgical repair and follow-up is pretty expensive.
Good luck. |
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Posts: 706
Location: Richland Center, WI. | Well, waited almost a year and had to do something. Tomorrow morning at 7:30 I will be at the UW Madison Hospital getting a SLAP repair and biceps tenodesis. Does not sound like it will be too much fun but at least I hit the musky shows this winter and stocked up on books and videos to keep me occupied. Should be scary smart by fall or really bored! If anyone needs a one handed net man, get back to me.
Ken |
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Posts: 667
Location: Wisconsin | Hope it went well and your recovery is quick! The best fishing is in the Fall anyway( just trying to be positive!) |
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Posts: 706
Location: Richland Center, WI. | Thanks. Sitting here at the computer trying to clear my head. Can't imagine this without the medication. Sure slept good last night in the recliner.
Ken |
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Posts: 1760
Location: new richmond, wi. & isle, mn | I would have surgery. Then hurry and book a cabin at a mom and pop resort in Vilas county and join the trolling masses that will be flooding the area. |
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Posts: 706
Location: Richland Center, WI. | Why would I do that? I prefer to cast!
Ken |
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Posts: 265
Location: Hudson,WI | So what did you end up doing? How was your season last year? |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | Average Joe - 3/10/2013 12:35 PM
So what did you end up doing? How was your season last year?
Check a mere 5 posts above yours.... |
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Posts: 13688
Location: minocqua, wi. | muskyhunter63 - 3/10/2013 12:08 AM
Why would I do that? I prefer to cast!
Ken
:0) |
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Posts: 706
Location: Richland Center, WI. | Last year I did not get out as much as I would have liked, but then who did. Fishing was painful at times so I used smaller baits a lot of the time. Saw fish but none in the boat.
Put off the surgery last year as we had another guy off work with a knee problem. Did not want to be running two guys short. Thought I would try to get in some bowhunting but was again slowed by the shoulder.
Set up an appointment in December to see the surgeon and finally got it done last Friday. Bored stiff right now (not just the shoulder) and spending some quality time in the recliner watching musky videos and reading. Was told it will be a 4 to 6 month recovery before I get back to work. Hoping it will be sooner. I will be in the boat this summer even if I have to just run the trolling motor. Should be able to jig I would think!
Ken |
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Posts: 1360
Location: Lake "y" cause lake"x" got over fished | I am in a simalar situation with my right elbow and forearm. It is bugging me not knowing how long I am goingt to be out for, I have already been dealing with this for 8 months now. But if I can't fish this season I am more than willing to play net man and at least help get some fish in the boat if I can't put them there myself. I plan on it in fact. I know I wont be ready for the start of the season but am hoping by August I should be back on the horse. I just need to keep up with my PT and my stretches. Also I am going in for whole blood injections tomorrow, so that should be interesting... Hope it works |
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Posts: 706
Location: Richland Center, WI. | Good luck with the elbow and forearm FAT-SKI. I see the surgeon again on March 19th and start physical therapy the same day. Not looking forward to the PT but know it will get me closer to getting back on the water.
Ken |
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Posts: 1360
Location: Lake "y" cause lake"x" got over fished | Thanks Muskyhunter, good luck with the Shoulder as well
The biggest thing IMHO about PT is making sure you are doing as much of it as you can at your house. Going to the appointments is great and all, but if you don't do it at home on a regular basis, the appointments are pretty much for nothing. Just make srue when you get some stretches and exercises to do from you therapist that you do them virgorously. The way I look at it, is I can sit back and take my time with this and I'm sure ill be fine after a year or so... OR I can take charge and possibly get back to fishing a little sooner than origanally hoped.
Edited by FAT-SKI 3/12/2013 1:13 PM
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Posts: 706
Location: Richland Center, WI. | I hear ya on the therapy. Had a torn achilles tendon back in 2006. Was out of work for 10 months and have not had a problem since thanks to the therapy!
I had been told before the achilles surgery that the stronger you go in the stronger you will come out.
I asked the surgeon about lifting weights. She said weights are good but not too heavy and easy on the bench press and no excessive overhead lifts. Lifted and rode bicycle with my 25 year old son starting in July of 2012. Ended up losing 30 pounds and found some muscle that I lost. Really made a difference in how I feel.
Looking forward to warmer weather and getting outside to start walking, get that pulse rate up Hope to fish this summer and get back to lifting maybe in the fall!
Ken |
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Medical advice!